The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

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I really admire Ramsey´s attitude, Joe Gibbs has shown no confidence at all in him, I don´t think at all that naming him the starting QB for next season shows that he has confidence in him, Brunell already showed he can´t play anymore, Hasselback is going to be cut and Campbell is a rookie so his only option is Ramsey.
If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing with Harrington in Detroit, since Harrington got drafted, for the last three years the lions have drafted a WR in the first round and Harrington has played all three years as the starting QB, but Gibbs instead of helping Ramsey what does he does to help him, he drafts a QB in the first round, way to show your confidence in your QB.
I don´t like how everyone is comparing the QB situation with San Diego, Brees started playing in the middle of the season of his rookie year, since that moment he had all the confidence in his coach, he was bench two years ago b/c he showed nothing but he did really got three years to show what he had and it took him until his 4th or 5th season to have a great year, but Ramsey played a few games in his rookie year. his first game he led the team to a huge vivtory at Tennessee, he also beat Dallas that season which was the last time the redskins beat Dallas, his next season under Spurrier he leads the team to the best offense in the NFL for the first 4 weeks, he also beat the Patriots with a horrible o-line, he played with a high school o-line and being hurt of his toe, he plays 10 games before being injured, and last season Gibbs gets Brunell after Spurrier named him the franchise QB and now Gibbs drafts a QB, so for me there´s real no comparison with Brees and Ramsey, two total different scenarios.

All you said is true, and I agree.

...But... It is always important to have a QB in the mnix getting ready for the future. Should Ramsey get hurt, we will be thankful for this pick. Should Ramsey fail this year, at least our rookie QB is getting his confidence pounded this year.

There are a lot of upsides to getting Campbell. In time we will all appreciate this I think. Today, though, it is still hard to swallow.

THE RAM wrote:I really admire Ramsey´s attitude,

Maybe he knows something you do not. Maybe he has had conversations with Joe Gibbs you have not. Maybe all of us could learn something from him.

I agree, what helps more than competition at Qb is knowing that the coach is behind you. Look at Rich Gannon in Oakland. He never succed and than when a coach believed in him (that knew what he was doing) he became the NFL MVP.

I think more than anything, Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey. If Ramsey plays well and continues to play well, he will never come out. This is what Gibbs wants. Brunell is essentially finished after this season, so Gibbs wanted to secure the quarterback position. It gives the team more options if things don't go according to plan. Putting a little pressure on Ramsey won't hurt him. If he can't handle it, he's probably not the guy for us anyway. If he is the guy for the Skins, we will find out this season. The selection of Campbell gives us answers quickly. Oh yeah by the way, how did Rich Gannon play in that SuperBowl in his MVP season?

THE RAM wrote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601456.html

I really admire Ramsey´s attitude, Joe Gibbs has shown no confidence at all in him, I don´t think at all that naming him the starting QB for next season shows that he has confidence in him, Brunell already showed he can´t play anymore, Hasselback is going to be cut and Campbell is a rookie so his only option is Ramsey.
If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing with Harrington in Detroit, since Harrington got drafted, for the last three years the lions have drafted a WR in the first round and Harrington has played all three years as the starting QB, but Gibbs instead of helping Ramsey what does he does to help him, he drafts a QB in the first round, way to show your confidence in your QB.
I don´t like how everyone is comparing the QB situation with San Diego, Brees started playing in the middle of the season of his rookie year, since that moment he had all the confidence in his coach, he was bench two years ago b/c he showed nothing but he did really got three years to show what he had and it took him until his 4th or 5th season to have a great year, but Ramsey played a few games in his rookie year. his first game he led the team to a huge vivtory at Tennessee, he also beat Dallas that season which was the last time the redskins beat Dallas, his next season under Spurrier he leads the team to the best offense in the NFL for the first 4 weeks, he also beat the Patriots with a horrible o-line, he played with a high school o-line and being hurt of his toe, he plays 10 games before being injured, and last season Gibbs gets Brunell after Spurrier named him the franchise QB and now Gibbs drafts a QB, so for me there´s real no comparison with Brees and Ramsey, two total different scenarios.

