The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

He is diffently the best pound for pound fighter in boxing now- where does he rank in among the greats?

Nowhere near the top ten of ALL time.

Boxing is going through a low ebb period in good fighters in many divisions. I can think of past heavy weights that would be ahead of him in the top five. When you include ALL the other divisions, he would not make the top 10.

We are talking about all time boxers at the peak of their performance level, right?

Diffently, i think kinda the same. He wont be beaten but his undefeated record will be more for a lack of competition than anything else. Dont get me wrong he is the best boxer out now and probably the best one in the past 5 maybe 10 years. I just think he is a generation too late to claim he is the best ever like he and boxing analysists are saying. They might also be saying that to bring attention to a dying sport. He has skills and maybe one of the quickest and best defensive fighters ever. But pound for pound im not sure, but you gotta put him in the top 10 simply because he's never lost and we dont know how he woulda faired against the greats. The best fighters in the sport now in the mid- divisions, he has beat them all. Knocked out the last dude (who was 40 sum and 0) inwhich mayweather had to dump his defensive style and go toe to toe and he peppered the guy all night. So i dont know thats why i ask- theres too many variables.

Assasin atm wrote:... but you gotta put him in the top 10 simply because he's never lost and we dont know how he woulda faired against the greats.

He has not lost YET. He will. Just as much as Julio Cesar Chavez, Sugar Ray Leonard and Mike Tyson did eventually lose. Your point is well taken. He has not fought a worthy set of bouts making him worthy of top ten. His opposition has been at the end of their careers or simply good enough in a sea of mediocrity.

Good fighter, do not get me wrong. Perhaps even great but not anywhere near top 10 of ALL time.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

Assasin atm wrote:... but you gotta put him in the top 10 simply because he's never lost and we dont know how he woulda faired against the greats.

He has not lost YET. He will. Just as much as Julio Cesar Chavez, Sugar Ray Leonard and Mike Tyson did eventually lose. Your point is well taken. He has not fought a worthy set of bouts making him worthy of top ten. His opposition has been at the end of their careers or simply good enough in a sea of mediocrity.

Good fighter, do not get me wrong. Perhaps even great but not anywhere near top 10 of ALL time.

I see your point- no right or wrong awnser because we simply dont know. Everything is speculation. He would go in my top 10 probably at 10 or 9 simply because he is 35-0 but there is no big name for him to fight. Dela Hoya is the biggest name he has fought and he's washed up so who knows. Good thoughts though bro- wish there was a way to decide how good he really is.

If you go by record alone, he would have to be considered one of the best. He can't help that there are no "Sugar Ray's" out there that can challenge him. I say if a person beats the best out there that is in their era, you have to give him credit. I think comparing boxers from different era's is rather difficult. He is definitely one of the best of this era.

Cappster wrote:If you go by record alone, he would have to be considered one of the best. He can't help that there are no "Sugar Ray's" out there that can challenge him. I say if a person beats the best out there that is in their era, you have to give him credit. I think comparing boxers from different era's is rather difficult. He is definitely one of the best of this era.

Thats what i think. There are too many variables that go into deciding who the best is when they have never fought and are from different generations. I think he's in the late top 10 like 8 or 9 maybe 10 but no higher simply because theres no other dominating mid-division fighter but him. He's moved up and down wieght classes to take fights and noone can touch him. He's the best in the a last 10 or so years without a doudt.

