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Can The Defense Be Fixed?

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:19 am
by SkinzCanes
A very interesting read from Jason La Canfora's Blog. I cant argue with anything that he says.

The Defense Rests, Rolls Over and Falls Asleep


In the process of reporting a story I am working on for the weekend, I've talked to a lot of NFL people. Current and former coaches and general managers. Scouts and decision makers. Lots of Redskins coaches and players. Former Redskins coaches and players. Agents for many people associated with the team.

All have essentially said the same thing: Fixing this defense is not going to be easy.

When Grilliams arrived here in 2004 he heard a lot of talk about how weak his talent was, about how they could not make plays on defense, about what a struggle it would be. And somehow they managed to be the third best D in the league. His scheme was rugged, his timing and feel for the blitz impeccable and pretty much everyone on that defense had a career year. Do you remember guys like Ron Warner, Matt Bowen, Jermaine Haley, Andre Lott, Garnell Wilds and Chris Clemons making plays? Know how many of them are still even in the league, or, if they are, actually playing?

Williams's stock was never higher. The next season the D dropped off, but hit stride in the playoff push, getting sacks, turnovers and defensive touchdowns like never before. It was enough to finish in the top 10 for the season, but there were some problems. Lemar Marshall had a strong season, but not an Antonio Pierce season at middle linebacker. The heart of the run defense, tackles Joe Salave'a and Cornelius Griffin, were hurt for large stretches and a team impervious to any runner in 2004 went through a deep rut where it could not stop the ground game (Tiki at the Meadowlands, anyone?)

Shawn Springs, playing like a shutdown corner, became dogged by injury problems again. Safety Ryan Clark, whose worth to the franchise will be explained in some detail in the story I am working on, was allowed to walk away for a pittance in Dan Snyder spending terms. Cornerback Carlos Rogers, the team's top first round pick in 2005, showed flashes of ability, but clearly had a ways to go. Warrick Holdman, the starting weakside linebacker after the LaVargate fiasco, has a brutal season all the way around. Save for a three-game flurry by Phillip Daniels in December 2005, the team had no defense end on its roster who showed an ability to fluster a quarterback regularly.

Which brings us to 2006. The Archuleta for Clark swap has been a abject failure, and the signing of Andre Carter to be that stud, pass-rushing D end has been a flop. No need to belabor those points.

I had two general managers and a high-ranking NFC personnel executive go over the defensive roster in detail with me. Couldn't really argue with what they said.

Essentially, all reached the same conclusions:

On the D line, Griffin is the only top flight talent, and after two straight years or serious injuries and little individual talent around him, expecting a return to 2004-form from a guy who will be 30 next year might be a bit much. Carter appears lost from his switch to LB last year. Salave'a is worried his career is nearing its end due to all of his injuries. Golston looks good, but Daniels is nearing the end. An overhaul could be in order, and we know the kind of success that type of thing generally produces with the Redskins.

At linebacker, Marcus Washington is the only above-average talent, they said. And it's become very clear how easy and fruitful it is to simply run plays to the opposite side. Holdman might be playing his last NFL season, these guys said, and is "just a guy," as one put it. Lemar is not that big to be playing inside, struggles in coverage and may be best suited to weak side. He plays very hard, and, at his size, these guys said it is natural for his body to be so beat up now.
They all like Rocky McIntosh, and, while realizing he has a lot to learn, were shocked the learning curve on the field has not begun, even if just on third down. For what he Redskins gave up - swapping second rounds, giving up this year's second rounder and a sixth rounder, "You've to start to see what the kid can do," as one personnel guy put it.

In the secondary, Rogers, considering how high he was taken, has not proven anything yet. He has the tools to be very good. Does he have all the maturity and intangibles? We'll have to see. Springs had serious injury problems before, and some close to him figure this will be his last year here. One person who had Kenny Wright on his team before called him "barely serviceable." Sean Taylor has taken steps backward this season. One GM thought he was having to think too much with Archuleta back there, and was not as much of a ball hawk in the passing game. Coverage was never his strong suit at Miami, one scout said, and he still takes poor angles to the ball. Losing Clark has had a dramatically detrimental impact on Sean, for reasons I will explain in the paper this weekend.

These guys I spoke to think it will be very hard for Williams for reverse this thing. No amount of scheming can change the attributes that make his system successful, and he may have overestimated the talent level considerably in terms of who can actually pull it off consistently. They wonder after three years of his intense, willful personality, if it's natural for some to start tuning the message out, or not buying in as thoroughly. Besides Golston and McIntosh, these guys said there is no one on the defensive roster not playing regularly you could say would be a potential impact player in the future, and the turns for the worse taken by the two youngest guys, Rogers and Taylor, are of concern.

