The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

PulpExposure wrote:

RedskinsFreak wrote:I'm not finding a single on-the-surface reason to like this move.

SI.com wrote:In his eight games in Oakland, Hall was beaten 40 times for 552 yards on 66 passes thrown his way, according to data compiled by STATS LLC. He gave up more yards than any defender this season and was tied for third worst in catches allowed.

So, he stinks in pass coverage and I think he's less of a person than he is a player.

He stunk in Oakland's defense, but he's a 24 year old, 2-time pro bowl cornerback...who is playing with us for 500k this year.

How the heck is this a bad move?

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Well, didn't Springs balk at restructuring? I'd love to keep him but he's not worth the money at this point. He needs to restructure and Im sure there wont be a ton of teams trying to overpay for a guy who'll miss half the season.

tcwest10 wrote:

countertrey wrote:

tcwest10 wrote:team that is better described by spelling the word 'team' backwards.

M-A-E-T? is that, like, meat with a bad Liverpool accent?

"If yah don't eat cha MAET, you cahn't have any pudding. How cahn yah get any pudding if yah don't eat cha MAET?"

It's ok, TC... we all know that Al Davis is senile, and that's probably how he spells it...

How about 'team', spelled backwards, hit so hard that the 'a' got moved over one spot?
Thanks for killing me softly, 'trey. I appreciate it.

Thundersloth wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

RedskinsFreak wrote:I'm not finding a single on-the-surface reason to like this move.

SI.com wrote:In his eight games in Oakland, Hall was beaten 40 times for 552 yards on 66 passes thrown his way, according to data compiled by STATS LLC. He gave up more yards than any defender this season and was tied for third worst in catches allowed.

So, he stinks in pass coverage and I think he's less of a person than he is a player.

He stunk in Oakland's defense, but he's a 24 year old, 2-time pro bowl cornerback...who is playing with us for 500k this year.

How the heck is this a bad move?

If I'm reading you correctly Pulp, your're saying that DeAngelo may have been in a defense that wasn't really a good fit for him. That particular defense and defensive scheme may not have utilized DeAngelo's strengths. Not to mention the fact that the guy on the other side was a flat out stud and QBs were afraid to throw to his side. Translation...Hall got thrown at more which means, of course, he would have given up more yards which make the numbers look skewed. If that's what you're saying, then I agree. He may not have looked like the best player in a TOTALLY DYSFUNCTIONAL ORGANIZATION, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt, besides it's a done deal now and there's nothing anyone can do about it even if you wanted to.

How many players have we signed that were studs in other defenses and were duds here in DC? I like this signing more than the signing of Adam Archuleta, Carl Banks, Stanley Richard, James Washington, Deion Sanders, Sean Gilbert, Cris Dishman, Dana Stubblefield, Dan Wilkinson, Sam Shade, Bruce Smith and Jeremiah Trotter just to name a few. So by the simple law of averages, we should have more than one of our signings be a stud, besides London Fletcher (Stud signing).

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

Thundersloth wrote:My

This signing has the potential to be very very good, but it also has the potential to be very very bad.

If I'm not mistaking, DeAngelo wasn't released because of any disciplinary reasons, he was released because "Old Man" Davis was throwing money around like peanuts and crackerjacks at a baseball game this past off-season and ended up paying him $8 million for 8 games. So his being put on waivers was a financial move. I don't remember seeing any stories saying that DeAngelo was a bad guy off the field this season. Having said that, everybody knows about his difficulties in Atlanta and the subsequent rumors that he was beaten up by his teammates in the locker room after the Carolina game.

Maybe...just maybe...Mr. Hall has grown up a bit and he has learned from his past mistakes. If he has; and understands that he will be closely scrutinized by the media and fans not to mention team officials; he'll be able to get through the rest of this season and the Redskins sign him to a longer deal.

If not, and he has an attitude and is a locker room cancer, the Redskins say, "Thanks for nothing...bye bye now". What have they really lost?

I hear people saying there are positive veteran influences in the locker room, which is true, but I can honestly say, no matter how good the influence is, the person has to want to change. The transformation from being a "me" guy to a "team" guy has be an intrinsic one, not extrinsic.

