Final 53

[riggofan]

Why is Norman not a plus for Scott?

Well, we haven't seen Norman play a game yet for one thing. I'd also say signing the biggest name FA CB to an enormous contract isn't exactly a genius move.

[DarthMonk]

all that matters is we're getting better and a large part of the credit for that is due to McCloughan being here and Dan Snyder staying away from the football operations

let's be clear - we did not win the division because of McCloughan but despite his draft and FA 'mistakes' the franchise is improving

We really don't know if we are getting better as an organization unless we WIN consistently. We've made it to the playoffs before of recent but typically right after that year of squeaking into the playoffs we are back into the cellar of the division.

So to me just like Kirk, we had a decent 2015 year but until we prove we can string together two or more consecutive seasons we won't get that respect like other organizations.

The bar have been lowered over the years to just wanting to get to the playoffs. I get it, take baby steps but one day we have to build a team and expect to win a few games and be a Super Bowl contender. Doesn't happen over night but we will know if we are moving in the right direction this year for sure.

Right now McCloughan's progress is still to be determined as far as the draft picks but we DO KNOW that he's failing as far as the free agents brought in right?
Derek Carrier - traded a 5th rounder. miss
Vernon Davis - tbd
Ty Nsekhe - hit..good quality swing tacker
Stork - didn't lose anything but c'mon it is a miss just for offering a pick for a guy that had multiple concussions for that was not healthy.
Paea - miss
Potroast - miss
Ricky Jean - hit
Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.
Culliver - miss
Dashon Goldson - i wouldn't necessarily call this a miss but you would think they would want to keep him multiple years...so more miss than hit.
Mason Foster - tbd..but so far a hit. We have to see how he plays for a full season.

Don't agree with your Stork analysis. Very low risk to reward situation, so I don't see how you can call it a miss. I also disagree that Potroast was a miss. He may not have been great last season, but he was good enough, as a one-year stop-gap, to be the starter on the team. And what about Josh Norman? Doesn't he count? It may not be a hit yet, but the chances are good. I'd say he's done fairly well in the FA market. As for the draft "mistakes," I say, Please! Every team passes on players that wind up getting drafted in the late rounds, and turn out to be stars. There are 31 teams kicking themselves for not drafting Brady in rounds 1-5. But those are the exception, not the rule.

... and if

Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.

then the same goes for Carrier and Culliver.

Derek Carrier suffered a season-ending injury tearing both his ACL and MCL in his right knee.

Chris Culliver is out for the season after suffering a knee injury during practice.

[mastdark81]

all that matters is we're getting better and a large part of the credit for that is due to McCloughan being here and Dan Snyder staying away from the football operations

let's be clear - we did not win the division because of McCloughan but despite his draft and FA 'mistakes' the franchise is improving

We really don't know if we are getting better as an organization unless we WIN consistently. We've made it to the playoffs before of recent but typically right after that year of squeaking into the playoffs we are back into the cellar of the division.

So to me just like Kirk, we had a decent 2015 year but until we prove we can string together two or more consecutive seasons we won't get that respect like other organizations.

The bar have been lowered over the years to just wanting to get to the playoffs. I get it, take baby steps but one day we have to build a team and expect to win a few games and be a Super Bowl contender. Doesn't happen over night but we will know if we are moving in the right direction this year for sure.

Right now McCloughan's progress is still to be determined as far as the draft picks but we DO KNOW that he's failing as far as the free agents brought in right?
Derek Carrier - traded a 5th rounder. miss
Vernon Davis - tbd
Ty Nsekhe - hit..good quality swing tacker
Stork - didn't lose anything but c'mon it is a miss just for offering a pick for a guy that had multiple concussions for that was not healthy.
Paea - miss
Potroast - miss
Ricky Jean - hit
Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.
Culliver - miss
Dashon Goldson - i wouldn't necessarily call this a miss but you would think they would want to keep him multiple years...so more miss than hit.
Mason Foster - tbd..but so far a hit. We have to see how he plays for a full season.

