The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Vince Young is not a bad QB. But I think the Skins will go after a guy like:
Nevada QB Kaepernick, who is moving up in the draft boards. Grant you he has not played in shift competition but he is big with an accurate arm and can go deep.

In fact, he has decent stats, plus he's mobile to play for KS's offense.

A quote from Russ Lande of The Sporting News,

"On the rise

1. Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada
After evaluating film of his junior year, most scouts viewed Kaepernick as a super athletic, developmental prospect who was a long way from being ready to play in the NFL and projected him to go in the fifth or sixth round.

This season, Kaepernick (6-4 3/4, 219) has impressed with his athleticism and speed as a runner but, more important, has shown good arm strength and accuracy as a passer.

Throughout his senior season, he has displayed the consistent ability to be accurate from the pocket and on the move. He also has carried the Nevada offense on his back, making big plays with his arm and legs.

Kaepernick will not be a high pick but with a good week at the Senior Bowl in January he could we set himself up to be a second- or third-round pick.

Remember, the Skins still need a RT. Brown does not seem to be the answer. Bench Rabach and play Cooke.

jpayne@kworksb2b.com wrote:Vince Young is not a bad QB. But I think the Skins will go after a guy like:
Nevada QB Kaepernick, who is moving up in the draft boards. Grant you he has not played in shift competition but he is big with an accurate arm and can go deep.

In fact, he has decent stats, plus he's mobile to play for KS's offense.

A quote from Russ Lande of The Sporting News,

"On the rise

1. Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada
After evaluating film of his junior year, most scouts viewed Kaepernick as a super athletic, developmental prospect who was a long way from being ready to play in the NFL and projected him to go in the fifth or sixth round.

This season, Kaepernick (6-4 3/4, 219) has impressed with his athleticism and speed as a runner but, more important, has shown good arm strength and accuracy as a passer.

Throughout his senior season, he has displayed the consistent ability to be accurate from the pocket and on the move. He also has carried the Nevada offense on his back, making big plays with his arm and legs.

Kaepernick will not be a high pick but with a good week at the Senior Bowl in January he could we set himself up to be a second- or third-round pick.

Let me guess... he's your nephew, and you have an option to become his agent...

Countertrey wrote:

jpayne@kworksb2b.com wrote:Vince Young is not a bad QB. But I think the Skins will go after a guy like:
Nevada QB Kaepernick, who is moving up in the draft boards. Grant you he has not played in stift competition but he is big with an accurate arm and can go deep.

In fact, he has decent stats, plus he's mobile to play for KS's offense.

A quote from Russ Lande of The Sporting News,

"On the rise

1. Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada
After evaluating film of his junior year, most scouts viewed Kaepernick as a super athletic, developmental prospect who was a long way from being ready to play in the NFL and projected him to go in the fifth or sixth round.

This season, Kaepernick (6-4 3/4, 219) has impressed with his athleticism and speed as a runner but, more important, has shown good arm strength and accuracy as a passer.

Throughout his senior season, he has displayed the consistent ability to be accurate from the pocket and on the move. He also has carried the Nevada offense on his back, making big plays with his arm and legs.

Kaepernick will not be a high pick but with a good week at the Senior Bowl in January he could we set himself up to be a second- or third-round pick.

Let me guess... he's your nephew, and you have an option to become his agent...

You mean Vince Young or Kaepernick?

LOL! Kaepernick... or, maybe both! You tell me!

Countertrey wrote:LOL! Kaepernick... or, maybe both! You tell me!

Actually, neither. But one can always dream of getting a piece of the pie.

Even assuming the best, why would the Redskins take a QB projected to maybe go in the second or third round with a first round pick when they can take a QB projected to go in the first round?

Because his uncle and agent says we should!

Deadskins wrote:I prefer raspberry.

I forgot about those, they are the rarest i believe.

I want Andrew Luck in the first round. I dont care if we have to trade away the stadium and play at some park in Manassass.

TCIYM wrote::? Even assuming the best, why would the Redskins take a QB projected to maybe go in the second or third round with a first round pick when they can take a QB projected to go in the first round?

Um, I'm thinking he meant to use our first rounder on another player, and a later pick on Kaepernick, either the 2nd or a new pick from trading down.

Deadskins wrote:

TCIYM wrote::? Even assuming the best, why would the Redskins take a QB projected to maybe go in the second or third round with a first round pick when they can take a QB projected to go in the first round?

