The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

spidey wrote:

1niksder wrote:You mentioned your WRs but Chad is really all you have Chad Johnson is no sloch but he's no Roy Williams or Jevon Walker either. Rudi might want to mail it in this week because we will shoutdown the passing game.
Gonna be a good game on Sunday to bad you guys cant win on the road

You can't be serious with this statement on Chad Johnson. He's no Roy Williams or Jevon Walker. Wait a minute, you're right because Chad is one of the best recievers in the game. Last year, he led the NFL in most catches of 40 or more yards while he also had the most yards in the AFC. He took on Champ Bailey this year and got 7 catches for 149 yds and a touchdown. Please feel free to try to convince Gibbs and Williams to leave either Smoot or Springs on him one on one. We Bengal fans would appreciate it.

Where do you guys get this "Chad is one of the best recievers in the game"....Check the stats he might be in the top 10 of the AFC but "in the League"
Last year he lead the league in catches over 40+ yards LAST YEAR......He's got 3 this year, Gardner also has 3 with a QB that has trouble throwing a 15 yard slant.
So he took on Champ Bailey, he put up good numbers against a guy we traded.. ever wonder why we traded him Take away the Denver/Champ game and look at Chad's stats and you get AVERAGE nothing more maybe less.
Johnson stats with the Denver game would look like this
Rec..37
Yds..475
and 1 TD
that averages out to 4.6 catches / 60 yards per game


I see why ya'll always bring up the Denver game It's ALL you got the rest is just AVERAGE

spidey wrote:Could it be that his numbers are down because of
a) a 1st year qb is throwing to him.
b) Warrick as a possesion reciever was vastly underrated and did not allow teams to double and triple team him consistently.
c) both

Champ Bailey who is considered the BEST cover corner in the league couldn't contain him and even stated after the game that he was one of the best recievers that he has ever faced.

It could be .... but more than likely it's because he's a average Reciever who sits up at night thinking of the next sign he wants to parade around with on the sidelines

spidey wrote:On a side note, how's Sean Taylor working out for your team?

Sean Taylor is working out just fine but I'll let you be the judge of that on Sunday

1niksder wrote:It could be .... but more than likely it's because he's a average Reciever who sits up at night thinking of the next sign he wants to parade around with on the sidelines


Sean Taylor is working out just fine but I'll let you be the judge of that on Sunday

yeah, he's just an average reciever you've probably never seen him play or the catches that he made. Look at his numbers the past two years and then say how average he is. Also keep in mind that he had John "noodle arm" Kitna throwing to him these past couple of years. You and Smootie will get to see how "average" he is this coming Sunday.

spidey wrote:

1niksder wrote:It could be .... but more than likely it's because he's a average Reciever who sits up at night thinking of the next sign he wants to parade around with on the sidelines


Sean Taylor is working out just fine but I'll let you be the judge of that on Sunday

yeah, he's just an average reciever you've probably never seen him play or the catches that he made. Look at his numbers the past two years and then say how average he is. Also keep in mind that he had John "noodle arm" Kitna throwing to him these past couple of years. You and Smootie will get to see how "average" he is this coming Sunday.

First of all, Kitna had the 5th-best passer rating last year. That's not very "noodly."

Secondly, no one said Johnson wasn't a good reciever.

Thirdly, Palmer will spend far too much time looking down at the turf to get the ball to him effectively.

Go Skins!

VA Bengal wrote:Thanks man. I know we're not ranked high in offense or defense but we're getting better. You guys are in for a surprise if you writing us off.

No team is a write-off in this year's NFL. Ask -anybody-. There have been surprises every single week this season.

Joe Gibbs does not underestimate ANY of its opponents. He knows how badly he needs to build momentum in light of our matches after yours.

I do not pay too much attention to Peter King but this is HIS prediction:

Cincinnati at Washington
Perhaps Chad Johnson would like to play a new role on the Bengals this week. Team player.
Washington 16, Cincinnati 14

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/w ... index.html

1niksder wrote:

jditty47 wrote:Chad is a top 5 receiver in this league, this year even with a rookie qb he has over 600 yards and 40 catches so far.

Not bad numbers but NOT top 5 numbers
YARDS
1. J.Walker GB 783
2. J.Smith JAX 703
3. T.Owens PHI 750
4. I.Bruce StL 694
5. A.Johnson Hou 693
Maybe a top 5 reciever in the AFC but not in the league he ain't
CATCHES
1. A.Gates SDG 54
2. D.Mason TEN 52
3. H.Ward PIT 51
4. E.Moulds BUF 47
5. A.Johnson HOU 45
And that's ONLY the AFC 44 catches wouldn't put Chad in the top 10 in the league

You obviously don't know ...

