The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Let's think through this logically through the eyes of Shanahan and I think the truth will present itself.  All this is assuming Snyder wants Luck which I will cover in the next post.
 
The owner wants Luck...at probably any cost.  The fans would like him, some at any cost and some no higher than 6th pick.  The team needs a franchise QB.  I (speaking on behalf of Shanny) have to produce a winning record next year if I do not draft Luck.  If I fail, I am probably going to face enough pressure that my job is in jeopardy.  If I draft RGIII, and I do not have a winning record, I'm pretty much gone as well, especially when I consider that Luck will do very well on some other team next year, and Snyder will hold me hostage for not drafting his guy.  The risk in drafting RGIII, is that he probably needs a year to learn a system.  He's probably not NFL ready.  If I draft Luck, NO MATTER HOW POOR OUR RECORD IS, I will be given a 4th and maybe even a 5th year. Also, I will most likely have to give up 2 1's to get Griffen anyway, why not go for a safer bet using one or two more picks and secure my career

Now, if I trade 3 1's and a 2, or 2 1's and 2 2's for Luck, really the big picture is that they aren't my draft picks anyway. I'm gambling with house money and the house is in favor of it.  The team will find it impossible to find a decent coaching replacement with those picks gone, so chances are even greater that I do not get canned before my contract runs out.  I'm willing to roll the dice that it's a good selection.
 
I also have 50 plus million in the bank to spend on the remaining holes on the team, which I can use to go out and sign someone like Flynn to compete.  3 year deal.  If the guy is a stud in year one, I trade him for at least a 1.  I can also grab one of the MANY WR's out there on the FA market so that I have Moss, Hankerson, and say Wallace or V Jack. My O-line is servicable right now with the starters coming back and I just spent this year building my depth. My defense will have Jenkins back to make it even tougher, along with all the 1st year team players having one year in this system. My RB's look very solid with almost every game in the last 6 having a 100 yard rusher.  Re-sign our own FA's and I think you may have just moved us into a pretty decent position with MAJOR upside. 
 
If I'm Shanny, I'm rolling the dice and going after Luck

CanesSkins26 wrote:I think you might be mixing up teams. Whitehurst is on the Seahwaks, but it was the Titans that drafted Locker. Following the Whitehurst trade and contract extension the Seahawks are still looking for a qb.

Yeah I think you're right...

Whitehusrt was replaced by Matt it was another free agent signing, or should I say former backup T Jackson (kind of kills my argument right there but ...). Whitehurst and Kolb's trade had to come with long term deals to make the deals work, Flynn will be a free agent so his only cost will be money.

Both Whitehurst and Kolb went to completely different offensive systems, but Flynn has been in the Packers
system (very close to what Kyle runs) for four years so the change of teams will be a change in terminolgy more so than scheme. This will only matter if Flynn want to succeed and not just get paid.

Another rumor has GB tagging Flynn (haven't check their available cap space yet), if that happens the truth will come out. Hopefully Mike won't be willing to trade for him and if he just wants to get paid he'll signed the tender and earn about $14M to backup Rodgers for another year. It's a gamble for Green Bay but if he's that hot they'll want to do more than just let him walk and get nothing

I think Mike will pass if Flynn has to be traded for.

If I'm Snyder, my thinking is like this (and I don't necessarily agree with it, just have a hunch what he's gotta be thinking)

I know what everyone has said about staying out of things, but this is ultimately a VERY important draft for the next decade or longer FOR MY COMPANY. I should at least have an understanding of what the plan is for this draft. I should have a conversation with Shanahan at the very least, so I can tell him that he has the go ahead to take the most coveted QB in the past 15 years if he chooses. That if he thinks that Luck is a franchise QB, that I trust him to make the play for him and I'll make sure I honor his contract of 5 years.

Here's the logic of that. If Shanahan is wrong, it'll take about three years to figure it out. All the while, I'm collecting massive amounts of money from fans and the hype this city will generate. I can always replace the coach at the end of his contract when the first round draft picks that we traded away come back in play. Oh and guess what, the pick is fan proof as well. He's the most touted QB in 15 years by all the experts, so who could blame us. I continue with a long term plan of keeping one coaching staff like the fans wanted. And because Bruce Allen purged my team of overpaid players, we can now use that money to fill in the holes with character players so we can try again in three years with a first round pick.

But if he's right, my company just put a super bowl in play for the next 15 years, we have found a face of a franchise and a league, I have returned a SB to my childhood team, and everyone will (gulp) love me. My stadium is packed, my actual season ticket waiting list is for real, and I now have pricing power. The potential revenues of this player is huge, and I have a team that's eating into my market share in NC with Cam Newton so I need to act fast

There's really no downside for Snyder. If I'm him, I nudge Shanahan to make the move.

I don't see the colts giving up on their boy luck for anything.. RGIII isn't as far behind luck as you think IMO.. I'd prefer RGIII being the cheaper of the two but if we trade our pick and score a great OL or Blackmon and take weeden in the 2nd I'd be cool w that too. Weedon and Blackmon are already on the same page of course I know weeden is older especially for a Rook.
But its an option- as I feel Luck will not be at all

As recievers go, Blackmon may not be there at #6 either. Alshon Jeffry out of SC would be a viable option. It all depends on what QB's are available though. and we still need to spend some higher draft picks on O-line. Not sure Jeffry is a #6 overall, could possibly trade back for him.

Still too many holes to fill, even to give up 1 first rounder next year for a QB this year.