Oh boy. Where to start. First and foremost, I was at that Dallas game, our last victory over the crackboys, and Ramsey did not win the game--the defense and Dallas (Dave Campo) won the game for us.

Secondly, this is undboubtedly Ramsey's make or break year. No more convenient, Pollyanna, excuses for him. Either win or get out. Gibbs has provided Ramsey with all the tools he needs to succeed, much, much, more than Brunell had. He had better use them to his advantage as I don't think the defense can copy the success they had last year. The offense is going to have to show up and make plays. That means getting rid of Rod Garnder before his losing stench curses the Redskins for the next year.

krills wrote:I think more than anything, Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey. If Ramsey plays well and continues to play well, he will never come out. This is what Gibbs wants. Brunell is essentially finished after this season, so Gibbs wanted to secure the quarterback position. It gives the team more options if things don't go according to plan. Putting a little pressure on Ramsey won't hurt him. If he can't handle it, he's probably not the guy for us anyway. If he is the guy for the Skins, we will find out this season. The selection of Campbell gives us answers quickly. Oh yeah by the way, how did Rich Gannon play in that SuperBowl in his MVP season?

He was there wasn't he. He was playing against his old coach who knew everything about that organazation. Gruden knew the players so well it was an unfair advatage. Ramsey is going to remember this treatment when he is a free agent and is going to say see yeah when he is good.

SKINZ_DOMIN8 wrote:

THE RAM wrote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601456.html

I really admire Ramsey´s attitude, Joe Gibbs has shown no confidence at all in him, I don´t think at all that naming him the starting QB for next season shows that he has confidence in him, Brunell already showed he can´t play anymore, Hasselback is going to be cut and Campbell is a rookie so his only option is Ramsey.
If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing with Harrington in Detroit, since Harrington got drafted, for the last three years the lions have drafted a WR in the first round and Harrington has played all three years as the starting QB, but Gibbs instead of helping Ramsey what does he does to help him, he drafts a QB in the first round, way to show your confidence in your QB.
I don´t like how everyone is comparing the QB situation with San Diego, Brees started playing in the middle of the season of his rookie year, since that moment he had all the confidence in his coach, he was bench two years ago b/c he showed nothing but he did really got three years to show what he had and it took him until his 4th or 5th season to have a great year, but Ramsey played a few games in his rookie year. his first game he led the team to a huge vivtory at Tennessee, he also beat Dallas that season which was the last time the redskins beat Dallas, his next season under Spurrier he leads the team to the best offense in the NFL for the first 4 weeks, he also beat the Patriots with a horrible o-line, he played with a high school o-line and being hurt of his toe, he plays 10 games before being injured, and last season Gibbs gets Brunell after Spurrier named him the franchise QB and now Gibbs drafts a QB, so for me there´s real no comparison with Brees and Ramsey, two total different scenarios.

Oh boy. Where to start. First and foremost, I was at that Dallas game, our last victory over the crackboys, and Ramsey did not win the game--the defense and Dallas (Dave Campo) won the game for us.

Secondly, this is undboubtedly Ramsey's make or break year. No more convenient, Pollyanna, excuses for him. Either win or get out. Gibbs has provided Ramsey with all the tools he needs to succeed, much, much, more than Brunell had. He had better use them to his advantage as I don't think the defense can copy the success they had last year. The offense is going to have to show up and make plays. That means getting rid of Rod Garnder before his losing stench curses the Redskins for the next year.

Are you joking Ramsey has an average to an above average line. Okay above average nothing to go home about. An solid running back, not that great, not a Riggins or Jamal Lewis though. Horrible recievers, no Te, a good H-back. Gibbs hasn't given him the tools at all to work with. When I say above average I mean a c+ when grading them. Don't give me Portis stat crap. He rushed for 30-35 times a game. He had to rush an ridiculous amount to get these yds. 3.8 yds. per carry. I am sorry he did not give Ramsey all the tools, a great D but hardly any tools on offense.

