The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

riggofan wrote:Man, I'm sure there are quite a few players who were only on our roster because of capgate. There is no debating that! I still think its smart to look at each player objectively like Chris is saying rather than just write everybody off as "he sucks" because he was on that 3-13 nightmare.

Not defending Chester btw. Personally I would like to see changes on the o-line mainly towards bigger guys who can protect RGIII and away from these smaller "he can run the ZBS" guys.

PAPDOG67 wrote:Riggofan, I have been seeing a lot of people lobbying for us to keep a majority of the players on our team.

hah. I don't know about that, especially after the 3-13 season. There are a lot of guys who need to go.

I am trying to remember the specifics but I do recall SEVERAL articles saying that Polumbus is only on this team because of cap gate! Chester should have NEVER BEEN SIGNED IMHO, his play wasn't good in Baltimore, and his play hasn't been good here IMHO.......

CLL, I would never say that Chester was "solid." I choose to use the word "serviceable." He had a serviceable year in 2012. I was never a big fan, but I could live with the job he did in 2012. As for last year he was bad, real bad. Just my opinion. I know you like to use numbers, and that's fine, althought I prefer to use more numbers when talking baseball. As for football I generally trust my eye, and I also ask myself this one question when it comes to certain players and how valuable they are to our team... and that question is this, "If we released this guy tomorrow, will there be a line of teams looking to sign him?" My answer to that question is no, so I feel we can do much better at the RG position. I am no fan of Polumbus either, but I could live with him for one more season if need be, as I also understand your arguement that we cannot overhaul the entire roster in one season.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

mastdark81 wrote:I hate to say it but this was not a good signing. He's average at best. Lauvao is one of those guys you get for depth, not as a true starter. Now maybe they see something in him and he may have growth but for that money they could have signed a better offensive lineman.

He's not good as a run blocker and just an average pass blocker. You have to keep in mind Browns had legit all pro's Joe Thomas and Alex Mack on their line and were still struggling to open up lanes. He was one of the holes.

He's younger than Chester but that's about it. Maurice Hurt woulda been the better option and he's already on the team. I thought we were looking to upgrade!!

We won't know until the pads are on. But we won't know how he fits into this system... Plus the HC played against him twice a year, so there's some familiarity. Who knows. This could be a whiff, or it could work out.

Also, he could be replacing Kory at LG, and Kory moving over to center... Again, time will tell. It's very early and too early to know that this isn't an upgrade.

Well he had pads on last year and he sucked in a similar system. At very very best he's as adequate as Chester. But at the same time don't we want a player better than Chester? I would have had our picks LeRibeus and Hurt battle it out for Kory's spot and still moved him to center. Used some of his money to grab Michael Oher and put him at RT. Better than not getting him at all though. Just thought he was paid high.

Here's a curveball for you:

Chris Russell ‏@Russellmania980 4m

ey pretty much confirms what we've been reporting that Kory Lichtensteiger will be moving to center. Mentions could move Chester to LG.

Skinsfan55 wrote:

HEROHAMO wrote:Regardless we need help on the Oline. We just need guys with a solid talent wise then we coach them up.
Dont understand how you dont like the fact that we addressed the Oline? We should still go after another tackle either the draft or free agency.

1.) I wholeheartedly disagree with the notion of "coaching them up". This is the NFL. It's not a Pop Warner team. These guys are pros who have been playing since they were old enough to strap on pads. By and large, they're as "coached up" as they're gonna get.

2.) I don't feel like the O-Line has really been addressed. Say your car broke down and you needed transportation for your 5 mile commute every day. In response your wife buys you a skateboard. Would you feel that your transportation needs were addressed?

Well you bring up some good points. I just think so long as we dont overpay and keep bringing in players who can potentially improve the Oline then thats a good sign. Lets hope Bruce Campbell can improve and start for us.

Man, it would be nice to see them develop Bruce Campbell, but I hope to heck we're not banking on him being a starter anytime soon. This feels like we're still under the cap penalties, naming Bacarri Rambo our starting safety!

riggofan wrote:Man, it would be nice to see them develop Bruce Campbell, but I hope to heck we're not banking on him being a starter anytime soon. This feels like we're still under the cap penalties, naming Bacarri Rambo our starting safety!

I tend to think that even though the 36 million was taken out over the last two years, this is going to hamper us for about the next 2-3 years as well. I think it's going to take that long just to build the roster with depth. I think other than Robert's the players signed are depth players. Should any of them really show anything they start. I think our starters will be gotten in the draft and the next couple of drafts. Perhaps Bruce is onto something, heck media is saying we didn't want to give up a 5th round draft choice for Darren Sprioles!! When was the last time the organization said that or even felt like that????

DaSkinz Baby wrote:

riggofan wrote:Man, it would be nice to see them develop Bruce Campbell, but I hope to heck we're not banking on him being a starter anytime soon. This feels like we're still under the cap penalties, naming Bacarri Rambo our starting safety!

I tend to think that even though the 36 million was taken out over the last two years, this is going to hamper us for about the next 2-3 years as well. I think it's going to take that long just to build the roster with depth.

