The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

As a Hokie and Redskins fan, I was happy to see Deangelo in Burgundy and Gold. (Snyder needs to look towards Blacksburg in the draft a little more often too, but I digress) There is something that has been bothering me. Skins wanted to keep Hall because, they say, he is great in man-to-man coverage and their defensive scheme requires CB's to go one on one quite often.

Okay, so then why did Oakland say they cut DeAngelo BECAUSE his man to man skills were horrible? In addition, he was the #2 CB and was not required to take on the #1 WR very often. If you look at the AFC West, their #2 WR's are some of the weakest in football. What gives?

Hall was supposed to form one of the top cornerback duos in the league with Nnamdi Asomugha, but struggled from the start of the season as he adjusted to the Raiders' man-to-man defense.

In his eight games in Oakland, Hall was beaten 40 times for 552 yards on 66 passes thrown his way, according to data compiled by STATS LLC. He gave up more yards than any defender this season and was tied for third worst in catches allowed.

Hall said earlier this season it took him time to get used to Oakland's man-to-man style of defense after being able to freelance frequently while playing zone with the Falcons.

Washington's proximity to his home town, the team's system (a press-man coverage system in which corners are put in position to make plays on the ball with great regularity) and the Redskins' 6-3 record all helped sway him

So I think we should hesitate before claiming hall our new #1 CB, even though he is being paid like one.

From the games I watched last year, I thought he did quite well for a mid-season acquisition. By the end of the year, he was starting over Carlos Rogers. With a full off-season and previous 1/2 season under his belt, I think he's going to make an impact. He's shown he has adequate hands (much better than stone hands Rogers) at the very least and can hold his own. Is he a true shut down corner in the Redskins scheme? Time will tell, but he is definitely going to be an asset in our secondary.

For reference, Randy Moss was said to have been washed up in Oakland, too...

I think everyone agrees that Oakland makes players worse. But, I just wonder if our little tryout of DeAngelo showed enough to warrant the money given. It seems odd that he admitted he had trouble mastering man to man coverage, yet, it was his man to man press coverage skills that the Redskins say they wanted him for???

I hope this isn't another case of the FO and coaches not doing their homework. (Archuleta?)

Patience Grasshopper's.......Patience....

The comparison of the systems actually sounds backwards.
There is a difference between man, and press man.

Oakland, from my understanding actually plays the press man. The corner is arms reach from the reciever at the beginning of the play on.

Washington's man system requires the corner to play 5 yards off, eyes in the backfield at the snap. this way they can support the run, and jump short to intermediate routes, and if the route goes long, release to the safey as the play dictates.

Playing 5 -7 yards off is Hall's strong suit. He takes risk, but makes them pay off at times. In oakland, he was not allowed to look into the backfield but expected to mirror the reciever step for step and could not do it. doing that is actually the definition of a "Shut Down" corner. We have a rep for playing way due to the years of Green and Bailey roaming the far sides of the field, but that is not how we play anymore.

Smoot is also good at playing off the ball, problem is he plays 7 yards off on 3rd and 4. Carlos has the instincts to jump the route, just not catch the ball, which has be covered a 1000 times over.

dad23hogjrs wrote:The comparison of the systems actually sounds backwards.
There is a difference between man, and press man.

Oakland, from my understanding actually plays the press man. The corner is arms reach from the reciever at the beginning of the play on.

Washington's man system requires the corner to play 5 yards off, eyes in the backfield at the snap. this way they can support the run, and jump short to intermediate routes, and if the route goes long, release to the safey as the play dictates.

Playing 5 -7 yards off is Hall's strong suit. He takes risk, but makes them pay off at times. In oakland, he was not allowed to look into the backfield but expected to mirror the reciever step for step and could not do it. doing that is actually the definition of a "Shut Down" corner. We have a rep for playing way due to the years of Green and Bailey roaming the far sides of the field, but that is not how we play anymore.

