The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Today, it was blatantly obvious that Campbell would look for either Moss or ey to the near exclusion of all others. If Moss is the primary and covered, he dumps it off to ey. Once in a while, ey is the primary, in which case, if covered, Campbell runs or gets sacked. His other dump offs are more or less panic induced. The man has no eyes and will never have them.

Zorn is a moron for playing Thrash (unless he wanted to lose) and twice a moron for not trying to develop his younger receivers (unless he wants to lose next year too.)

The most moronic statement today was made by an idiot in the both, who said that ARE is not really much of a receiver (true enough) but should be used primarily PR, where, he, presumably, excels. I didn't know whether to die laughing or break out in tears.

Only a moron like Zorn would keep ARE at PR. He's got to be one of the worst in the game.

Zorn's a bad coach. He doesn't recover from his preconceptions regardless....

ARE has 5 TDs on punt returns, one of them with DC in 2006. He also scored once in a KR while in Pitt.

Surely he has SOME ability.

El Mexican wrote:ARE has 5 TDs on punt returns, one of them with DC in 2006. He also scored once in a KR while in Pitt.

Surely he has SOME ability.

or HAD

El Mexican wrote:ARE has 5 TDs on punt returns, one of them with DC in 2006. He also scored once in a KR while in Pitt.

Surely he has SOME ability.

You know it's almost 2009 right? When does 2006 become irrelevant, 2012?

crazyhorse1 wrote:Zorn is a moron for playing Thrash (unless he wanted to lose) and twice a moron for not trying to develop his younger receivers (unless he wants to lose next year too.)

...

Only a moron like Zorn would keep ARE at PR. He's got to be one of the worst in the game.

Zorn's a bad coach. He doesn't recover from his preconceptions regardless....

Dude, he played the hand he was dealt in his FIRST season DURING the season. If he went to his plethora of WR and PR options you'd hat on him for that. How STUPID it was to play THAT loser! It's easy to criticize decisions as stupid without providing viable alternatives, alternatives that don't magically appear in the middle of the season.

My point is these are things that need to be addressed NOW, in the off season. And he's not going to solve EVERY problem in ONE year. The expectation would be we get rid of a couple of cap drains and make some decent improvements. He needs to learn to call better plays next year, develop our young players more, and do the same next year. That's how you build a winning organization. Solutionless, unrealistic criticism's easy and solves nothing. Anyone can sit there and say they don't like something.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

crazyhorse1 wrote:Zorn is a moron for playing Thrash (unless he wanted to lose) and twice a moron for not trying to develop his younger receivers (unless he wants to lose next year too.)

...

Only a moron like Zorn would keep ARE at PR. He's got to be one of the worst in the game.

Zorn's a bad coach. He doesn't recover from his preconceptions regardless....

Dude, he played the hand he was dealt in his FIRST season DURING the season. If he went to his plethora of WR and PR options you'd hat on him for that. How STUPID it was to play THAT loser! It's easy to criticize decisions as stupid without providing viable alternatives, alternatives that don't magically appear in the middle of the season.

My point is these are things that need to be addressed NOW, in the off season. And he's not going to solve EVERY problem in ONE year. The expectation would be we get rid of a couple of cap drains and make some decent improvements. He needs to learn to call better plays next year, develop our young players more, and do the same next year. That's how you build a winning organization. Solutionless, unrealistic criticism's easy and solves nothing. Anyone can sit there and say they don't like something.

Crazyhorse is right in what you quoted of him. We're not talking about massive scheme changes or overhauls to the system.

There's no excuse for not getting ARE off of PR duty. Let Rock return or Devon Thomas who has blazing speed.

Playing Thrash instead of Devon or Malcom is disgusting and retarded, there's no way to spin that.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:There's no excuse for not getting ARE off of PR duty. Let Rock return or Devon Thomas who has blazing speed.

OK, these are "potential" solutions and had Zorn gone to them it would have made sense. I don't see the intuitive that these were immediate "solutions" either though. KR and PR aren't the same and I have no idea if Zorn felt Devon was ready for this. How exactly do you KNOW you aren't just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic? I do like the idea of prepping Devon for next year, I can't see the intuitiveness that Zorn was idiotic for not just going to it now.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Playing Thrash instead of Devon or Malcom is disgusting and retarded, there's no way to spin that.

Again, jump to conclusion. It's not just playing, it's practicing the plays. We have different receivers who play different plays in different situations. If Thrash was better prepared for the play/situation then Malcolm and Devon then just because he played a few plays Zorn's a bad coach? Way too big a jump. I would hope if we keep WRs on the roster they serve some purpose. And while I think Devon and Malcolm both showed some potential this year, neither exactly blew me away and I think a better way to build them up is to put them in positions they can succeed in, not just putting them in plays so they are there.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:There's no excuse for not getting ARE off of PR duty. Let Rock return or Devon Thomas who has blazing speed.

