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Let me get this straight:
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:48 pm
by USS Redskin
Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense, Dallas would have been worse.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
1st Slap: Signing a over the hill, has-been in Brunell.
2nd Slap: Letting the over the hill back-up start 9 horrid games and saying he played like a hero in each one, before he finally starts the young QB.
3rd Slap: Drafting a potentially bad or good rookie, who, at least is mobile.
No way of getting around this.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
Re: Let me get this straight:
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:55 pm
by Steve Spurrier III
USS Redskin wrote:Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense, Dallas would have been worse.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
1st Slap: Signing a over the hill, has-been in Brunell.
2nd Slap: Letting the over the hill back-up start 9 horrid games and saying he played like a hero in each one, before he finally starts the young QB.
3rd Slap: Drafting a potentially bad or good rookie, who, at least is mobile.
No way of getting around this.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
As much as I hated to see Smoot and Pierce go, I was happy to see that the Redskins exhibited some restraint in terms of giving out contracts. Football is a business, and if you give your players more than their market value, you are going to handcuff yourself. I offer the Patriots releasing Troy Brown as an example of managment exhibiting restraint.
As for Ramsey and all the direspect, I hope he isn't as sensitive as you suggest. Gibbs believes he needs two quality quarterbacks, so attempting to acquire a second quality quarterback isn't something that should suprise or insult Patrick.
Re: Let me get this straight:
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:05 pm
by Fios
USS Redskin wrote:Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
Conversely, Fred Smoot could have taken a little bit less money to stay with a team he so profusely claimed to love. Fred Smoot could have recognized his value does not exceed that of Sean Springs. I grow tired of athletes who have to choose between millions one plane and millions another place and act as if their hands are tied.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
How do you know that?
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
The next TO? So the Redskins passed on a guy who, while unquestionably talented, invariably becomes a cancer to his team. Does that sound like a Gibbs player?
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
Um, yes. What would you have done differently?
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense,
Dallas would have been worse.
See Smoot.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
Some say I deserve to wed Angelina Jolie, that doesn't make it true. This one (Campbell and the Brunell stuff) has been addressed ad nauseum across this site.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
So you don't like him, much, and you are concerned that they've taken steps to find his replacement?
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
They all got high and neglected to solicit your expert opinion.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:06 pm
by VASkin27
WOW. Its been months since everything on that list happened (excluding Campbell) and youre STILL WHINING ABOUT IT. It's time to quit acting like a GM and start acting like a FAN. YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT THESE PLAYERS WERE DRAFTED/LET GO FOR A REASON!! Did the Pats fans beat a dead horse when Bledsoe/Milloy were let go? NO!! Now they have 3 rings.
Williams didn't want a skinny ankle-biting corner, he wanted a Ronnie Lott, which is what Rogers is. PIERCE WAS A SUCCESS OF THE SYSTEM!! Anyone who is plugged in there will succeed.
Now, you got a chance to vent, so I took mine. Now go back the Cowboys forum if you want to keep bashing Gibbs and Williams. Other than that, God Bless.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:11 pm
by vife
Well said.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:13 pm
by thaiphoon
PIERCE WAS A SUCCESS OF THE SYSTEM!! Anyone who is plugged in there will succeed.
My wife is a 5'0, 105lbs asian woman. Would SHE succeed in GW's system ??
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:18 pm
by joebagadonuts
does she have any experience at middle linebacker?
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:22 pm
by thaiphoon
does she have any experience at middle linebacker?
Hehe ... she's got some experience ... not telling what its at though
Still considering everyone's so convinced its solely GW's system that makes people play great I figure she might have a more than decent chance at starting for us next year. Especially considering Marshall hasno MLB experience and Barrow won't even start running until 2 months before training camp.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:36 pm
by FatPat
I absolutely agree with VASkin Pierce was the product of a system. Much like Trotter is a product of Jim Johnson's system in Philly (just look at him as a redskin). The man (Trotter) just blows up the center on every play and once in a while gets in the the backfield to tackle the running back. I dont think Pierce will be as great as he was here but due to his football IQ will have a solid/reliable season...
Re: Let me get this straight:
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:41 pm
by unter13
USS Redskin wrote:Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense, Dallas would have been worse.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
1st Slap: Signing a over the hill, has-been in Brunell.
2nd Slap: Letting the over the hill back-up start 9 horrid games and saying he played like a hero in each one, before he finally starts the young QB.
3rd Slap: Drafting a potentially bad or good rookie, who, at least is mobile.
