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Safety to look at?
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 3:43 pm
by yupchagee
Just cut:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/778 ... c5R.VDubYF
Jimmy Williams #24 Safety Atlanta Falcons Height: 6-2 Weight: 216
Born: Mar 8, 1984 - Hampton, VA
College: Virginia Tech
Draft: 2006 - 2nd round (5th pick) by the Atlanta Falcons
Hasn't done much, but was a 2nd rnd pick, so there SHOULD be some talent there. We only have 6 on roster & 1 of them (Kareem Moore) is injured.
Re: Safety to look at?
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 3:55 pm
by PulpExposure
yupchagee wrote:We only have 6 on roster & 1 of them (Kareem Moore) is injured.
Lol.
Only 6 safeties!
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 4:04 pm
by GSPODS
That, and there is a reason why these players get cut BEFORE training camp.
Williams showed up overweight and with a poor attitude.
Why do people keep suggesting the Redskins pick up these problem children?
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:50 pm
by LOSTHOG
I would take a look at him. I watched him play his whole career at Tech. I really don't remember any real trouble there. He is by far better than any safety we brought in this year. He is worth a look. If nothing else, being cut may have humbled him. Never hurts to bring a guy in for a look.
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:51 pm
by Paralis
because there's no real downside. If the Redskins can claim him on waivers, he's bound by his rookie contract, so he'll play for basically nothing for the next two years. And if he can't make the final 53, they won't owe him a cent (further, because he's not a vested veteran, his salary is only guaranteed on a per-game basis, so it's not like they're liable if he turns into a turd in the opener).
Given that safety's definitely not a position of strength on the team, and given the price of the contract, I don't think there's any real reason not to take a flyer.
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:21 pm
by GSPODS
FLOWERY BRANCH, Ga. -- The Atlanta Falcons released disgruntled safety Jimmy Williams on Tuesday, two years after trading up 10 spots to pick him in the second round of the NFL draft.
"It's a football decision," new Falcons coach Mike Smith said. "It's a decision we made, and one that we've been evaluating."
With only seven career starts in 27 games, Williams made a poor first impression on Smith, who demoted the former Virginia Tech standout to third string after he reported to a voluntary mini-camp nearly 20 pounds overweight.
Williams skipped the next two days of the voluntary camp, but despite falling behind Erik Coleman and rookie Thomas DeCoud on the depth chart, he was present at every team session before Tuesday.
"I knew it could get to this point, but I wasn't sure it would," Williams told the Daily Press of Newport News, Va. "They've been upset with my weight, but I didn't think the weight thing was a big issue. I thought they were hiding behind that. Other than that, there weren't any real disputes between me and the Falcons."
Williams was deemed expendable despite DUI charges Atlanta police filed last weekend against safety Daren Stone, who was on the field at practice Tuesday.
Stone is listed as the No. 2 strong safety behind Lawyer Milloy.
"There isn't really anything I can say other than I'm disappointed," Smith said. "We're disappointed as an organization. I spoke with Daren and, again, any of those conversations I would like to keep private."
Williams, who has just one interception and 40 tackles in his career, seemed at odds with the Falcons under three coaching staffs. An ankle injury contributed to his struggles as a rookie under former coach Jim Mora, and last year's coach, Bobby Petrino, put him on the inactive list twice for poor play on special teams.
Before mini-camp in May 2007, former defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer moved Williams from cornerback to safety, but the switch didn't help. Williams failed to beat out Chris Crocker for a starting job, a scenario similar to his rookie year when Jason Webster stayed atop the depth chart at right cornerback.
Falcons president and former general manager Rich McKay swapped draft picks with Green Bay to take Williams 37th overall in 2006. He was the first pick that year for Atlanta, which didn't have a first-round spot after acquiring defensive end John Abraham in a three-team trade.
But Williams' stock had fallen enough as a senior that four NFL teams drafted cornerbacks ahead of him. Entering his final year at Virginia Tech, Williams had been considered by some draft experts as the best player at his position.
