The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Just to stir the pot... last year the Vikings showed that they don't even have a viable back up qb! Most reputable football heads score the qb class out of the top 10 best players in the draft.. I could see them taking bpa then making a deal overnight to obtain cousins then taking one of the qbs in the second to develop/ fill the back up role. They aren't the only team that that scenario can play out for either..

SkinsJock wrote:DUH! - a trade for any and all NFL players is possible however the implication that trading Cousins is a real possibility at this time is just BS

Uh no its not BS. Cleveland is a team that needs a QB. They have multiple additional picks in the draft to make a trade if they want. They have a new OC who just happens to have been Kirk Cousins' OC the past two years. And there have been numerous reports in the Cleveland press that the trade has at least been discussed.

I'm not saying its likely that a trade will happen, but no its not "BS". That's just a lame dismissal.

OK - in your opinion - do you think it's a real possibility or just a possibility?

I agree that Cleveland needs a QB but I do not agree that we are really close to trading Cousins

that's just hyping the possibility of a trade - it's possible that we could trade RG3 but it's not a real possibility

we'll see if Cleveland makes a trade for Cousins - I'll be happy to say I was wrong ...

riggofan wrote:Soooooo.... Kirk Cousins possibly joining Kyle in Cleveland? What do you think?

possible yes - but certainly not a real possibility

we need Cousins and I SERIOUSLY doubt that Cleveland will make a good enough offer

SkinsJock wrote:OK - in your opinion - do you think it's a real possibility or just a possibility?

Realistic possibility.

riggofan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:OK - in your opinion - do you think it's a real possibility or just a possibility?

Realistic possibility.

OK - we both understand all the ramifications and the situation - I just don't see these guys letting Cousins go right now

and

I think the Browns would do it if they were desperate enough but that is not realistic to me .... possible yes, but not till the draft at the earliest

SkinsJock wrote::roll: OK - we both understand all the ramifications and the situation - I just don't see these guys letting Cousins go right now

I hear what you are saying. Again, I'm not talking about how likely a trade is either way - and I understand you're reading "real possibility" to mean "a very likely possibility". Nothing to ::roll:: about.

The whole point of this thread though was that the Browns might be a realistic trade partner for a number of reasons. As opposed to saying "the Patriots should give us a second round pick for Cousins". You'd be hard pressed to explain why the Pats might do that. Fans are always talking about wanting to trade Cousins for a second round pick, but you rarely hear them suggest a team that might actually be willing and have the trade ammo to do it.

Moving on, I kind of disagree about the team not being willing to let Cousins go right now. I don't have much doubt that they would give up Cousins if someone offers a 2d round pick. Just do the cap math on what that trade would mean. You could either a) hang on to Kirk Cousins for two more seasons at the rookie contract salary or b) lose Kirk, draft another player in the 2d round and have him for four-five more seasons at the rookie contract salary.

It would make too much sense to pass that up. Add another quality player with the 2d rounder, and you could still probably get a guy like AJ McCarron or Tom Savage in the third or fourth round to groom as your backup QB.

you and I do not look at this the same - I don't see this FO letting Cousins go at this time UNLESS a franchise wants to make an offer that would make us change our mind

now ... that is not a realistic possibility or a real possibility

a franchise like Cleveland is a likely trade partner but I don't see them giving this FO a reason to lose a good back up QB at this time

that is why I do not look at trading Cousins at this time as a realistic possibility or a real possibility

Kirk Cousins will be our back up QB on 5/7 - we will see

SkinsJock wrote:you and I do not look at this the same - I don't see this FO letting Cousins go at this time UNLESS a franchise wants to make an offer that would make us change our mind

Well sure, but what's your point exactly? Saying we're not going to trade Cousins UNLESS we get a good offer is not the same thing as saying we're not going to trade Cousins.

I don't see myself going to the Super Bowl this year UNLESS somebody gives me a ticket. That doesn't mean I wouldn't be open to taking a trip to the Super Bowl.

riggofan wrote:Soooooo.... Kirk Cousins possibly joining Kyle in Cleveland? What do you think?

this was posted on Feb 4 - at that time this and the thread title would imply a trade was close ... certainly on/before the draft

I did not agree that a trade would happen before the draft

AND

I still don't think any franchise will make an offer high enough for this FO to trade Cousins before the draft

it's possible but not a real possibility

we shall see

Now I hope we trade him on the minute before the draft starts..

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Now I hope we trade him on the minute before the draft starts..

and that would be the best time for the FO to get the best value - in your humble opinion?

SkinsJock wrote:

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Now I hope we trade him on the minute before the draft starts..

and that would be the best time for the FO to get the best value - in your humble opinion?

Absolutely! A trade at that time would mean a first rounder.

I would be very happy with that and would have to say that riggofan, cowboykillerzRGiii, and the 'dead man' are absolutely in touch with what is going on regarding Cousins

I'm happy to be proven wrong in my assessment of this ... we shall see

SkinsJock wrote:

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Now I hope we trade him on the minute before the draft starts..

and that would be the best time for the FO to get the best value - in your humble opinion?

I dunno if there is a "best" time, but we actually have a full day after round one to court offers. We can shop not only Cousins, but also our 34th pick to possibly trade back a bit- something we know Bruce can make happen while still getting "our guy".
It all depends on when the qbs start going- other teams will get nervous and reach on a player instead of taking a guy when they had planned- that's how 2nd rounders get drafted in the first.

