Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:Yes, well, until last January I never would have imagined the President spending most of his time tweeting and golfing.riggofan wrote:I don't know. I guess everyone is different, and I know this is a different world, but I can't remotely imagine my wife engaging online with my employer like this or me allowing it. Its just bad on multiple, multiple levels.
Social media has made the world's ignorance highly visible.
Richmond native Michael Robinson, a former Seattle Seahawks player, was on "The Wes McElroy Show" on Fox Sports 910 on Thursday morning, and relayed a conversation he had recently with fired Redskins general manager Scot McCloughan.
Robinson was signed by McCloughan in Seattle, and the two maintain a good relationship.
In the conversation, Robinson said McCloughan felt his firing from the Redskins was "a pride thing" on the part of team president Bruce Allen.
"He knew the players loved him, and he started feeling the hate from Bruce Allen right around, well, he’s been feeling it, but when they didn’t let him speak at the Senior Bowl, he said to him that was his last straw, and he knew that he was on his way out," Robinson said on McElroy's show. "He said it was after a draft meeting, after the Combine, Bruce called him up to his office and was just like, ‘Nobody likes you in this building. Nobody wants you here.’ And Scot was like, well, I guess I’m out of here."
The Redskins fired McCloughan exactly three weeks ago. At the time, an anonymous team official told the Washington Post that the firing was the result of McCloughan's struggles with alcohol.
Robinson said in his conversation, McCloughan told him that wasn't the reason.
"He said, 'Mike, I don’t have an issue right now drinking,'" Robinson said. "'I haven’t touched a drink in a while. But of course they wouldn’t let me say it because they silenced me.'
"And (the conversation) was deep. And we’ll talk more - I can’t go into everything we talked about, but it was a guy who didn’t look like he was done with the National Football League. He looked like a guy who felt like he had something to prove."
Robinson is a weekly guest on McElroy's program, and in addition to his media work is the founder of Excel To Excellence, a tutoring program for middle an high schoolers in the Richmond area.
In the interview, Robinson also addressed a report that Allen was angry at McCloughan for talking to a player after a rough practice.
I read this earlier but it sounds like complete BS. "Nobody wants you here?" Bruce Allen was the one who brought him into the fold in the first place. "They silenced me?" Who is "they" and why can't you talk now that you're no longer employed by the Redskins? And why would Scot discuss this with a player if he was "silenced?" Too much of this doesn't hold water.DEHog wrote:From the Richmond Times...
Richmond native Michael Robinson, a former Seattle Seahawks player, was on "The Wes McElroy Show" on Fox Sports 910 on Thursday morning, and relayed a conversation he had recently with fired Redskins general manager Scot McCloughan.
Robinson was signed by McCloughan in Seattle, and the two maintain a good relationship.
In the conversation, Robinson said McCloughan felt his firing from the Redskins was "a pride thing" on the part of team president Bruce Allen.
"He knew the players loved him, and he started feeling the hate from Bruce Allen right around, well, he’s been feeling it, but when they didn’t let him speak at the Senior Bowl, he said to him that was his last straw, and he knew that he was on his way out," Robinson said on McElroy's show. "He said it was after a draft meeting, after the Combine, Bruce called him up to his office and was just like, ‘Nobody likes you in this building. Nobody wants you here.’ And Scot was like, well, I guess I’m out of here."
The Redskins fired McCloughan exactly three weeks ago. At the time, an anonymous team official told the Washington Post that the firing was the result of McCloughan's struggles with alcohol.
Robinson said in his conversation, McCloughan told him that wasn't the reason.
"He said, 'Mike, I don’t have an issue right now drinking,'" Robinson said. "'I haven’t touched a drink in a while. But of course they wouldn’t let me say it because they silenced me.'
"And (the conversation) was deep. And we’ll talk more - I can’t go into everything we talked about, but it was a guy who didn’t look like he was done with the National Football League. He looked like a guy who felt like he had something to prove."
Robinson is a weekly guest on McElroy's program, and in addition to his media work is the founder of Excel To Excellence, a tutoring program for middle an high schoolers in the Richmond area.
In the interview, Robinson also addressed a report that Allen was angry at McCloughan for talking to a player after a rough practice.
Disagree. There are two main narratives: (1) Scot's a drunk, (2) Bruce is jealous.Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:I read this earlier but it sounds like complete BS. "Nobody wants you here?" Bruce Allen was the one who brought him into the fold in the first place. "They silenced me?" Who is "they" and why can't you talk now that you're no longer employed by the Redskins? And why would Scot discuss this with a player if he was "silenced?" Too much of this doesn't hold water.DEHog wrote:From the Richmond Times...
