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Taylor, Moss Miss Redskins Workouts

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:25 pm
by Chris Luva Luva
Washington Redskins Coach Joe Gibbs expressed frustration yesterday over the absence of top wide receiver Santana Moss and starting safety Sean Taylor from voluntary offseason workouts, which are in their third week, and believes both key players should be attending regularly.

"Everybody should be here," said Gibbs, who stressed the importance of workouts when in a team meeting that neither player attended last week. "Everybody should be here, and it's very disappointing to us when they're not here."

Moss, 25, was Washington's most significant offseason addition and was acquired from the New York Jets last month for star receiver Laveranues Coles, who requested a trade after expressing concerns about Washington's offense. Taylor was selected fifth overall in the 2004 draft and has been seeking to renegotiate his contract, which is worth a maximum of $40 million.

Both players, who attended the University of Miami and are represented by agent Drew Rosenhaus, are believed to be working out in Florida. Moss has one year and $450,000 remaining on his contract, and the Redskins immediately expressed a strong desire to sign him to a new deal. Moss is seeking a contract with a significant signing bonus comparable to other top receivers, sources said, and, those talks appear to have hit a snag.

Gibbs said he believed that Moss's absence was related to his desire for a new contract, adding, "We're just working through a process there and trying to work [his contract] out, but the bottom line is everybody should be here."

When asked if he thought a resolution was near, he said, "I have no idea. We're just trying to work our way through it."

Gibbs confirmed last week that team officials had held discussions with Taylor to hear his contract concerns, but at this point the Redskins do not appear inclined to greatly alter that deal. "We've had some meetings there," Gibbs said last Thursday, "But he's got a contract, and we're all set there for a bunch of years, so we're in good shape there."

Rosenhaus has not returned numerous phone messages regarding Moss and Taylor, but told the Associated Press last month that Moss was thrilled to be a Redskin. "He's going to be a focal point of their offense," Rosenhaus said. "I anticipate that we'll be able to work out a very lucrative extension for him.''

The Redskins were adamant about getting rid of Coles after he expressed a desire to play elsewhere, taking a $9 million salary-cap hit to complete the trade, but Coles was routinely lauded for his passion during games, practices and offseason workouts, a fact not lost on some Redskins yesterday who privately expressed concerns about Moss's actions so early in his tenure with the organization.

Most every Redskins player is at the team's headquarters at least four days a week, lifting weights and working on conditioning. This time is most critical for receivers and quarterbacks, however, particularly those who have never played together, as the Redskins are desperate to improve the league's third-worst passing game.

Starting quarterback Patrick Ramsey said he left a phone message with Moss but has yet to speak with him and has no idea when he might report to Redskins Park. While not criticizing the receiver, Ramsey said he believes a lot can be accomplished in voluntary workouts.


"Our job now is to prepare," Ramsey said, "and you don't even want to really approach it from a job standpoint, you want to approach it kind of from a pride standpoint, that this is what I want, this is what I need to do -- and maybe even more than this -- to get ready to get to where we want to go as a team. It's not like I have to go do it, it's like, 'it's time to go get it done.' "

Wide receiver Taylor Jacobs, who has not spoken to Moss but is represented by Rosenhaus, said: "I think Santana's got some things he's got to work out right now with the organization and his agent. We share the same agent, and I know our agent will get it done. But being out there with the guys this time of year is great, and it's a chance to get better."

Moss was selected 16th overall by the Jets in 2001 and posted his best season in 2003 with 74 catches for 1,105 yards and 10 touchdowns. Last season he slipped to 45 receptions for 838 yards and five touchdowns.

"I don't really understand how all this works, and I guess it's not a huge surprise to me that he's not here," said second-year H-back Chris Cooley, "but it's kind of weird that he's brand new here and it looks like he's not going to make it for the workouts."

Redskins Notes: The Redskins signed linebacker Brian Allen, who had been with Carolina, to bolster their special teams. . . . A miscommunication between Taylor and team officials resulted in the Redskins ordering and selling jerseys with his name and the No. 21 on the back at team stores. Taylor did not change from No. 36, however, and, according to a team representative, the mistake has been corrected. Those who bought the No. 21 jersey will be given refunds if they desire.


Taylor...Ive been defending you and your actions thus far but Im done. Theres no excuse for him not to be here. Maybe he's selling his apartment... :roll:

I've been preaching all offseason that nobody on this team is a neccessity. We can afford to lose ANYONE if it'll make the team better. No one person is worth a bad season and he's included.