Don't agree with your Stork analysis. Very low risk to reward situation, so I don't see how you can call it a miss. I also disagree that Potroast was a miss. He may not have been great last season, but he was good enough, as a one-year stop-gap, to be the starter on the team. And what about Josh Norman? Doesn't he count? It may not be a hit yet, but the chances are good. I'd say he's done fairly well in the FA market. As for the draft "mistakes," I say, Please! Every team passes on players that wind up getting drafted in the late rounds, and turn out to be stars. There are 31 teams kicking themselves for not drafting Brady in rounds 1-5. But those are the exception, not the rule.

The fact that you had to trade for an average center LATE in camp tells me you didn't put an emphasis on the position and misevaluated the talent we already had on the team. We could have gotten a healthier center earlier in free agency with no injury issues and he could have competed. Should have known that Kory is on his last leg, we as fans do right? So why didn't Scott? Since we lost out on the center Ryan in the draft we should have made it more of a priority.

Potroast was suppose to be our NT for at least 4 years...c'mon man they offered him a multi-year deal but Potroast was the guy that only wanted the 1 YEAR deal to prove his worth. He didn't make an impact I don't think hardly any game he played last year and I think they paid him 4mil so that was a bust. The tag on him right before we picked him up was that he was heavily out of shape...we signed him anyway. Could have picked up Dan Williams that year right?

Josh Norman counts but not in this post because he haven't played with us yet so he's yet to be determined. If he plays like he did in Carolina then he wouldn't be a steal because he's getting paid big time but would be labeled as a good acquisition for sure. TBD.

I never mentioned any draft mistakes maybe someone else did but it is too early to tell. I just said we could actually evaluate his current free agent acquisitions at least. Everybody have an opinion and I gave mine with my rationale on the picks that were hit and miss. If you think he's done fairly well how so? Explain please.

[mastdark81]

all that matters is we're getting better and a large part of the credit for that is due to McCloughan being here and Dan Snyder staying away from the football operations

let's be clear - we did not win the division because of McCloughan but despite his draft and FA 'mistakes' the franchise is improving

We really don't know if we are getting better as an organization unless we WIN consistently. We've made it to the playoffs before of recent but typically right after that year of squeaking into the playoffs we are back into the cellar of the division.

So to me just like Kirk, we had a decent 2015 year but until we prove we can string together two or more consecutive seasons we won't get that respect like other organizations.

The bar have been lowered over the years to just wanting to get to the playoffs. I get it, take baby steps but one day we have to build a team and expect to win a few games and be a Super Bowl contender. Doesn't happen over night but we will know if we are moving in the right direction this year for sure.

Right now McCloughan's progress is still to be determined as far as the draft picks but we DO KNOW that he's failing as far as the free agents brought in right?
Derek Carrier - traded a 5th rounder. miss
Vernon Davis - tbd
Ty Nsekhe - hit..good quality swing tacker
Stork - didn't lose anything but c'mon it is a miss just for offering a pick for a guy that had multiple concussions for that was not healthy.
Paea - miss
Potroast - miss
Ricky Jean - hit
Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.
Culliver - miss
Dashon Goldson - i wouldn't necessarily call this a miss but you would think they would want to keep him multiple years...so more miss than hit.
Mason Foster - tbd..but so far a hit. We have to see how he plays for a full season.

Don't agree with your Stork analysis. Very low risk to reward situation, so I don't see how you can call it a miss. I also disagree that Potroast was a miss. He may not have been great last season, but he was good enough, as a one-year stop-gap, to be the starter on the team. And what about Josh Norman? Doesn't he count? It may not be a hit yet, but the chances are good. I'd say he's done fairly well in the FA market. As for the draft "mistakes," I say, Please! Every team passes on players that wind up getting drafted in the late rounds, and turn out to be stars. There are 31 teams kicking themselves for not drafting Brady in rounds 1-5. But those are the exception, not the rule.

... and if

Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.

then the same goes for Carrier and Culliver.

Derek Carrier suffered a season-ending injury tearing both his ACL and MCL in his right knee.