Richmond native Michael Robinson, a former Seattle Seahawks player, was on "The Wes McElroy Show" on Fox Sports 910 on Thursday morning, and relayed a conversation he had recently with fired Redskins general manager Scot McCloughan.
Robinson was signed by McCloughan in Seattle, and the two maintain a good relationship.
In the conversation, Robinson said McCloughan felt his firing from the Redskins was "a pride thing" on the part of team president Bruce Allen.
"He knew the players loved him, and he started feeling the hate from Bruce Allen right around, well, he’s been feeling it, but when they didn’t let him speak at the Senior Bowl, he said to him that was his last straw, and he knew that he was on his way out," Robinson said on McElroy's show. "He said it was after a draft meeting, after the Combine, Bruce called him up to his office and was just like, ‘Nobody likes you in this building. Nobody wants you here.’ And Scot was like, well, I guess I’m out of here."
The Redskins fired McCloughan exactly three weeks ago. At the time, an anonymous team official told the Washington Post that the firing was the result of McCloughan's struggles with alcohol.
Robinson said in his conversation, McCloughan told him that wasn't the reason.
"He said, 'Mike, I don’t have an issue right now drinking,'" Robinson said. "'I haven’t touched a drink in a while. But of course they wouldn’t let me say it because they silenced me.'
"And (the conversation) was deep. And we’ll talk more - I can’t go into everything we talked about, but it was a guy who didn’t look like he was done with the National Football League. He looked like a guy who felt like he had something to prove."
Robinson is a weekly guest on McElroy's program, and in addition to his media work is the founder of Excel To Excellence, a tutoring program for middle an high schoolers in the Richmond area.
In the interview, Robinson also addressed a report that Allen was angry at McCloughan for talking to a player after a rough practice.
Bruce Allen being jealous doesn't add up. First of all, Dan Snyder loves him some Bruce Allen. Bruce Allen can do no wrong by Snyder. Secondly, Allen isn't going to go to Snyder and say, "We've got to get rid of Scot because he's too good at his job!" Snyder is a weasel but I don't believe for two seconds that he would get rid of Scot McCloughan over some invented drinking narrative. It's pretty clear at this point the argument was over signing or not signing Cousins back when he was still affordable. Bruce controls the purse strings so if he wanted Cousins signed two years ago he would have been. Scot's gone. Cousins still isn't signed. There's no way in hell that's on Scot. But Bruce would put it on Scot to save his own phony baloney job. I doubt Scot would agree to take the wrap for Bruce Allen not agreeing to sign Kirk Cousins two years ago when Scot wanted to extend his rookie deal. The thing is, Bruce should have had no say in personnel. He brought Scot in for that specific reason. Then he wouldn't let the man do his job from all outward appearances.markshark84 wrote:Disagree. There are two main narratives: (1) Scot's a drunk, (2) Bruce is jealous.
I think the fact that they aren't even looking for a General Manager before the draft says everything. It's still the Little Danny's Napoleon Complex Show.mastdark81 wrote:I think there is one other narrative. McCloughan wasn't never going to stay long term! Bruce & Dan was only satisfying fans with a temporary quick fix to our frustrations. To me the hiring of Scot was a PR move after Allen got blasted by the media and tension rose in the fan base to an all-time high. I knew they would come up with an excuse the first time we didn't achieve playoffs. He knew that hiring a GM would keep folks at bay (not me but most). So he hired Scot, a guy with prior baggage. Perfect candidate b/c he could put blame on Scot for his baggage at the end of the day. Scot was ok given the tools that he was given but that is another underlying fact... He was never allowed to pull all of his prior staff in. So he was the odd man in most cases. Once Snyder & Co. seen he was a different fella and not wanting to join their social club, they did what they wanted to do originally and that is keep the current setup. Again hiring McCloughan was originally a PR move and not even thought about prior. They were just fine going to McCloughan's scouting service to pick his staff's brain.
What is crazy is how many bridges Snyder is burning in the NFL...guys that actually have talent that will never again be employed by the Skins.
This is how it will work here longterm as long as Snyder is owner:
Snyder = Dictator / Bruce Allen or Person A or Person B = puppet/face/voice of snyder
Any other scenario will be short-term. Can we win a Super Bowl in this method...sure we may get lucky one year but it will never be long term sustainable success in the current order until Snyder stay away from the football decisions and they stop hiring buddies and guys they know to have a social club with and hire guys instead who's earned work.
I don't. This McCloughan thing was a mess and a complete PR nightmare. I know we have a low opinion of Snyder, but it strikes me as nonsense that he would just go along with this without some sort of reason. Professional jealousy? Yeah I don't think so.DEHog wrote:Does anybody really think Allen has this much or type of authority?
