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Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:30 pm
by Kilmer72
DarthMonk wrote:OldSchool wrote: ... explain to me why Griffin has learned how to read defenses well enough to make pre snap reads, according to Chris
ey ...
The Deadman debunked this a few weeks ago. Actually, you debunked it yourself with a link you posted that a few of us actually read.
Also, you probably meant to type "has NOT learned ..."
You make a few good points sometimes but always end up descending into going way over the top with your Griff bashing. I think most of us are willing to say he regressed after a terrific rookie year but all you seem to see is athleticism and nothing else.
You keep raising the same tired (and false) points ... can't read defenses, can't change a protection, backyard football.
Every QB who has ever lived has failed to make the proper read, or missed a protection change that would have saved a play, or bailed out too early. Griff does it a few more times than is to your liking and all of a sudden he never has done it and is still incapable. Your claims simply fly in the face of what all of us have seen with our own eyes ... including Chris C
00ley and "other knowledgeable analysts." This is a no win situation. Even if you agree and people understand that you are just placent and not trying to be plagiarizing, no one will understand. Simple as that. Another words don't waste your time.
FWIW, I happen to agree with the first half of your 3-posts-ago post where you cite many benefits of trading Cousins. Then you go off the deep end again.
](./images/smilies/eusa_wall.gif "Brick wall")
Well you know... He shuns anything that is shown to him that he doesn't agree with. Sometimes people must be aggressive and intolerant towards the truth. The horse has been beaten and yet people reply to nothingness. In other words, don't waste your time.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 1:10 am
by OldSchool
Baloney, I heard a clip from a radio show where
ey brings things down. He named the lineman who was making the pre snap reads for Griffin and changes the protections.
Griffin reminds me of the story of the emperor's new clothes. He walked around naked until someone pointed out the obvious. Believe what you want. Maybe his leg will be healthy and he'll be back to backyard form for a bit.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:27 pm
by SkinsJock
as a matter of interest, Co0ley and co are reporting (on ESPN 980) that they have heard from the Redskins that they are not pushing for a trade for Kirk Cousins at this time
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:28 am
by riggofan
SkinsJock wrote:as a matter of interest, Co0ley and co are reporting (on ESPN 980) that they have heard from the Redskins that they are not pushing for a trade for Kirk Cousins at this time
A lot of people have been saying this for the past two years that its way more beneficial to the team to have Cousins here than to trade him for a pick. We have a guy on his rookie contract who isn't costing us much money and we know can step in to play for RGIII if we need him. Its all been kind of hypothetical until now: we're in free agency and need every last dime to fill a lot of holes, you can see how valuable Cousins is. Still one of the best moves Shanahan made in my opinion, especially since it was so heavily criticized.
For that same reason, I would not be disappointed to see the team draft a late round QB this year if a guy with some talent/potential drops. Start to prepare for Kirk moving on. With the rookie pay scale, I think it makes a ton of sense to draft and groom your own backup QB rather than having to drop a couple million on Kyle Orton or whoever.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 7:06 pm
by DarthMonk
Kirk Cousins - QB - Redskins
The Cleveland Plain Dealer suggests the Browns could target Kirk Cousins in a draft-day trade.
"It's all on the table. It might even include trade discussions for Kirk Cousins," writes beat reporter Mary Kay Cabot. The Browns have ten picks in the upcoming draft, while the Redskins are without a first-rounder and may be looking for additional selections in what is widely considered the deepest draft in recent memory. The Redskins are reportedly seeking a second-round pick for Cousins. That's not going to happen. We bet they'd take a third-rounder. Ultimately, Cousins is likely to be holding the clipboard as Washington's backup in 2014.
Source: Cleveland Plain Dealer Apr 20 - 10:20 AM
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:22 pm
by Hooligan
I think he's worth a 2nd. No way we trade him for one 3rd round pick, one round higher than we drafted him not long ago.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:24 pm
by Neo
DarthMonk wrote:Kirk Cousins - QB - Redskins
The Cleveland Plain Dealer suggests the Browns could target Kirk Cousins in a draft-day trade.