Chris Culliver is out for the season after suffering a knee injury during practice.

[/quote]


Naw bro we seen Carrier and Culliver and they was maaaaad average. Carrier was a poor blocker and downgrade from even Niles Paul right or wrong? They traded a 5th for him. You can find Carriers in 2nd portions of free agency. If anybody they should have picked up Jermaine Gresham for free and would have had a better blocker, player that knew the system, and an extra option in the redzone. Culliver played as well (not long) and wasn't worth the 9mil we was paying him. But didn't he already have an injury history? They got lucky he had an suspension and was able to release his contract. I mentioned Galette because he had not played a down and was free from an injury history prior to this. Tell me if I'm wrong.

[DarthMonk]

... and if

Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.

then the same goes for Carrier and Culliver.

Derek Carrier suffered a season-ending injury tearing both his ACL and MCL in his right knee.

Chris Culliver is out for the season after suffering a knee injury during practice.

Naw bro we seen Carrier and Culliver and they was maaaaad average. Carrier was a poor blocker and downgrade from even Niles Paul right or wrong? They traded a 5th for him. You can find Carriers in 2nd portions of free agency. If anybody they should have picked up Jermaine Gresham for free and would have had a better blocker, player that knew the system, and an extra option in the redzone. Culliver played as well (not long) and wasn't worth the 9mil we was paying him. But didn't he already have an injury history? They got lucky he had an suspension and was able to release his contract. I mentioned Galette because he had not played a down and was free from an injury history prior to this. Tell me if I'm wrong.

Will do.

The Washington Redskins have recently sent two of their tight ends to injured reserve. On Friday, they filled a void.

The Redskins have acquired tight end Derek Carrier from the San Francisco 49ers in exchange for a fifth-round pick in the 2016 NFL Draft.

It's a necessary move for Washington after Niles Paul and Logan Paulsen suffered season-ending injuries in the past two weeks. Carrier, 25, is an unproven player with considerable upside as a blocker and receiver. He signed a three-year deal in March that keeps under team control for the next three years at less than $1 million annually.

We were pretty desperate and had an extra 5th rounder from a draft day trade. I started him one day when Reed was out with a concussion. He blocked well and scored a TD.

Culliver had a strong 2014 after missing the previous season due to an ACL tear. His career arc is still ascending, too, with a marked improvement over each of his first two seasons.

Surprisingly, this past season was his best, though.

Culliver pushed through what is typically a down year for those recovering from a torn ACL. He allowed just half of the passes thrown his way to be caught, according to Pro Football Focus, and surrendered an opposing passer rating of 66.5.

That 66.5 was 6th in the league, Josh Norman was 4th.

You can say we lucked out on the suspension thing but it's something Scot knew about and that's why it was in the contract. I'll say he was smart.

BTW - I like your posts a lot and I enjoy arguing.

[mastdark81]

Will do.

The Washington Redskins have recently sent two of their tight ends to injured reserve. On Friday, they filled a void.

The Redskins have acquired tight end Derek Carrier from the San Francisco 49ers in exchange for a fifth-round pick in the 2016 NFL Draft.

It's a necessary move for Washington after Niles Paul and Logan Paulsen suffered season-ending injuries in the past two weeks. Carrier, 25, is an unproven player with considerable upside as a blocker and receiver. He signed a three-year deal in March that keeps under team control for the next three years at less than $1 million annually.

We were pretty desperate and had an extra 5th rounder from a draft day trade. I started him one day when Reed was out with a concussion. He blocked well and scored a TD.

Culliver had a strong 2014 after missing the previous season due to an ACL tear. His career arc is still ascending, too, with a marked improvement over each of his first two seasons.

Surprisingly, this past season was his best, though.

Culliver pushed through what is typically a down year for those recovering from a torn ACL. He allowed just half of the passes thrown his way to be caught, according to Pro Football Focus, and surrendered an opposing passer rating of 66.5.

That 66.5 was 6th in the league, Josh Norman was 4th.

