ATX_Skins wrote:Red_One43 wrote:ATX_Skins wrote:I understand that Banks had a solid, not great first two games (there, I addressed it). However, I brought this up last week as an issue I had noticed, and once again there was no production out of him. He muffed a punt that quite honestly he could have made a good return on. If teams are game planning him then he needs to take advantage of the opportunities he gets.
I too hope the special teams gets some extra attention during the bye week.
Please guys, he is not Randle El. As someone said he would have to juke right, then left, then spin, then go down all within a 2 yd box. Randle El did catch better though.
This comes from your opening post. Good to see you have softened your stance.
ATX_Skins wrote:
Last night and every game so far he has reminded me of Cartwright.
Like Cartwright?
First of all, Cartwright didn't return kicks under these rules.
Second you opening post is clearly pointing towards kick offs, but later statements expands to his punt returning because you didn't want to address the valid responses concerning what is happening on kick-off returns.
Statwise, Banks had a very good first two games on punt returning ( 18 yards a pop ain't bad for an opening game) but stats don't always tell how valuable a guy is .
Against the Giants, Banks was a vicious facemask away from taking a punt return to the house. It doesn't show in the stats, but teams take note of that.
Against the Cards, with time running out in the 1st half, Banks gets the big return and sets us up with great scoring position only to se us go three downs and then a blocked field goal. Banks did the job his $405,000 salary pays him. He fulfilled the reason that he is on this roster and he has 12 more games to make more game changing plays.
Yes, his production is down in the last two games. I think all of us are aware of that. If you want open a thread to dicuss that them discuss that, but your statements about Banks getting armed tackled tell the truth about your motives.
I have seen post after post trying to discuss your observation which is quite valid, but clearly all you wanted to do is criticize and put Banks down.
If you want to discuss then discuss. What are some possible solutions?
Should we let the bigger Paul return kick offs. Should we put both of them back there so Paul gets the short kicks. Saying Banks should take advantage of his opportunities? Who on this thread doens't know that?
Your observations are valid - now, lets have a real discussion.
Cardinals:
Kickoff Returns NO AVG TD LG
B. Banks 4No 26 Avg 0TD 31LG
Punt Returns NO AVG TD LG
B. Banks 4NO 18AVG 0TD 35LG
Giants:
Kickoff Returns NO AVG TD LG
B. Banks 2No 24AVG 0TD 24 LG
Punt Returns NO AVG TD LG
B. Banks 4No 13 Avg 0TD 25 LG
N. Paul 1No 0AVG 0TD 0LG
Red_One, did Brandon Banks rescue you from a burning building or something?
What did Brandon do to you, burn your house down or something? I am not defending Banks. I am countering your bashing with facts to show that it is not Bank's fault why his production is down (in other words discuss). He didn't suddenly change his style of returning. You are the one bashing him. You went beyond making observations about his production in the last two games.
Look, I will continue to point out his fumbles and yes, his last two games. You can throw out all the stats you want but you can't deny he has been less than average the last two games. Why do you think this thread is still going after I posted it over a week ago, because it's an issue (and you keep it alive for some reason).
Uh Tex, check out this:
Red_One43 wrote:
Your observations are valid - now, lets have a real discussion.
It was on the post that you responded to and if you keep reading above you will get to it.
I keep it alive because I want a discussion about it. How many times do you want me to tell you that your observations are valid as far as the average kick-off stats in the last two games and the shaky punt fielding?
I have NEVER said he needs to be replaced, I simply brought up an issue that I determined fit for this board. If you for some reason have an issue with people posting on this board about the Redskins than I don't know what to tell you. I had softened my stance because you and others brought up valid points about his production in the first two games, which is also the exact reason I had not mentioned it during that time, it had not IMO been an issue then. But it is now, and since two games ago I have decided to bring it up. Some of you think it's the special teams, I have a feeling it is too, or was, until last game when he had a chance to return a punt and fumbled it. Therefor it is a mix. Remember he also fumbled the ball last year, a couple times. The stats won't show all fumbles, just fumbles lost. The only reason I brought up Cartwright is because of the arm tackle thing. I couldn't stand Cartwright for that very reason, he was terrible but we kept him around for some reason and I could never figure out why. It was like having two vehicles, a sedan and a truck, then you buy a third brand new sedan and keep the old one because it had character. Everyone knew it ran like crap, it was too small and it was bound to break down but you just had to hold onto it. Made no sense.