"It's all on the table. It might even include trade discussions for Kirk Cousins," writes beat reporter Mary Kay Cabot. The Browns have ten picks in the upcoming draft, while the Redskins are without a first-rounder and may be looking for additional selections in what is widely considered the deepest draft in recent memory. The Redskins are reportedly seeking a second-round pick for Cousins. That's not going to happen. We bet they'd take a third-rounder. Ultimately, Cousins is likely to be holding the clipboard as Washington's backup in 2014.
Source: Cleveland Plain Dealer Apr 20 - 10:20 AM
I'm OK with us trading Cousins at this point. After seeing Cousin play the last few games of last year, I'd say we're better off w/ McCoy as the backup.
I'm sure we can find another 3rd string QB, but even better, pick up some hogs in the draft for our oline and then the best defensive players w/ remaining picks. Good protection = less need for a 3rd string QB.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2014 11:26 pm
by Neo
Hooligan wrote:I think he's worth a 2nd. No way we trade him for one 3rd round pick, one round higher than we drafted him not long ago.
I would say it depends on what round we're in when offered and what player is available who fits an immediate need.
If that player is greater than the value of Cousins, I'd take the trade, even if it was in the later rounds.
If the offer is up front before the draft/end of 1st round, I'd accept no less than a 2nd for Cousins.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:18 pm
by riggofan
Hooligan wrote:I think he's worth a 2nd. No way we trade him for one 3rd round pick, one round higher than we drafted him not long ago.
I agree. He may not be worth a 2d round pick to every other team in the league, but there is no doubt he is worth that much to the Redskins. The guy has at the very least proven he is a reliable backup, and he only costs us like $500k/year over the next two seasons. I just don't believe there is anybody you're going to draft in the third round who is going to be as valuable to the team right now as Cousins is.
Interesting that this chatter is coming out of Cleveland again. Could just be a pre-draft smoke screen so other teams don't know which QB they plan to draft. But you can see a lot of legit reasons why they might be interested in Cousins, #1 being Kyle Shanahan. He might be thinking they could get on the winning track sooner with Cousins than with a rookie QB. Cleveland also has multiple picks in the first, third and fourth rounds. It wouldn't kill them to trade their second rounder.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:18 pm
by cowboykillerzRGiii
Good call riggo! Thwae days the. Smoke and mirrors has become an art form, to try and direct people/teams attention elsewhere while you are plotting on something entirely different. All we can do is wait for the draft and see how it all shakes out.
Cousins should only be let go for either a second rounder or a third plus a conditional pick or something of that nature
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 1:22 pm
by Deadskins
riggofan wrote:Cleveland also has multiple picks in the first, third and fourth rounds. It wouldn't kill them to trade their second rounder.
Or one of those firsts.
It is Cleveland after all.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:00 pm
by Chris Luva Luva
We may see something where we get a 3rd in 2015 but if he takes them to the playoffs it'll get bumped up to a 2nd and a 3rd. Something along those lines.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 3:04 pm
by SkinsJock
I don't agree that trading Cousins is a real possibility, at this time - it's possible but not likely
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 5:28 pm
by KazooSkinsFan
riggofan wrote:Soooooo.... Kirk Cousins possibly joining Kyle in Cleveland? What do you think?
My guess is that Cleveland is going to wait until draft day and then if they don't pick up a QB they want they'll trade for Cousins. That could be the best scenario for us as we might get a #2 from them to make that happen. My guess is they offer their first 3 and refuse to budge. But that's the most likely scenario we squeeze out a #2. I would prefer not to trade a #3 for him this year because we need a backup and we probably can get a #3 next year. I don't think anyone else is giving us a #2 and waiting a year probably won't change that. We'll see. I always thought that it was odd that every team in the NFL passed on him at least 3 times since we got him in the fourth round, and suddenly based on some pre-season glitz he was anointed by our fans as being a #1 everyone let get away. I'm not dissing him, I think he's a good fourth round pick. I just don't get how people think other teams are kicking themselves for not using a high pick on him suddenly. What would make GM's think they'd screwed up that badly based on what we've seen so far? If I'm a GM, I'm just thinking maybe we should have taken him in the 3rd round. Not exactly a boner.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 2:54 am
by cowboykillerzRGiii
SkinsJock wrote:I don't agree that trading Cousins is a real possibility, at this time - it's possible but not likely
You don't agree that its a possibility... but agree that it's possible?!?! You crack me up SJ!!