The dismissal of Williams leaves the Falcons with only one former Virginia Tech player, imprisoned quarterback Michael Vick.
When Williams was drafted, team owner Arthur Blank seemed proud of Atlanta's connection with the Hokies, saying that "we're building a little fraternity here."
Cornerback DeAngelo Hall was coming off his first Pro Bowl season, Matt Lehr started at left guard, Bryan Randall was competing for a backup quarterback job, and Vick was the franchise centerpiece.
Vick's dogfighting crimes landed him a 23-month federal sentence and indefinite NFL suspension last year. Lehr, who served a four-game suspension for violating the NFL's steroid policy in 2006, was cut in March '07 after an ineffective and injury-marred season.
Hall complained throughout Petrino's lone season with Atlanta. His demands for a new contract didn't sit well with new general manager Thomas Dimitroff, who traded Hall to Oakland in March.
Randall, the Atlantic Coast Conference offensive player of the year in 2004, was placed on waivers twice by the Falcons.
No risk. And no reward.
Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:48 pm
by Fios
Especially when you highlight the DUI and subsequent reaction to it for a totally different player.
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:06 pm
by GSPODS
Fios wrote:Especially when you highlight the DUI and subsequent reaction to it for a totally different player.
I believe the highlighted passage says that Atlanta deemed Williams expendable
despite the fact that Stone, the player ahead of him on the depth chart, was recently charged with a DUI. I don't see the confusion.
Re: Safety to look at?
Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:41 pm
by yupchagee
PulpExposure wrote:yupchagee wrote:We only have 6 on roster & 1 of them (Kareem Moore) is injured.
Lol.
Only 6 safeties!
Yes, ONLY. We will probably carry 5 on the 53 man roster. 6 is not many entering camp. I'm not suggesting that he wil make the Pro Bowl, just that we need some more competition there.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:17 am
by LOSTHOG
Despite all the kind things GSPODS said of him, he his still worth a look. I stand by my original statement that he is still better than any safety we have brought in this year. I'm not really sold on the Falcons as talent evaluators.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:24 am
by yupchagee
LOSTHOG wrote:Despite all the kind things GSPODS said of him, he his still worth a look. I stand by my original statement that he is still better than any safety we have brought in this year. I'm not really sold on the Falcons as talent evaluators.
Exactly! Just look at our current roster at S. We have an injured rookie 6th rnd pick, a rookie 7th rnd pick & a career ST player among our 6. That leaves only 3 who we can have reasonable confidence can play S in the NFL.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:21 am
by GSPODS
yupchagee wrote:LOSTHOG wrote:Despite all the kind things GSPODS said of him, he his still worth a look. I stand by my original statement that he is still better than any safety we have brought in this year. I'm not really sold on the Falcons as talent evaluators.
Exactly! Just look at our current roster at S. We have an injured rookie 6th rnd pick, a rookie 7th rnd pick & a career ST player among our 6. That leaves only 3 who we can have reasonable confidence can play S in the NFL.
Our career special teamer (Fox) has far more than 40 career tackles.
The Skins have two strong safeties already.
What they need is another solid free safety.
I've never been sold on picking up bad team's rejects.
Williams had a total of 16 tackles in 14 games in 2007. One per game.
27 career games and 40 career tackles. For the Falcons.
Every time a player is cut from any team for any reason, we get the privilege of having someone start a "Should "We" Get Him?" Thread. I doubt I need to list them all here.
I was hoping these threads had died with the creator of most of them.
If Ed Reed, Chris Harris, Sean Jones or Bob Sanders become available, please start a ""Should "We" Get Him?" thread.
As for safeties with fewer tackles in two seasons than Anthony Montgomery had last season, let's pass and hope the Redskins do the same.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:25 am
by VetSkinsFan
If that happened, you'd have less material to suck the life out of!!