Um, I'm thinking he meant to use our first rounder on another player, and a later pick on Kaepernick, either the 2nd or a new pick from trading down.

Which would make sense if, and only if we keep McNabb next season. We need a starting QB and that is always the priority no matter how long the list of needs. Perhaps someone thinks there is a franchise free safety or a franchise right guard we should draft in the first round, however I am not that someone. We either draft a QB or we trader our first rounder for one is my guess.

One way or another, McNabb has been a mistake. Either he was over the hill when they signed him, in which case that that was a chronic failure in player evaluation. Or he just wasn't suited to the scheme, in which case THAT was a chronic failure of player evaluation, plus an overblown assessment by the coaching staff of their own ability to bend McNabb to their system. Or it was the inability of that same coaching staff to adjust their scheme to McNabb's strengths, which everybody knows already, and certainly should have known when they signed him.

So, the Redskins have screwed up on McNabb, big time.

But it would be a bigger mistake to not acknowledge that error, and to keep banging away at the same brick wall that they've banging away at for the last 13 weeks. By benching McNabb, the Shanahans have openly admitted their error, although I very much doubt that is how they would describe the latest sorry goings on at Redskins HQ.

I doubt that Rex Grossman is about to prove that he will be any more successful in running this offence. But he might just prove to the coaching staff that having a better knowledge of this offence still won't guarantee success, not without a sturdy offensive line, reliable running game, and a couple of wide receivers capable of catching 80+ catches in a season.

What all the above waffle reinforces is this fact: yes, the search for the next Redskins QB really is under way. I now have every expectation that our first round pick next year will be used on a QB. Let's hope they find somebody worthy of that pick, and more suited to their own grand design.

UK Skins Fan wrote:One way or another, McNabb has been a mistake. Either he was over the hill when they signed him, in which case that that was a chronic failure in player evaluation. Or he just wasn't suited to the scheme, in which case THAT was a chronic failure of player evaluation, plus an overblown assessment by the coaching staff of their own ability to bend McNabb to their system. Or it was the inability of that same coaching staff to adjust their scheme to McNabb's strengths, which everybody knows already, and certainly should have known when they signed him.

So, the Redskins have screwed up on McNabb, big time.

But it would be a bigger mistake to not acknowledge that error, and to keep banging away at the same brick wall that they've banging away at for the last 13 weeks. By benching McNabb, the Shanahans have openly admitted their error, although I very much doubt that is how they would describe the latest sorry goings on at Redskins HQ.

I doubt that Rex Grossman is about to prove that he will be any more successful in running this offence. But he might just prove to the coaching staff that having a better knowledge of this offence still won't guarantee success, not without a sturdy offensive line, reliable running game, and a couple of wide receivers capable of catching 80+ catches in a season.

What all the above waffle reinforces is this fact: yes, the search for the next Redskins QB really is under way. I now have every expectation that our first round pick next year will be used on a QB. Let's hope they find somebody worthy of that pick, and more suited to their own grand design.

I don't agree. I still think McNabb is a great QB and showed it this year, I stand by it. The only advantage he had over JC was a marginally improved line and a part time RB in Torain. We did not add anyone to throw to and Davis has been a huge disappointment after he showed promise last year and he had no where near the D JC had, yet we've won 5 and been in most of our games this year against a killer schedule. It was phenomenal. You can only gauge him on what he had to work with.

I'll risk the wrath of Ray that I'm "fence sitting" by agreeing that if we don't keep him we wasted the picks we traded for him. Which seems to me to be stubbornness not to admit rather then vice versa. But I won't agree with that move, it won't have been McNabb's fault and I seriously doubt we'll get anyone nearly as good next year. If our scheme's not right for him, Shannahan (both of them) need to do a Gibbs and adjust their scheme for the players they have rather then the other way around.

Something coach Shanahan said got me thinking:

Mike Shanahan wrote:"When I had Jake Plummer, he had a winning percentage of 36 percent. Everybody said we were crazy. He had 90 touchdown passes and 114 interceptions. ‘How can you bring a guy to the Denver Broncos that had won 36 percent of his games?' And four years later, he'd won 72 percent of his games, which was the best in four years."

Will the Skins be looking for someone like Plummer?

Jake the Snake was a former 2nd round draft pick out of Arizona State. He always had the reputation as a mobile QB on a bad team and he was pretty unimpressive when you looked at the numbers. He was 29 in his first season with the Broncos. Who is a QB with an unimpressive resume, but some potential that Shanahan might want to use?