No way of getting around this.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
What's done is done my man. In all honesty I don't think Smoot was all that great. I think skins fans are just going to miss saying smoooooooooooooooooooooot at the games. I will not lie I am one of the many skins fans who wish they took Mike Williams with the 9th pick, but I'm not looking back and crying about it. Move on and enjoy the players that are already on the team. We were just a few plays and bad calls away from being a playoff team last year. It's not that bad. I enjoy coming to this sit to gain knowledge on the team not continually read peoples crying remarks.
Re: Let me get this straight:
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:43 pm
by ANT7088
USS Redskin wrote:Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense, Dallas would have been worse.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
1st Slap: Signing a over the hill, has-been in Brunell.
2nd Slap: Letting the over the hill back-up start 9 horrid games and saying he played like a hero in each one, before he finally starts the young QB.
3rd Slap: Drafting a potentially bad or good rookie, who, at least is mobile.
No way of getting around this.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
If Smoot wanted to be here SO MUCH then he would've took the VERY fair deal we offered him. He's not better then Springs and he shouldn't be paid more.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:45 pm
by USS Redskin
No lie. I aint a GM. GM's usually adress needs in the offseason.
Receiver = Trades, signings...Down graded
Corner - Lost Smoot added Rookie = Downgrade
DE = Standing pat - 12 sacks in the NFC East aint gonna cut it - Cant downgrade can only go up.
Vent all you want at me, I didnt make these bad decisions.
I love this team but the truth is the truth and of course, its as I see it.
Just hope they can prove me wrong. VASkins - I admire your loyalty but I got the guts to say Gibbs aint wearing no clothes.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:46 pm
by John Manfreda
VASkin27 wrote:WOW. Its been months since everything on that list happened (excluding Campbell) and youre STILL WHINING ABOUT IT. It's time to quit acting like a GM and start acting like a FAN. YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT THESE PLAYERS WERE DRAFTED/LET GO FOR A REASON!! Did the Pats fans beat a dead horse when Bledsoe/Milloy were let go? NO!! Now they have 3 rings.
Williams didn't want a skinny ankle-biting corner, he wanted a Ronnie Lott, which is what Rogers is. PIERCE WAS A SUCCESS OF THE SYSTEM!! Anyone who is plugged in there will succeed.
Now, you got a chance to vent, so I took mine. Now go back the Cowboys forum if you want to keep bashing Gibbs and Williams. Other than that, God Bless.
Yeah, but the Patriots won a super bowl prior to letting these guys go. The Redskins haven't done jack before doing these moves. I will say this about the draft, even though I think what they did was absolutely mornic and will never buy any Redskin memorbilla anymore until they prove to me they can win because I have disagreed with almost every move they have made (not all) since I started following themand this was the straw that broke my back and really just pissed me off. I think Rogers will be a solid b to b+ player in the pros. The reason I think drafting him was dum is because we have mediocre to average recievers all of them. We have a no.1 corner, a solid no.2 Harris. Williams would have filled a much bigger need than Rogers and will be a bonafide superstar. But Rogers is going to be a solid not spectacular player I think, but no Mike Williams at all. Williams is a playmaker Rogers isn't. If you want to know which moves I disagreed with you can ask and I will tell you.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:53 pm
by BringThePain!
John Manfreda wrote:...and will never buy any Redskin memorbilla anymore until they prove to me they can win
hmm... there's some type of definition for this sitting on the tip of my tongue... but I just can't remember what it is...
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:59 pm
by JPFair
Let me get this straight:
Plan:
Let Fred Smoot go, a proven corner who was a locker room leader, played hurt, a fan fave and wanted to stay. Would’ve cost the team another $500,000 than they offered to keep him.
You draft a rookie Corner, who I am sure will be good in a year or so and in a few years will have to let go to b/c he will be too expensive.
You pass up possibly the next TO in the draft, even though you have no go to Receivers because….
You traded a whiney Laverneous Coles because 90 catches isn’t enough balls thrown his way and take a $9 million cap hit, which is like 15% of the cap.
You let a “core” linebacker go to a hated division rival. Nice Core guy – go to the Giants. Though, in his defense, Dallas would have been worse.
You slap your starting QB in the face for the 3rd time by drafting a rookie QB in the 1st round (who some say was 3rd round material).
1st Slap: Signing a over the hill, has-been in Brunell.
2nd Slap: Letting the over the hill back-up start 9 horrid games and saying he played like a hero in each one, before he finally starts the young QB.
3rd Slap: Drafting a potentially bad or good rookie, who, at least is mobile.
No way of getting around this.