Most, if not all, of this qb class are consider project qbs and or back ups... there's just not a whole lot of starter material this year. While I personally think Cousins has a ways to go- he is more gameday ready then anyone in the draft. With that said, if a team takes BPA just to see their "guy" go later in the round to a team who is going to fill the back up roll, but still needs a qb- we got some time to work out a deal. This can also go against us if magically every team gets a qb day one that needs one. The risk of another team getting Cousins when your team is interested, makes it a real possibility that we sign a deal before the first pick is submitted. Its a big game of what ifs, and guessing who the other 31 teams are going to take.

So in short, the best time to get the best value is when we get an offer we like, as there are to many what ifs that can play out. We might trade him on the eve of round one before it starts so that the team can have the comfort of following their board.. or if the first round leaves a team looking and desperate maybe they offer more.. its all pretty basic stuff SJ, I can break down point value of draft spots, compensation, and player scores in a PM if you like.

Mainly, I just want to see him traded so we can address a need- but now I'd like to see the Browns take him before the draft just to put a cork in your "there's no way this FO.." does this that or the other thing.. bottom line we are all speculating or we would be on the Skins pay roll and not be allowed to post on here.

this is really simple - I do not think the FO will trade Cousins unless a franchise will give up more than many are indicating he's worth ...

this FO is not trading a good back up QB for less than he's worth

SkinsJock wrote:this is really simple - I do not think the FO will trade Cousins unless a franchise will give up more than many are indicating he's worth ...

this FO is not trading a good back up QB for less than he's worth

So pretty much everybody has agreed that Cousins is worth a second rounder at a minimum. You're saying the FO would not trade him for anything less than a first??? That's nonsense.

SkinsJock wrote:I would be very happy with that and would have to say that riggofan, cowboykillerzRGiii, and the 'dead man' are absolutely in touch with what is going on regarding Cousins

Come on, man. That's a ridiculous statement. Nobody is making claims to be "in touch with what is going on regarding Cousins". We're discussing a very specific trade rumor.

cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Most, if not all, of this qb class are consider project qbs and or back ups... there's just not a whole lot of starter material this year. While I personally think Cousins has a ways to go- he is more gameday ready then anyone in the draft.

I agree. Its funny how that consensus about the QBs is starting to form. A few weeks ago most mock drafts probably had five or six QBs going in the first. Not sure what has changed exactly, maybe some real film study and workouts, but a lot of those presumed top guys have slipped a lot.

I don't think that Cousins is 'worth' a first round pick - that's not the point ..

I just think that Cousins is worth more to the Redskins as a back up QB at this time than what a lot of GMs and fans think ..

it's possible the Redskins could trade him but I doubt that another franchise is going to make the Redskins an offer high enough ..


put another way - this FO is not going to trade Cousins at this time unless the deal is too good and I don't think another franchise wants to make that happen

we shall see

I'm not sure where you're getting your information about what the front office will or won't do.

Mark Maske of the Washington Post reports that the team would like a second-round pick in return for their backup quarterback.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foo ... k-cousins/

It doesn't sound to me like another team has to make us some sort of "too good" deal to move Cousins. What they are looking for is a "fair" deal.

I don't disagree that Cousins is a good backup - I like him and will be happy if he's still here this year. I'd say his "value" to the team has gone down some now that Shanahan has left and all the QBs are learning a new system. I'd also encourage you to pull up Cousins stats side by side with Colt McCoy's and take a quick comparison. You might be surprised.

Unless you believe Cousins is going to be a Redskin for the long term then there shouldn't be any question that you take a second round pick for him this year or next if you have the opportunity.

This is really going nowhere - we disagree on Cousins value to the team

we shall see ...

btw - stats don't mean very much - Cousins is more 'valuable' than McCoy because he's a better QB

SkinsJock wrote:This is really going nowhere - we disagree on Cousins value to the team

Actually, it seems like we're all agreeing that for a #2 he's gone and for a #3 we keep him for the year

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:This is really going nowhere - we disagree on Cousins value to the team

Actually, it seems like we're all agreeing that for a #2 he's gone and for a #3 we keep him for the year

OK - that's a possibility - let's see if there's a franchise that thinks he's worth giving up a top 50 pick for - most think he's worth less than that

IMO - Cousins is worth more to this franchise as a back up for another season ...

SkinsJock wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:This is really going nowhere - we disagree on Cousins value to the team

Actually, it seems like we're all agreeing that for a #2 he's gone and for a #3 we keep him for the year

OK - that's a possibility - let's see if there's a franchise that thinks he's worth giving up a top 50 pick for - most think he's worth less than that

IMO - Cousins is worth more to this franchise as a back up for another season ...

I'm not clear how you got out of my saying that for a #2 he's gone and for a #3 he stays that I think we'll get a #2 for him. In fact I don't think we'll get a #2 for him, particularly this year. And probably not next year unless he gets an opportunity and plays better than he did at the end of the season. I've actually said all along that the people who think all the GMs who passed on him suddenly thought he was worth a high pick based on the pre-season are dreaming. He's a good backup, that's it so far.

I do agree with those who think there is some chance that Kyle would get Cleveland to meet our price if he doesn't like his other options to pry him free. He brought Grossman with him from the Texans, lightning could strike twice. I'm not holding my breath. But with 2 years left on his rookie deal, I say no way to trading him for less than a 2. A #3 isn't worth giving up your backup QB for. I'm not sure I'd trade him next year for a #3 either, maybe. We'll see how it goes.