The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Until SM became Gm, I thought RG3 would be a Redskin as long as DS wanted him. Now I don't think that is the case, but if SM and JG think he is capable of becoming the QB they need, I think he could be signed. However, if he is not signed this implies they do not think he is capable regardless of where he goes.

SKINS#1 wrote:However, if he is not signed this implies they do not think he is capable

Not really. It implies that they think Cousins is the better option and that they couldn't get a deal done with RGIII that justifies him staying put.

Robert may choose to not be here even if the staff and FO want him to stay - if he is here it's an indication that they think he can help the franchise - if he is playing for another franchise we'll only know if he made any progress this past 6 months by how he performs on the field

SkinsJock wrote:Robert may choose to not be here even if the staff and FO want him to stay - if he is here it's an indication that they think he can help the franchise - if he is playing for another franchise we'll only know if he made any progress this past 6 months by how he performs on the field

ummm... actually, if the team wants him to stay, he stays... he can go elsewhere only if they release him...

Countertrey wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Robert may choose to not be here even if the staff and FO want him to stay - if he is here it's an indication that they think he can help the franchise - if he is playing for another franchise we'll only know if he made any progress this past 6 months by how he performs on the field

ummm... actually, if the team wants him to stay, he stays... he can go elsewhere only if they release him...

OK - I think that sometime before Mar 9th, the team will release him and may decide to re-sign him depending on what they know about him

I don't see him here under the current deal but they, like some other franchises may think he could be a good NFL QB

SkinsJock wrote:

Countertrey wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Robert may choose to not be here even if the staff and FO want him to stay - if he is here it's an indication that they think he can help the franchise - if he is playing for another franchise we'll only know if he made any progress this past 6 months by how he performs on the field

ummm... actually, if the team wants him to stay, he stays... he can go elsewhere only if they release him...

OK - I think that sometime before Mar 9th, the team will release him and may decide to re-sign him depending on what they know about him

I don't see him here under the current deal but they, like some other franchises may think he could be a good NFL QB

If the team releases him, he won't be back. Some one will pay him more than what Scot would be willing to pay. If they want him, they won't release him... the only other scenario would require that Bob take less money and sign a new contract for a lot less... why would he do that?

Countertrey wrote:the only other scenario would require that Bob take less money and sign a new contract for a lot less... why would he do that?

Because no team in the league is going to a) pay him a fortune and b) make him the guaranteed opening day starter.

But he needs to move on and so does the Redskins organization. The RGIII in DC ship has long since sailed.

I'm not hoping that Robert stays and IMO he will be released in the next month

My point is simply that there are a few fans here who dislike Robert and claim that he is not capable of playing QB in the NFL





oldschool, StorminMormon86 & MarkShark84 are letting their feelings about RG3 cloud their judgement - they actually don't want him to succeed

Robert is worth a certain amount of money - there will be a few franchises that will have a good idea of what that is including this franchise because he's here - I really doubt that Robert's going to get paid a lot of money and be a starting QB in 2016



the point is - if he can't play QB, like some here maintain, why is anyone, (including this FO) even considering paying him anything?

simple question

SkinsJock wrote:Robert is worth a certain amount of money - there will be a few franchises that will have a good idea of what that is including this franchise because he's here - I really doubt that Robert's going to get paid a lot of money and be a starting QB in 2016



the point is - if he can't play QB, like some here maintain, why is anyone, (including this FO) even considering paying him anything?

simple question

Because he's a former 1st round draft pick with a ton of athletic talent. You can't coach athleticism. He's also a long-term developmental project. RGIII is nowhere close to being an effective pocket passer.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Robert is worth a certain amount of money - there will be a few franchises that will have a good idea of what that is including this franchise because he's here - I really doubt that Robert's going to get paid a lot of money and be a starting QB in 2016 - the point is - if he can't play QB, like some here maintain, why is anyone, (including this FO) even considering paying him anything?