He has a rookis QB throwing to him. Of course his numbers are going to be down a little. So you're saying he's not as good as those players above just because they have better numbers than him through the first half of THIS season? Moss isn't up there. Are you going to say that he's not in the top 5 because he's been hurt the past few weeks?

Hines Ward has a rookie QB throwing to him. Johnson actually has a 2nd-year QB throwing to him. Yes, there is a difference, Palmer has been a pro for a year, and while not having the playing time makes him "like a rookie" in some respects, he has had much more time with the coaches and the playbook.

cvillehog wrote:Hines Ward has a rookie QB throwing to him. Johnson actually has a 2nd-year QB throwing to him. Yes, there is a difference, Palmer has been a pro for a year, and while not having the playing time makes him "like a rookie" in some respects, he has had much more time with the coaches and the playbook.

He didn't play one snap last year so he's pretty much a rookie. Yes I know Hines QB is a rookie. A rookie that has a great O-Line and perhaps the best WR core in thr NFL. As you probably know, most rookie QB's struggle. Rothlisberger is a rare exception.

you guys have alot of semi truths. way to get ur data.

Theres a ton of reasons why chad's stats are down. The one ill point out is that hes always double covered. U saw what he did when someone tried to leave him in man vs champ. Every team double covers him to try to limit his aggressiveness...and with a rookie qb, i dont want him forcing things that hes not sure of until he gets more experience.

Look, don't get all defensive. One of your fans said Johnson was one of the top 5 recievers in the game.

We are saying he's a good reciever, but not top five. The facts support that.

To the double coverage comment, all the top recievers are doubled. Does the name Randy Moss ring a bell?

There are many great receivers in the NFL, so I definately don't take offense if someone doesn't think Chad is a top 5 receiver. Plus Chad doesn't have the longevity, but after watching him play every week I think he is a top 5 receiver.

There are still many people who haven't been exposed to CJ yet so they just don't know. Hopefully he'll show you guys what he's all about on Sunday. I'm expecting a big game from him after las week's antics.

Please refer to my new topic in Hogwash and list your top 5 receivers.

jditty47 wrote:you guys have alot of semi truths. way to get ur data.

Here are some semi truths
1.

jditty47 wrote:Every team double covers him to try to limit his aggressiveness....

then you point out Denver left Champ on him man to man.
How about saying some teams or most teams double cover him
2.

VA Bengal wrote:He has a rookis QB throwing to him

jditty47 wrote:and with a rookie qb, i dont want him forcing things that hes not sure of until he gets more experience

When was Palmer drafted Because you don't play your first year doesn't mean you get to be a rookie the next
3.

spidey wrote:yeah, he's just an average reciever

What I said was...

1niksder wrote:Take away the Denver/Champ game and look at Chad's stats and you get AVERAGE nothing more maybe less.
Johnson stats without the Denver game would look like this
Rec..37
Yds..475
and 1 TD
that averages out to 4.6 catches / 60 yards per game

The numbers don't lie... you mentioned Moss yeah he's hurt so he has a Valid reason for his numbers to be down and like you said he isn't in the top 5 but who said he was... no one
but you guys keep saying Chad Johnson is in the top five in the league. Don't try toconfuse the issuse by nringing up Moss, but lets look at the numbers Moss as put up compared to Johnson
Chad 44 catches 624 yards 14.2 Avg ypc 2 TDs 3 for 40+
Moss 20 catches 447 yards 22.4 Avg ypc 1 TD 4 for 40+
conclusion Chad has twice as many catches... but only 177 more yards...Moss averages more than hate yards more per catch....Chad has 1 TD more than Moss...and Moss as 1 more catch for more than 40 yards than Chad
I'd call that pretty even. So I guess you can say Moss and Johnson are on about the same level

1niksder wrote:I'd call that pretty even. So I guess you can say Moss and Johnson are on about the same level

Of course we know this is a simple comparison of two recievers who are the goto guys on there respective teams so naturally Chad would have better numbers in some areas and Santana would excel in others

Because you don't play your first year doesn't mean you get to be a rookie the next

No technically he's not a rookie but this is the first season he's actually played. So it's kinda like being a rookie. Is that clear enough for you?

no one
but you guys keep saying Chad Johnson is in the top five in the league.

Most people haven't even see Chad play so they don't know how good he is. Hell you probably haven't seen him play.

I'd call that pretty even. So I guess you can say Moss and Johnson are on about the same level

So you're saying that Moss is not one of the top 5 receivers as well. I can understand why you wouldn't think CJ is a top 5 receiver. You haven't had the privelage to watch him play much. I don't understand how you could say Moss isn't a top 5 receiver though.

Like I said...please refer to my new post and post your top 5 receivers. I would like to see who yours are.

