Page 3 of 18
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 3:03 pm
by Deadskins
KazooSkinsFan wrote:CanesSkins26 wrote:Deadskins wrote:CanesSkins26 wrote:This Manning talk is insane. Why would he want to come to a 5-11 team at age 36? If he leaves the Colts and doesn't retire, he is going to try and go to a team that is close to making a playoff run, like the Jets. He's not going to want to be part of a rebuilding process like what is going on in DC.
So you don't think that with better play from the QB position this year, that PM would bring, this team would not have made a playoff run? I think that's insane. There were so many games this season that we would have won without the horrible QB play we got from Rexy and Becksy.
Would we have been better, sure? A Super Bowl contender? No chance in hell. If Manning leaves the Colts he's not going to go to a rebuilding franchise that's been one of the worst teams in the NFL over the past 15 years.
The Redskins just haven't had the problem getting elite players to come here that some "fans" want us to have had. With our D's improvement and some emerging targets to throw to, he could be enough to give it a shot. I think the #1 question is the O-line. Even manning can't throw with a guy in his face unblocked. The issue for me is I don't want to sign him and pay cap hell for years to come to do it. But if we can do it without that, it's worth finding out what it would take to get him
I agree with this, but I don't think we would get into a cap hell situation. First we have never seen the cap hell predicted every year for the last decade, because we seem to understand the cap better than other organizations. Second, I think PM's injury situation will mitigate his cost to his next team. I can't see anyone signing him to more than a two year contract that has language that protects the team from further injuries.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 3:13 pm
by PAPDOG67
CanesSkins26 wrote:This Manning talk is insane. Why would he want to come to a 5-11 team at age 36? If he leaves the Colts and doesn't retire, he is going to try and go to a team that is close to making a playoff run, like the Jets. He's not going to want to be part of a rebuilding process like what is going on in DC.
So if he stays in Indy he will be going back to a 2-14 team?!?!? With better QB play we absolutely would have been at least contending for the division this season, even with all of our injuries.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:45 pm
by CanesSkins26
PAPDOG67 wrote:CanesSkins26 wrote:This Manning talk is insane. Why would he want to come to a 5-11 team at age 36? If he leaves the Colts and doesn't retire, he is going to try and go to a team that is close to making a playoff run, like the Jets. He's not going to want to be part of a rebuilding process like what is going on in DC.
So if he stays in Indy he will be going back to a 2-14 team?!?!? With better QB play we absolutely would have been at least contending for the division this season, even with all of our injuries.
He's been with Indy his entire career. There's a big difference in staying with the team that you've been with for 14 years, and leaving a team after 14 years to sign with a team that is rebuilding and coming off of multiple seasons with losing records. Some of you guys really live in a fantasy dream world and I can't believe that anyone is actually taking this possibility seriously.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:13 pm
by The Hogster
This is insane. Why would Peyton Manning want to come play on an Offense coordinated by Kyle ( a kid younger than him who hasn't proven he can even get along with anybody but Rex) when the Head Coach here is the father of said snot nosed kid.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:15 pm
by RayNAustin
riggofan wrote:RayNAustin wrote:It's very shallow surface analysis to simply say that McNabb failed in Washington and Minnesota as if there were no mitigating circimstances.
Then why not just say that the Redskins and Vikings weren't the Eagles, and neither team was a good situation for a past-his-prime QB like McNabb? I think most people can agree with that. Instead you've made this lengthy post blaming freaking Kyle Shanahan for McNabb's lack of success. You're complaining about "shallow surface analysis" while you're engaging in pure speculation and fantasy.
Because simply saying it was not a good situation really doesn't say very much, and could have been confused as pure speculation. I chose to inculde the details I considered evidence to support those conclusions. Now you can disagree with my conclusions, or challenge the validity of those details .... but you cannot call it pure speculation unless you don't know what speculation means.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:38 pm
by RayNAustin
CanesSkins26 wrote:PAPDOG67 wrote:CanesSkins26 wrote:This Manning talk is insane. Why would he want to come to a 5-11 team at age 36? If he leaves the Colts and doesn't retire, he is going to try and go to a team that is close to making a playoff run, like the Jets. He's not going to want to be part of a rebuilding process like what is going on in DC.
So if he stays in Indy he will be going back to a 2-14 team?!?!? With better QB play we absolutely would have been at least contending for the division this season, even with all of our injuries.
He's been with Indy his entire career. There's a big difference in staying with the team that you've been with for 14 years, and leaving a team after 14 years to sign with a team that is rebuilding and coming off of multiple seasons with losing records. Some of you guys really live in a fantasy dream world and I can't believe that anyone is actually taking this possibility seriously.
