The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Damn, this guy is never satisfied. It merely confirms what I've known for almost two years, that it was the right thing to let this guy go. What we got rid of was a whining maggot, and what we got in return was a no-nonsense team player who never complains.

From the Washington Post:

And yet another former Skins receiver is unhappy, again. Laveranues Coles, despite being like the most throwed-to receiver in the league, got a little testy (or shall we say, noisewater-y?) over not featuring much in the J-E-T-S's 41-0 loss to the Jags Sunday I know what I'd to if I owned that team: Threaten to burry him on the bench and buy him a plasma TV. That'll get his attention.

Remember when we got Coles?

He was supposed to be a team leader type, a guy who sacrificed for the team and who would block, go over the middle whatever it took to win...

What the hell happened?

Skinsfan55 wrote:Remember when we got Coles?

He was supposed to be a team leader type, a guy who sacrificed for the team and who would block, go over the middle whatever it took to win...

What the hell happened?

We got "Sideline Santana", who turned out to be all of those things. Turns out we picked the wrong NY receiver the first time around. . .but it was okay, because NY has a generous return policy.

Irn-Bru wrote:

Skinsfan55 wrote:Remember when we got Coles?

He was supposed to be a team leader type, a guy who sacrificed for the team and who would block, go over the middle whatever it took to win...

What the hell happened?

We got "Sideline Santana", who turned out to be all of those things. Turns out we picked the wrong NY receiver the first time around. . .but it was okay, because NY has a generous return policy.

That's hilarious!!! Still, I think Coles gave all on the field; he was no Jacobs/Gardner. It's too bad he wasn't happy here, but that trade sure worked out OK.

Irn-Bru wrote:

Skinsfan55 wrote:Remember when we got Coles?

He was supposed to be a team leader type, a guy who sacrificed for the team and who would block, go over the middle whatever it took to win...

What the hell happened?

We got "Sideline Santana", who turned out to be all of those things. Turns out we picked the wrong NY receiver the first time around. . .but it was okay, because NY has a generous return policy.

i second the

I think we got Moss at the right time. He would have lived up to his name if he had to endure the beating Coles took.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:I think we got Moss at the right time. He would have lived up to his name if he had to endure the beating Coles took.

Yeah, if we had drafted Moss instead of Gardner and he had to play Martyball, and later for Spurrier where recievers ran deep routes only to see the QB get sacked, or if we were lucky throw a checkdown pass to one of the backs or the tight end... he would have the same stigma Coles does.

Personally I think that Coles is a more complete and versitle reciever... but Moss is an explosive playmaker who makes up for some of his minor shortcomings.

Coles is a super position receiver -- the guy who can make the 7 yard catch but his YAC are not that good. He doesn't have the explosion of Moss.

I'd say Coles is more like Hines Ward, will nickle and dime you all day but Moss is a gamebreaker.

fredp45 wrote:Coles is a super position receiver -- the guy who can make the 7 yard catch but his YAC are not that good. He doesn't have the explosion of Moss.

I'd say Coles is more like Hines Ward, will nickle and dime you all day but Moss is a gamebreaker.

I thought Coles had the possibility to be a new Monk - not the fastest, flashiest guy, but the guy with good hands and no fear. Not afraid to go over the middle and get that short-to-medium length pass for that crucial first down, even if it meant getting leveled by a linebacker or safety. I saw Coles get leveled plenty of times, but he always got back up and rarely dropped the ball in the process. Too bad he had to get all bitchy and go back to NY.

Irn-Bru wrote:NY has a generous return policy.

Let's return Hall, too.

Skinsfan55 wrote:
Yeah, if we had drafted Moss instead of Gardner and he had to play Martyball, and later for Spurrier where recievers ran deep routes only to see the QB get sacked, or if we were lucky throw a checkdown pass to one of the backs or the tight end... he would have the same stigma Coles does.

What a silly statement. Based on what? A bad assessment of the situation? How would Moss have earned a reputation as a tough receiver that could make a catch in traffic and play tough? You just said he'd have been downfield on a deep route watching the QB get sacked... is that where Coles was every time? (After all... were it not for their respective situations, they'd be the same right?)