Why are you assuming none of us have seen him play?

Wasn't the Denver game nationally televised?

Don't you think that maybe at least some of us have NFL Sunday Ticket.

Don't you know that your head coach was our defensive coordinator, and has many fans in the Washington (and Baltimore) areas?

You have to be kidding me with that stuff.

Yes Johnson is a good WR. So is Coles, BTW. But, I'm not so much of a homer as to rank Coles in the top 5 of the league because his numbers just aren't there.

Why don't we settle on Johnson being a talented guy with the potential to become a top 5 reciever?

More semi truths

VA Bengal wrote:Because you don't play your first year doesn't mean you get to be a rookie the next

No technically he's not a rookie but this is the first season he's actually played. So it's kinda like being a rookie. Is that clear enough for you?

It's not clear to you because you are the one that said Chad has a rookie throwing to him or is someone else posting under your user name

VA Bengal wrote:no one
but you guys keep saying Chad Johnson is in the top five in the league..

jditty47 was the one that stated that ...I just posted facts that showed otherwise
Whoever it is that's using your user name started a thread in the wrong forum about the top 5 recievers in the NFL Guess who was listed as #5....Oh I get it now ... it must be one of us guys thats saying he a top 5 reciever using your user name

VA Bengal wrote:Most people haven't even see Chad play so they don't know how good he is. Hell you probably haven't seen him play..

cvillehog has address that ... what did you think the Bengals only played on closed curcuit or what?

VA Bengal wrote:I'd call that pretty even. So I guess you can say Moss and Johnson are on about the same level

So you're saying that Moss is not one of the top 5 receivers as well. I can understand why you wouldn't think CJ is a top 5 receiver. You haven't had the privelage to watch him play much. I don't understand how you could say Moss isn't a top 5 receiver though.

Like I said I was comparing Johnson's stats to Santana Moss's stats and they came out pretty even ... where would you rank him

VA Bengal wrote:Like I said...please refer to my new post and post your top 5 receivers. I would like to see who yours are.

Mine have been posted.. since we are the only one's saying Chad Johnson is a top 5 WR I'm sure he's not on your list

cvillehog wrote:Why are you assuming none of us have seen him play?

Wasn't the Denver game nationally televised?

Don't you think that maybe at least some of us have NFL Sunday Ticket.

Don't you know that your head coach was our defensive coordinator, and has many fans in the Washington (and Baltimore) areas?

You have to be kidding me with that stuff.

Yes Johnson is a good WR. So is Coles, BTW. But, I'm not so much of a homer as to rank Coles in the top 5 of the league because his numbers just aren't there.

Why don't we settle on Johnson being a talented guy with the potential to become a top 5 reciever?

OK let me ask you this. Besides the Denver and Miami games(if you watched them) what Bengals games have you watched? I think I stated that I can understand why you wouldn't have Chad in your top 5. Did you read that??? I'm not trying to convince you of anything. He'll do that on Sunday.

I know about gameday and that we were on national tv but how many people care to watch the Bengals around the country buddy? That's right....NOT MANY! Our team isn't mentioned every 15 minutes on Sportscenter like you beloved Redskins. I said most of you probably haven't seen him play...and if you have it was probably just the MNF game against the Broncos.

I'm sure there are some people here that have seen him play quite a few times though.

VA Bengal wrote:I'm not trying to convince you of anything. He'll do that on Sunday.

Not against a Gregg Williams top NFL defense. Sorry.

Pick another week to measure your boy. The ball is not going to even get to him. Pressure will be too tight with blitzes coming from every difrferent direction this Sunday.

You have a better chance toscore on defense, as difficult as that might be (#27) than on offense.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

VA Bengal wrote:I'm not trying to convince you of anything. He'll do that on Sunday.

Not against a Gregg Williams top NFL defense. Sorry.

Pick another week to measure your boy. The ball is not going to even get to him. Pressure will be too tight with blitzes coming from every difrferent direction this Sunday.

You have a better chance toscore on defense, as difficult as that might be (#27) than on offense.

Well we do lead the league in forced fumbles. Tory James leads the league in interceptions and we also have the most points off of turnovers so it's not out of the question that some points will be scored by the defense tomorrow.

spidey wrote: Well we do lead the league in forced fumbles. Tory James leads the league in interceptions and we also have the most points off of turnovers so it's not out of the question that some points will be scored by the defense tomorrow.

Again, you have a better chance on defense than on offense.

So, we agree. Chad will go nowhere. Sorry, Chad will turn against its own team.

The desire to win is one thing. The disruptive behaviour of brats only harms their own team and the game as a whole.

this is a freakin' understatement that ....this is a HUGE GAME for keeping our slim playoff hopes alive.