Top 20 Heavyweights:

1 Muhammad Ali 56 (37) - 5 (1) - 0
1960-1981 orthodox United States
2 Joe Louis 69 (55) - 3 (2) - 0
1934-1951 orthodox United States
3 Jack Johnson 89 (49) - 14 (7) - 12
1894-1938 orthodox United States
4 Ezzard Charles 90 (51) - 25 (7) - 1
1940-1959 orthodox United States
5 Sam Langford 200 (130) - 47 (9) - 46
1902-1926 orthodox Canada
6 Rocky Marciano 49 (43) - 0 (0) - 0
1947-1955 orthodox United States
7 Harry Wills 79 (49) - 10 (5) - 4
1911-1932 orthodox United States
8 Floyd Patterson 55 (40) - 8 (5) - 1
1952-1972 orthodox United States
9 Jack Sharkey 38 (13) - 14 (4) - 3
1924-1936 orthodox United States
10 Larry Holmes 69 (44) - 6 (1) - 0
1973-2002 orthodox United States
11 Jimmy Bivins 86 (31) - 25 (5) - 1
1940-1955 orthodox United States
12 Evander Holyfield 42 (27) - 9 (2) - 2
1984-2007 orthodox United States
13 Jack Dempsey 66 (51) - 6 (1) - 11
1914-1927 orthodox United States
14 Sam McVea 65 (47) - 15 (5) - 11
1902-1921 orthodox United States
15 Lennox Lewis 41 (32) - 2 (2) - 1
1989-2003 orthodox United Kingdom
16 Mike Tyson 50 (44) - 6 (5) - 0
1985-2005 orthodox United States
17 George Foreman 76 (68) - 5 (1) - 0
1969-1997 orthodox United States
18 Jersey Joe Walcott 51 (32) - 18 (6) - 2
1930-1953 orthodox United States
19 Max Schmeling 56 (40) - 10 (5) - 4
1924-1948 orthodox Germany
20 Sonny Liston 50 (39) - 4 (3) - 0
1953-1970 orthodox United States

Top 20 Light Heavyweights:

1 Gene Tunney 82 (48) - 1 (0) - 3
1915-1928 orthodox United States
2 Archie Moore 185 (131) - 23 (7) - 11
1935-1963 orthodox United States
3 Tommy Loughran 115 (17) - 30 (3) - 12
1919-1937 United States
4 Tommy Gibbons 94 (48) - 5 (1) - 2
1911-1925 orthodox United States
5 Bernard Hopkins 48 (32) - 4 (0) - 1
1988-2007 orthodox United States
6 Roy Jones Jr 51 (38) - 4 (2) - 0
1989-2007 orthodox United States
7 Billy Conn 64 (15) - 12 (3) - 1
1934-1948 orthodox United States
8 Young Stribling 256 (128) - 16 (1) - 15
1921-1933 orthodox United States
9 Battling Levinsky 195 (31) - 54 (4) - 36
1910-1930 orthodox United States
10 Philadelphia Jack O'Brien 134 (54) - 11 (3) - 24
1896-1912 United States
11 Maxie Rosenbloom 221 (19) - 42 (2) - 32
1923-1939 orthodox United States
12 Billy Miske 73 (33) - 16 (1) - 13
1913-1923 orthodox United States
13 Mike McTigue 108 (52) - 46 (11) - 13
1914-1930 orthodox Ireland
14 Paul Berlenbach 42 (35) - 8 (3) - 3
1923-1933 United States
15 Jack Delaney 77 (44) - 13 (4) - 2
1919-1932 orthodox Canada
16 Bob Foster 56 (46) - 8 (6) - 1
1961-1978 orthodox United States
17 Harold Johnson 76 (32) - 10 (4) - 0
1946-1971 orthodox United States
18 Mike Glover 67 (16) - 14 (1) - 13
1908-1916 United States
19 John Henry Lewis 94 (54) - 8 (1) - 5
1931-1939 United States
20 Victor Emilio Galindez 55 (34) - 9 (3) - 4
1969-1980 orthodox Argentina