Because he's a former 1st round draft pick with a ton of athletic talent. You can't coach athleticism.
He's also a long-term developmental project. RGIII is nowhere close to being an effective pocket passer.

there are a few here that don't want to admit that Robert might be able to play QB because they don't like him and want him to fail

SkinsJock wrote:oldschool, StorminMormon86 & MarkShark84 are letting their feelings about RG3 cloud their judgement - they actually don't want him to succeed

Can't speak for others, but Griffin's play on the field is the only thing that's clouded my judgement.

StorminMormon86 wrote:Can't speak for others, but Griffin's play on the field is the only thing that's clouded my judgement.

that's not the issue - according to you and a couple of others here, Robert cannot play QB in the NFL based on what he's done.

are you guys the only ones that know anything about QBs or are you guys just blind to the possibility that he might be able to?

OK - I'm done here - I think that Robert will show that he can help a franchise with his play at QB and some here obviously disagree ...

we shall soon see ...

IF he can stay on the field, with good coaching, I think he can play QB at this level. Durability is the biggest concern.

StorminMormon86 wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:oldschool, StorminMormon86 & MarkShark84 are letting their feelings about RG3 cloud their judgement - they actually don't want him to succeed

Can't speak for others, but Griffin's play on the field is the only thing that's clouded my judgement.

SJ,

You didn't believe Cousins could be more than a backup QB but his play this year changed your estimation of him. I never believed in Griffin . I thought it was a crazy decision to give 3 first round and 1 second round pick for 1 guy. He was fun to watch in 2012 but I always thought he'd get hurt. I've been watching the NFL for 50+ years and every running QB I ever saw play got hurt. in the 60's and 70's Fran Tarkenton and now Russell Wilson scrambles effectively without taking a beating but a running QB is a suckers bet in the NFL.

It was clear to me in 2012 that Roberts mobility was masking a lack of understanding. That became so crystal clear when Cousins played against the Browns and Kirk was able to execute a diverse pro offense right out of the gate. Right then I knew Cousins would become the better NFL QB. People laughed at me then but they stopped laughing in 2015, I was right about Cousins.

Griffin could've changed my perception of his potential if he had learned how to read defenses and run Shanny's or Gruden's offenses from the pocket. He got the starters reps for 4 years whenever he was healthy and 2 competent offensive coaching regimes worked with him and Robert failed to develop. During the preseason games this year it was evident to me and I think most fans that Robert had not progressed. He just didn't understand things. You and his other defenders criticized the OL but it was Robert that was inept not his line because when Cousins took over it was evident the pass protection was adequate for a QB who understands defenses and Jay's offense.

Since he failed to exhibit any meaningful improvement in the pocket in 2015 I think Robert is just not wired to play QB in the NFL. Intelligence comes is different stripes so while Robert Griffin is a bright young man who graduated from Baylor in 3 years he seems to lack the spatial processing ability to play at NFL speed.

Maybe Robert will thrive with some other NFL team but I doubt it. If Robert wants to become a QB I think he should swallow his pride and talk to Gruden about arena football or others about the CFL to determine if playing at a lower competition level for a couple of years could help him get over the hump. I don't see value in him as a NFL backup QB since he can't run a conventional pro offense when he gets all the starters reps so I wouldn't expect him to perform with benefit of practice. Young baseball players with talent but holes in their games work on their deficiencies in the minor leagues. Maybe the Arena League or the CFL could help him.

SkinsJock wrote:oldschool, StorminMormon86 & MarkShark84 are letting their feelings about RG3 cloud their judgement - they actually don't want him to succeed

Now this is saying something ---- the above statement is the most idiotic you have made; at least in the past couple years.

Go back and read my history on RGIII. I was a huge fan of his play, I called for patience with RGIII back in 2013 (to the point I look back and think I was dumb for having such patience). My views changed at the end of 2013 when I realized he was not progressing into the type of QB he wanted to evolve into. This was further supported by his 2014 play. I have consistently stated how much I like him as a person. The issue I have is that based on his close to 20 post-injury games, he has shown absolutely no progression/improvement.... and we have learned from Cousins how quickly improvement/progression can be seen within one season.

I have also consistently wished RGIII the best in the future. I sincerely hope he gets a shot with another team. I've said this like a dozen times.....