Wow, now you are bringing up Brandon's fumbles from last year. If I remember correctly, Mike told him that if he continued to fumble the ball, he would be cut. He didn't return kicks and was cut, when he came back he was phenomenal - Banks cannot be categorized as a fumbler. This is further evidence that you are digging up dirt on the guy - for what?
Your car analogy makes no sense.
Of course, you never said you wanted Banks replaced. You never said anything definitive. I asked several times what is your point and even tried to define your point for you, but you had none. To me your agenda was to just bash the Banks. He has two good games you say nothing - He has two average games - you bash him.
Let's look at your origianal post:
ATX_Skins wrote:
I want to start a discussion about this subject because before the season started there were a lot of people on here (including myself) that thought this would be an area where we could change games.
You said that you wanted to start a discussion, but you would never discuss the responses.
Call Banks' first two games what you like, but he had game changing punt returns in each game. It is not his fault that the offense couldn't take advantage of the field position in that Card game. You just don't want to admit that Banks did in those two games what he was brought in to do, give us the advantage in field position. You didn't even want to discuss it.
The ONLY reason Brandon Banks has a job with us is due to his ability to return kicks. Well, that just isn't happening.
This statement speaks that you had no intention to discuss - you only wanted to focus on his last two games. You totally dismissed the first two games to try to keep your agenda.
Last night and every game so far he has reminded me of Cartwright. I am aware that league wide there hasn't been great returning but let's be real, if you get the ball at the goal line and can't get past the 20 you shouldn't be the guy returning.
Once again, this part neglects the first two games. He had a 31 yard KO return in one of the games got past the 20 regularly.
Here's where a good discussion could have happened. Other folks countered you with the blocking, but all you did was pile more on to Banks instead of responding to those post.
It seems to me as if you don't think there is anything wrong with his performance and that is fine for you to think that, I will just continue to argue with you. I DID open up a thread to discuss how his production is down and for some reason you have taken it personally like I'm texting him at midnight while you are at his house about going on the lake this weekend, relax.
I don't think that there is anything wrong with his performance, but I do agree that his production was down. Blocking is a big key. Banks hasn't lost a step. I thought you might want to discuss reasons why his production is down the last two games. You want to claim that I am fixated on Banks, but actually you are the one fixated on Banks - all you want to discuss is stuff you have piled on him. I have said your observation is valid. I am the one suggesting that we try something different to spring him if teams are kicking shallow. By asking you if you think that Paul might be worth a try either pairing with him or taking the short kicks, it shows that I am not the one fixated.
BTW stop overanalyzing and assuming things when you read my posts. Well, you can do what you want but it's only going to frustrate you (possibly) and mean nothing to me.
I am not overanalyzing. It is easy to see that your agenda is to bash Banks and not to have a real discussion on this discussion board on the thread that you requested a discussion. A discussion means responding to valid counters to your statements.
Also, no, you cannot be on my "crap list". That is an exclusive club.
This one hurts. It is not fair at all. I think that by my numerous posts I deserve a crack at your "crap list."
Just so you know I typed all of this with a smile on my face.
I had a smile when I read your post.
Except for that short power outage where I had to take a break to check to see if my neighbors lights were out too, which they were, thanks for asking. There may be more fires somewhere here in Austin as they usually cut power for some time. If you would like to know more about the wildfires we can talk about that too but I would suggest we do that in another thread ok? These threads are meant for Redskins talk.
Pleased to meet you.