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:50 am
by LOSTHOG
GSPODS wrote:The Skins have two strong safeties already.
What they need is another solid free safety.
Williams can play free safety. Williams can play corner if need be. Have you ever watched the kid play or are you basing your opinion of what a loser this kid is on a reporters article? If that is the case then we need to dump our whole team according to JLC.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:58 am
by GSPODS
LOSTHOG wrote:GSPODS wrote:The Skins have two strong safeties already.
What they need is another solid free safety.
Williams can play free safety. Williams can play corner if need be. Have you ever watched the kid play or are you basing your opinion of what a loser this kid is on a reporters article? If that is the case then we need to dump our whole team according to JLC.
I am basing my opinion on several things.
The first is that Landry at free safety and Doughty at strong safety is a more experienced combination than is Landry and Williams.
The second is that Williams couldn't play cornerback, even for the Falcons.
He gained too much weight, was told so, and didn't think he needed to lose it. So, he was moved to safety, where he was third string, gained more weight, was told to lose it, didn't think it was important, and was cut.
I see a pattern, one that doesn't bode well for coaching Jimmy Williams.
If we throw out the stats, the experience, and the team he played for, we still have what appears to be a poor attitude and a suspect work ethic.
Now, take what Williams admitted to, the weight issue, and add the supporting evidence, namely the team's statement of disappointment, the team's statement of long-term evaluation, the team's decision timing.
Evaluate the evidence. Williams did not take the weight issue seriously and made no effort to lose the weight. Williams failed to display extra effort by attending
all of the voluntary OTA's. The team did not feel that there would be a change in effort or results, and therefore, cut Williams before training camp. If the
only issue was the weight, training camp alone probably would have resolved that. The evidence indicates that the weight issue is a symptom of a larger issue.
Taking an educated guess, the larger issue is either lack of talent or poor attitude and work ethic. From what I have seen, Williams has displayed signs of talent. He has also displayed lack of effort. That leads me to conclude his lack of effort exceeds his talent.
Could I be wrong? Of course. That's why this is an opinion. You said as much yourself. But the record indicates that problem children have to go to Dallas to survive training camp and cuts.
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:06 pm
by yupchagee
GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:LOSTHOG wrote:Despite all the kind things GSPODS said of him, he his still worth a look. I stand by my original statement that he is still better than any safety we have brought in this year. I'm not really sold on the Falcons as talent evaluators.
Exactly! Just look at our current roster at S. We have an injured rookie 6th rnd pick, a rookie 7th rnd pick & a career ST player among our 6. That leaves only 3 who we can have reasonable confidence can play S in the NFL.
Our career special teamer (Fox) has far more than 40 career tackles.
The Skins have two strong safeties already.
What they need is another solid free safety.
I've never been sold on picking up bad team's rejects.
Williams had a total of 16 tackles in 14 games in 2007. One per game.
27 career games and 40 career tackles. For the Falcons.
Every time a player is cut from any team for any reason, we get the privilege of having someone start a "Should "We" Get Him?" Thread. I doubt I need to list them all here.
I was hoping these threads had died with the creator of most of them.
If Ed Reed, Chris Harris, Sean Jones or Bob Sanders become available, please start a ""Should "We" Get Him?" thread.
As for safeties with fewer tackles in two seasons than Anthony Montgomery had last season, let's pass and hope the Redskins do the same.
Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:08 pm
by yupchagee
GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:LOSTHOG wrote:Despite all the kind things GSPODS said of him, he his still worth a look. I stand by my original statement that he is still better than any safety we have brought in this year. I'm not really sold on the Falcons as talent evaluators.
Exactly! Just look at our current roster at S. We have an injured rookie 6th rnd pick, a rookie 7th rnd pick & a career ST player among our 6. That leaves only 3 who we can have reasonable confidence can play S in the NFL.
Our career special teamer (Fox) has far more than 40 career tackles.
The Skins have two strong safeties already.