Im just frustrated. :oops:

Taylor, Moss Out

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:26 pm
by Jake
Taylor, Moss Miss Redskins Workouts

By Jason La Canfora
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, April 7, 2005; Page D01

Washington Redskins Coach Joe Gibbs expressed frustration yesterday over the absence of top wide receiver Santana Moss and starting safety Sean Taylor from voluntary offseason workouts, which are in their third week, and believes both key players should be attending regularly.

"Everybody should be here," said Gibbs, who stressed the importance of workouts when in a team meeting that neither player attended last week. "Everybody should be here, and it's very disappointing to us when they're not here."

Image
Coach Joe Gibbs is not happy that Santana Moss, above, has not attended the voluntary workouts. (Bill Kostroun - AP)

Moss, 25, was Washington's most significant offseason addition and was acquired from the New York Jets last month for star receiver Laveranues Coles, who requested a trade after expressing concerns about Washington's offense. Taylor was selected fifth overall in the 2004 draft and has been seeking to renegotiate his contract, which is worth a maximum of $40 million.

Both players, who attended the University of Miami and are represented by agent Drew Rosenhaus, are believed to be working out in Florida. Moss has one year and $450,000 remaining on his contract, and the Redskins immediately expressed a strong desire to sign him to a new deal. Moss is seeking a contract with a significant signing bonus comparable to other top receivers, sources said, and, those talks appear to have hit a snag.

Gibbs said he believed that Moss's absence was related to his desire for a new contract, adding, "We're just working through a process there and trying to work [his contract] out, but the bottom line is everybody should be here."

When asked if he thought a resolution was near, he said, "I have no idea. We're just trying to work our way through it."

Gibbs confirmed last week that team officials had held discussions with Taylor to hear his contract concerns, but at this point the Redskins do not appear inclined to greatly alter that deal. "We've had some meetings there," Gibbs said last Thursday, "But he's got a contract, and we're all set there for a bunch of years, so we're in good shape there."

Rosenhaus has not returned numerous phone messages regarding Moss and Taylor, but told the Associated Press last month that Moss was thrilled to be a Redskin. "He's going to be a focal point of their offense," Rosenhaus said. "I anticipate that we'll be able to work out a very lucrative extension for him.''

The Redskins were adamant about getting rid of Coles after he expressed a desire to play elsewhere, taking a $9 million salary-cap hit to complete the trade, but Coles was routinely lauded for his passion during games, practices and offseason workouts, a fact not lost on some Redskins yesterday who privately expressed concerns about Moss's actions so early in his tenure with the organization.

Most every Redskins player is at the team's headquarters at least four days a week, lifting weights and working on conditioning. This time is most critical for receivers and quarterbacks, however, particularly those who have never played together, as the Redskins are desperate to improve the league's third-worst passing game.

Starting quarterback Patrick Ramsey said he left a phone message with Moss but has yet to speak with him and has no idea when he might report to Redskins Park. While not criticizing the receiver, Ramsey said he believes a lot can be accomplished in voluntary workouts.

"Our job now is to prepare," Ramsey said, "and you don't even want to really approach it from a job standpoint, you want to approach it kind of from a pride standpoint, that this is what I want, this is what I need to do -- and maybe even more than this -- to get ready to get to where we want to go as a team. It's not like I have to go do it, it's like, 'it's time to go get it done.' "

Wide receiver Taylor Jacobs, who has not spoken to Moss but is represented by Rosenhaus, said: "I think Santana's got some things he's got to work out right now with the organization and his agent. We share the same agent, and I know our agent will get it done. But being out there with the guys this time of year is great, and it's a chance to get better."

Moss was selected 16th overall by the Jets in 2001 and posted his best season in 2003 with 74 catches for 1,105 yards and 10 touchdowns. Last season he slipped to 45 receptions for 838 yards and five touchdowns.

"I don't really understand how all this works, and I guess it's not a huge surprise to me that he's not here," said second-year H-back Chris Cooley, "but it's kind of weird that he's brand new here and it looks like he's not going to make it for the workouts."

Redskins Notes: The Redskins signed linebacker Brian Allen, who had been with Carolina, to bolster their special teams. . . . A miscommunication between Taylor and team officials resulted in the Redskins ordering and selling jerseys with his name and the No. 21 on the back at team stores. Taylor did not change from No. 36, however, and, according to a team representative, the mistake has been corrected. Those who bought the No. 21 jersey will be given refunds if they desire.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... 5Apr6.html

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:30 pm
by Chris Luva Luva

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:43 pm
by SkinzCanes
There is one common thread running through all of this: Drew Rosenhaus. Moss wants a new contract so this is a ploy by Rosenhaus to get him a long-term deal. Taylor's situation sounds similar to the TO situation now in Philly. Rosenhaus began representing both Taylor and Owens after they had signed their current contracts and therefore he doesn't het paid unless they sign new deals. So I'm guessing he sold both players on getting them new deals and that's why they both switched agents. And I'm sure that he's telling Moss, Taylor, and Owens that they best way to get their money is to play hardball.

Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:44 pm
by cvillehog
Chris Luva Luva wrote:Scooped! It took me long enough!

http://www.thehogs.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12386


You were probably posting at the same time, since they are only about a minute apart. :)

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 12:26 am
by air_hog
These contracts situations dont sound too good. I dont fricken get why a player will sign a contract saying that they will play for however many years for however much money and then say... well never mind.

If you sign a contract you are held to it.

I mean Sean, your good and all and you will soon be THE BEST safety, but you didnt even make the Pro Bowl, you didnt even win Rookie of the year, you didnt even win Rookie of the Week.

The only good I see out of this is that Rosenhaus and Snyder are buddies so hopefully they will help each other out.

Come on Sean, just play football.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:07 am
by The Hogster
This should be a reason that neither guy is given a new contract until this one expires. Okay...you want to be bigger than the team, then screw re-working the deal...they have to play this deal out, they don't have a right to a new deal.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:09 am
by C'fieldSkin
I'm not happy they aren't at the workouts either, but on the contract point teams can cut a player before the contract is up if they are not happy with their play or if they don't want to pay a part of their contract they agreed to, so why shouldn't a player do the samething. The system isn't really fair to the player. Just my thoughts.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:23 am
by Hog Heaven
The Hogster wrote:This should be a reason that neither guy is given a new contract until this one expires. Okay...you want to be bigger than the team, then screw re-working the deal...they have to play this deal out, they don't have a right to a new deal.

I totally agree. If you don't like the deal, you shouldn't have signed it go begin with

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:23 am
by Irn-Bru
Looks like the 30 dollar Taylor #36 jersies were a good deal, after all. I bet in 20 years those Taylor #21 jersies will be worth a bit of money. . .

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:29 am
by Scottskins
I don't think it's that big a deal. Gibbs wants the guys there, they have contract issues, they aren't there. If they take too long getting there, then they won't start the season.

We'll be fine. Sure it would be great if every single guy on the team was at the workouts, but they are voluntary afterall. Give em half a chance. Moss is understandable, Sean a bit less, but they will come in in plenty of time I bet. Gibbs won't stand for players skipping out too much for any reason.

Gibbs is setting the tone for how the redskins are run. It's gonna take awhile before these players AND their agents start to understand and act accordingly. Moss needs to be playing with Patrick, but somebody else can start if he isn't up to speed by seasons time and Taylor should be ready much faster. We can also get by without Taylor if need be for awhile.

I'm not saying these guys won't start the season, I'm just saying chill guys...

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:48 am
by Chris Luva Luva
Scottskins wrote:I don't think it's that big a deal. Gibbs wants the guys there, they have contract issues, they aren't there. If they take too long getting there, then they won't start the season.

We'll be fine. Sure it would be great if every single guy on the team was at the workouts, but they are voluntary afterall. Give em half a chance. Moss is understandable, Sean a bit less, but they will come in in plenty of time I bet. Gibbs won't stand for players skipping out too much for any reason.

Gibbs is setting the tone for how the redskins are run. It's gonna take awhile before these players AND their agents start to understand and act accordingly. Moss needs to be playing with Patrick, but somebody else can start if he isn't up to speed by seasons time and Taylor should be ready much faster. We can also get by without Taylor if need be for awhile.

I'm not saying these guys won't start the season, I'm just saying chill guys...


I wouldn't be upset if either player was on the bench for the opener. We'd be good to go with Bowen, Lott, or Clark. We'll be just fine.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:55 am
by Manchester_Redskin
I would have thought if Moss was so pleased to have come to teh skins then he would want to attend these workouts and give the right impression.

Trade him for Mike Williams :)

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 6:34 am
by skins81
Taylor is a disappointment. But he'll be here in time.