Skinsfan55 wrote: Personally I think that Coles is a more complete and versitle reciever... but Moss is an explosive playmaker who makes up for some of his minor shortcomings.

In what ways is Coles a more 'complete' receiver than Moss?

If anything, Moss has the ability to return punts as well (not that he does), so there's an element of Moss' ame that has never been in Coles'... one that makes him a more 'complete' player. Moss can go deep or take a -1 yard screen pass 75 yards to the house... what can coles do other than catch an intermediate or short pass? We KNOW Coles can't stretch the defense.... and we know that Moss can. Coles is definitely a really tough player thatmay catch MORE intermediate stuff, but is that because he's more complete, or is it because when you can't outrun a defender, you have no choice but to settle into zones or find seams and make tough short-to-medium length receptions?

So what exactly does Coles do so much more that makes him so much more of a complete player? I'm actually curious to know, because frankly... I couldn't disagree any more.

Oh and I forgot... if whining about your situation all the time and not being a team player constitutes being a complete player, then maybe you have a point. Most however, would feel that the guy who acts as a teammate to all and never seems to put personal accolades ahead of those of his team woud be the more 'complete' player.

Yeah, Moss is clearly the better player, now.

I guess I was just thinking about at the time. Coles had a reputation as a great wideout with excellent speed but who could also go over the middle, take tough catches etc.

Moss was thought of as being more one dimentional, like an all or nothing type player, but he's clearly dispelled those myths. He can take passes over the middle, has excellent ability in the open field, can burn guys deep, runs crisp routes, catches everything thrown his way...

He's a much more complete player than Coles, and than we were led to believe he was.

What I was saying about drafting Moss over Gardner is that under Marty and later Steve I don't think he would have been happy.

None of the recievers were happy in these terrible situations. Now in Washington Coles has this stigma of being a whiner, and a guy who forced his way out of town because he failed to see the future.

If Moss had been in the same situation as Coles, then who's to say he wouldn't have reacted similarly? Those teams weren't much fun to watch sometimes, just immaging playing on one.

Just throwing it out there, because I'm not sure when it happened, but Laveranues Coles used to be pretty damn fast.

I'm talking he broke Deion Sanders' speed record at FSU.

And he was pretty consistent with that his first time around with the Jets.

Did something happen when he was with you, or did it just sort of gradually go?

Because I find it hard to believe all that speed just dissipated overnight.

He's had chronic toe injuries that have limited his speed and mobility.

Primetime42 wrote:Just throwing it out there, because I'm not sure when it happened, but Laveranues Coles used to be pretty damn fast.

I'm talking he broke Deion Sanders' speed record at FSU.

And he was pretty consistent with that his first time around with the Jets.

Did something happen when he was with you, or did it just sort of gradually go?

Because I find it hard to believe all that speed just dissipated overnight.

As JP said... ever since the toe injury... Coles hasn't stretched too many DB's... to his credit, he has managed to adapt and get tough yards instead of deep yards. Other than the way he went out, which was pretty cry babyish, I really liked the guy when he was here.

... but after the toe injury, he couldn't seem to do what we originally got him to do... which was to stretch the defense. And then to whine about not being part of the offense enough when you were thrown to as many times as he was, was a little bit much. Very primadonna-ish, and not even really indicative of how he had behaved for his entire team here.

It also seemed that after he left there were a few players that seemed to think that Coles' angst (with not enough catches) had spilled over a little bit into the dressing room towards the end of the year. That was reported after the fact though, and could very well have just been bad reporting.

BEFORE we got Moss, I thought he was the more fragile one... we'd been told that by a certain jets 'expert' that Sideline Santana would 'shy away' from hits and step out of bounds and be often injured.... and never have what it takes to be a number one guy... and nothing could have been further from the truth. The guy plays hard and touch wood... hasn't missed a down that I can remember... and I don't think many people would deny that he's considered one of the most dangerous receivers in the league right now.