What they need is another solid free safety.
I've never been sold on picking up bad team's rejects.
Williams had a total of 16 tackles in 14 games in 2007. One per game.
27 career games and 40 career tackles. For the Falcons.
Every time a player is cut from any team for any reason, we get the privilege of having someone start a "Should "We" Get Him?" Thread. I doubt I need to list them all here.
I was hoping these threads had died with the creator of most of them.
If Ed Reed, Chris Harris, Sean Jones or Bob Sanders become available, please start a ""Should "We" Get Him?" thread.
As for safeties with fewer tackles in two seasons than Anthony Montgomery had last season, let's pass and hope the Redskins do the same.
Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:50 pm
by GSPODS
yupchagee wrote:Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
I'll admit, the thought of Vernon Fox backing up Reed Doughty at strong safety is not an appealing one. Unfortunately, reliable and experienced strong safeties are hard to come by. Free Safeties are almost a dime a dozen, and as stated earlier, a cornerback can play the position in an emergency.
I will say that whatever the Redskins do, I hope it involves keeping LaRon Landry at free safety. He's far too valuable at free safety for the Redskins to leave themselves no other options but to move Landry back to strong safety.
I understand Adam Archuleta is available yet again.
Before anyone even asks, it was a sick joke, and no the Redskins should not pick Archuleta back up. There just aren't many decent veteran options (yet). Maybe that will change after training camp cuts (I hope).
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:54 pm
by yupchagee
GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
I'll admit, the thought of Vernon Fox backing up Reed Doughty at strong safety is not an appealing one. Unfortunately, reliable and experienced strong safeties are hard to come by. Free Safeties are almost a dime a dozen, and as stated earlier, a cornerback can play the position in an emergency.
I will say that whatever the Redskins do, I hope it involves keeping LaRon Landry at free safety. He's far too valuable at free safety for the Redskins to leave themselves no other options but to move Landry back to strong safety.
I understand Adam Archuleta is available yet again.
Before anyone even asks, it was a sick joke, and no the Redskins should not pick Archuleta back up. There just aren't many decent veteran options (yet). Maybe that will change after training camp cuts (I hope).
That's exactly why I think yhis kid is worth a look. What do we have to lose?
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:59 pm
by GSPODS
yupchagee wrote:GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
I'll admit, the thought of Vernon Fox backing up Reed Doughty at strong safety is not an appealing one. Unfortunately, reliable and experienced strong safeties are hard to come by. Free Safeties are almost a dime a dozen, and as stated earlier, a cornerback can play the position in an emergency.
I will say that whatever the Redskins do, I hope it involves keeping LaRon Landry at free safety. He's far too valuable at free safety for the Redskins to leave themselves no other options but to move Landry back to strong safety.
I understand Adam Archuleta is available yet again.
Before anyone even asks, it was a sick joke, and no the Redskins should not pick Archuleta back up. There just aren't many decent veteran options (yet). Maybe that will change after training camp cuts (I hope).
That's exactly why I think yhis kid is worth a look. What do we have to lose?
Well, in Williams' defense, he hasn't been charged with DUI, drugs, weapons, or any of the other criminal acts most released players seem to come with. Truthfully, anyone is worth a look, so long as they aren't about to be suspended by the league, like Thurman and Henry. It just seems like grasping at straws ...
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 3:03 pm
by fredp45
I normally fall out on the side of giving someone a look but I get the impression this guy is either really arrogant and never thought the Falcons would do this to him and/or he's just plain stupid!
Va Tech has had their share of great athletes that are arrogant and not real smart (Vick, Vick's brother, Hall) -- they aren't my type of players... I also think Springs could play Free Safety in a pinch and we have a pretty group of corners now.
I'd prefer to give LeCharles Bently the center the Browns recently cut, a chance.