Your above post is just another example of your gross lack of reading comprehension skills and pure idiocy. My issues with RGIII only relate to his inability to progress as a QB and my uncertainty that he lacks the requisite skills to be the pure drop-back passer he desires to become. We had a better option in Cousins. I saw that in 2014 and expressed as much this past season. I was right. You were wrong. Again. Get over it. For someone who has been historically (well, over the past 7 years) CONSISTENTLY WRONG IN BASICALLY EVERYTHING redskins related, I'd think you wouldn't be as butt hurt about this as you clearly are.

Your post is just another example of why no one on this site respects anything you post. You add nothing to the forum other than trolled posts and pure garbage.

markshark84, just my two cents, but that last sentence is more than a bit harsh and not very collegial of you.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Robert is worth a certain amount of money - there will be a few franchises that will have a good idea of what that is including this franchise because he's here - I really doubt that Robert's going to get paid a lot of money and be a starting QB in 2016



the point is - if he can't play QB, like some here maintain, why is anyone, (including this FO) even considering paying him anything?

simple question

Because he's a former 1st round draft pick with a ton of athletic talent. You can't coach athleticism. He's also a long-term developmental project. RGIII is nowhere close to being an effective pocket passer.

Look here. RG3's not the greatest "pocket passer" neither is Russell Wilson, Tony Romo, McNabb, Cam Newton...it takes time for some guys to get to that level when they didn't have the 4 years of college to do so. Besides, every QB doesn't have the fit the mold of Peyton Manning or Dan Marino to win. RG3 just needs to be a playmaker first and over time he should improve his ability to pass in the pocket.

If you say he won't EVER be able to play Qb with success b/c his inability to learn you are a HATER, if you say it because of his injury history then it makes more sense.

Best spot for him is Denver Broncos to me. I'm not sure where he will go but I feel with Denver he will have the best chance to win, best long term chance for success for a coach that just won a SuperBowl and a legit chance to start and battle it out against Brock Osweiler (if he is resigned, he is an unrestricted free agent).

The system out there is identical to Shanahan's (passing schemes etc.) and this was his favorite team growing up.

Texans make sense too, however who knows how much Bill OBrien will tailor his offense around him.

LA Rams are one year away from firing their coach if they do not make the playoffs so he shouldn't want a situation like that. Rams are good but they are in a tough division.

No way he goes to the Cowboys. I know those are the rumors and I think only why is because Jerry has been noted as interested and a few notables guessing that he would go there, but if I know RG3 like everyone on this board does...he is not sitting out another year or two. He wants to play now!!

mastdark81 wrote:

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Robert is worth a certain amount of money - there will be a few franchises that will have a good idea of what that is including this franchise because he's here - I really doubt that Robert's going to get paid a lot of money and be a starting QB in 2016



the point is - if he can't play QB, like some here maintain, why is anyone, (including this FO) even considering paying him anything?

simple question

Because he's a former 1st round draft pick with a ton of athletic talent. You can't coach athleticism. He's also a long-term developmental project. RGIII is nowhere close to being an effective pocket passer.

Look here. RG3's not the greatest "pocket passer" neither is Russell Wilson, Tony Romo, McNabb, Cam Newton...it takes time for some guys to get to that level when they didn't have the 4 years of college to do so. Besides, every QB doesn't have the fit the mold of Peyton Manning or Dan Marino to win. RG3 just needs to be a playmaker first and over time he should improve his ability to pass in the pocket.

If you say he won't EVER be able to play Qb with success b/c his inability to learn you are a HATER, if you say it because of his injury history then it makes more sense.

I think it is ridiculous to compare Griffin with Wilson, Romo, McNabb, or Newton. Wilson, Romo, McNabb, and Newton have all demonstrated a fair amount of effectiveness in the pocket in addition to their mobility. They might not be classic drop back guys but certainly have presence and competence in a pocket unlike Robert. Griffin wasn't close to being competent he missed badly in DC because even in his 4th season he failed to demonstrate any aptitude in the pocket. Not everyone has the ability to process things NFL speed. Griffin performed much slower than McCoy and Cousins even though the Skins gave him a lot more reps so I think it is entirely reasonable to question if he is able to process things fast enough to make it in the NFL. Not a Griffin hater but certainly a skeptic at this point.