I disagree, the tools are in place... the line will be much much imporved with Rabach and the return of Jansen. The WR can strach the field. Royal is not very good, but he did show marked improvement. ey is good and will get even better. Finally, Portis' troubles can be traced back to poor line play (due to injuries), defenses focusing only on the run (due to a lack of a deep threat), and learning a new system. Regaurdless of this, he did well. This year Portis will do spectacular. Ramsey has plenty of tools. All he lacks is a big WR, but maybe McCants can fill that role.

Gibbs is creating a running machine, so PR will throw when he wants too more than when he has to. He needs to be accurate and crisp with his passes and we will be fine

Redskin in Canada wrote:

THE RAM wrote:I really admire Ramsey´s attitude,

Maybe he knows something you do not. Maybe he has had conversations with Joe Gibbs you have not. Maybe all of us could learn something from him.

Excellent post RIC. These guys just have no idea. The Job of an NFL coach more than anything is motivation. Every coach does it different ways. Gibbs is one of the best motivators in the history of the league.

Watch and see doubters. Ramsey will flourish, and it's all because of Joe Gibbs. His career could have went down the tubes soo easily. He's lucky Gibbs was here to show him how to be great.

John Manfreda wrote:

SKINZ_DOMIN8 wrote:

THE RAM wrote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601456.html

I really admire Ramsey´s attitude, Joe Gibbs has shown no confidence at all in him, I don´t think at all that naming him the starting QB for next season shows that he has confidence in him, Brunell already showed he can´t play anymore, Hasselback is going to be cut and Campbell is a rookie so his only option is Ramsey.
If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing with Harrington in Detroit, since Harrington got drafted, for the last three years the lions have drafted a WR in the first round and Harrington has played all three years as the starting QB, but Gibbs instead of helping Ramsey what does he does to help him, he drafts a QB in the first round, way to show your confidence in your QB.
I don´t like how everyone is comparing the QB situation with San Diego, Brees started playing in the middle of the season of his rookie year, since that moment he had all the confidence in his coach, he was bench two years ago b/c he showed nothing but he did really got three years to show what he had and it took him until his 4th or 5th season to have a great year, but Ramsey played a few games in his rookie year. his first game he led the team to a huge vivtory at Tennessee, he also beat Dallas that season which was the last time the redskins beat Dallas, his next season under Spurrier he leads the team to the best offense in the NFL for the first 4 weeks, he also beat the Patriots with a horrible o-line, he played with a high school o-line and being hurt of his toe, he plays 10 games before being injured, and last season Gibbs gets Brunell after Spurrier named him the franchise QB and now Gibbs drafts a QB, so for me there´s real no comparison with Brees and Ramsey, two total different scenarios.

Oh boy. Where to start. First and foremost, I was at that Dallas game, our last victory over the crackboys, and Ramsey did not win the game--the defense and Dallas (Dave Campo) won the game for us.

Secondly, this is undboubtedly Ramsey's make or break year. No more convenient, Pollyanna, excuses for him. Either win or get out. Gibbs has provided Ramsey with all the tools he needs to succeed, much, much, more than Brunell had. He had better use them to his advantage as I don't think the defense can copy the success they had last year. The offense is going to have to show up and make plays. That means getting rid of Rod Garnder before his losing stench curses the Redskins for the next year.

Are you joking Ramsey has an average to an above average line. Okay above average nothing to go home about. An solid running back, not that great, not a Riggins or Jamal Lewis though. Horrible recievers, no Te, a good H-back. Gibbs hasn't given him the tools at all to work with. When I say above average I mean a c+ when grading them. Don't give me Portis stat crap. He rushed for 30-35 times a game. He had to rush an ridiculous amount to get these yds. 3.8 yds. per carry. I am sorry he did not give Ramsey all the tools, a great D but hardly any tools on offense.

wrong again manny

he's got a great OLine, one of the best RBs in the NFL, good receivers most of whom can fly and have great hands, a great receiving HB in ey, above average blocking from the TE position and the best offensive mind in the game calling the plays. What else could he want or need?

PRam will have a great year this year and with 1 year left on his contract he will sign a 5-7 year extension with us for a ton-o-cash

but go ahead and keep living in litte johns world where everything is bland and blah blah blah. now go take your pills...