Yet that is exactly what was expected of McNabb, who also spent his entire career with a successful team, while being selected to the Pro Bowl 6 times, including 2009, just a short few months before coming to a rebuilding team who then blamed him for not achieving immediate success after 6 games, while later we discovered that the topic of benching him had been discussed after 4 games ... apparently giving no consideration to a horrendous offensive line that produced no running game and had McNabb running for his life to make plays. Expectations were high, they were not satisfactorily achieved, and the fall guy was the QB.
Of course, now, even with hindsight showing that changing the QB didn't improve the situation, still too many are willing to ignore that fact and continue blaming the player. The reality was, expectations were unreasonably high given the situation, and the player was put in a no win situation, rather than the player's play creating it.
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:55 pm
by 1niksder
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:25 pm
by The Hogster
Yep
Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:28 pm
by SkinsJock
AND ....
we have months to go with this sort of stupidity
Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:38 pm
by StorminMormon86
Just gives the talking heads something to stir the pot up with. Nothing more, nothing less. Manning will not be here next year.
Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 2:56 am
by 1niksder
For all the hype you will undoubtedly hear about some other quarterback-needy teams -- like the Redskins, Dolphins and Jets -- let's not forget who would be calling the shots in free agency: Manning. He'd dictate which team or situation makes the most sense for him, and he's earned the right to be picky.
Washington's offensive line is every bit as bad as Indy's and the roster is deprived of skill players. The Redskins also have a history of turmoil and instability. And don't forget, in the NFC East, he'd be facing little brother Eli twice a year. I don't see it, and execs I talk to expect Washington to make a move for St. Louis' No. 2 overall slot in the draft, and select whichever quarterback doesn't go first overall (at this point, it looks like Griffin).
As for the Dolphins, it's hard to look at their recent track record and project them to win a Manning sweepstakes. They never seem to get their man. They didn't land Jim Harbaugh a year ago, could not pull off a trade for Kyle Orton in preseason and then missed out on Jeff Fisher a few weeks back. Though Miami boasts a defense with bite and some receivers, I'm not sure Manning lands there with a rookie head coach in Joe Philbin. (Having free agent quarterback Matt Flynn follow Philbin over from Green Bay probably makes more sense, anyway).
With Indy seemingly turning the page, where will Peyton end up? from NFL.comThe Skins are expected to have competition from the Browns, and perhaps the Dolphins if they fail to land free agent Matt Flynn. Peyton Manning, who will likely be steering his own ship, won't find the depleted Redskins roster any more attractive than the prospect of facing his brother twice a year. In which case, nobody will be more desperate to land a young franchise QB by late April than Mike Shanahan.
Rotoworld
Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:09 am
by Irn-Bru
1niksder wrote:Washington's offensive line is every bit as bad as Indy's and the roster is deprived of skill players. The Redskins also have a history of turmoil and instability. And don't forget, in the NFC East, he'd be facing little brother Eli twice a year. I don't see it, and execs I talk to expect Washington to make a move for St. Louis' No. 2 overall slot in the draft, and select whichever quarterback doesn't go first overall (at this point, it looks like Griffin).
Looks like JLC is still pulling ideas straight out of his ass. In no way was the Washington line on the same level as Indy last year. We had a bad mid-season stretch, but our offensive line was very good in the first quarter of the year and downright kicked butt in the last third of the season. If Peyton were to play here, o-line would not be a major concern.
Talented skilled players is more of an issue. We are still lacking a go-to #1 wideout. But our receiving depth is at least avergae, our running backs are adequate to good, and we've got a very good tight end with a former pro-bowler backing him.
I'd still much rather jump at whoever we can get in the draft, but Peyton is IMO a realistic option to play here. Or, at least, we are as realistic a landing spot as Arizona or Seattle, both of whom JLC treats as serious contenders.
The guy's finally out of town and he still annoys the hell out of me.
Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:14 am
by Irn-Bru
The Skins are expected to have competition from the Browns, and perhaps the Dolphins if they fail to land free agent Matt Flynn. Peyton Manning, who will likely be steering his own ship, won't find the depleted Redskins roster any more attractive than the prospect of facing his brother twice a year. In which case, nobody will be more desperate to land a young franchise QB by late April than Mike Shanahan.
I would love it if the Browns end up with Manning. It would relieve some pressure off the QB draft and probably lower our costs a bit.
Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:06 pm
by KazooSkinsFan
Irn-Bru wrote:Looks like JLC is still pulling ideas straight out of his ass. In no way was the Washington line on the same level as Indy last year
I don't get the comment either on how Peyton wouldn't want to play his brother twice a year. I have a younger brother and we get along great. But we're brothers, we love to compete against each other. It seems like it'd be a positive, not a negative.