You can say we lucked out on the suspension thing but it's something Scot knew about and that's why it was in the contract. I'll say he was smart.

BTW - I like your posts a lot and I enjoy arguing.

[/quote]

Just cause you have an extra 5th don't mean you are free to blow it. We had DYoung. We could have easily went to a 1 TE/1FB set. Derek Carrier came in and did not help with the running game AT ALL. He was no better than any other guy. Mind you this was a WR in college, who came into the NFL with questions at blocking.
"Heading into training camp, the big question for Carrier was his blocking." [with 49ers]
http://www.ninersnation.com/2014/9/20/6 ... ek-carrier
At the end of the day he's a backup when healthy and 3rd or 4th string with Reed, Davis, Paul all clearly ahead of him....and he don't play special teams, now he's hurt haha get out of here. This was a bad pickup. There were guys we could have picked up prior to even being desperate. But Scott decided not too.

Picking up Will Blackmon, Quinton Dunbar, Pierre Thomas were better free agent value picks but they didn't hit with Carrier when you factor trading a draft pick for him. I bet they wouldn't do that agaiin if they had the chance. Now if he turn out to be a starter and be a solid player then I will eat crow.

In reference to Culliver well why pick up Norman? Or why not keep him if he's comparable to Josh Norman statistics? We could have kept a solid Culliver for half the price. Why would they do such a thing? lol

[riggofan]

The fact that you had to trade for an average center LATE in camp tells me you didn't put an emphasis on the position and misevaluated the talent we already had on the team. We could have gotten a healthier center earlier in free agency with no injury issues and he could have competed. Should have known that Kory is on his last leg, we as fans do right? So why didn't Scott? Since we lost out on the center Ryan in the draft we should have made it more of a priority.

I don't know man. You're smart enough to point out that we lost out on Ryan Kelly in the draft - its been pretty widely reported that he was Scot's target. So I disagree that Scot didn't put emphasis on the position.

It seems to me that he just doesn't believe those issues get solved in free agency. I'd say the Redskins of the past two decades are pretty clear evidence that he is right on that.

Couldn't address center in the draft this year. Seems he judged his next best option was to roll with Kory, see what Long and Reiter can do to challenge for the job. And not overpay for or put us in a bind with yet another free agent retread castoff.

I feel your frustration on that position, man. We gotta get bigger and better than Lichtensteiger. I'll be bummed if Long doesn't push his way into the starting position this season.

[mastdark81]

The fact that you had to trade for an average center LATE in camp tells me you didn't put an emphasis on the position and misevaluated the talent we already had on the team. We could have gotten a healthier center earlier in free agency with no injury issues and he could have competed. Should have known that Kory is on his last leg, we as fans do right? So why didn't Scott? Since we lost out on the center Ryan in the draft we should have made it more of a priority.

I don't know man. You're smart enough to point out that we lost out on Ryan Kelly in the draft - its been pretty widely reported that he was Scot's target. So I disagree that Scot didn't put emphasis on the position.

It seems to me that he just doesn't believe those issues get solved in free agency. I'd say the Redskins of the past two decades are pretty clear evidence that he is right on that.

Couldn't address center in the draft this year. Seems he judged his next best option was to roll with Kory, see what Long and Reiter can do to challenge for the job. And not overpay for or put us in a bind with yet another free agent retread castoff.

I feel your frustration on that position, man. We gotta get bigger and better than Lichtensteiger. I'll be bummed if Long doesn't push his way into the starting position this season.

I think your right where our gm feels we don't live off of free agents, but you cannot ignore them all. If you pick one up or you trade for one, my motto is to trade for one early before camp starts. Nick Martin the rookie (now injured) was available I believe in the 2nd round and likely he would have started day 1 or at least pushed our current center, however we drafted Sua Cravens instead. Martin was considered the 2nd best center in the draft by most and immediate starter for most clubs.