You guys kill me with your Pollyanna world view. "Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey." Holy Mother! The only problem with Ramsey is Gibbs and the tools Gibbs has given him to work with. How many horrendous stats and sacks and failures and missed assignments does the Ol have to produce before you guys stop believing its filled with all pros. The line, with Jansen, is average, without, below average, at best. The receivers are the weakest in the NFC (I'm not counting H back). Can anybody understand that Samuels is not an effective run blocker (he's a strong pass blocker). Dockery has not come around. Casey is only a second year starter and not a star by anyone's estimation. Brown is 42. Royal is not a strong blocker. Both Thomas and Jansen are solid run blockers, if not all pro's, but ey is basically a pass catching H back. WE do not have the makings of a strong ground game. For Portis to find holes, we must pass. Too bad our receivers, except ey, can't cut it. If we can't dig up a big, talented WR from somewhere and a top TE, we're simply not going to score many points. Face reality. Tell Joe and Danny to deal.

crazyhorse1 wrote:You guys kill me with your Pollyanna world view. "Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey." Holy Mother! The only problem with Ramsey is Gibbs and the tools Gibbs has given him to work with. How many horrendous stats and sacks and failures and missed assignments does the Ol have to produce before you guys stop believing its filled with all pros. The line, with Jansen, is average, without, below average, at best. The receivers are the weakest in the NFC (I'm not counting H back). Can anybody understand that Samuels is not an effective run blocker (he's a strong pass blocker). Dockery has not come around. Casey is only a second year starter and not a star by anyone's estimation. Brown is 42. Royal is not a strong blocker. Both Thomas and Jansen are solid run blockers, if not all pro's, but ey is basically a pass catching H back. WE do not have the makings of a strong ground game. For Portis to find holes, we must pass. Too bad our receivers, except ey, can't cut it. If we can't dig up a big, talented WR from somewhere and a top TE, we're simply not going to score many points. Face reality. Tell Joe and Danny to deal.

Thank you crazyhorse for finally making me want to speak out. I agree 100% with your post. I don't post much during the offseason because it is what it is...the offseason.

Gibbs has absolutely NO faith in Ramsey. That goes back to his overpaying for an old washed up QB to start in front of him. You all can say it was an open comp. going into the preseason, but can you really believe that? Brunell is/was making waaaaaaaay too much $$ to be a backup.

I think this is just going to hurt Ramsey, and I love the kid. It ranks right up there with bringing in George even though B. Johnson was getting the job done just fine. It undermines these players confidence, not light a fire under them. I HOPE Ramsey comes out on top of all of this BS, but I'm not so sure. Look back as to how he played in last preseason, even though most of us knew he was the better QB.

Sorry guys, no deals for the skins. We will be going mostly with what we currently have. Guess we'll see whose right, and whose wrong. I for one hope I'm right. Seems you guys want to be right as well. I hope for the sake of most skins fans, your not, and I hope it doesn't pain you too much when we don't "suck". I know you really want us to, but you'll be better off once the depression wears off

Champsturf wrote:

crazyhorse1 wrote:You guys kill me with your Pollyanna world view. "Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey." Holy Mother! The only problem with Ramsey is Gibbs and the tools Gibbs has given him to work with. How many horrendous stats and sacks and failures and missed assignments does the Ol have to produce before you guys stop believing its filled with all pros. The line, with Jansen, is average, without, below average, at best. The receivers are the weakest in the NFC (I'm not counting H back). Can anybody understand that Samuels is not an effective run blocker (he's a strong pass blocker). Dockery has not come around. Casey is only a second year starter and not a star by anyone's estimation. Brown is 42. Royal is not a strong blocker. Both Thomas and Jansen are solid run blockers, if not all pro's, but ey is basically a pass catching H back. WE do not have the makings of a strong ground game. For Portis to find holes, we must pass. Too bad our receivers, except ey, can't cut it. If we can't dig up a big, talented WR from somewhere and a top TE, we're simply not going to score many points. Face reality. Tell Joe and Danny to deal.

Thank you crazyhorse for finally making me want to speak out. I agree 100% with your post. I don't post much during the offseason because it is what it is...the offseason.