Alex Smith is going to be 27 next season, has shown flashes of brilliance and obviously has talent as a former #1 overall pick. He's mobile. Looks like someone Shanny could mold.

Tarvaris Jackson is a former second rounder out of a small school who is mobile and has shown some talent in the past. If the Vikings allow him to become a free agent then would Shanny be interested in this guy?

Matt Moore hasn't been able to stay healthy, but when he's played he's been surprisingly good. Wonder if Shanahan would take a flier on him and let him compete for a job in camp.

Redskins_Fanatic wrote:I'll use the same two words I did earlier in the week.....

CAM NEWTON.

We end up 5-11, probably picking somewhere right around #8 and so long as Luck comes out as well as Newton, he should fall right into our laps.

LoL, not another guy from AUburn!

SKINFAN wrote:LoL, not another guy from AUburn!

Then let me know who you would prefer, who will be available? Andrew Luck will not be there by the time we draft. McNabb is obviously gone. Do you want Grossman as youre starting QB going into next year? Is there another draft pick or some FA you would prefer to see under center for us next year?

I wouldn't mind starting Grossman for a year while Newton learns the system from him. YES, it would essentially be a throw away year, probably 7-9 or 8-8, but then hopefully Newton is ready to come in and run this offense and take us somewhere with Rex as his backup and mentor.

What's your better option?

skins2357 wrote:Realistically, we might be able to get Newton, Lockler or Mallet in the 1st rounder. Dunno who I want out of that group?

Newton would be a waste taking him in the top 10.

I would go for Mallet or Luck, but you really have to wait and see what happens with the charts.

Redskins_Fanatic wrote:

SKINFAN wrote:LoL, not another guy from AUburn!

Then let me know who you would prefer, who will be available? Andrew Luck will not be there by the time we draft. McNabb is obviously gone. Do you want Grossman as youre starting QB going into next year? Is there another draft pick or some FA you would prefer to see under center for us next year?

I wouldn't mind starting Grossman for a year while Newton learns the system from him. YES, it would essentially be a throw away year, probably 7-9 or 8-8, but then hopefully Newton is ready to come in and run this offense and take us somewhere with Rex as his backup and mentor.

What's your better option?

SKINFAN, I don't even see him listed anywhere in the upper echelons on most of the draft sites I've looked at; yet you want him to be the STARTING QB Week 1 of next year? You've got some nerve, I'll give you that.

SKINFAN wrote:

Redskins_Fanatic wrote:

SKINFAN wrote:LoL, not another guy from AUburn!

Then let me know who you would prefer, who will be available? Andrew Luck will not be there by the time we draft. McNabb is obviously gone. Do you want Grossman as youre starting QB going into next year? Is there another draft pick or some FA you would prefer to see under center for us next year?

I wouldn't mind starting Grossman for a year while Newton learns the system from him. YES, it would essentially be a throw away year, probably 7-9 or 8-8, but then hopefully Newton is ready to come in and run this offense and take us somewhere with Rex as his backup and mentor.

What's your better option?

If that is the case, then are you interested in drafting a OL in the top 10? The reason I ask is because at a shade UNDER 6 feet, Moore won't be drafted in the first 3 rounds. Also, take a look at his hands -- they are practically baby hands for the NFL. The NFL ball is insanely big compared to the college ball size. I consider myself to have large hands (I wear an XL glove size for golf, winter wear, etc. -- and I even have to squeeze into those) and I can barely get my fingers around an NFL football. Hand size is a huge consideration when analyizing the ability for a college QB to make the NFL transition. Sure some guys with smaller hands have done it -- see Brees and Warner, but you need very special talent to do so.

To draft him in the top 10 would be complete insanity. There is no question that this guy is good, but is he NFL good? He's got to be Drew Brees good to make it. After all, Brees is the only 6-0 footer I know that has had any success in the NFL (in the past 10 or so years when OLs started tipping the charts at 6-5+).

Even Brees was drafted as the last pick in the 2nd round (aka a gloried 3rd rounder).

markshark84 wrote:

SKINFAN wrote:

Redskins_Fanatic wrote:

SKINFAN wrote:LoL, not another guy from AUburn!

Then let me know who you would prefer, who will be available? Andrew Luck will not be there by the time we draft. McNabb is obviously gone. Do you want Grossman as youre starting QB going into next year? Is there another draft pick or some FA you would prefer to see under center for us next year?