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 3:31 pm
by Cappster
GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
I'll admit, the thought of Vernon Fox backing up Reed Doughty at strong safety is not an appealing one. Unfortunately, reliable and experienced strong safeties are hard to come by. Free Safeties are almost a dime a dozen, and as stated earlier, a cornerback can play the position in an emergency.
I will say that whatever the Redskins do, I hope it involves keeping LaRon Landry at free safety. He's far too valuable at free safety for the Redskins to leave themselves no other options but to move Landry back to strong safety.
I understand Adam Archuleta is available yet again.
Before anyone even asks, it was a sick joke, and no the Redskins should not pick Archuleta back up. There just aren't many decent veteran options (yet). Maybe that will change after training camp cuts (I hope).
I really hope Landry stays at FS. He filled the role well last season and is impact player. FS, IMO, is a position of higher need. Landry can take over any WR that comes along on his path. Flat out, he makes a bigger impact at FS than SS.
Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:11 pm
by VetSkinsFan
Cappster wrote:GSPODS wrote:yupchagee wrote:Fox started several games for us in '06. The results speak for themselves. He is not only not starting material, he really isn't good enough to be a sub. He's there for ST.
We have to free S in Landry & Schweigert. Doughty is 1 good SS & I know Landry CAN play there, but I think he is more effective at FS. I still just see:
Landry & Doughty starting
Schweigert backing up Landry.
?????????????????
I'll admit, the thought of Vernon Fox backing up Reed Doughty at strong safety is not an appealing one. Unfortunately, reliable and experienced strong safeties are hard to come by. Free Safeties are almost a dime a dozen, and as stated earlier, a cornerback can play the position in an emergency.
I will say that whatever the Redskins do, I hope it involves keeping LaRon Landry at free safety. He's far too valuable at free safety for the Redskins to leave themselves no other options but to move Landry back to strong safety.
I understand Adam Archuleta is available yet again.
Before anyone even asks, it was a sick joke, and no the Redskins should not pick Archuleta back up. There just aren't many decent veteran options (yet). Maybe that will change after training camp cuts (I hope).
I really hope Landry stays at FS. He filled the role well last season and is impact player. FS, IMO, is a position of higher need. Landry can take over any WR that comes along on his path. Flat out, he makes a bigger impact at FS than SS.
A little extreme, Capp, but I agree with the sentiment.
Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 2:09 am
by 1niksder
GSPODS wrote:Well, in Williams' defense, he hasn't been charged with DUI, drugs, weapons, or any of the other criminal acts most released players seem to come with. Truthfully, anyone is worth a look, so long as they aren't about to be suspended by the league, like Thurman and Henry. It just seems like grasping at straws ...
Lets see first you were against taking a look at this kid for a bunch of reason that made no sense now it's ok because he wasn't released because he hasn't been charged with DUI, drugs, weapons, or any of the other criminal acts
OK let's look at his whole career so you'll be informed and can get off the fence.
Williams was considered one of the top defensive back in the 2006 draft and the best corner althought three were taken before him including Antonio Cromartie. Maybe because he was linked to a $55,000 lawsuit for payments he may have recieved in Violation of NCAA rules (not sure of the outcome of that one). Atlanta took him two spots after we moved up to get Rocky. In his rookie season with the Falcons, Williams started five games and made 24 tackles, he was limited because of a ankle injury,. That off-season he was cited for possession of marijuana in Richmond, Va. Jim Mora (who drafted him) left that off-season and Bobby Petrino stopped by until Emmitt Thomas was tagged to close out the season. Before any of that happened he was moved from corner to safety, didn't matter because when Mike Smith showed up he started packing up any former Virginia Tech Hokie he could find. Vick is the only ne left but he's locked up and Mike was looking that hard.
Williams wouldn't cost anything to bring in but he he has baggage, he's played both corner and safety, and won't cost much if he pans out.
Posted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 2:37 pm
by fredp45
right, he wouldn't cost us much...just a drop in the average IQ of our players by 5 or more pts...
let's go with the guys we have...