But anyway, good conversation. #httr

[riggofan]

I think your right where our gm feels we don't live off of free agents, but you cannot ignore them all. If you pick one up or you trade for one, my motto is to trade for one early before camp starts. Nick Martin the rookie (now injured) was available I believe in the 2nd round and likely he would have started day 1 or at least pushed our current center, however we drafted Sua Cravens instead. Martin was considered the 2nd best center in the draft by most and immediate starter for most clubs.

But anyway, good conversation. #httr

Right on, man. The only thing about Nick Martin is that he's about the same size as Lichtensteiger. Maybe an inch or two taller. I think McCloughan wants to get big at every position on the line, including center. Ryan Kelly had like 20 lbs on both of those guys.

I don't really know off the top of my head what FA centers might have been on the market. It just seems like when you look back at free agency, for the most part if guys were really good their teams don't let them get away in the first place. I know there are always exceptions, but you get my point.

On the bright side, I hear Licht can actually snap the ball.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Our FA spending allowance is something to note as well... Scotty Mac came in on the tail end of a major sanction for violating unwritten rules. Not like he was able to just bring in all the best guys at their position.

I liked the Pierre addition, blackmon.. the o wd that weren't super splashy but equated to direct contributions.

As per the draft... Sua is said by more then just skins fans to be part of the xfactor leading in to Monday's battle... I doubt a rookie C would've had that same kind of spotlight if u catch my drift... BPA- and no his best player on his chart is not the same as Rich Tandlers! LOL

[Irn-Bru]

Right now McCloughan's progress is still to be determined as far as the draft picks but we DO KNOW that he's failing as far as the free agents brought in right?

I don't think so.

Derek Carrier - traded a 5th rounder. miss

Eh. If he's a miss, it's only because we used a draft pick. Not an issue with how well he performed here.

Vernon Davis - tbd
Ty Nsekhe - hit..good quality swing tacker

I've got a good feeling about Davis. And yes, Nsekhe was a hit.

Stork - didn't lose anything but c'mon it is a miss just for offering a pick for a guy that had multiple concussions for that was not healthy.

Absolutely not a miss. A smart move by a GM who got to take a look at a player before the rest of the league. And when it didn't look good, it didn't cost us a dime. That's not exactly a hit but shows that we've got someone smart in the front office.

Paea - miss
Ricky Jean - hit
Galette - not Scot's fault on this one.
Culliver - miss
Mason Foster - tbd..but so far a hit. We have to see how he plays for a full season.

Sure.

Potroast - miss

No, he played OK for us last year on a modest deal. (The size of his deal is key to evaluating whether he was a hit or miss.) Not good enough to merit a raise, but then he didn't cost us much either. It is what it is, and that's not a miss.

Dashon Goldson - i wouldn't necessarily call this a miss but you would think they would want to keep him multiple years...so more miss than hit.

I disagree. I believe Tampa Bay payed Goldson more than we did while he played for us. (Similar to the deal that brought DeSean Jackson in.)

His level of play was about what you'd expect from a stopgap . . . good enough when "nobody" is basically the only other option, but something we wanted to upgrade — which we did.

And I'll add:
Dustin Hopkins - hit
Will Blackmon - hit
Quinton Dunbar - we'll see but seems to be a hit
Jeron Johnson - miss

For one year, that's not a bad list of hits versus misses. And even the misses have been small and had little impact on the rest of our team: it was more about giving guys a chance to compete here and ensuring we weren't so invested in them that we couldn't cut our losses at any time. FA signings are risky like draft picks, so we have to expect misses — the key questions are, (1) are we also hitting on a decent number of acquisitions and (2) are we avoiding giving a big contract to a FA bust?

It's pretty clear that SM is running a tight ship and exercising quite a bit of patience. The riskiest thing we've done yet is acquire Josh Norman. If he turns out to be a total bust this year, then I'll agree that SM has not done well in free agency. But for now there's just not enough to say much one way or the other, IMHO.

[riggofan]

It's pretty clear that SM is running a tight ship and exercising quite a bit of patience.

That sums it up exactly.

[oj]

Since we've included Scott in this discussion - I wonder how his hand is doing?