Well, at this point we signed him until the end of the season. With as many pointed out while Springs plays great for us when he plays, he doesn't play way too often and hasn't been willing to give us any release. So it's hard to see how this could be a "bad" move at this point since we have a vulnerability and filled it without a commitment and can decide later whether to make it long term or not AFTER we see how he fits in here.

JSPB22 wrote:

tcwest10 wrote:

countertrey wrote:

tcwest10 wrote:team that is better described by spelling the word 'team' backwards.

M-A-E-T? is that, like, meat with a bad Liverpool accent?

"If yah don't eat cha MAET, you cahn't have any pudding. How cahn yah get any pudding if yah don't eat cha MAET?"

It's ok, TC... we all know that Al Davis is senile, and that's probably how he spells it...

How about 'team', spelled backwards, hit so hard that the 'a' got moved over one spot?
Thanks for killing me softly, 'trey. I appreciate it.

Aaaaagh! You answer his Pink Floyd reference with a Roberta Flack one? I'm embarassed for you.

Thundersloth wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

Thundersloth wrote:My

This signing has the potential to be very very good, but it also has the potential to be very very bad.

If I'm not mistaking, DeAngelo wasn't released because of any disciplinary reasons, he was released because "Old Man" Davis was throwing money around like peanuts and crackerjacks at a baseball game this past off-season and ended up paying him $8 million for 8 games. So his being put on waivers was a financial move. I don't remember seeing any stories saying that DeAngelo was a bad guy off the field this season. Having said that, everybody knows about his difficulties in Atlanta and the subsequent rumors that he was beaten up by his teammates in the locker room after the Carolina game.

Maybe...just maybe...Mr. Hall has grown up a bit and he has learned from his past mistakes. If he has; and understands that he will be closely scrutinized by the media and fans not to mention team officials; he'll be able to get through the rest of this season and the Redskins sign him to a longer deal.

If not, and he has an attitude and is a locker room cancer, the Redskins say, "Thanks for nothing...bye bye now". What have they really lost?

I hear people saying there are positive veteran influences in the locker room, which is true, but I can honestly say, no matter how good the influence is, the person has to want to change. The transformation from being a "me" guy to a "team" guy has be an intrinsic one, not extrinsic.

Well, at this point we signed him until the end of the season. With as many pointed out while Springs plays great for us when he plays, he doesn't play way too often and hasn't been willing to give us any release. So it's hard to see how this could be a "bad" move at this point since we have a vulnerability and filled it without a commitment and can decide later whether to make it long term or not AFTER we see how he fits in here.

Agreed Kazoo, the more I think about this the better and better it sounds to me. This is basically an audition for Hall, almost like a guy on the fence in the pre-season. If he performs well, he could get a lucrative long term deal with us or someone else. If he goes in the tank and is a bad locker room guy, he's blown big money. I like the fact that he hasn't missed games due to injury too.

JSPB22 wrote:

tcwest10 wrote:

countertrey wrote:

tcwest10 wrote:team that is better described by spelling the word 'team' backwards.

M-A-E-T? is that, like, meat with a bad Liverpool accent?

"If yah don't eat cha MAET, you cahn't have any pudding. How cahn yah get any pudding if yah don't eat cha MAET?"

It's ok, TC... we all know that Al Davis is senile, and that's probably how he spells it...

How about 'team', spelled backwards, hit so hard that the 'a' got moved over one spot?
Thanks for killing me softly, 'trey. I appreciate it.

Aaaaagh! You answer his Pink Floyd reference with a Roberta Flack one? I'm embarassed for you.

Thundersloth wrote:If I'm reading you correctly Pulp, your're saying that DeAngelo may have been in a defense that wasn't really a good fit for him. That particular defense and defensive scheme may not have utilized DeAngelo's strengths. Not to mention the fact that the guy on the other side was a flat out stud and QBs were afraid to throw to his side. Translation...Hall got thrown at more which means, of course, he would have given up more yards which make the numbers look skewed. If that's what you're saying, then I agree. He may not have looked like the best player in a TOTALLY DYSFUNCTIONAL ORGANIZATION, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt, besides it's a done deal now and there's nothing anyone can do about it even if you wanted to.