Posted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:49 pm
by Irn-Bru
KazooSkinsFan wrote:Irn-Bru wrote:Looks like JLC is still pulling ideas straight out of his ass. In no way was the Washington line on the same level as Indy last year
I don't get the comment either on how Peyton wouldn't want to play his brother twice a year. I have a younger brother and we get along great. But we're brothers, we love to compete against each other. It seems like it'd be a positive, not a negative.
I wondered about that too. But I've seen more than one writer say something like that, so I'm guessing Peyton has expressed hesitation before about playing his brother more than is necessary?
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:13 am
by jmooney
Irn-Bru wrote:KazooSkinsFan wrote:Irn-Bru wrote:Looks like JLC is still pulling ideas straight out of his ass. In no way was the Washington line on the same level as Indy last year
I don't get the comment either on how Peyton wouldn't want to play his brother twice a year. I have a younger brother and we get along great. But we're brothers, we love to compete against each other. It seems like it'd be a positive, not a negative.
I wondered about that too. But I've seen more than one writer say something like that, so I'm guessing Peyton has expressed hesitation before about playing his brother more than is necessary?
Seems that most of the comments coming out of the Manning camp are from Archie. I'd say thats where this comes from too. JLC rarely gets his quotes directly from the source. For whatever reason Archie Manning has been the one talking to the media. Which is perfect for JLC, he gets to spin it to fit his own personal agenda.
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:05 am
by KazooSkinsFan
Irn-Bru wrote:KazooSkinsFan wrote:Irn-Bru wrote:Looks like JLC is still pulling ideas straight out of his ass. In no way was the Washington line on the same level as Indy last year
I don't get the comment either on how Peyton wouldn't want to play his brother twice a year. I have a younger brother and we get along great. But we're brothers, we love to compete against each other. It seems like it'd be a positive, not a negative.
I wondered about that too. But I've seen more than one writer say something like that, so I'm guessing Peyton has expressed hesitation before about playing his brother more than is necessary?
It's certainly possible. The media also like to repeat inane points someone made up so it could be fabrication. Hard to say unless we hear it from Peyton or Eli. My brother and I compete at everything. Sports, scrabble, bridge. My brother went to the naval academy and we once played a game of full court one on one to 100 (by ones). We both get our best running and swimming times against each other. We play a game of scrabble for hours. If one of us is throwing paper in a trash can the other will try to hit more shots or from further. If I were Peyton I'd be trying to get on an NFC East team just to beat Eli twice a year...
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:09 am
by StorminMormon86
KazooSkinsFan wrote:I don't get the comment either on how Peyton wouldn't want to play his brother twice a year. I have a younger brother and we get along great. But we're brothers, we love to compete against each other. It seems like it'd be a positive, not a negative.
Exactly. I'm sick of people in the media using this as a legitimate reason as to why Manning wouldn't want to come play in DC. Why not simply say, "Manning is going to be the offensive coordinator wherever he goes to play. Shanahan is not going to get rid of his son. End of discussion."
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:55 am
by CanesSkins26
The Manning Bowl is a great idea. I’ll even volunteer to pay the fee for their rental shoes.
We can hold the event in North Brunswick, home of the U.S. Open, and give the proceeds to charity. We can get the great Pete Weber to provide commentary and critique their form.
We can even make them bowl in the same lane so they’d each have to see the other’s grinning face after every gutter bowl. I can almost hear the back and forth between them now ...
PEYTON: “Another 7-10 split?!”
ELI: “Split the uprights, brother.”
Maybe that Manning Bowl might give us a window into how they’d behave when matched head-to-head, to finally see if there is even an iota of brotherly competitiveness there.
Because Sunday? This is no Manning Bowl, despite NBC’s promotional commercial that shows childhood film of the two players with the song — what else? — “Anything You Can Do I Can Do Better.”
This is a football game between two very good teams and recent Super Bowl winners. This is a chance to see them compete against two defenses in the same game, but not against each other.
“Two quarterbacks are never dueling each other,” Eli Manning said. “It’s not a boxing match.”
But if it were a boxing match, who would land the most punches?
“You don’t want to see that,” the Giants quarterback said. “It would be ugly. Raw.”
Oh well. This is the remarkable thing about the Bros. Manning: There is no indication they compete against each other in anything, much less the sport that made them millionaires.
Golf?
“
If we play golf, it’s more friendly, having fun and being together,” Peyton said. “It’s not a competitive situation, it’s more of a support situation. We try to help each other.”
Basketball?
“Not really,” said oldest brother Cooper from his office in New Orleans.
“When one brother is 10 and one is just 5, and you play basketball, there’s no glory in winning that.”