[DarthMonk]

... Reed, Davis, Paul all clearly ahead of him ... lol

At the time, the 3 guys you name were concussed, not on the team yet, and out for the year with a knee. We were desperate. Then the acquisition named Carrier blew out his knee.

In reference to Culliver well why pick up Norman?

umm .. he blew out his knee. He's gone.

If Norman blows out his knee Monday night, he he a miss too ?

LOL

[Burgundy&GoldForever]

Not to sound like a wet blanket but could we let the team play a game before we start judging Scot McCloughan's prowess as a general manager in re personnel?

[SkinsJock]

This franchise was in complete disarray at the end of 2014 with no direction, no plan and no leadership ...

McCloughan came in and has the franchise at least looking and acting like an NFL franchise - we're not considered a good team but there's hope where there was nothing ... it's possible that with a little more time under McCloughan's leadership, this franchise might be considered in the top 5 or top 10 - that by itself is an amazing turnaround all things considered

this roster is still a work in progress but there is certainly many reasons to feel good about what McCloughan has achieved

[mastdark81]

Yall still drinking the koolaid I see. 0-1 again. Havent beat the Steelers since I dont know when. Same ole same ole...getting crushed at home. McCloughans free agents nowhere to be found...draft picks subpar.

[mastdark81]

... Reed, Davis, Paul all clearly ahead of him ... lol

At the time, the 3 guys you name were concussed, not on the team yet, and out for the year with a knee. We were desperate. Then the acquisition named Carrier blew out his knee.

In reference to Culliver well why pick up Norman?

umm .. he blew out his knee. He's gone.

If Norman blows out his knee Monday night, he he a miss too ?

LOL

Gresham was available for FREE champ. They traded for a guy that cant crack the 2nd string spot when healthy...#2 you didnt have to be desperate when you had a fullback.

Culliver was just average at best when he did play. Dont act like you dont remember him getting smoked in the games he did play. He wasnt what they thought and They knew this after they got him, therefore they didnt offer to restructure. Gallette came off acl and they resigned. Why? B/c when he practiced they seen he was real deal... But did not in Cully. They didnt see him being a factor and was confident in Breeland. Thats a miss clearly and lets be honest he wasnt a #1 before we got him unlike Norman.

Like the other guy said Dustin Hopkins was a good acquistion. Will Blackmon was ok but hes not a starter. I was more grading him on the free agents that recieved multi million dollar deals

[DarthMonk]

... Reed, Davis, Paul all clearly ahead of him ... lol

At the time, the 3 guys you name were concussed, not on the team yet, and out for the year with a knee. We were desperate. Then the acquisition named Carrier blew out his knee.

In reference to Culliver well why pick up Norman?

umm .. he blew out his knee. He's gone.

If Norman blows out his knee Monday night, he he a miss too ?

LOL

Gresham was available for FREE champ. They traded for a guy that cant crack the 2nd string spot when healthy...#2 you didnt have to be desperate when you had a fullback.

Culliver was just average at best when he did play. Dont act like you dont remember him getting smoked in the games he did play. He wasnt what they thought and They knew this after they got him, therefore they didnt offer to restructure. Gallette came off acl and they resigned. Why? B/c when he practiced they seen he was real deal... But did not in Cully. They didnt see him being a factor and was confident in Breeland. Thats a miss clearly and lets be honest he wasnt a #1 before we got him unlike Norman.

Like the other guy said Dustin Hopkins was a good acquistion. Will Blackmon was ok but hes not a starter. I was more grading him on the free agents that recieved multi million dollar deals

Your post is spewing. Culliver was top notch - a clear number one before we got him. The 49ers put him on IR in August 2013 with a torn ACL. He was outstanding both before and after that ACL. He wrecked his knee with us. He was never the same. You don't restructure for that guy. You cut your losses.

Carrier stepped in immediately and was helping us at FB, TE, and WR. He was blocking with Reed in the lineup while a few other TE/FB/WRs were out. Reed got concussed and Carrier started as a receiving TE against the Falcons. He scored a TD. Then he blew out a knee.