In the Raiders' aggressive "bump and run" scheme, Hall and Asomugha were expected to maul and shut down receivers at the line, thereby disrupting the timing of the opponent's passing game. When used in conjunction with a blitz-heavy pass rush, the scheme forces the quarterback to complete a series of low percentage throws under duress. The scheme has been a hallmark of the Raiders since the days of Hall of Famer Willie Brown, and Hall was expected to thrive in it due to his exceptional athleticism.

However, the marriage appeared flawed from the beginning because of Hall's preference for playing "off" coverage. Although Hall has the speed and athleticism to excel as a "bump and run" corner, the "ball hawk" is at his best when allowed to sit back and read the quarterback. By using the "clue" technique, Hall aggressively jumps short-to-intermediate routes while reading the quarterback's drop. He mastered the technique while playing in a zone-based scheme in Atlanta and has used it to tally the third-most interceptions (18) in the league since 2005. He was leading the Raiders with three interceptions and ranked third in the league in passes defensed (16).

"He wasn't playing well," said an NFC personnel director. "But it wasn't as poorly as it has been portrayed."

<snip>

But don't be surprised if Hall regains his Pro Bowl form with Washington. The 'Skins feature a blitz-heavy scheme that encourages its corners to aggressive play short-to-intermediate throws. Hall's knack for reading the quarterback should fit in nicely within the scheme. In addition, his new position coach (Jerry Gray) is one of the best at teaching the nuances of the position. If Hall takes to his coaching, he will learn how to properly gamble in the back end without exposing himself to negative plays. Gray transformed Samari Rolle into a Pro Bowl player as a Titan, and he could take Hall's game from good to great in Washington.

Thundersloth wrote:How many players have we signed that were studs in other defenses and were duds here in DC? I like this signing more than the signing of Adam Archuleta, Carl Banks, Stanley Richard, James Washington, Deion Sanders, Sean Gilbert, Cris Dishman, Dana Stubblefield, Dan Wilkinson, Sam Shade, Bruce Smith and Jeremiah Trotter just to name a few. So by the simple law of averages, we should have more than one of our signings be a stud, besides London Fletcher (Stud signing).

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Thundersloth wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

Thundersloth wrote:My

This signing has the potential to be very very good, but it also has the potential to be very very bad.

If I'm not mistaking, DeAngelo wasn't released because of any disciplinary reasons, he was released because "Old Man" Davis was throwing money around like peanuts and crackerjacks at a baseball game this past off-season and ended up paying him $8 million for 8 games. So his being put on waivers was a financial move. I don't remember seeing any stories saying that DeAngelo was a bad guy off the field this season. Having said that, everybody knows about his difficulties in Atlanta and the subsequent rumors that he was beaten up by his teammates in the locker room after the Carolina game.

Maybe...just maybe...Mr. Hall has grown up a bit and he has learned from his past mistakes. If he has; and understands that he will be closely scrutinized by the media and fans not to mention team officials; he'll be able to get through the rest of this season and the Redskins sign him to a longer deal.

If not, and he has an attitude and is a locker room cancer, the Redskins say, "Thanks for nothing...bye bye now". What have they really lost?

I hear people saying there are positive veteran influences in the locker room, which is true, but I can honestly say, no matter how good the influence is, the person has to want to change. The transformation from being a "me" guy to a "team" guy has be an intrinsic one, not extrinsic.

Well, at this point we signed him until the end of the season. With as many pointed out while Springs plays great for us when he plays, he doesn't play way too often and hasn't been willing to give us any release. So it's hard to see how this could be a "bad" move at this point since we have a vulnerability and filled it without a commitment and can decide later whether to make it long term or not AFTER we see how he fits in here.

Agreed Kazoo, the more I think about this the better and better it sounds to me. This is basically an audition for Hall, almost like a guy on the fence in the pre-season. If he performs well, he could get a lucrative long term deal with us or someone else. If he goes in the tank and is a bad locker room guy, he's blown big money. I like the fact that he hasn't missed games due to injury too.

Springs could be the best nickel back in the league!

Countertrey wrote:

Oh my freakin goodness! The old Snyder shows his self.