I wouldn't mind starting Grossman for a year while Newton learns the system from him. YES, it would essentially be a throw away year, probably 7-9 or 8-8, but then hopefully Newton is ready to come in and run this offense and take us somewhere with Rex as his backup and mentor.

What's your better option?

If that is the case, then are you interested in drafting a OL in the top 10? The reason I ask is because at a shade UNDER 6 feet, Moore won't be drafted in the first 3 rounds. Also, take a look at his hands -- they are practically baby hands for the NFL. The NFL ball is insanely big compared to the college ball size. I consider myself to have large hands (I wear an XL glove size for golf, winter wear, etc. -- and I even have to squeeze into those) and I can barely get my fingers around an NFL football. Hand size is a huge consideration when analyizing the ability for a college QB to make the NFL transition. Sure some guys with smaller hands have done it -- see Brees and Warner, but you need very special talent to do so.

To draft him in the top 10 would be complete insanity. There is no question that this guy is good, but is he NFL good? He's got to be Drew Brees good to make it. After all, Brees is the only 6-0 footer I know that has had any success in the NFL (in the past 10 or so years when OLs started tipping the charts at 6-5+).

Even Brees was drafted as the last pick in the 2nd round (aka a gloried 3rd rounder).

Fully agree with this. Moore is an unrealistic stretch in the top 10.

exactly mark, this guy is cerebral, a student of the game. Supersmart if you use Gibbs terminology, which means he will get that playbook down fairly quickly.

Fanatic, you won't start Cam but you want me to start this guy? Who's got the nerve? We need an OL guy, more than we need a QB, this guy will fall to us in the 2nd rd.

markshark84 wrote:If that is the case, then are you interested in drafting a OL in the top 10? The reason I ask is because at a shade UNDER 6 feet, Moore won't be drafted in the first 3 rounds. Also, take a look at his hands -- they are practically baby hands for the NFL. The NFL ball is insanely big compared to the college ball size. I consider myself to have large hands (I wear an XL glove size for golf, winter wear, etc. -- and I even have to squeeze into those) and I can barely get my fingers around an NFL football. Hand size is a huge consideration when analyizing the ability for a college QB to make the NFL transition. Sure some guys with smaller hands have done it -- see Brees and Warner, but you need very special talent to do so.

To draft him in the top 10 would be complete insanity. There is no question that this guy is good, but is he NFL good? He's got to be Drew Brees good to make it. After all, Brees is the only 6-0 footer I know that has had any success in the NFL (in the past 10 or so years when OLs started tipping the charts at 6-5+).

Even Brees was drafted as the last pick in the 2nd round (aka a gloried 3rd rounder).

The specs for the NFL football and the NCAA football are exactly the same tolerances. The only difference is the 1001 model is max tolerance size and the 1005 model is minimum tolerance size. The difference is 3/4 inch in circumference, one pound in air pressure, and one ounce in weight from minimum to maximum tolerance. It isn't that great a difference. Michael Vick is barely six feet tall. He's doing OK for himself. Ryan Mallett is 6'7" and probably has large hands. Should we draft him on that basis alone? I'm really not convinced hand size is a determining factor.

SKINFAN wrote:exactly mark, this guy is cerebral, a student of the game. Supersmart if you use Gibbs terminology, which means he will get that playbook down fairly quickly.

I'm looking for TALENT more than brain power, than you very much. He doesn't need to have gotten a 1600 on the SAT's or a perfect score on the Wonderlic test. He needs to be able to PLAY FOOTBALL & WIN GAMES.

SKINFAN wrote:Fanatic, you won't start Cam but you want me to start this guy? Who's got the nerve? We need an OL guy, more than we need a QB, this guy will fall to us in the 2nd rd.

I asked you what your plan was. You posted Moore's photo with no commentary on starting anyone else next year other than him. What else am I supposed to expect you mean?

We already drafted an OL in the Top 10 LAST YEAR. We don't need another Top 10 Offensive Tackle (you don't even consider interior linemen up there) at this point. This team is NOT going to win ANYTHING (division, conference, Super Bowl) with any of the QB's currently on the roster. Hopefully next year we're not drafting in the Top 10, so QB should be out of the question so far as I'm concerned. If we don't get one of those guys this year, then we're stuck trying to find a Free Agent replacement for McNabb who is an upgrade from Grossman and I'm not sure there's anyone out there who can do it even with a year on the bench to learn the system.

SKINFAN wrote:

Was this the gayest looking picture of him you could find or was that just coincidence?