Just because you don't want to trade him doesn't mean we won't.. holding on to him until next year when he hits the market seems pointless imo... especially if we have a capable BACKUP (meaning hopefully they never see the field) in pin place. Cousins didn't look any better then McCoy from what I've seen- we tend to church people up round here...
I'm hearing about this fifth year option more and more and I'm not sure if it applies to Cousins due to where he was drafted.. not sure what it'll mean for Griff or if his draft class has the same clause. I'm also not sure if the players have a choice in the matter. Sounds to me that players like jj watt, Sherman, Newton, and Patterson are getting shafted on what they are actually worth.
If we can't get a second (not likely) or a third+ a conditional pick next year (possible) and we can tenure him with this fifth year extention then I'm good w holding on to him.. if we get a chance to get any kind of roi we ought to jump on it though.. RGiii is our guy so getting someone who can fill a role is more important to the team the selling Cousins jerseys to the bewildered skins fans out there!!! Lmao
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:54 am
by KazooSkinsFan
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Just because you don't want to trade him doesn't mean we won't.. holding on to him until next year when he hits the market seems pointless imo... especially if we have a capable BACKUP (meaning hopefully they never see the field) in pin place. Cousins didn't look any better then McCoy from what I've seen- we tend to church people up round here...
I'm hearing about this fifth year option more and more and I'm not sure if it applies to Cousins due to where he was drafted.. not sure what it'll mean for Griff or if his draft class has the same clause.
Cousins, like RG3, only played two years. He doesn't hit the market next year regardless of the fifth year option because it will only have been his third year. Which is why there's no point in trading him this year unless we get a great deal. We need a backup.
As far as I know, the fifth year option only applies to first rounders, but I'm not positive about that. I am positive who would know though, 1niksder!
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:38 am
by Deadskins
KazooSkinsFan wrote:cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Just because you don't want to trade him doesn't mean we won't.. holding on to him until next year when he hits the market seems pointless imo... especially if we have a capable BACKUP (meaning hopefully they never see the field) in pin place. Cousins didn't look any better then McCoy from what I've seen- we tend to church people up round here...
I'm hearing about this fifth year option more and more and I'm not sure if it applies to Cousins due to where he was drafted.. not sure what it'll mean for Griff or if his draft class has the same clause.
Cousins, like RG3, only played two years. He doesn't hit the market next year regardless of the fifth year option because it will only have been his third year. Which is why there's no point in trading him this year unless we get a great deal. We need a backup.
As far as I know, the fifth year option only applies to first rounders, but I'm not positive about that. I am positive who would know though, 1niksder!
Yes, the option year only applies to first rounders.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:46 am
by riggofan
cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:SkinsJock wrote:I don't agree that trading Cousins is a real possibility, at this time - it's possible but not likely
You don't agree that its a possibility... but agree that it's possible?!?! You crack me up SJ!!
That one belongs in the greatest hits collection.
I think you can say "possible but not likely" about pretty much every trade you hear about in the NFL. The point about Cleveland is just that there are some legit reasons why a trade with them could happen, not that its likely it will. We hear fans talking about wanting to trade Cousins all the time, but its rare you hear anyone suggest an actual trade partner.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:00 am
by SkinsJock
there's a difference between 'there's a real possibility of a trade' and 'a trade is possible' but that's just me
and if you think that applies to all NFL trades then that makes s lot of things clear to me as well
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:26 am
by riggofan
SkinsJock wrote:there's a difference between 'there's a real possibility of a trade' and 'a trade is possible' but that's just me
hah. I know what you were saying. It was one of those things that just looked crazy on first glance.