Gallette never came off an ACL. He hurt his Achilles. We signed him twice dirt cheap.

I think your argument for Carrier being a miss is stronger than the one against Culliver but only because we gave up a pick (extra 5th rounder). I still disagree that either was a miss. They both got hurt real bad while here.

We are all entitled to our opinions. At least get the facts straight.

#whatever

[SkinsJock]

Yall still drinking the koolaid I see. 0-1 again. Havent beat the Steelers since I dont know when. Same ole same ole...getting crushed at home. McCloughans free agents nowhere to be found...draft picks subpar.

If you cannot see the improvement here since 2014 you're only looking for things that suit your 'agenda' - not many teams are beating the Steelers when they play like that - we did not play well but they were still much better than we were - it's just 1 game ...

there are still many issues and McCloughan has made mistakes but considering what he's done with what he inherited, this is a franchise that to most fans and the media looks a lot more stable with a lot better outlook than anything we've had this century

the roster is a work in progress but there's still a lot to do - rather than 'invest' in quick fixes this FO has taken a far better approach and in the long run this franchise will be a lot better off as long as Snyder stays out of things

many of us were disappointed in what we saw Monday but the product on the field will prove to be better and we are fortunate to be in a weak division - I watched parts of the eagles and most of the pukes/giants game and am not convinced that we cannot win our division again - that being said, we certainly do have issues both running the ball and stopping the run - but ...

this is NOT the "same ole, same ole ... " this team can and will play a lot better than what we saw Monday

[mastdark81]

Your post is spewing. Culliver was top notch - a clear number one before we got him. The 49ers put him on IR in August 2013 with a torn ACL. He was outstanding both before and after that ACL. He wrecked his knee with us. He was never the same. You don't restructure for that guy. You cut your losses.

Carrier stepped in immediately and was helping us at FB, TE, and WR. He was blocking with Reed in the lineup while a few other TE/FB/WRs were out. Reed got concussed and Carrier started as a receiving TE against the Falcons. He scored a TD. Then he blew out a knee.

Gallette never came off an ACL. He hurt his Achilles. We signed him twice dirt cheap.

I think your argument for Carrier being a miss is stronger than the one against Culliver but only because we gave up a pick (extra 5th rounder). I still disagree that either was a miss. They both got hurt real bad while here.

We are all entitled to our opinions. At least get the facts straight.

#whatever

I am typing facts. Culliver was definitely a #1 with the 49ers for maaaaaybe a year. If he was actually even a top 10 corner we would have kept him even if he had an ACL injury. We actually got him on subpar #1 cb money. You want to know why? Because he's really like a 1 1/2 & most general managers dont consider him an elite corner. Most #1 cb's were getting over 10-15 range in salary at his age. Culliver is rated with Sean Smith, Verner, Maxwell and he got less than all of them. We had a sliver of an opportunity to get rid of him and we did. He wasn't worth the money we was paying him. This is facts! He's gone, made 0 impact with us so its a MISS! They didn't try to resign him, later on for the cheap don't be delusional.

Carrier wasn't kicking up no dust with nobody. Yeah he started on a depleted te squad but once again I had no problem getting him, I just wouldn't have traded a 5th for a guy you can get in free agency waivers. I pointed out who we could have signed don't ignore it (Gresham). I said it when it happened. We wasted a 5th. You going to trade a pick, we gotta traded for Vernon Davis at that point or a Pettigrew for that (more of a proven te). You trade for a guy that wasn't making nothing happen and a poor blocker. Look at the tape, he is not good a blocking and you probably couldn't name 5 NFL teams he can start TE for.

[mastdark81]

Yall still drinking the koolaid I see. 0-1 again. Havent beat the Steelers since I dont know when. Same ole same ole...getting crushed at home. McCloughans free agents nowhere to be found...draft picks subpar.