Neither Luck or Griffin is worth that many picks. One player doesn't make a team and Shanny is not going to throw away our future picks. Trade back for more picks...

I think we should pick up Griffin only if he is available at #6 and we haven't filled it through free agent . If not, trade back .

welch wrote:I predict that this topic will be beaten like the most irritating drum until the draft is finished. There will come a time, when we will be throwing rotten eggs and tomatoes at anyone who mentions it.

it's not even 1 page down and it's already irritating - AND the Redskins signed a young QB off the practice squad

SkinsJock wrote:

welch wrote:I predict that this topic will be beaten like the most irritating drum until the draft is finished. There will come a time, when we will be throwing rotten eggs and tomatoes at anyone who mentions it.

it's not even 1 page down and it's already irritating - AND the Redskins signed a young QB off the practice squad

They also signed running back Tristan Davis and safety Travon Bellamy as well as guard Nevin McCaskill. All of whom had been on the practice squad

Don't look at a lot of mocks this early but this one has RGIII falling to #6

1niksder wrote:Don't look at a lot of mocks this early but this one has RGIII falling to #6

Thanx - right on top of it, as usual - how great would that be?

The Browns having 2 first round picks is a bit of an issue though

We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

I would not draft a WR. The FA class is loaded with stud WRs. As far as OL goes I would sign at least 1 if not 2 FAs. I'm not sure if the Saints will let Nicks go but he's definitely a stud.

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

Agree 1,000,000% with this. No matter who our QB is, they alone are not going to magically fix this team.

StorminMormon86 wrote:

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

Agree 1,000,000% with this. No matter who our QB is, they alone are not going to magically fix this team.

If we get a stud WR and 1-2 great OL in FA then why not go for Luck or RG III?

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

Tanehill played less than 2 years of qb in college. Foles was wildly inconsistent and loves throwing int's. Weeden will be 29 next season and has a history of shoulder problems. Cousins stunk it up against pretty much every decent team MSU played this year. There is no Dalton in this year's draft. If we can't get Luck or RGIII we have to hope that Landry Jones comes out.

GoSkins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

I would not draft a WR. The FA class is loaded with stud WRs. As far as OL goes I would sign at least 1 if not 2 FAs. I'm not sure if the Saints will let Nicks go but he's definitely a stud.

I know you feel that way, but I don't. There are a few good ones that might be available, but none that are studs. Bowe comes the closest to that discription to me. VJ is just a high y/c guy, but not a stud and would cost WAY more than he is worth.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

Tanehill played less than 2 years of qb in college. Foles was wildly inconsistent and loves throwing int's. Weeden will be 29 next season and has a history of shoulder problems. Cousins stunk it up against pretty much every decent team MSU played this year. There is no Dalton in this year's draft. If we can't get Luck or RGIII we have to hope that Landry Jones comes out.

It's about projecting how a guy will play in your system, not necessarily about critiquing every statistical aspect of their games in college. Dalton wasn't Dalton in last year's draft until he got into the league.

As we continue adding pieces to the puzzle, we can develop as an offense overall. Joe Flacco is no Peyton Manning. We can't assume that only one of the "Top 2" QB prospects will do for us. I don't see Weeden's age as a hinderance. The guy is mature, and played pro baseball. He hasn't taken a beating like a normal 28 year old QB has. As a result, he likely will have 5-7 good years in him. I like Landry Jones. But, this team is in worse shape offensively than fans think. A good game for us was 19 points. If we broke 20 it was a miracle. Accordingly, we need playmakers at more than one position.

If we wind up with one of the aforementioned QBS or even Tyler Wilson from Arkansas (if he declares) along with Alshon Jeffery, and one of the better Tackles available in the early 2nd, then I say that is a win. Especially given the free agent additions, and the expected improvement of the young players who got experience this year.

I was reading today that Griffins stock is up and he could be the number one pick in the draft. Most likely that won't happen. I love all the rumors. What else is there, since our season is over. I just hope we do what's best for the team and be on top again. Been way to long.

The Hogster wrote:We have to dig a little deeper in this year's QB class. We don't have to have Luck or RG3 to win. We need to get more playmakers. Peyton Manning only has 1 ring which shows us how far even a great QB can take us without a good team around him.

Accordingly, trading back is my preferred strategy. Slide down into the mid-first, then possibly to the late first. Take the best players available at positions of need with the first round pick and 2 second round picks. If it were up to me: Brandon Weeden, Ryan Tannenhill, Nick Foles or Kirk Cousins would be in the B & G, along with a guy like Alshon Jeffrey (WR) & Nate Potter or Mike Adams at (OT).

As I said before, I'd go after All Pro Guard Carl Nicks from the Saints to solidify our O Line. If we can trade back, I would address WR, OT & QB with the first 3 picks. Of course this would all vary since we will have a regular FA period that starts before the Draft. In this rebuild, I think we need to strike quickly in FA and go into the draft with our eyes open.

i,m thinking at QB in the later rounds with kellen moore or casey kenum or any of those you mentioned we need deep ball threats to open things up with a chance to grab a signal caller that can get them the ball quick with great decision making i'm all for it but i agree with your post it makes sense in the grand scheme of things for the future of the franchise to continue to build thru the draft and fill in with free agency.

Vikes say they are sticking with Ponder...
http://eye-on-football.blogs.cbssports. ... 8/34198549

yeah i dont think anyone was worried about the vikes drafting a qb. I heard on Nfl radio that the browns want to upgrade the qb position this year so bye bye RG3. Im ready to just go all in for Luck and stop all this qb talk for the next decade