Top 20 Middleweights:
1 Harry Greb 260 (48) - 21 (2) - 17
1913-1926 orthodox United States
2 Carlos Monzon 87 (59) - 3 (0) - 9
1963-1977 orthodox Argentina
3 Sugar Ray Robinson 173 (108) - 19 (1) - 6
1940-1965 orthodox United States
4 Marvin Hagler 62 (52) - 3 (0) - 2
1973-1987 southpaw United States
5 Jack Dillon 178 (67) - 23 (2) - 30
1908-1923 orthodox United States
6 Dick Tiger 60 (27) - 19 (2) - 3
1952-1970 orthodox Nigeria
7 Mickey Walker 109 (58) - 22 (6) - 5
1919-1935 orthodox United States
8 Tiger Flowers 135 (55) - 16 (10) - 8
1918-1927 southpaw United States
9 Nino Benvenuti 82 (35) - 7 (3) - 1
1961-1971 orthodox Italy
10 Mike Gibbons 110 (38) - 10 (0) - 10
1908-1922 orthodox United States
11 Stanley Ketchel 54 (49) - 4 (2) - 5
1903-1910 United States
12 Mike O'Dowd 85 (33) - 17 (1) - 6
1914-1923 orthodox United States
13 Charley Burley 83 (50) - 12 (0) - 2
1936-1950 orthodox United States
14 Jake LaMotta 83 (30) - 19 (4) - 4
1941-1954 orthodox United States
15 Bryan Downey 82 (24) - 32 (2) - 16
1914-1927 orthodox United States
16 Carl (Bobo) Olson 97 (47) - 16 (7) - 2
1944-1966 orthodox United States
17 Gene Fullmer 55 (24) - 6 (2) - 3
1951-1963 orthodox United States
18 Jeff Smith 110 (35) - 34 (4) - 4
1910-1927 United States
19 Billy Papke 40 (31) - 16 (1) - 7
1906-1919 United States
20 Bert Lytell 71 (24) - 23 (1) - 7
1944-1951 southpaw United States

Top 20 Welterweights:

1 Emile Griffith 85 (23) - 24 (2) - 2
1958-1977 orthodox U.S. Virgin Islands
2 Ted (Kid) Lewis 228 (80) - 44 (5) - 23
1909-1929 United Kingdom
3 Jose Angel Napoles 79 (55) - 7 (4) - 0
1958-1975 orthodox Cuba
4 Jack Britton 212 (30) - 52 (1) - 42
1905-1930 orthodox United States
5 Sugar Ray Leonard 36 (25) - 3 (1) - 1
1977-1997 orthodox United States
6 Dave Shade 147 (16) - 27 (2) - 62
1918-1935 orthodox United States
7 Johnny Griffiths 62 (15) - 37 (1) - 30
1911-1924 United States
8 Henry Armstrong 149 (101) - 21 (2) - 10
1931-1945 orthodox United States
9 Thomas Hearns 61 (48) - 5 (4) - 1
1977-2006 orthodox United States
10 Floyd Mayweather Jr 39 (25) - 0 (0) - 0
1996-2007 orthodox United States
11 Young Corbett III 124 (33) - 12 (4) - 22
1919-1940 southpaw United States
12 Luis Manuel Rodriguez 107 (49) - 13 (3) - 0
1956-1972 orthodox Cuba
13 Jimmy McLarnin 54 (21) - 11 (1) - 3
1923-1936 orthodox Canada
14 Kid Gavilan 108 (28) - 30 (0) - 5
1943-1958 orthodox Cuba
15 Felix Trinidad 42 (35) - 2 (1) - 0
1990-2005 orthodox Puerto Rico
16 Barney Ross 74 (22) - 4 (0) - 3
1929-1938 orthodox United States
17 Pernell Whitaker 40 (17) - 4 (1) - 1
1984-2001 southpaw United States
18 Harry Lewis 101 (46) - 34 (2) - 20
1903-1913 United States
19 Curtis Cokes 62 (30) - 14 (3) - 4
1958-1972 orthodox United States
20 Soldier Bartfield 120 (34) - 68 (5) - 32
1911-1932 orthodox United States

Top 20 Lightweights:

1 Carlos Ortiz 61 (30) - 7 (1) - 1
1955-1972 orthodox Puerto Rico
2 Benny Leonard 183 (70) - 18 (4) - 12
1911-1932 orthodox United States
3 Joe Gans 130 (89) - 8 (5) - 15
1891-1909 orthodox United States
4 Packey McFarland 101 (51) - 1 (1) - 7
1904-1915 United States
5 Ike Williams 125 (60) - 24 (6) - 5
1940-1955 orthodox United States
6 Roberto Duran 103 (70) - 16 (4) - 0
1968-2001 orthodox Panama
7 Tony Canzoneri 141 (44) - 24 (1) - 10
1925-1939 orthodox United States
8 Ismael Laguna 65 (37) - 9 (0) - 1
1960-1971 orthodox Panama
9 Lou Ambers 94 (31) - 8 (2) - 7
1932-1941 orthodox United States
10 Lockport Jimmy Duffy 93 (21) - 22 (5) - 26
1908-1921 orthodox United States
11 Johnny Dundee 185 (23) - 64 (2) - 39
1910-1932 orthodox United States
12 Freddie Welsh 110 (32) - 24 (1) - 16
1905-1922 United Kingdom
13 Sammy Angott 94 (22) - 28 (1) - 8
1935-1950 orthodox United States
14 Beau Jack 88 (43) - 24 (4) - 5
1939-1955 orthodox United States
15 Rocky Kansas 125 (39) - 26 (3) - 13
1911-1932 United States
16 Bob Montgomery 75 (37) - 19 (3) - 3
1938-1950 orthodox United States
17 Sammy Mandell 137 (31) - 27 (6) - 11
1920-1934 United States
18 Joe Brown 105 (47) - 46 (10) - 13
1943-1970 orthodox United States
19 Freddie Dawson 101 (46) - 13 (2) - 3
1943-1954 orthodox United States
20 Billy Petrolle 121 (65) - 25 (3) - 14
1922-1934 United States

If you think you can place Floyd Mayweather above any 10 of these names, be my guest. I can't even place Mayweather in the Top 50 (yet), although Mayweather isn't done yet. Most of these names are long retired.

I can see that- but i still think its too hard to say because he cant fight anybody on that level and its one thing to judge on record and another to judge on actual fighter himself .But that doesnt make him not as good as the top fighters but it also can hender people from putting him up that list. I dont know where he ranks, i put him on my top 10 pound for pound fighters strickly because of his record and that noone can touch him. How good he really is i quess we will never know. But ive watch espn classic boxing as much as i do football and i gotta tell you that Mayweathers skill ability is up there with the greats in any wieght class. Thanks for the collection of top 10's bro- it was well put together.

Assasin atm wrote:He is diffently the best pound for pound fighter in boxing now- where does he rank in among the greats?

I would definitely put these 10 ahead of Mayweather AT THIS POINT and say he has a chance to pass most of them if he can do this for a 20 or so fights. I weigh KO ratio heavily and Mayweather’s is strong.

10 Julio Cesar Chavez - Won 104 Lost 5, 2 draws, 80 KO.

Should probably have him higher. Titles in 3 divisions. 13 years before not winning a fight, with a draw to Pernell Whitaker - another year before he lost which he avenged. Avenged all late career losses (24 years) except loss to de la Hoya.

9 Thomas Hearns - 59 wins 4 Loss 1 Draw, 46 KO.

Seven world championships in six weight classes in 22 years

8 Joe Frazier - 32 wins, 4 losses, 1 draw, 27 KO

If you ever saw him you know

7 Rocky Marciano - Won 49 Lost 0, 43 KO

Undefeated bro!

6 Sugar) Ray Leonard - 36 Wins, 3 Loss, 1 Draw, 25 KO

8 titles in multiple divisions

5 Marvin Hagler - 62 Wins, 3 Losses, 2 Draws, 52 KO

Avenged only 2 losses before “loss” to Leonard

4 Archie Moore - 181 wins, 24 losses, 9 draws and 1 no contest, 145 KO

4 decades! Only fighter to face both Marciano and Ali! Titles in 2 weight classes. Most KOs ever.