Gibbs has absolutely NO faith in Ramsey. That goes back to his overpaying for an old washed up QB to start in front of him. You all can say it was an open comp. going into the preseason, but can you really believe that? Brunell is/was making waaaaaaaay too much $$ to be a backup.

I think this is just going to hurt Ramsey, and I love the kid. It ranks right up there with bringing in George even though B. Johnson was getting the job done just fine. It undermines these players confidence, not light a fire under them. I HOPE Ramsey comes out on top of all of this BS, but I'm not so sure. Look back as to how he played in last preseason, even though most of us knew he was the better QB.

So you're blaming Brunell for Ramsey's horrible training camp last year?

Listen i like ramsey and i hope he lites it up this year. But guys i have never seen a group of fans so blindly behind a qb like some of the people on this board. Isnt Rmsey the same qb who had putrid summer last year followed by a performance in Meadowlands which was vomit inducing were he threw like 20INTOS . Never mind the Philly(our home game) and steeler games where he threw some bad picks to put the fork in us ....Guys last year we went thru a strectch of like 9 GAMES WITH NO PLAYS OVER 30 YARDS!!!!... or something like that, i remember when they said that it was the worst performance since LIKE the 1980 something Patriots....HOW IN GODS NAME DO YOU EXPECT GIBBS TO ROLL WITH RAMSEY WITH ALL OF THIS CONFIDENCE WITH WHAT HES SEEN FIRST HAND!..THE QB must be held accountable for 9 games of zero 30 yard plays or more...its inexecusable ..its unacceptable and it must not be tolerated in anyway..we set new standards for ineptitude last yaer...EVERYONE MUST BNE HELD ACCOUNTABLE!...Gibbs stood up and took full blame(i expected nothing less). we now hve new recievers (for better or worse) we were horrible at short yardage--in comes manuel white and broughton ..we signed rabach and get jansen back we signed musgrave and demoted Breaux.....AND WE DRAFTED A FIRST ROUND QB .....I EXPECTED NOTHING LESS FROM GIBBS...Hes addresed every offensive problem we had last year...now is it solved ?...to be dtermined.........TWO THINGS I WANT TO POUND HOME TO EVERYONE WHO BLINDLY SUPPORTS RAMSEY(WHO I HOPE THROWS FOR 4000 YARDS THIS YEAR)------1.remember we ACTUALLY SET NEW STANDARDS for failure on offense last year with Ramsey at helm for 3quarters of it......2. WHY JASON CAMPELL???....Please pullout game 2 meadow lands giants/ skins...one of worst performances by any qb ever!!!..no excuses! ....do you really think gibbs is going to blindly trust a qb who threw 7 picks in his HATED meadowlands!!!!!...Think again my friends....potential...its one one worst words ever.....production is what we look for.....and we lacked a BOAT LOAD of production last year...AND RAMSEY was right in the middle of it.....I support gibbs i support ramsey.....I hope 2005 ROCKS....bUT GUYS C'MON WAKE UP!..RAMSEY SUCKED LAST YEAR...THIS SHOULDNT BE NEW TO ANYONE.

If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing with Harrington in Detroit, since Harrington got drafted, for the last three years the lions have drafted a WR in the first round and Harrington has played all three years as the starting QB,

And The Lions have had success with this formula?

It's a good plan in theory, but it requires a QB that can score 80 bajillion points a game. Tough to do when you're a femme and your receivers are always hurt.

John Manfreda wrote:Don't give me Portis stat crap. He rushed for 30-35 times a game. He had to rush an ridiculous amount to get these yds. 3.8 yds. per carry. I am sorry he did not give Ramsey all the tools, a great D but hardly any tools on offense.

Thinks take time if you want to get it right…….
You could have took the time to check your facts and would have known Portis only had 4 games in which he had 30 or more carries .... in fact there were 10 games that he had 25 or less.

The average attempts by the top 10 backs last season was 330
Portis had 14 attempts more than that average (that’s not ridiculous amount).