What??? 500K for a CB who has been to the probowl for 2 of the past 4 years??? That's a freaking bargain. The OLD SNYDER???

SkinsJock wrote:I'm pretty sure Samuels was 2nd and Arrington the 3rd pick in the draft that year

HEROHAMO wrote:

Countertrey wrote:

Oh my freakin goodness! The old Snyder shows his self.

What??? 500K for a CB who has been to the probowl for 2 of the past 4 years??? That's a freaking bargain. The OLD SNYDER???

Snyder is Snyder, so I guess its not old Snyder its the same ole same ole Snyder.

At least this time he is bringing in a young talent. Also not overpaying him yet is a good thing as well.

At least it wont be like the Jason Taylor situation. You know the guy whos age has no relevance to his injuries?

You know the guy you said who would be back soon? Hey Doc?

SkinsJock wrote:I'm pretty sure Samuels was 2nd and Arrington the 3rd pick in the draft that year

Supposedly he didn't fit Oakland's style of play at all

Ex-Raiders CB Hall agrees with Redskins on 1-year deal

By John Clayton
ESPN.com

Even though DeAngelo Hall wanted to take the weekend to consider 15 or more scenarios for a new team, the cornerback decided Friday to accept a one-year deal from the Washington Redskins, according to his co-agents, Joel Segal and Alvin Keels.

According to a source, Hall agreed to a one-year deal that is worth $492,000 for the remainder of the season, the prorated portion of his $1 million base salary that he would have received from the Oakland Raiders.

"He's excited to be coming home, he's a Virginia Tech guy," Segal told The Associated Press.

<snip>

A source close to the Redskins said Hall spoke with Redskins coach Jim Zorn and some of Zorn's assistants before accepting a contract, and that team owner Daniel Snyder met with defensive captains London Fletcher and Cornelius Griffin to gauge their opinion of the move.

Hall had a highly-publicized blowup in Atlanta. During a game last year, after allowing three penalties for 67 yards in one series, he got into a shouting match with his head coach, Bobby Petrino, and the assistant defensive backs coach, on the sidelines.

League sources describe him as a good locker-room guy who was popular with teammates and media alike. Raider teammates, sources said, were genuinely disappointed over his release.

“I want the world to know that this didn't happen because I was a dirt bag and messing around," Hall told Steve Wyche of NFL.com. "A lot of people were making me out to be a [bad person]. It is what it is, a business decision. Al Davis assured me that it had nothing to do with me, the person. It was a financial thing."

ATX_Skins wrote:I think Springs and Hall right now are our only legit #1's. I think the entire reason we went out and got him is because we currently are playing with 2 #2's on the field with Smoot and Rogers.

NJ-SKINS-FAN wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:I'm pretty sure Samuels was 2nd and Arrington the 3rd pick in the draft that year

wasnt arrington 2? samuels 3?

SkinsJock wrote:I'm pretty sure Samuels was 2nd and Arrington the 3rd pick in the draft that year

PulpExposure wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:I'm pretty sure Samuels was 2nd and Arrington the 3rd pick in the draft that year

As pointed out, Arrington was 2 and Samuels was 3. But what I was saying is I can't figure out which pick originated from the second Panthers first rounder from the Sean Gilbert trade. We traded that pick for other picks that ended up as 2/3 (arrington/samuels), and it's old enough that it's hard to find the info online.

Countertrey wrote:

HEROHAMO wrote:

Countertrey wrote:

Oh my freakin goodness! The old Snyder shows his self.

What??? 500K for a CB who has been to the probowl for 2 of the past 4 years??? That's a freaking bargain. The OLD SNYDER???

Snyder is Snyder, so I guess its not old Snyder its the same ole same ole Snyder.

At least this time he is bringing in a young talent. Also not overpaying him yet is a good thing as well.

At least it wont be like the Jason Taylor situation. You know the guy whos age has no relevance to his injuries?

You know the guy you said who would be back soon? Hey Doc?

Wow! Brilliant response. A topic that has no relevance to this discussion, as well as being inaccurate. Beautiful!

Snyder is not being the "old" Snyder. He went and got a young, pro-bowl corner for next to nothing, and with virtually no risk.