The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

who do u all think is the best ever, I think its Joe Louis his title rain was very impressive. My grandfather who saw all the greats said it was Marciano, he said Ali and Louis had more talent but he doesn't think they could beat Marciano because he said the Rock had an intangible he always found ways to win, no matter how far behind they were. I think its Louis because of his inside punching when he got inside he hit hard as hell and he threw those punches so fast that they were hard to see. I personally think that the night Frazier fought Ali and won no one could beat him on that night, he just walked through everything Ali threw at him. Ali didn't even put a dent in Frazier. I think its hard to label the greatest ever because they never fought. There is also Jack Johnson, his record is tainted though because he was forced to loose some matches because he was black.

Ali.

I really didn't see Marciano fight, nor did I see Joe Louis fight. Mike Tyson, in his glory days, was just plain scary, however, and I don't think anyone could beat him "in his prime."

Justice Hog wrote:I really didn't see Marciano fight, nor did I see Joe Louis fight. Mike Tyson, in his glory days, was just plain scary, however, and I don't think anyone could beat him "in his prime."

I think a lot of people could beat Tyson in his prime, Tyson's defense was too boring and predictable. Against Ali he has no chance, Tyson stance is built more for Martial arts than Boxing he would keep all his hands toward his body, its hard to get a body shoot on him but against Ali and Foremon in his prime can beat Tyson all u have to do is jam that jab right in his face. He could never defend the jab that is why Holyfield beat him and buster Douglass, he could not defend the jab.

Justice Hog wrote:I really didn't see Marciano fight, nor did I see Joe Louis fight. Mike Tyson, in his glory days, was just plain scary, however, and I don't think anyone could beat him "in his prime."

yes! I agree

How about Braddock?...I dont know, I dont know anything about boxing.

redskins12287 wrote:How about Braddock?...I dont know, I dont know anything about boxing.

"The gentleman" was a scrapper. One of those wonderful stories about rising, falling and struggling on your way back. Great character, but no, I do not think he was the "best" as far as athletic ability was concerned.

Remember guys, the best years were taken away from Ali by Uncle Sam. Still, his character and athletic ability are without a match in boxing. Nobody is better recognised and admired internationally as Ali is (with good reason).

BUT if anybody wanted to REALLY create a good argument here, the name of [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teófilo_Stevenson]Teófilo Stevenson[/url]could have been brought up. Not a professional but probably the greatest heavyweight fighter of all time. He was not allowed to fight Ali. THAT would have been a classic match.

Both of them side-by-side:

Everyone knows Rocky Balboa was the best fighter ever.

I remember watching Stevenson in the Olympics (he boxed for Cuba), and he was just plain scary, too. He could hit you, and you might walk away, but the next thing you knew, they were waving the salts under your nose, without him having to hit you a second time. It was like a time-released knock out, or at least it seemed that way to me. That is one man that I wish would have taken a raft to the States, because he would have been widely hailed as one of the greats. From what I have read about the sport, I'd have to say that Marciano was the best, hard to argue his record. The best I've ever seen fight would definitely go to Ali, he had it all, physical ability, toughness, showmanship and boxing talent.

Consensus normally is Joe Louis.

Rocky...

It's been on TNT all day today.

I'm very disappointed that nobody has mentioned Audley Harrison. Or what about Joe Bugner? Frank Bruno?

What do you mean - I can't be serious?

You're right of course, I'm not serious.

I knew we could rely on RiC to come up with the non American option! It's always easy to overlook the amateurs though.

"Down Go's Fraizer!"

John Manfreda wrote:I personally think that the night Frazier fought Ali and won no one could beat him on that night, he just walked through everything Ali threw at him. Ali didn't even put a dent in Frazier.

Unfortunately, the world missed Ali's prime. He spent it in a suspension for being a "Conscientious Objector." At the time a huge chunk of the populace hated him for it. It wasn't until later in life that he became as beloved as he apparently is now. There were several rounds in that fight that Ali dominated ... where he peppered Fraziers face with strong jabs and Frazier could not touch him. Ali lost because he was rusty and out of shape. I have no doubt that if Ali had been fighting for the previous 3 years Frazier would not have had a chance. Frazier actually spent more time in the hospital after that fight than Ali did. Frazier landed the one huge punch and broke Ali's jaw. Ali really messed up Frazier's face horribly that night. I would say that in his prime Ali was essentially untouchable and had the greatest combination of speed and power the heavyweight division has ever seen. As most boxers will say, it's usually not the raw power of the punch that causes the knockout but rather the fact that you never see it coming and therefore can't deal with it properly. So many never saw Ali's fist coming.