3 Joe Louis - Won 68 Lost 3, 54 KO

Aside from 2 failed comebacks due to debt avenged only loss (Schmeling). National hero at time despite his color.

1a Muhammed (Louisville Lip) Ali - won 56 Lost 5, 37 KO

I think he would have toyed with anyone in his prime. He actually toyed with Frazier after 3 year layoff but ran out of gas. Avenged all losses until well, well, well past his prime. Probably the best ever but we missed his 3 best years because he refused to go to Viet Nam.

1 Sugar Ray Robinson 179 wins, 19 losses, 6 draws, 2 no contests, 109 KO

Won the middleweight title an unprecedented 5 times.

DarthMonk

DarthMonk wrote:

Assasin atm wrote:He is diffently the best pound for pound fighter in boxing now- where does he rank in among the greats?

I would definitely put these 10 ahead of Mayweather AT THIS POINT and say he has a chance to pass most of them if he can do this for a 20 or so fights. I weigh KO ratio heavily and Mayweather’s is strong.

10 Julio Cesar Chavez - Won 104 Lost 5, 2 draws, 80 KO.

Should probably have him higher. Titles in 3 divisions. 13 years before not winning a fight, with a draw to Pernell Whitaker - another year before he lost which he avenged. Avenged all late career losses (24 years) except loss to de la Hoya.

9 Thomas Hearns - 59 wins 4 Loss 1 Draw, 46 KO.

Seven world championships in six weight classes in 22 years

8 Joe Frazier - 32 wins, 4 losses, 1 draw, 27 KO

If you ever saw him you know

7 Rocky Marciano - Won 49 Lost 0, 43 KO

Undefeated bro!

6 Sugar) Ray Leonard - 36 Wins, 3 Loss, 1 Draw, 25 KO

8 titles in multiple divisions

5 Marvin Hagler - 62 Wins, 3 Losses, 2 Draws, 52 KO

Avenged only 2 losses before “loss” to Leonard

4 Archie Moore - 181 wins, 24 losses, 9 draws and 1 no contest, 145 KO

4 decades! Only fighter to face both Marciano and Ali! Titles in 2 weight classes. Most KOs ever.

3 Joe Louis - Won 68 Lost 3, 54 KO

Aside from 2 failed comebacks due to debt avenged only loss (Schmeling). National hero at time despite his color.

1a Muhammed (Louisville Lip) Ali - won 56 Lost 5, 37 KO

I think he would have toyed with anyone in his prime. He actually toyed with Frazier after 3 year layoff but ran out of gas. Avenged all losses until well, well, well past his prime. Probably the best ever but we missed his 3 best years because he refused to go to Viet Nam.

1 Sugar Ray Robinson 179 wins, 19 losses, 6 draws, 2 no contests, 109 KO

Won the middleweight title an unprecedented 5 times.

DarthMonk

I agree with most of those fighters position except i woulda had Rocky second if not tied for first with Ali and Robinson close behind. My point of view is not so much on career longevity as much as it is actual in ring ability and the fact that noone has touched Mayweather. Noone has touched him because of lack of competition or he's just that dang good (No way to judge). Mayweather wont have the career longevity to get 150 fights under his belt because he has stated he doesnt wanna fight much longer and in the mean time he's on a two year break from the Hatton fight. I dont think that fact should figure into where he ranks. Dont get me wrong- i dont really care much for Mayweather ( Im more of a Tyson/ Roy Jones/ Marvin Hagler man) but i do appreciate a boxer who has perfected the sweet science. I think until he's defeated he has to go into the top 10 of all time ( i would say at number 10). Diffently in the top 5 of middle wieght class fighters. The debate continues.