That's all possible. But they could have easily moved on from Scot without creating the s***show we all witnessed last month.mastdark81 wrote:I think there is one other narrative. McCloughan wasn't never going to stay long term! Bruce & Dan was only satisfying fans with a temporary quick fix to our frustrations. To me the hiring of Scot was a PR move after Allen got blasted by the media and tension rose in the fan base to an all-time high. I knew they would come up with an excuse the first time we didn't achieve playoffs. He knew that hiring a GM would keep folks at bay (not me but most). So he hired Scot, a guy with prior baggage. Perfect candidate b/c he could put blame on Scot for his baggage at the end of the day. Scot was ok given the tools that he was given but that is another underlying fact... He was never allowed to pull all of his prior staff in. So he was the odd man in most cases. Once Snyder & Co. seen he was a different fella and not wanting to join their social club, they did what they wanted to do originally and that is keep the current setup. Again hiring McCloughan was originally a PR move and not even thought about prior. They were just fine going to McCloughan's scouting service to pick his staff's brain.
I don't think Allen was jealous based on Danny's perception ---- but the perception of the fans. The FANS thought (rightfully so) that Scot was the reason for the turnaround. Meanwhile, there are players on this team that Allen brought in that are contributing (same came be said, and mostly so, for Shanahan). He was jealous that Scot was RESPECTED. And he clearly wasn't.Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:Bruce Allen being jealous doesn't add up. First of all, Dan Snyder loves him some Bruce Allen. Bruce Allen can do no wrong by Snyder. Secondly, Allen isn't going to go to Snyder and say, "We've got to get rid of Scot because he's too good at his job!" Snyder is a weasel but I don't believe for two seconds that he would get rid of Scot McCloughan over some invented drinking narrative. It's pretty clear at this point the argument was over signing or not signing Cousins back when he was still affordable. Bruce controls the purse strings so if he wanted Cousins signed two years ago he would have been. Scot's gone. Cousins still isn't signed. There's no way in hell that's on Scot. But Bruce would put it on Scot to save his own phony baloney job. I doubt Scot would agree to take the wrap for Bruce Allen not agreeing to sign Kirk Cousins two years ago when Scot wanted to extend his rookie deal. The thing is, Bruce should have had no say in personnel. He brought Scot in for that specific reason. Then he wouldn't let the man do his job from all outward appearances.markshark84 wrote:Disagree. There are two main narratives: (1) Scot's a drunk, (2) Bruce is jealous.
Professional franchises have one GM. The Redskins have a cluster *f$ck* by committee which is why they fail so frequently.
I still don't see how that makes sense. Allen knew McCloughan was going to be the personnel guy when he hired him. Allen knew he was going to be "promoted" to being the finance guy. Allen was not only on board with the hiring of McCloughan, he's the reason McCloughan was hired. Allen knew McCloughan was better at personnel than he is. That's why Allen wanted McCloughan in the first place. So, you're suggesting Allen changed his mind on wanting a real personnel GM? That sounds ridiculous. Now the onus is entirely on Allen to get the Cousins deal done. I think it's more likely McCloughan wanted to do things his way and Allen did what Dan Snyder always does: Stuck his nose where it didn't belong.markshark84 wrote:I don't think Allen was jealous based on Danny's perception ---- but the perception of the fans. The FANS thought (rightfully so) that Scot was the reason for the turnaround. Meanwhile, there are players on this team that Allen brought in that are contributing (same came be said, and mostly so, for Shanahan). He was jealous that Scot was RESPECTED. And he clearly wasn't.
And with respect to Allen getting Scot fired ---- you have to look at it like a decently smart person would in what Allen would say to Danny boy in order to get Scot out. He wouldn't be an idiot and say it was because Scot is good or getting more respect --- no way. Instead he would do what slimy @ssholes do ---- (1) use Danny's trust against him by making accusations/suggestions putting Scot in a bad light, (2) turn others Allen has power over within redskins park against Scot, (3) bad mouth Scot's less desirable character traits to his "followers" and superior, (4) take powers away from Scot or otherwise do things that he knows would upset Scot and that Scot would react to (i.e., manipulate him so that he displays character traits that fit the agenda in parts 1 and 3 --- these would include not resigning the players he wants), and then (5) when Scot reacts, all the things Allen planted in Danny boy's head are now somehow "true"...... And at that point, Allen makes the play that "we just can't keep this relationship together, Scot is tearing down the place"..... Then little idiot boy Danny will acquiesce because he's a dope and saw none of the planned manipulation coming. This type of sh!t happens all the time in the business world. It's the class A corporate manipulation special. And I bet you that Allen is a motherf#&$ing PRO at it.