Smoot is also good at playing off the ball, problem is he plays 7 yards off on 3rd and 4. Carlos has the instincts to jump the route, just not catch the ball, which has be covered a 1000 times over.

Thanks, that answers it, mostly. I realize now, I was putting too much stock in the media reports or "press man coverage" at Oakland AND Washington. Thinking back, I rarely recall seeing a Skins CB in bump and run mode.

Still there was mention of Deangelo being more comfortable in zone, but I'm not buying that either. Thanks.

I'm not sure it's entirely correct to say Redskin corners are taught to jump short to intermediate routes. Frankly, I think the whole point of the Williams/Blache scheme is to keep the action in front of you and force the offense to negotiate a long field rather than give up cheap touchdowns.

Mainly, this is a function of our front four, since the coaches had no confidence we could generate pressure without blitzing — and not even then.

Hopefully with the addition of Haynesworth to collapse the pocket and flush the quarterback out to the DEs, that will change and the defense as a whole can play more aggressively.

Hall's game is to read and jump routes. He does not do press coverage. It's that simple. Playing the Redskins style actually benefits from the strenths Hall brings to the table... and with a little pressure on the QB, opportunities to read and jump routes will dramatically increase.

He will flourish under Greg Blache.

yes he's a good fit

Countertrey wrote:Hall's game is to read and jump routes. He does not do press coverage. It's that simple. Playing the Redskins style actually benefits from the strenths Hall brings to the table... and with a little pressure on the QB, opportunities to read and jump routes will dramatically increase.

He will flourish under Greg Blache.

Agreed. He was totally miscast as a bump and run corner in Oakland.

fleetus wrote:As a Hokie and Redskins fan, I was happy to see Deangelo in Burgundy and Gold. (Snyder needs to look towards Blacksburg in the draft a little more often too, but I digress) There is something that has been bothering me. Skins wanted to keep Hall because, they say, he is great in man-to-man coverage and their defensive scheme requires CB's to go one on one quite often.

Okay, so then why did Oakland say they cut DeAngelo BECAUSE his man to man skills were horrible? In addition, he was the #2 CB and was not required to take on the #1 WR very often. If you look at the AFC West, their #2 WR's are some of the weakest in football. What gives?

Hall was supposed to form one of the top cornerback duos in the league with Nnamdi Asomugha, but struggled from the start of the season as he adjusted to the Raiders' man-to-man defense.

In his eight games in Oakland, Hall was beaten 40 times for 552 yards on 66 passes thrown his way, according to data compiled by STATS LLC. He gave up more yards than any defender this season and was tied for third worst in catches allowed.

Hall said earlier this season it took him time to get used to Oakland's man-to-man style of defense after being able to freelance frequently while playing zone with the Falcons.

Washington's proximity to his home town, the team's system (a press-man coverage system in which corners are put in position to make plays on the ball with great regularity) and the Redskins' 6-3 record all helped sway him

So I think we should hesitate before claiming hall our new #1 CB, even though he is being paid like one.

I couldn't care less what he did in Oakland, I liked what I saw last year in Washington!

sch1977 wrote:... I couldn't care less what he did in Oakland, I liked what I saw last year in Washington!

agreed - c'mon people, this is not that difficult to understand.

He came here and was given an opportunity which from what I saw he more than took advantage of

The Redskins most likely factored in what they saw from Hall with what they had and realized IF we can get Fat Albert and he somehow plays more games than he's been able to in the past - then the secondary is going to benefit a lot more from that pressure.

Our defense on paper is definetly better than last year and last year's group had a pretty good year statistically now we have to hope we can add the LB that we still really need and that the trainers and conditioning coaches can get Fat Albert on the field for most of the games rather than on the sidelines

Hall could very well turn out to be a bust, but I don't see any reason why we should expect that over the likelihood that he'll play well here. The FO did a good job in making sure he was re-signed.