If you cannot see the improvement here since 2014 you're only looking for things that suit your 'agenda' - not many teams are beating the Steelers when they play like that - we did not play well but they were still much better than we were - it's just 1 game ...

there are still many issues and McCloughan has made mistakes but considering what he's done with what he inherited, this is a franchise that to most fans and the media looks a lot more stable with a lot better outlook than anything we've had this century

the roster is a work in progress but there's still a lot to do - rather than 'invest' in quick fixes this FO has taken a far better approach and in the long run this franchise will be a lot better off as long as Snyder stays out of things

many of us were disappointed in what we saw Monday but the product on the field will prove to be better and we are fortunate to be in a weak division - I watched parts of the eagles and most of the pukes/giants game and am not convinced that we cannot win our division again - that being said, we certainly do have issues both running the ball and stopping the run - but ...

this is NOT the "same ole, same ole ... " this team can and will play a lot better than what we saw Monday

My only agenda is for this team to win but I'm going to grade what I see. Tired of sugar coating. We are 0-2 of year 3 of Gruden (when things suppose to shape up) and I'm seeing the same things. Poor 53 squad put together. I was optimistic. I thought we could win 9 games...but looking more on the 7-9 with all this talent on offense.

[SkinsJock]

we might win 4 or 5 games the way we're playing ...

the big picture is that we were absolutely horrible coming out of 2014 - this franchise has improved

there are a number of jobs on the line here and Scot will bring the hammer down if he thinks it makes the franchise better - Gruden, Barry, McVay and Cousins have all got to show that they can do their jobs a lot better

[mastdark81]

we might win 4 or 5 games the way we're playing ...

the big picture is that we were absolutely horrible coming out of 2014 - this franchise has improved

there are a number of jobs on the line here and Scot will bring the hammer down if he thinks it makes the franchise better - Gruden, Barry, McVay and Cousins have all got to show that they can do their jobs a lot better

Look at it this way. When you can say this franchise is improved you can check these boxes:

stability with
1. franchise qb
2. top tier defensive line
3. top tier offensive line
(must have 3 at same time)

If you can check those 3 boxes you can definitely say we have improved. Skins haven't had those 3 categories in 25 years. Without those 3 you going to have inconsistency year to year with this team. It is Scot's job to fulfill those needs. You give a gm around 3 good solid years until you can start making realistic evaluations on the club.

One of the things Redskins fans do is compare themselves to past years. WE CANNOT NO LONGER DO THIS. We are not going against the 2004 Washington Redskins on Sunday's. We are going against the 2016 NY Giants. The Redskins have to be better within the scheme of the current NFL. Forget the past!!

Judge this team this year on what you see. We are 0-2. Now we can turn it around and beat Giants and then have an easier game against the Browns and be 2-2 and everybody will be back with hope...but the signs say we are the same old squad that don't know how to win games and struggle in primetime.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

we might win 4 or 5 games the way we're playing ...

the big picture is that we were absolutely horrible coming out of 2014 - this franchise has improved

there are a number of jobs on the line here and Scot will bring the hammer down if he thinks it makes the franchise better - Gruden, Barry, McVay and Cousins have all got to show that they can do their jobs a lot better

Look at it this way. When you can say this franchise is improved you can check these boxes:

stability with
1. franchise qb
2. top tier defensive line
3. top tier offensive line
(must have 3 at same time)

If you can check those 3 boxes you can definitely say we have improved. Skins haven't had those 3 categories in 25 years. Without those 3 you going to have inconsistency year to year with this team. It is Scot's job to fulfill those needs. You give a gm around 3 good solid years until you can start making realistic evaluations on the club.

One of the things Redskins fans do is compare themselves to past years. WE CANNOT NO LONGER DO THIS. We are not going against the 2004 Washington Redskins on Sunday's. We are going against the 2016 NY Giants. The Redskins have to be better within the scheme of the current NFL. Forget the past!!

Judge this team this year on what you see. We are 0-2. Now we can turn it around and beat Giants and then have an easier game against the Browns and be 2-2 and everybody will be back with hope...but the signs say we are the same old squad that don't know how to win games and struggle in primetime.

That would be a double negative... meaning- we are to compare this franchise to its previous craptastic years... right?