Ramsey will now be getting the tools he needs, Gibbs couldn’t do it all in one year ….. he is working on it (maybe fixing the defense first was part of the Gregg Williams deal)

crazyhorse1 wrote:You guys kill me with your Pollyanna world view. "Gibbs is trying to light a fire under Ramsey." Holy Mother! The only problem with Ramsey is Gibbs and the tools Gibbs has given him to work with. How many horrendous stats and sacks and failures and missed assignments does the Ol have to produce before you guys stop believing its filled with all pros. The line, with Jansen, is average, without, below average, at best. The receivers are the weakest in the NFC (I'm not counting H back). Can anybody understand that Samuels is not an effective run blocker (he's a strong pass blocker). Dockery has not come around. Casey is only a second year starter and not a star by anyone's estimation. Brown is 42. Royal is not a strong blocker. Both Thomas and Jansen are solid run blockers, if not all pro's, but ey is basically a pass catching H back. WE do not have the makings of a strong ground game. For Portis to find holes, we must pass. Too bad our receivers, except ey, can't cut it. If we can't dig up a big, talented WR from somewhere and a top TE, we're simply not going to score many points. Face reality. Tell Joe and Danny to deal.

There’s not much here that I could TOTALLY agree with and a lot that’s just UNFOUNDED.

Again Gibbs is/will be providing the tools for Ramsey.
You call the receivers the weakest in the NFC … when did Patten or Moss play in the NFC.

The O-line was in need of repair this offseason, and most of the repairs have been made (MOST).

There was a need at center (we got one the best available free agents as the Sun was coming up day 1 of free agency), we also had issues at tackle and guard .
The tackle position worked itself out with the return of Jenson and Samuels may not be what you want but every year on opening day he’s out there giving his all (knowing you and your kind are hoping he fails so you can say I told you so).
I agree Dockery being backed up by Ray Brown remains a concern that I was hoping would be addressed.
It appears Gibbs has drafted a back up for ey and will be going with Royal as the pass catching TE

So we need a Blocking TE, a Starting G, and for some fans to have more faith in there team …….even in the offseason when there is really NO REASON TO PANIC

Sorry THE RAM could not let this pass! I respect your thoughts/opinions but there were so many areas that you are mistaken IMO that we had to play "cut & paste" until I frankly got bored with correcting things.

Joe Gibbs has given every indication he can to Patrick, the other QBs and to the team that Patrick is the starting QB - that is what it is and Patrick has indicated that Joe is as good as his word!

THE RAM wrote:.. I really admire Ramsey´s attitude, Joe Gibbs has shown no confidence at all in him.

I think he not only has confidence in him I think he thinks Patrick is going to be here for a long time.

THE RAM wrote:..I don´t think naming him the starting QB for next season shows that he has confidence in him..

What more can he do?

THE RAM wrote:..Brunell already showed he can´t play anymore

Maybe to a lot of us but Joe will decide that and he seems to be thinking that given the $ situation with Mark that he has to be on the team. If he thinks that Mark can handlke the job then he will be the back-up!

THE RAM wrote:.. Hasselback is going to be cut

Please tell us how you know this?

THE RAM wrote:..If he would have the slightest confidemce in him he would do what Mariucci is doing

Joe Gibbs is one of the best at getting the most out of his QBs - last year with Mark was not a good indicator! We had problems on the line, Mark's play was not to be believed and frankly I think the adjustment was a bit more than Joe expected. That is over! Joe will have 3 QBs and they will not let the offense down this year.

THE RAM wrote:.. but Gibbs instead of helping Ramsey what does he does to help him, he drafts a QB in the first round,

This has more to do with the other QBs than patrick! We need more than 1 and the other 2 are obviously not going to be here after this season.

There is no problem here and the QB situation is fine. We are going to have many other decisions to make before we have to worry about having a QB problem

Mark is here as a back up and will only play if Gibbs thinks he will not hurt the team. Joe will know if Mark can get it done this year otherwise we will not see him play.

I think that this situation is fine and we are going to see the stability pay off in improved play from both Patrick and better offensive decisions/game planning from the coaches.

SkinsJock

I respect your comments, I just don´t agree with you at all.