The constant trading away of draft picks leaves the team without the means to replenish. People around the league are fully expecting the Redskins to get Nate Clements if/when he becomes available. They also expect the Skins to make a huge bid for Dwight Freeney if possible. Problem is three of the people I spoke to all said the same thing: No way Polian lets Freeney leave Indy.

No on with the Redskins would ever say it, but go back to the class of 2004 free agents and it seems like there was a definite three year plan in place when you look at the ages, experience and injury history of many of those guys. Now a lot of them, quarterback included, seem to be at a career crossroads, and this defense might be, too. Those three years are almost up, and with so many problems stopping the run or the pass, it could be a rough second half for the D.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:07 am
by die cowboys die
i think the D can be fixed in the offseason, but not during this year. it should get a bit better if springs and rogers can ever be on the dang field healthy at the same time.

people like to point to the D-line and while it certainly would be great to have an excellent line, it isn't necessary in GW's system (he had a mediocre line in buffalo yet still shaped them into a top defense, and our '04 and '05 teams were similar).

GW's D is all about the secondary. all the exotic blitzes he loves to do rely on being able to have strong coverage in the secondary, often 1 on 1 since extra guys are sent on the blitz. the blitzing (in theory) makes up for the lack of "pure" pass rush by the line.

this is why our defense looks so horrible compared to last year even though there are only a few different players on the field.

so yes, i think we can shore it up for next year, and should be all set for a good run if we can just get set at the QB position. we only need 2 or 3 players to at least make the defense respectable... the problem is, who's going to find these players? the same front office that made this year's changes to the secondary?

...ugh...

Re: Can The Defense Be Fixed?

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:23 am
by Mursilis
The two most bothersome paragraphs:

The Defense Rests, Rolls Over and Falls Asleep


They all like Rocky McIntosh, and, while realizing he has a lot to learn, were shocked the learning curve on the field has not begun, even if just on third down. For what he Redskins gave up - swapping second rounds, giving up this year's second rounder and a sixth rounder, "You've got to start to see what the kid can do," as one personnel guy put it.


Why are we wasting our young talent? Duckett still sits, Campbell still sits, McIntosh still sits (mostly). Is Holdman really better? Doesn't look like it on the field.


The constant trading away of draft picks leaves the team without the means to replenish. People around the league are fully expecting the Redskins to get Nate Clements if/when he becomes available. They also expect the Skins to make a huge bid for Dwight Freeney if possible. Problem is three of the people I spoke to all said the same thing: No way Polian lets Freeney leave Indy.


We need a real GM, one who will tell Joe NO when he wants to do all those 3 picks for 1 deals. Denver must jump for joy every time we call.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:27 am
by Mursilis
die cowboys die wrote:i think the D can be fixed in the offseason, but not during this year. it should get a bit better if springs and rogers can ever be on the dang field healthy at the same time.


Springs is already 31, meaning he's likely to slow down, not speed up. Plus, he hasn't played a full 16 game season since 2000, meaning his injuries will probably increase.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:49 pm
by The Hogster
Hey guys...all is not lost...we can still buy someone elses talent in Free Agency!!!!

I think we've been pretty poor at evaluating talent....personally I think Ryan Clark and Antonio Pierce are about as good as it gets without paying a ton of money...I also think that Demetric Evans is our best pass rusher, but we never put him in the game.

It's funny that these coaches think so much of their "schemes"..they seem to forget that this is just football...some guys can just play. They're so scared of putting in a player that will 'make a mistake', that they are making the mistake of keeping talent on the shelf. Rocky McIntosh is gonna make mistakes...but guess what, so is Warrick Holdman, so why not put in the guy with more talent?

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:18 pm
by die cowboys die
Mursilis wrote:
die cowboys die wrote:i think the D can be fixed in the offseason, but not during this year. it should get a bit better if springs and rogers can ever be on the dang field healthy at the same time.


Springs is already 31, meaning he's likely to slow down, not speed up. Plus, he hasn't played a full 16 game season since 2000, meaning his injuries will probably increase.


oh, i agree- i meant that during this season the D could improve somewhat if springs and rogers can ever be on the field together. i wouldn't count on that as a long term solution for years to come though, absolutely.

we need a decent #3 CB immediately, and are going to need another #1 prospect very soon. rogers looks like he MIGHT pan out to be a decent #2, but not #1. and as you say, you can never be sure when springs will be out. we can't have our secondary fall apart like this in that event.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:34 pm
by USAFSkinFan
Do we even have any draft picks left for next year? I forgot we used 2 seconds and a sixth for Rocky Mac... and what did we give up for Ducket? We're going to be stuck replacing our castaways with other people's castaways for some time...