No question about that. Btw seems to be something up with Bruce Campbell. Apparently not a done deal and may not happen.

riggofan wrote:

DaSkinz Baby wrote:

riggofan wrote:Man, it would be nice to see them develop Bruce Campbell, but I hope to heck we're not banking on him being a starter anytime soon. This feels like we're still under the cap penalties, naming Bacarri Rambo our starting safety!

I tend to think that even though the 36 million was taken out over the last two years, this is going to hamper us for about the next 2-3 years as well. I think it's going to take that long just to build the roster with depth.

No question about that. Btw seems to be something up with Bruce Campbell. Apparently not a done deal and may not happen.

Yes something about a failed physical. Depressing I really thought he was going to get Polumbus outs here.....

Personally, I have no clue how this will work out. I wasn't to enthused by the signing except for his size. He may work out because our scouting tells us he is a zone blocking lineman. CLL is right about other factors... Receivers have a part in the game as far as allowing sacks. Running back might not block as well as we wished. QBs might hold the ball too long. I watched Kirk get rid of the ball lightning fast behind receivers because, he knew he didn't have much time before he got hit hard. What ever the reasons all the parts play the role in the line caving in. Leave it up to the scouting department to try to figure it out. I like his size he might work out. What scares me is Kory and his light body as center. He doesn't have Trent next to him but maybe technique is all that is needed there. I am not a fan of the zone blocking. I prefer smash mouth but this wont be the case this year. I can't understand why Morris wouldn't be as effective in a different scheme. They know more than I so I have to wait and see before I complain. I thought the whole line needed to be replaced other than Trent. IMO. They can't fix everything this year. This team will take years to climb back to dominance. Here is to hoping I am wrong and all is well and nothing to fear.

Kilmer72 wrote:Personally, I have no clue how this will work out. I wasn't to enthused by the signing except for his size. He may work out because our scouting tells us he is a zone blocking lineman. CLL is right about other factors... Receivers have a part in the game as far as allowing sacks. Running back might not block as well as we wished. QBs might hold the ball too long. I watched Kirk get rid of the ball lightning fast behind receivers because, he knew he didn't have much time before he got hit hard. What ever the reasons all the parts play the role in the line caving in. Leave it up to the scouting department to try to figure it out. I like his size he might work out. What scares me is Kory and his light body as center. He doesn't have Trent next to him but maybe technique is all that is needed there. I am not a fan of the zone blocking. I prefer smash mouth but this wont be the case this year. I can't understand why Morris wouldn't be as effective in a different scheme. They know more than I so I have to wait and see before I complain. I thought the whole line needed to be replaced other than Trent. IMO. They can't fix everything this year. This team will take years to climb back to dominance. Here is to hoping I am wrong and all is well and nothing to fear.

I share many of your concerns. It should be noted that the position along a line that can afford to be lightest is center. That may seem counter-intuitive but it's true. They generally either work in space or perform cut-off blocks. When they are handling a NT in pass pro they are generally part of a double team. They easily have to be the most intelligent of the linemen as they are instrumental in making protection adjustments. Kory is currently listed (pro-football reference) at 6-3, 296. The all-pro center this past year, Ryan Kalil, comes in at 6-3, 299. We have no worries at all with Kory when it comes to size at the center position.

DarthMonk wrote:

Kilmer72 wrote:Personally, I have no clue how this will work out. I wasn't to enthused by the signing except for his size. He may work out because our scouting tells us he is a zone blocking lineman. CLL is right about other factors... Receivers have a part in the game as far as allowing sacks. Running back might not block as well as we wished. QBs might hold the ball too long. I watched Kirk get rid of the ball lightning fast behind receivers because, he knew he didn't have much time before he got hit hard. What ever the reasons all the parts play the role in the line caving in. Leave it up to the scouting department to try to figure it out. I like his size he might work out. What scares me is Kory and his light body as center. He doesn't have Trent next to him but maybe technique is all that is needed there. I am not a fan of the zone blocking. I prefer smash mouth but this wont be the case this year. I can't understand why Morris wouldn't be as effective in a different scheme. They know more than I so I have to wait and see before I complain. I thought the whole line needed to be replaced other than Trent. IMO. They can't fix everything this year. This team will take years to climb back to dominance. Here is to hoping I am wrong and all is well and nothing to fear.

I share many of your concerns. It should be noted that the position along a line that can afford to be lightest is center. That may seem counter-intuitive but it's true. They generally either work in space or perform cut-off blocks. When they are handling a NT in pass pro they are generally part of a double team. They easily have to be the most intelligent of the linemen as they are instrumental in making protection adjustments. Kory is currently listed (pro-football reference) at 6-3, 296. The all-pro center this past year, Ryan Kalil, comes in at 6-3, 299. We have no worries at all with Kory when it comes to size at the center position.

How accurate is pro-football reference? He is listed smaller on http://www.redskins.com/team/roster.html Not that it matters a ton because technique plays a huge role. What worries me is Montgomery being bigger and pushed around and the year before he supposedly had good technique. It may have a lot to do with how people are/were playing beside him. It still bothers me but maybe everything works out.