OK, these are "potential" solutions and had Zorn gone to them it would have made sense. I don't see the intuitive that these were immediate "solutions" either though. KR and PR aren't the same and I have no idea if Zorn felt Devon was ready for this. How exactly do you KNOW you aren't just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic? I do like the idea of prepping Devon for next year, I can't see the intuitiveness that Zorn was idiotic for not just going to it now.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Playing Thrash instead of Devon or Malcom is disgusting and retarded, there's no way to spin that.

Again, jump to conclusion. It's not just playing, it's practicing the plays. We have different receivers who play different plays in different situations. If Thrash was better prepared for the play/situation then Malcolm and Devon then just because he played a few plays Zorn's a bad coach? Way too big a jump. I would hope if we keep WRs on the roster they serve some purpose. And while I think Devon and Malcolm both showed some potential this year, neither exactly blew me away and I think a better way to build them up is to put them in positions they can succeed in, not just putting them in plays so they are there.

Thrash contributed nothing to this team at the WR position. What would it have hurt? Really?

None of our rookie receivers played, Devon, Kelly and Davis. They CAN'T all be retarded?!?! They can't be. It was the teaching and that falls on Zorn/coaches.


Again, with the PR situation. What would it have hurt towards the end of the season? What would it have hurt on the last game of the year? THe season was over...

Again, jump to conclusion. It's not just playing, it's practicing the plays. We have different receivers who play different plays in different situations. If Thrash was better prepared for the play/situation then Malcolm and Devon then just because he played a few plays Zorn's a bad coach? Way too big a jump. I would hope if we keep WRs on the roster they serve some purpose. And while I think Devon and Malcolm both showed some potential this year, neither exactly blew me away and I think a better way to build them up is to put them in positions they can succeed in, not just putting them in plays so they are there.

Thrash had 9 catches for 81 yards and 1 td on the season. Those numbers would be impressive if he did that in one game, not in an entire season. Thrash was a waste of space on the field. Sure there are risks with giving young players PT, but how could their production have been any worse. Thrash was garbage.

CanesSkins26 wrote:Thrash had 9 catches for 81 yards and 1 td on the season. Those numbers would be impressive if he did that in one game, not in an entire season. Thrash was a waste of space on the field. Sure there are risks with giving young players PT, but how could their production have been any worse. Thrash was garbage.

It's indisputable. Zorn was being stubborn to the detriment of the team. He wasn't playing the people that gave us the best chance to win and when the season was over he refused to give them good experience for next year.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Thrash contributed nothing to this team at the WR position. What would it have hurt? Really?

None of our rookie receivers played, Devon, Kelly and Davis. They CAN'T all be retarded?!?! They can't be. It was the teaching and that falls on Zorn/coaches.


Again, with the PR situation. What would it have hurt towards the end of the season? What would it have hurt on the last game of the year? THe season was over...

Again I'm not arguing that Zorn should not have done that. I'm just saying that they are kids in their 20s learning to play in the NFL. I'm just saying that is was "reasonable" for Zorn to not throw them into situations "if" he didn't feel they were ready to succeed there because of their skills or their preparation. I am just arguing I disagree with the point that it was automatically bad coaching not to do that.

I do agree that if next year, Thrash is a "big" part of our O or ARE is our main PR then that's a pretty legit reason to criticize the Z man. It's the off-season now, time to make some changes.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:Again I'm not arguing that Zorn should not have done that. I'm just saying that they are kids in their 20s learning to play in the NFL. I'm just saying that is was "reasonable" for Zorn to not throw them into situations "if" he didn't feel they were ready to succeed there because of their skills or their preparation. I am just arguing I disagree with the point that it was automatically bad coaching not to do that.

I do agree that if next year, Thrash is a "big" part of our O or ARE is our main PR then that's a pretty legit reason to criticize the Z man. It's the off-season now, time to make some changes.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:Again I'm not arguing that Zorn should not have done that. I'm just saying that they are kids in their 20s learning to play in the NFL. I'm just saying that is was "reasonable" for Zorn to not throw them into situations "if" he didn't feel they were ready to succeed there because of their skills or their preparation. I am just arguing I disagree with the point that it was automatically bad coaching not to do that.

I do agree that if next year, Thrash is a "big" part of our O or ARE is our main PR then that's a pretty legit reason to criticize the Z man. It's the off-season now, time to make some changes.

Fair enough and I see where you're coming from. However, I don't believe you're giving the rookies enough credit. You don't draft guys that high if they aren't ready to come in and play (i didnt say start). The difference between you and I is that I believe they could have been ready with the proper teaching. I simply refuse to believe that our front office is incompetent enough to draft 3 guys that are that stupid... I refuse to believe that. What I choose to believe is that Zorns coaching of his passing offense was horrid. What I saw from watching Devon Thomas play is that he was getting better as the year went on and still wasn't in the game as much as he should have been.