Not only that, I could not believe how solid the guy was standing beside him at camp... I always think of him as slight because he's obviously not very big (tall) but the dude is ripped... and to me he plays with no less toughness than Coles did (or does). But Santana is a whole different level of speed than Coles is... at least at their current 'level of ability'... or at least it would seem that way. Most teams try to use two guys to cover Santana for most part, and Coles doesn't command that type of respect IMO.

Fact is, regardless of what people thought of this trade when it went down, as time passes... the Redskins are the ones that really won this trade... at least in terms of personnel - we still paid a giant chunk of money to make it happen that we never should have had to... but Moss for Coles is all Moss right now in my opinion. Were it not for a new CBA agreement the trade may have been more devastating because of the cap hit... but we were able to eat it ultimately... and come out with a dynamite playmaker.

The Jets got a good receiver, and at a better price than we were paying him, but we ended up with a better receiver making less money than Coles was anyway. It worked out pretty well for both teams, but if Coles is going to start playing the 'me' game there then his services might be short-lived.

And considering that Santana was all about how much opportunity he had been sfforded by the Redskins in last week's press conference, I think it's safe to say that from a team spirit stand-point... the Redskins won there as well.

BossHog wrote:

Primetime42 wrote:Just throwing it out there, because I'm not sure when it happened, but Laveranues Coles used to be pretty damn fast.

I'm talking he broke Deion Sanders' speed record at FSU.

And he was pretty consistent with that his first time around with the Jets.

Did something happen when he was with you, or did it just sort of gradually go?

Because I find it hard to believe all that speed just dissipated overnight.

As JP said... ever since the toe injury... Coles hasn't stretched too many DB's... to his credit, he has managed to adapt and get tough yards instead of deep yards. Other than the way he went out, which was pretty cry babyish, I really liked the guy when he was here.

... but after the toe injury, he couldn't seem to do what we originally got him to do... which was to stretch the defense. And then to whine about not being part of the offense enough when you were thrown to as many times as he was, was a little bit much. Very primadonna-ish, and not even really indicative of how he had behaved for his entire team here.

It also seemed that after he left there were a few players that seemed to think that Coles' angst (with not enough catches) had spilled over a little bit into the dressing room towards the end of the year. That was reported after the fact though, and could very well have just been bad reporting.

BEFORE we got Moss, I thought he was the more fragile one... we'd been told that by a certain jets 'expert' that Sideline Santana would 'shy away' from hits and step out of bounds and be often injured.... and never have what it takes to be a number one guy... and nothing could have been further from the truth. The guy plays hard and touch wood... hasn't missed a down that I can remember... and I don't think many people would deny that he's considered one of the most dangerous receivers in the league right now.

Not only that, I could not believe how solid the guy was standing beside him at camp... I always think of him as slight because he's obviously not very big (tall) but the dude is ripped... and to me he plays with no less toughness than Coles did (or does). But Santana is a whole different level of speed than Coles is... at least at their current 'level of ability'... or at least it would seem that way. Most teams try to use two guys to cover Santana for most part, and Coles doesn't command that type of respect IMO.

Fact is, regardless of what people thought of this trade when it went down, as time passes... the Redskins are the ones that really won this trade... at least in terms of personnel - we still paid a giant chunk of money to make it happen that we never should have had to... but Moss for Coles is all Moss right now in my opinion. Were it not for a new CBA agreement the trade may have been more devastating because of the cap hit... but we were able to eat it ultimately... and come out with a dynamite playmaker.

The Jets got a good receiver, and at a better price than we were paying him, but we ended up with a better receiver making less money than Coles was anyway. It worked out pretty well for both teams, but if Coles is going to start playing the 'me' game there then his services might be short-lived.

And considering that Santana was all about how much opportunity he had been sfforded by the Redskins in last week's press conference, I think it's safe to say that from a team spirit stand-point... the Redskins won there as well.

Long story short, you're telling me something I already knew.

And that is, that the Jets screwed up twice when it comes to that guy.

Where have you gone, Terry Bradway?