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:51 pm
by Mursilis
USAFSkinFan wrote:Do we even have any draft picks left for next year? I forgot we used 2 seconds and a sixth for Rocky Mac... and what did we give up for Ducket? We're going to be stuck replacing our castaways with other people's castaways for some time...


We still have a first round pick, and a few second day picks (5-6th round, I think). At least, we have those now, but when April rolls around, who knows?

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:05 pm
by 1niksder
1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:11 pm
by Mursilis
1niksder wrote:1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7


3 went for Ducket, right?

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:11 pm
by Deadskins
1niksder wrote:1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7

The 3rd pick to Denver / to get Lelie to Atlanta / to bring us Duckett.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:19 pm
by 1niksder
JSPB22 wrote:
1niksder wrote:1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7

The 3rd pick to Denver / to get Lelie to Atlanta / to bring us Duckett.

That's with the current standings, Hopefully the Skins can get on a roll and Denver takes a dive and then we are only looking at swapping #1s

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:25 pm
by Mursilis
1niksder wrote:
JSPB22 wrote:
1niksder wrote:1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7

The 3rd pick to Denver / to get Lelie to Atlanta / to bring us Duckett.

That's with the current standings, Hopefully the Skins can get on a roll and Denver takes a dive and then we are only looking at swapping #1s


I don't get that - so if that happens, won't Denver have a higher pick (having finished worse) than us? Why would they want to switch? Regardless, Denver's probably going to finish with a better record than us, so I don't see that scenario happening.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:37 pm
by Chris Luva Luva
Goodness this front office is retarded.......its just freaking mind numbing. This is the 1st time since Gibbs has came here that Ive felt completely hopeless about an impending season. With the lack of chemistry, picks and plan of action, I dont know what this team is going to do.

Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:25 pm
by 1niksder
Mursilis wrote:
1niksder wrote:
JSPB22 wrote:
1niksder wrote:1
2 - To get McIntosh
3
4 - Went to SF for Lloyd
5
6
7

The 3rd pick to Denver / to get Lelie to Atlanta / to bring us Duckett.

That's with the current standings, Hopefully the Skins can get on a roll and Denver takes a dive and then we are only looking at swapping #1s


I don't get that - so if that happens, won't Denver have a higher pick (having finished worse) than us? Why would they want to switch? Regardless, Denver's probably going to finish with a better record than us, so I don't see that scenario happening.

Lots of ifs & ands in this deal, everything depends on how both teams go into the draft. The trade was for the equivalent of a 3rd round pick not a third. In fact they could get MORE than a 3rd round pick

Here are the 4 difference scenarios

Swap first-round picks if Denver has a significantly lower pick than the Redskins at this point in the season this isn't a option to meet the terms of the deal.

Exchange first-rounders and the Broncos get a fourth-rounder in 2008 but both teams would have to finsh pretty close in the final rankings... Right now not a option

Flip-flop first-rounders and the Broncos get a third- rounder next year again the teams would have to be realitvely close at the end of the year

The last option is the one that would kick in if the season ended today and in that case the Broncos would get a third-rounder in 2007 and a fourth-rounder in 2008. But we wouldn't have to swap a high 1st for a low one.

Posted: Sat Oct 28, 2006 5:14 pm
by Fanforever
Mursilis wrote:
die cowboys die wrote:i think the D can be fixed in the offseason, but not during this year. it should get a bit better if springs and rogers can ever be on the dang field healthy at the same time.


Springs is already 31, meaning he's likely to slow down, not speed up. Plus, he hasn't played a full 16 game season since 2000, meaning his injuries will probably increase.




Springs has only had three seasons of the ten he's been in the league where he's played every game.

Posted: Mon Oct 30, 2006 2:40 am
by crazyhorse1
In all probability, we'll have to spend a 1 and a three on a QB and CB respectively. We'd better hope Montgomery Golson real deals and one of them can shift to DE. We also need to put Arch on the block. Further, we've got to stop kidding ourselves about the OL and Daniels at DE. If Brunell is back, I sersiously think I'd better skip next season for the sake of my health. If Holdman's still around, I'll probably watch but won't expect to win.
If Holdman and Brunell are both still playing, I'll start advocating firing a couple of coaches, starting with Gibbs, my all time favorite NFL coach, as a mercy to him.