Darth

What about Tommy Gunn

UK Skins Fan wrote:I knew we could rely on RiC to come up with the non American option! It's always easy to overlook the amateurs though.

I consider it a compliment.

Thanks.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

UK Skins Fan wrote:I knew we could rely on RiC to come up with the non American option! It's always easy to overlook the amateurs though.

I consider it a compliment.

Thanks.

Well, it certainly wasn't an insult. But I was a little disappointed that you didn't provide us all with a list of outstanding Tanzanian or Chinese boxers

UK Skins Fan wrote:... But I was a little disappointed that you didn't provide us all with a list of outstanding Tanzanian or Chinese boxers

I agree. I should have mentioned Mbwana Matumla but he is a flyweight and the Poll is about heavyweights.

Pound for pound I'd have to put Archie Moore or better yet Sugar Ray Robinson near the top, but that wasn't the question. Still Sugar Ray Robinson was pretty damn bad!

With the Heavyweights it would have to be Ali, but I think that Jack Johnson earns a pretty close look too.

Chad

BTW, isn't it a shame that they stopped making any decent boxing games for PC, Playstation, etc?

I found fight night round 3 on xbox 360 pretty fun. I only played it twice at a friends house, but from what I played it was probably the best boxing game I've played in a while.

DiRTyHoG3026 wrote:I found fight night round 3 on xbox 360 pretty fun. I only played it twice at a friends house, but from what I played it was probably the best boxing game I've played in a while.

that is a bad ass game, in most video games what gets me pissed is that Marciano is underrated as hell, his power should be skyrocketed.

chaddukes wrote:Pound for pound I'd have to put Archie Moore or better yet Sugar Ray Robinson near the top, but that wasn't the question. Still Sugar Ray Robinson was pretty damn bad!

With the Heavyweights it would have to be Ali, but I think that Jack Johnson earns a pretty close look too.

Chad

BTW, isn't it a shame that they stopped making any decent boxing games for PC, Playstation, etc?

Sugar Ray Robinson hands down pound for pound, the best of all time in two diffrent weight classes, 175-1-2 in his prime, 92 straight wins, no one matches up with him.

Joe Louis

Was Joe Louis the most revered heavyweight of all time? Historian Bert Sugar says yes.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/classic/ ... id=2441173

Boxing has always had GREAT books and writers associated with it. Several of the books have turned into movies (Raging Bull by La Motta himself with other two writers; Cinderella Man by J. Schaap, etc). If your choice is Sugar Ray Robinson, maybe you know:

Pound for Pound
A Biography of Sugar Ray Robinson by H. Boyd and R. Robinson

BernieSki wrote:Was Joe Louis the most revered heavyweight of all time? Historian Bert Sugar says yes.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/classic/ ... id=2441173

One of the best sports writers this generation has -not- really gotten to know.

Boxing's Greatest Fighters is a well-written book by Bert Randolph Sugar. He also wrote about Archie Moore, M. Ali, and others but his best known work is his Boxing Encyclopedia.

Maybe his LEAST well known book and perhaps the MOST relevant in this board is:

I Hate the Dallas Cowboys : And Who Elected Them America's Team Anyway? by him as an editor published in 1997. Look it up. It contains the views of about a dozen players and a dozen writers about the Pukes and why they are the Pukes. Every Redskins fan should read it and it should be quoted in our Football 101 section.

Boxing and football have always attracted the minds of good old fashion great writers, the like of which seem sadly to be in true danger of extinction.

By the way, I stand behind Ali (among heavyweights) but nobody has mentioned the Irish-American John L. Sullivan and the first true African-American boxing legend Jack Johnson. A great documentary entitled
Unforgivable Blackness: The Rise and Fall of Jack Johnson was presented in PBS not too long ago. These two fighters deserve honourable mentions in the history of boxing.