SkinsJock wrote:and if you think that applies to all NFL trades then that makes s lot of things clear to me as well
Possible but not likely? I didn't say ALL trades, but yeah I think that phrase applies to most trades in the NFL. Its one thing for teams to see possible trade scenarios, but getting all of the details worked out, especially agreeing on the trade terms and compensation... I would not believe that is especially easy or straightforward. I'll bet there are far more trades proposed each year than there are actual trades.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:37 am
by SkinsJock
DUH! - a trade for any and all NFL players is possible however the implication that trading Cousins is a real possibility at this time is just BS
I don't see these guys losing a really good back up QB for a player outside the top 50 and I don't agree that the Browns will part with a top 50 player from this draft
NOT trading him .... at this time
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:47 am
by SkinsJock
KazooSkinsFan wrote:riggofan wrote:Soooooo.... Kirk Cousins possibly joining Kyle in Cleveland? What do you think?
My guess is that Cleveland is going to wait until draft day and then if they don't pick up a QB they want they'll trade for Cousins. That could be the best scenario for us as we might get a #2 from them to make that happen. My guess is they offer their first 3 and refuse to budge. But that's the most likely scenario we squeeze out a #2. I would prefer not to trade a #3 for him this year because we need a backup and we probably can get a #3 next year. I don't think anyone else is giving us a #2 and waiting a year probably won't change that. We'll see. I always thought that it was odd that every team in the NFL passed on him at least 3 times since we got him in the fourth round, and suddenly based on some pre-season glitz he was anointed by our fans as being a #1 everyone let get away. I'm not dissing him, I think he's a good fourth round pick. I just don't get how people think other teams are kicking themselves for not using a high pick on him suddenly. What would make GM's think they'd screwed up that badly based on what we've seen so far? If I'm a GM, I'm just thinking maybe we should have taken him in the 3rd round. Not exactly a boner.
if these guys decide to let Cousins go it will take a really good deal to make that happen because we need him - AT THIS TIME
and
stating that a trade for Cousins is a real possibility is just BS
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:52 am
by Deadskins
SkinsJock wrote:stating that a trade for Cousins is a real possibility is just BS
Is it not a possibilty? Is that possibility not real?
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:02 am
by Skins Fan in Indy
If Red Lobster was still here I would say it is just a matter of time before Cousins was gone, but with Gruden I think he realizes what he has in Cousins and it would take a really good offer for them to let him go. My gut tells me Cousins already has a place in Cleveland.
Re: Kirk Cousins trade - real possibility?
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:26 am
by cowboykillerzRGiii
KazooSkinsFan wrote:cowboykillerzRGiii wrote:Just because you don't want to trade him doesn't mean we won't.. holding on to him until next year when he hits the market seems pointless imo... especially if we have a capable BACKUP (meaning hopefully they never see the field) in pin place. Cousins didn't look any better then McCoy from what I've seen- we tend to church people up round here...
I'm hearing about this fifth year option more and more and I'm not sure if it applies to Cousins due to where he was drafted.. not sure what it'll mean for Griff or if his draft class has the same clause.
Cousins, like RG3, only played two years. He doesn't hit the market next year regardless of the fifth year option because it will only have been his third year. Which is why there's no point in trading him this year unless we get a great deal. We need a backup.
As far as I know, the fifth year option only applies to first rounders, but I'm not positive about that. I am positive who would know though, 1niksder!
Ah I see.. For some reason I thought Cousins and Rgiii were on 3 year rookie contracts and I guess I assumed that meant the 5th year option added two years. Four year contract w the one year option makes more sense tho, and I agree that we should sit tight unless there is a good offer on the table that will address a current need: I.e. starter.
I'm not to sure who didnt declare in college ball, or what the qb class looks like next year... but as it stands THIS year, it's a very shaky group. Cousins certainly didnt help himself much last year, but he still could be a better option for a couple of teams then drafting a rookie.