If Allen is anything, he's a survivor. He's the type of guy that has no real skill, but keeps his job because he knows how to manipulate others and his superiors by getting their trust and exploiting it. It's basically akin to being a leech. Similar to a kiss @ss but a little less respectable. Kiss @sses at least can still be good at their jobs.
And if the argument was over signing or not signing Cousins --- Scot has been very clear he wanted to resign Cousins in 2014!!! Allen is the one that has been against it --- and continues to look like a fool.
BINGO - them's the facts!Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:The Redskins are 45-66-1 in the Bruce Allen era. They were 17-14-1 in the Scot McCloughan era. People can talk all they like about how some of Bruce's picks were good ones and about how some of Scot's picks were bad ones but McCloughan can put on his resume that he had two winning seasons with a Redskins front office where "no one wanted him there."
I don't know what either of you guys believe this proves. Bruce Allen was also 17-14-1 over the past two years. So was Jay Gruden. So was Redskins nutritionist Paul Kelly.SkinsJock wrote:BINGO - them's the facts!Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:The Redskins are 45-66-1 in the Bruce Allen era. They were 17-14-1 in the Scot McCloughan era. People can talk all they like about how some of Bruce's picks were good ones and about how some of Scot's picks were bad ones but McCloughan can put on his resume that he had two winning seasons with a Redskins front office where "no one wanted him there."
Probably so. I can give two recent examples outside of the Redskins of Scot McCloughan leaving an NFL team under shaky circumstances but I won't waste anyone's time either.fredp45 wrote:Bruce Allen is a liar and I can give many instances -- but won't waste my time...or yours!
I think it proves that Scot McCloughan made a huge difference. Allen was 32-52 before Scot McCloughan. That's a 0.380 winning percentage, which would get most GMs fired.riggofan wrote:I don't know what either of you guys believe this proves. Bruce Allen was also 17-14-1 over the past two years. So was Jay Gruden. So was Redskins nutritionist Paul Kelly.SkinsJock wrote:BINGO - them's the facts!Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:The Redskins are 45-66-1 in the Bruce Allen era. They were 17-14-1 in the Scot McCloughan era. People can talk all they like about how some of Bruce's picks were good ones and about how some of Scot's picks were bad ones but McCloughan can put on his resume that he had two winning seasons with a Redskins front office where "no one wanted him there."
Or it proves that Kirk Cousins made a huge difference. Or maybe nutritionist Paul Kelly. Or maybe Trent Murphy, Morgan Moses, Spencer Long, Bashaud Breeland who were all starters from Bruce Allen's draft? RG3 was on the team in 2015. Maybe it proves he's a good QB?Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:I think it proves that Scot McCloughan made a huge difference. Allen was 32-52 before Scot McCloughan. That's a 0.380 winning percentage, which would get most GMs fired.
This is where we disagree. I don't think Allen ever WANTED Scot. I think Scot was forced on Allen by Snyder. Danny is spineless and knew that the fans wouldn't be happy with a Dumb & Dumber 2.0 situation with him and Allen (like we have now), so he forced Allen to hire a "GM-Scout type guy". The only decent one available was Scot --- and Allen knew they'd have a very good alibi if it didn't work out or Allen grew sick of him: Scot's drinking.Burgundy&GoldForever wrote: That's why Allen wanted McCloughan in the first place. So, you're suggesting Allen changed his mind on wanting a real personnel GM? That sounds ridiculous.
That's not what's being reported though. Not saying that he was going to break the bank for Cousins, but he told Michael Robinson that he wanted to get a deal done.DEHog wrote:SM was a part of building some pretty completive teams; I think he was in the process of doing that here. I also think part of that building included not breaking the bank (cap) on one player. Let’s see if the FO backs up a brinks truck for Cousins!
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc- ... 6fbedbecefAnd Robinson said McCloughan told him he had wanted to sign Kirk Cousins to a long-term deal, another reported source of conflict.
The guy left his last two NFL jobs because of drinking and personal issues. Yet fans still want to turn this all into Game of Thrones. lol.markshark84 wrote:This is where we disagree. I don't think Allen ever WANTED Scot. I think Scot was forced on Allen by Snyder. Danny is spineless and knew that the fans wouldn't be happy with a Dumb & Dumber 2.0 situation with him and Allen (like we have now), so he forced Allen to hire a "GM-Scout type guy". The only decent one available was Scot --- and Allen knew they'd have a very good alibi if it didn't work out or Allen grew sick of him: Scot's drinking.