Look here. RG3's not the greatest "pocket passer" neither is Russell Wilson, Tony Romo, McNabb, Cam Newton...it takes time for some guys to get to that level when they didn't have the 4 years of college to do so. Besides, every QB doesn't have the fit the mold of Peyton Manning or Dan Marino to win. RG3 just needs to be a playmaker first and over time he should improve his ability to pass in the pocket.

If you say he won't EVER be able to play Qb with success b/c his inability to learn you are a HATER, if you say it because of his injury history then it makes more sense.[/quote]


I think it is ridiculous to compare Griffin with Wilson, Romo, McNabb, or Newton. Wilson, Romo, McNabb, and Newton have all demonstrated a fair amount of effectiveness in the pocket in addition to their mobility. They might not be classic drop back guys but certainly have presence and competence in a pocket unlike Robert. Griffin wasn't close to being competent he missed badly in DC because even in his 4th season he failed to demonstrate any aptitude in the pocket. Not everyone has the ability to process things NFL speed. Griffin performed much slower than McCoy and Cousins even though the Skins gave him a lot more reps so I think it is entirely reasonable to question if he is able to process things fast enough to make it in the NFL. Not a Griffin hater but certainly a skeptic at this point.[/quote]

You keep going back to the pocket. What I'm saying is he is a scrambling type of qb like those guys. Everyone that has success isn't a pocket qb right or wrong? Now if you have a system that only suits him from the pocket (like Redskins) than of course he's not going to be at his best when the system isn't playing towards his strengths. It takes time. Tyrod Taylor would have struggled as well. I know you gotta be able to throw from the pocket but what gets me is that folks act like he has never completed a 3rd and long play in his career. He had a read option pass that he was passing around 75-80% completion percentage and they only ran it 4 times in 2014. That is not his fault Jay want to trot him out in 2015 preseason and take snaps from under center instead of doing what he is more comfortable at. But it is fine to be a skeptic because he have not won many games the last few years. But to me it is crazy for some that can say he WON'T have success in this league when he's already had it. Had it once he can do it again, just in the right system and the major question is always his health more than if he can play in the pocket.

Thats what part of what Cam was talking about...we are starting to see guys at a talent level that we have never seen before. Unfortunately the current coaches in the league stuck to what they've been knowing from day 1...but you will see a change in philosophies and the stereotype that only pocket guys can win Super Bowls in the future.

They could just be trying get leverage again Osweiler, but some chatter out there this week about Griffin to Denver. What a potentially great situation that would be for him. Manning was bad this year, and they still won a Super Bowl. RG3 could actually be an upgrade.

LOL!! Griffin would be an upgrade over Payton Manning? Robert is utterly clueless and helpless in the pocket Payton is a machine. Can Robert earn a spot with an NFL team running some sort of hybrid offense? Perhaps, but I won't be surprised if no one wants him but replacing one of the great pocket passers of all time with Griffin? bahahahaahahah!!!!!!

OldSchool wrote:LOL!! Griffin would be an upgrade over Payton Manning? Robert is utterly clueless and helpless in the pocket Payton is a machine. Can Robert earn a spot with an NFL team running some sort of hybrid offense? Perhaps, but I won't be surprised if no one wants him but replacing one of the great pocket passers of all time with Griffin? bahahahaahahah!!!!!!

I understand your reaction. But Griffin wouldn't be replacing one of the great pocket passers of all time. He would only have to replace a 40 year old, broken neck QB whose arm strength is gone, who was ranked 34th in the league this year and was benched for Brock freaking Osweiler. The only thing machine-like about Manning this year was the number of interceptions he threw. He ranked #2 with 17 INTs.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/playe ... backRating

Anybody who watched the AFC championship game this year knows that Manning was horrible this year. So yeah, I think Griffin would probably be an upgrade.