So what if the kids weren't ready.... What would have happened that was worse than what was already happening?

U agree that if they're a big part next year? I said the same thing last year. So in a way, according to how you're feeling I'm warranted in how I feel. I hated to see Thrash on the field last year and I hated it htis year. ARE hasn't done jack since 2006, how many years does he get before the plug is pulled? Jeezzz it's clear as day!! ARE sucks at PR and he's a mediocre WR. Thrash is a helluva lockerroom guy and special teamer but he should not be on the field at WR. However...I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

Oh, he runs straight enough... just not upfield.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

Yeah, in fact ARE would have been a better punt returner than ARE if he had just caught the ball and ran straight forward (no matter what) each and every time. He'd easily have gotten 10x the yards on his season.

Irn-Bru wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

Yeah, in fact ARE would have been a better punt returner than ARE if he had just caught the ball and ran straight forward (no matter what) each and every time. He'd easily have gotten 10x the yards on his season.

Yes, it did get old watching him run three yards to the left, three yards to the right, then get tackled where he started. As you say at least running forward he'd have gotten a couple.

Irn-Bru wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

Yeah, in fact ARE would have been a better punt returner than ARE if he had just caught the ball and ran straight forward (no matter what) each and every time. He'd easily have gotten 10x the yards on his season.

But...but...Irn-Bru...ARE has got to dance. He's got the fever.

PulpExposure wrote:

Irn-Bru wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

.I think Thrash would be better at PR than ARE.

Anybody that knows how to run straight would be a better PR than ARE.

Yeah, in fact ARE would have been a better punt returner than ARE if he had just caught the ball and ran straight forward (no matter what) each and every time. He'd easily have gotten 10x the yards on his season.

But...but...Irn-Bru...ARE has got to dance. He's got the fever.

Maybe he should follow in Jason Taylor's footsteps on Dancing With the Stars.

the skins need to win with something and the special team just like the offense was either self destructing or easy for opponents to dismantel, the coaches will need to make serious improvements especially on the offense...personell wise I think the skins were unprepared in the trenches and should be upgraded, that will help the Wr and cambell most

PulpExposure wrote:But...but...Irn-Bru...ARE has got to dance. He's got the fever.

My personal favorite is the ball-slap after every damn return. "Oh man, I almost broke that one!!!"

Irn-Bru...not for nothin', but what's your personal favorite?? Tell me twice so I don't miss it, will you?

tcwest10 wrote:Irn-Bru...not for nothin', but what's your personal favorite?? Tell me twice so I don't miss it, will you?

I've been posting after a couple of g-n-t's lately.

okay i dont know if any one has said this or looked at Campbell stats for the past 2 years but im going to any ways.

2008 16 games starts
315 comp 506 att 62.3% 3,245 yrds 6.4 YPA 13 TD 6 INT 84.3 rating

2007 13 Games started
250 comp 417 att 60.0% 2,700 yrds 6.5 YPA 12 TD 11 INT 77.6 Rating

Now that is a pretty good improvement i think.. take into consideration that his line really didnt help him at all torwards the end of the year as well. hes young, he will be great. i know that. but it does not matter 1 bit who we have at QB if we do not protect em. i mean look at the super bowl last year. They had Tom freakin Brady back there. The same guy who threw for 50 tds. But they didnt protect him, and he looked like crap and they lost. So dont blame JC. Blame the line.

actually, dont blame the line. blame the FO who wont get new bullets to load in the gun sooner of later. someone's gonna "dare ya to shoot" :p

ChocolateMilk wrote:okay i dont know if any one has said this or looked at Campbell stats for the past 2 years but im going to any ways.

2008 16 games starts
315 comp 506 att 62.3% 3,245 yrds 6.4 YPA 13 TD 6 INT 84.3 rating

2007 13 Games started
250 comp 417 att 60.0% 2,700 yrds 6.5 YPA 12 TD 11 INT 77.6 Rating

Now that is a pretty good improvement i think.. take into consideration that his line really didnt help him at all torwards the end of the year as well. hes young, he will be great. i know that. but it does not matter 1 bit who we have at QB if we do not protect em. i mean look at the super bowl last year. They had Tom freakin Brady back there. The same guy who threw for 50 tds. But they didnt protect him, and he looked like crap and they lost. So dont blame JC. Blame the line.

I'm going to go after the glaring stat of those to ME. He went from 6.4 to 6.5 YPA? I'm not going to look it up, but for something to think about, check out any decent QB's YPA and let me know. I have a feeling they are higher that that. Campbell has been properly trained by Brunell and does well with the dinks and dunks, but that's about it. IMHO.