Most guys who have a brother know a game of Checkers can devolve into a fist-fight. If there is evidence of a pillow fight between them as kids, the family has kept a tight lid on it.
“
I think that’s dead right,” Cooper said. Now, as adults, there’s less time or inclination to compete.
“Everybody is running in 100 different ways that when you do see each other and get into a fight, you’re more likely to bite your tongue than be at each other’s throats.”
So the matchup on Sunday night is not really about seeing one Manning outdo the other one. It’s more of a chance to see them together and appreciate the uniqueness, to marvel that two players who have combined for 69,468 yards and 497 touchdown passes are family.
There are 32 starting quarterbacks in the NFL. Maybe a dozen of them are truly elite players. That two of that dozen come from the same family is not just unprecedented, but remarkable.
Eli Manning said that, unlike their first meeting in the 2006 opener, he planned to enjoy this moment. He was still an unproven quarterback, one who dreaded the five months of answering the same questions in the offseason.
This time, he is a star in his own right, one comfortable in opening up yesterday about his brother. The relationship between the brothers has changed over the years, of course. Eli joked that it became easier to become friends with his brother when he “could get into an R-rated movie.”
“By the time he really went to college at 18, he didn’t come home for summers,” Eli said. “It wasn’t like we were great pals then. It was when I got to college, when he could come to Ole Miss for five or six days, that’s when we became better friends than brothers.
“We have a great relationship.”
The younger brother is now almost 30. He and Peyton live in different time zones and have their own families, and when their conversations turn to football, it has become a give and take.
They genuinely seem to relish in each other’s accomplishments, two friends in a competitive field without a trace of competitiveness toward each other. The first question Eli will often ask his father, Archie, after a game is, “How’d Peyton do?”
The relationship is rare and worth appreciating. Still, would it be too much to ask that, when they meet at midfield for the pregame coin toss, that the NFL set up a table so they can arm wrestle?
http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2010/09/politi_when_it_comes_to_eli_an.html
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:14 am
by KazooSkinsFan
CanesSkins26 wrote:They genuinely seem to relish in each other’s accomplishments, two friends in a competitive field without a trace of competitiveness toward each other. The first question Eli will often ask his father, Archie, after a game is, “How’d Peyton do?”
This is a logical fallacy where the term "competitive" is used in a different way. I was discussing my brother and I enjoying competing against each other, which is positive. This sentence it's used in a negative way that they are not jealous of each other's accomplishments.
I like to engage in friendly competition with my brother.
Eli and Peyton are happy with the other's accomplishments against other people.
There is no conflict there.
Posted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:31 pm
by Redskin in Canada
SkinsJock wrote:AND ....
we have months to go with this sort of stupidity
The level of immaturity in this thread was already pretty low a few days ago, I agree that we have reached the "stupidity" level when posters feel that it is needed to repeat a thousand times the SAME sort of arguments.
Not reading this thread anymore. I had enough.
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:43 pm
by GoSkins
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:51 pm
by Kilmer72
My biggest issue with Manning is will he be able to deal with the hits that are dished out in our division? Next is, will he be treated like Brady, as far as flags being thrown every time someone does hit him? Last but not least, can he deal with changing to a new system after being in the same one for so many years?
I hope he lands a job with someone that can protect him and give him the time he needs. If it is with us and we can miraculously fix the oline in the off season, then so be it, but I still want a young QB that we can call our own.
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 3:46 pm
by SkinsJock
Redskin in Canada wrote:The level of immaturity in this thread was already pretty low a few days ago, I agree that we have reached the "stupidity" level when posters feel that it is needed to repeat a thousand times, the SAME sort of arguments.
Not reading this thread anymore. I've had enough.
I'm out of this too
actually - given the time left till free agency begins, I'm going to try and just read and be amused for a while
There are times that I have doubts about the intelligence or knowledge level of some posters here - then they go ahead and make it obvious
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:26 am
by Hooligan
It's been said here before that Peyton would be a poor fit due to his freedom to run the offense in Indy vs listening to Kyle in his ear in Washington. I've been against the idea, but I'm starting to reconsider...
Is it that black and white? Would the Redskins or Peyton need to change that much? Would the coaches and Manning find a happy medium somewhere, say, if Peyton got a play in his ear, but had the freedom to change at the line if he thought he could exploit the defense? Maybe he'd get a more extensive list of audibles than someone like Rex. Would Kyle get annoyed with Peyton changing his plays?
I think it's worth some serious consideration. PM can read defenses, he's accurate, makes good decisions, and he's passionate about the game and winning. Would he fit here? Would the offense need to change that much?
I'm not talking about health issues, that's another story.