That is a HUGE slap in the face. BAM – CRACK – SMASH – I was never a big Ramsey fan but I feel for him now. This sucks. They can spin it all they want. SMACK!
What’s up with the Team that I love so much?
This post is filled with nothing but assumptions, presumptions, guesses, and spitefullness.
The next TO? The guy hasn't even cought one pass in the pros yet, and he's posibly the next TO? If he is the next TO, then not selecting him makes even MORE sense.
Let Smoot go? Smoot let himself go, not Gibbs or The Redskins. If he wanted to stay, all he had to do was sign on the dotted line of a very substantial offer that he was given.
He wanted to stay? Well, if he wanted to stay, then he should have stayed. Maybe he would have had to accept approximately One Million dollars less than the Vikings, but hey, what's a million dollars between friends, especially if he "wanted to stay". Think of Tom Brady, who has said that he'd take less money to stay in New England. Now THERE'S a guy that "wants to stay".
A fan fave? Oh, well, then in that case, we should have given him everything he wanted and then some. Decisions like Smoots are not based on whether or not he's a fan fave.
You slap your starting QB in the face? Didn't Ramsey himself say that he ABSOLUTELY DOES NOT have any problem with bringing in another QB, and he said it BEFORE the draft. If Ramsey was slapped in the face, it sure didn't hurt very much. If he was slapped in the face, he would have said so. The only people whining about the Ramsey situation are ones that shouldn't be, and if anyone should whine, it would be Ramsey. Is he whining? I DON"T THINK SO!!!
This post is riddled with assumptions, and you know what they say about using the word assume!!
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:01 pm
by NC43Hog
John Manfreda wrote:I have disagreed with almost every move they have made (not all) since I started following them . . .
Well since they haven't be good since . . . let's see, Joe Gibbs left, this comment makes you a Rookie!
Unless you disagreed with the Skins when they were winning SBs.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:04 pm
by JPFair
If you want to know which moves I disagreed with you can ask and I will tell you.
How bout the move to become a Redskins fan? Perhaps you should re-think that one?
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:10 pm
by Skinna Mob
BringThePain! wrote:John Manfreda wrote:...and will never buy any Redskin memorbilla anymore until they prove to me they can win
hmm... there's some type of definition for this sitting on the tip of my tongue... but I just can't remember what it is...
Umm BANDWAGON/FAIR WEATHER FRIEND?? LOL
Forgive me for my cosign, but you pointed out what sounds to be the obvious.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:25 pm
by thaiphoon
Umm BANDWAGON/FAIR WEATHER FRIEND?? LOL
ForgUmm BANDWAGON/FAIR WEATHER FRIEND?? LOL
Forgive me for my cosign, but you pointed out what sounds to be the obvious.
ive me for my cosign, but you pointed out what sounds to be the obvious.
It pains me to say this but as much as I disgree with John on just about everything, I don't think refusing to reward Danny for a sub-standard product for the past 6 years by continuing to line his pockets through merchandise sales should be considered a fair weather fan.
Many fans are equally passionate about their Skins and root for them even if they don't like the owner. They watch their team at home on TV but refuse to give anymore money than necessary to reward Snyder's bumbling. Think about it, if a restaurant continues to give you bad service and bad food, are you going to continue to frequent the restaurant ?
Yes I know things have been different since JG is back in town but that doesn't wash Snyder's sins right away for many 'Skins fans.
So I disagree with John Manfreda on pretty much everything. But I disagree with you that refusing to buy memorabilia b/c you don't want to reward the owner for a bad product is a "fair weather" fan. I didn't know that true fans had to blindly follow and keep their wallets open so that Danny could empty them continuously. My apologies.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:30 pm
by EasyMoney
John Manfreda wrote:Yeah, but the Patriots won a super bowl prior to letting these guys go. The Redskins haven't done jack before doing these moves. I will say this about the draft, even though I think what they did was absolutely mornic and will never buy any Redskin memorbilla anymore until they prove to me they can win because I have disagreed with almost every move they have made (not all) since I started following themand this was the straw that broke my back and really just pissed me off. I think Rogers will be a solid b to b+ player in the pros. The reason I think drafting him was dum is because we have mediocre to average recievers all of them. We have a no.1 corner, a solid no.2 Harris. Williams would have filled a much bigger need than Rogers and will be a bonafide superstar. But Rogers is going to be a solid not spectacular player I think, but no Mike Williams at all. Williams is a playmaker Rogers isn't. If you want to know which moves I disagreed with you can ask and I will tell you.