Moss is making a HUGE mistake. He has to learn new schemes and start to get a feel for Ramsey, as well as for Gibbs and Musgrove. He needs to start catching balls from Ramsey right now. It's not like his stock is going to go up if he has a marginal year. He is under contract currently. He is going to play. He has zero bargaining power. What will the draft bring in terms of WR? That's more potential competition. I'm starting to thinnk Gibbs is going to make him prove something to him in the next few months before he gets a new deal. Maybe even play a regular season game or three.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 6:35 am
by Skin by Grace
I really don't think this is a big deal and we shouldn't jump the gun and turn on these guys....have patience everything will work out

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 7:14 am
by Justice Hog
C'fieldSkin wrote:[B]ut on the contract point teams can cut a player before the contract is up if they are not happy with their play or if they don't want to pay a part of their contract they agreed to, so why shouldn't a player do the samething. The system isn't really fair to the player. Just my thoughts.


If a team cuts the player before the contract is up, doesn't that player still get "Paid" even if/when they're cut? Just ask Mark Brunell if the Redskins cut him. Ask Coles how much the Redskins are paying him now that he's not a Redskin.

If you want my "thoughts", the players are all way over-paid. It's a vicious never-ending tidal wave that will only continue to grow each year.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 7:22 am
by Britskin
Not really what you want to read about a new arrival - when experienced pros are saying that they think its strange that Moss isn`t at the workouts then you start to worry. We need team players not people who put personal contracts before practise. I hope this resolves itself quickly - Joe Gibbs doesn`t sound too impressed.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 8:14 am
by USAFSkinFan
Skin by Grace wrote:I really don't think this is a big deal and we shouldn't jump the gun and turn on these guys....have patience everything will work out


The fact is both of these guys have been developing reputations for being difficult... this was just one more chance that they blew to show they are "team players" as opposed to individuals... they can complain and renegotiate all day long, but that's the agent's job... the player's job is to be productive and do everything in their power to get better as team, including attending "voluntary" workouts!

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 8:45 am
by The Hogster
I just think we don't need another headache from Santana when the reason we traded Coles was to get rid of a headache.

I think that Santana should be there before Taylor actually, he is new to this team and should put his best foot forward to step up and be a leader to improve this offense.

But, Gibbs is the kind of coach who will say...Okay...David Patten will be the focal point...or Taylor Jacobs will start...he does not play this stuff

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:04 am
by stwasm
Well, now that didn't take long, now did it?!? :x

We did all that hemmin' and hawin' about how we needed to get Moss here for Coles. Well, here he is in all his glory, doing what amounts to be a holdout. You would think that, given you're starting with a new team and you have to get used to the quarterback and the plays, you'd want as many reps as possible. But, that's just me. We get rid of one headache for another. Nice!

And Taylor just needs to grow up! His opinion of himself is higher than it needs to be. Get your you-know-what on the field and play! And shut up about your stupid jersey change/non-change! :evil: :evil: :evil:

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:33 am
by vife
They should be there.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:20 am
by gregory smith
It just makes me sick. Many of todays players are so spoiled. Taylor is a total head-case. He is undoubtedly a great player with unlimited potential, but from day one he has consistently shown how immature he really is. What's up with the miscommunication on the #21 or #36 jersey. You know the Skins didn't make it up. He is just an idiot. I love his play on the field, but he is approaching Randy Moss Stupidity. As for Santana, he is in the last year of his contract, I would be tempted to trade him, I'm just tired of being jerked around by these rotten little brats.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:29 am
by The Hogster
I would not give Santana an extension before seeing what he can do within this offense. It would be safer to negotiate an extension at the end of the season, than to pay him top dollar now and there is no cguarantee he will even be the number one guy...not coming to voluntary workourts should be one of the reasons to end negotiations with Rosenhaus.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:34 am
by FanofallthatisGibbs
Let's use Santana as trade bait for a second rounder and pick up a steal WR in the deep WR class of this draft.

I know it won't happen, but I hate these kind of antics. And it is all about the AGENT. What a crock of bs from the business pov.

Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:44 am
by SkinsJock
IMO they should be attending these workouts as should everyone. That being said I'm pretty sure that things will work out okay. Joe is in charge and wants everyone to participate in everything. Some will benefit some will not.

The media's job is to report and hype every little nuance and they will always look for the potential disaster and over analyze it!

The agent's job is to do the best he can for his player (which also means he gets more!). The player's job is to get ready to play the game AND play the game. Both of these (getting ready and playing) should be done as well as possible. That is why you pay them all that money!

Players are judged overall not only on what they did but how they prepared AND achieved what they did. We do not really look up to or really respect players who are good but are not good for the team or themselves.

Joe will not keep players who do not make a great deal of effort to be not only a part of the team but also to make themselves better players and people.

I firmly believe that we are going to be a team of players who are committed to the Redskin's (and Joe's) team concepts and that team will be a success because they will be better than any team of great players who are not a team.