Let me get this straight. Just because the Skins didn't pick the players YOU wanted, you're going to stop buying memorabilia? You're going to stop being a fan UNTIL they win? Talk about inserting foot in mouth. The true colors are coming out.
This is typical bandwagon garbage. I question you being a skins fan at all. The typical Skins fan will boast about offseason moves. They say they'll be a great team this year, when they end up not being great you'll always hear "it's fine, just wait until next year." I'm guilty of this myself. Do I go around saying that I'm disowning the team because they made this move or that move? No. A real fan is a fan of the team, not a fan of the moves that said team makes.
The rest of the logic here doesn't make sense either. Comparing the Patriots to the Skins is simply not fair. How long has Belechick been in Foxboro?
We drafted Rogers because Springs and Harris are getting up there in age. After Springs and Harris there might not be a huge drop off in skill... but there is definitely a huge drop off in experience.
We have plenty of young receivers. Morale in any business essentially comes from knowing that the hard work you are putting in is going to be rewarded. All of these guys work hard, they should get the opportunity to show what they have. We're already YOUNG at WR.
This entire post comes off like a bandwagon fan and Nostradamus all at the same time. Neither of which are good things. What happens if the Skins make the playoffs this year? What will be your tune? I really wish I could predict the future...
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:43 pm
by GibbsLombardi
10 Reasons for Optimism!!!
1. Gibbs has had a year to learn his personel
2. Despite everyone who wined last year when Champ left, we had a better defense than the year before! (Without Lavar)
3.
ey, Shawn Taylor, Wilson, and Molinaro are no longer rookies which should lead to better play!
4. Ramsey and even Brunell have had a year to digest Gibbs offense, while adding West Coast components.
5. Our receiver's coach will be here all year rather than just the end because his son is out of the hospital.
6. We have added a great Center and got John Jansen back which will help the offesive Line.
7. We've just added two huge backs to get us through the goalline problems that cost a few games last year.
8. We've upgraded special teams with speed and intelligence.
9. We have finally shown financial restraint this season and avoided the big name overhyped players that have plagued recent years.
10. Joe Gibbs lost his first 5 games as a rookie coach but took his team to the Superbowl the following two years. He made the necessary adjustments to turn the Redskins back into winners!
The king has returned!
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:47 pm
by BringThePain!
thaiphoon - profanity is not aloud per
board rules... your post was edited... thanks for understanding...
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:52 pm
by The Hogster
Lets see...when we get all of the 'high profile' perennial superstar players.....you complain.
When we overpay for aging superstars....you complain.
When Gibbs plays Brunell and he sucks.....you complain.
When Gibbs admits a mistake by drafting another Quarterback....you complain.
When we take the opposite approach and try to build a solid team of blue collar guys....ah yes....you complain.
QUIT COMPLAINING SO MUCH...WE'RE FANS....THERE IS A GROUP PAID TO MOAN AND WHINE...ITS CALLED THE MEDIA.
How many times does it take for some of us to learn...the fan's choice is not always the right choice...that's what fantasy football is for.
Tell you what...all of you noodle spine, whining crybabies out there...do a fantasy team of who the Skins should have...keep us posted on how that team is doing during the year...until then..shut up.
You go to war with the Army you've got....quit surrendering on your comrades....it is sickening to die hard fans.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:53 pm
by OCSkins
Guys it's freaking Manfreda, the guy must be a closeted cowpuke fan. This guy would rather have Schottenheimer, or Puke Parcells over Gibbs. He's a spoiled brat whining because we didn't take Mike Williams who had been out of football for over a year. "Waaah Waah the 'Skins didn't take Mike Williams I'll make every other fan suffer because I am a bandwagon jumper!" Hey I'm not happy about missing out on david Pollack but you'd better believe I'm going out to get a Chris Samuels Jersey, If I can find a store that has them in Southern California (mostly they sell Coles and Chump jerseys. Arrgh) I am seriously sick of you, Manfreda when we try to agrue with you using reason and backing up our points you resort to name calling. Does anyone know if Manfreda has said anything positive about the 'Skins? I can understand fans who question the moves we made, but I am sick of the bandwagon jumpers like Manfreda.
Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:58 pm
by thaiphoon
thaiphoon - profanity is not aloud per board rules... your post was edited... thanks for understanding...
BTP - my apologies. I didn't mean for them to get out.
I tend to write first and then edit right before posting (good thing the wife is an Editor) since I type too fast and tend to transpose characters at times (like instead of typing since I type too fast and type sicne). I always endeavour to replace any offensive words with one that is non-profane but gets my point across.
Again, my apologies. I will be more vigilant next time.