The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

JSPB22 wrote:IMO, the long pass to Fitzgerald is less on Reed than on the fact that Warner had all day to wait for him to get open and pass him the ball.

I disagree. At no point during that play was Reed in position to be successful. The only time he wasn't behind the behind the WR was when Larry was behind the LOS.

Right, and if we get to Warner sometime before next week, he doesn't get behind Reed.

Nah, Fitzgerald had Reed beat right from the out move, Warner only needed a few seconds back there. The only way that pass isn't a TD is if Warner is sacked right away, or he overthrows. It wasn't like he had all day (or needed it).

joebagadonuts wrote:Nah, Fitzgerald had Reed beat right from the out move, Warner only needed a few seconds back there. The only way that pass isn't a TD is if Warner is sacked right away, or he overthrows. It wasn't like he had all day (or needed it).

You're just mad because of my comments on your blog.

J/K JBD. Reed definitely was toasted on the play, but Warner is still sitting in the pocket waiting for some pressure.

SKINFAN wrote:

ChocolateMilk wrote:

SKINFAN wrote:Reed had a pretty solid game, he was there to make the play for the most part. The long TD was designed to get the safety to bite, if he didn't bite they wouldn't throw it to Fitz, you win some you lose some, hopefully Reed will allow the small marginal plays and snuff out the big ones like this one. The guy has heart, he tried his best to get back but it was way too late. That fumble was McIntosh laying wood and sandwiching James between him and Reed, W/o Mc's hit reed won't be able to pop that ball out.

yeah but some times having heart and trying your best isnt enough. im sure he's a great guy but he's just not starting safety material. And in his career he has lost more than he has won. He cant keep making the same mistakes next week at dallas or Romo will tear it up against us

How do you know he's not starting safety material, do you sit in practice all week and take notes on both Horton and Doughty? Not trying to attack you but my point is that Blache is not an idiot, he'll start who ever can give us the best chance of winning, or send in packages that optimizes personnel. I just think that Reed, for now, has that starting spot, it's his to lose, and it does look like Horton might be a better option. This I think is a good thing, having the luxury of grooming a rookie to take over the spot.

Blache doesnt beleive in starting rookies, he's said that before. He'd rather have a veteran in there than a rookie. but no i dont watch practice or anything like that, but i watch the games. and what i saw during the game was Doughty not performing well. That TD pass to Boldin he was just standing there if you look at it. And you cant rely on the D-Line to get pressure every single play, the secondary has to do their job. Their job, IMO, is a lil more important than the D-Line on a pass play. And Doughty just doesnt have the skills, or speed to do the job of a Safety. He's just like Archuleta except hes younger and was thrown in when the late Sean Taylor was killed. So i feel as though everyone is emotionally attached to him or something. But in reality he's not that good at all.

Gibbs4Life wrote:

So, when you were playing Strong Safety for the Redskins, how would you have played them?

I'm not an NFL safety genius. But there are NFL safeties, about 31 of them right now better than your boy.

Believe it or not there are players out there who could play the position, should'nt we expect to have a safety that can cover a deep post and make tackles, I mean it does occur, I don't think that's asking too much.

Anyone see Reed D. against the colts in pre-season, if we see him start next week we are in trouble write it down.

Must be warm here. First of all, regarding your first sentence... Yes, I know.

Regarding Doughty, not my boy... just that he is playing pro football... and someone else isn't...

However, your acid thrown at him is misplaced.

As I have said, many times... I believe Horton is the real deal. It's also true that there is more to playing SS than having a nose for the ball. At this time, Doughty knows things that Horton doesn't... and, just as Taylor took several games of the season before becoming the starter (I'm assuming you believed Taylor to be a better player than Horton, anyway... could be wrong about that), I suspect that Horton will, as well. Calling Doughty "the worst Safety ever" doesn't make Horton ready to start, nor is is true.

Countertrey wrote:

Gibbs4Life wrote:

So, when you were playing Strong Safety for the Redskins, how would you have played them?

I'm not an NFL safety genius. But there are NFL safeties, about 31 of them right now better than your boy.

Believe it or not there are players out there who could play the position, should'nt we expect to have a safety that can cover a deep post and make tackles, I mean it does occur, I don't think that's asking too much.

Anyone see Reed D. against the colts in pre-season, if we see him start next week we are in trouble write it down.

Must be warm here. First of all, regarding your first sentence... Yes, I know.

Regarding Doughty, not my boy... just that he is playing pro football... and someone else isn't...

However, your acid thrown at him is misplaced.

As I have said, many times... I believe Horton is the real deal. It's also true that there is more to playing SS than having a nose for the ball. At this time, Doughty knows things that Horton doesn't... and, just as Taylor took several games of the season before becoming the starter (I'm assuming you believed Taylor to be a better player than Horton, anyway... could be wrong about that), I suspect that Horton will, as well. Calling Doughty "the worst Safety ever" doesn't make Horton ready to start, nor is is true.

Regarding the bolded portion, the coaches have echoed that very thing, not that it matters since we have so many posters whose expertise far exceeds that of the coaching staff.

It's also true that there is more to playing SS than having a nose for the ball. At this time, Doughty knows things that Horton doesn't... and, just as Taylor took several games of the season before becoming the starter (I'm assuming you believed Taylor to be a better player than Horton, anyway... could be wrong about that), I suspect that Horton will, as well. Calling Doughty "the worst Safety ever" doesn't make Horton ready to start, nor is is true.

Taylor was starting by week 4. In addition, that season we had Matt Bowen and Ryan Clark. While neither is Pro Bowl caliber, both are way better than Doughty, so that season we at least had some options.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

It's also true that there is more to playing SS than having a nose for the ball. At this time, Doughty knows things that Horton doesn't... and, just as Taylor took several games of the season before becoming the starter (I'm assuming you believed Taylor to be a better player than Horton, anyway... could be wrong about that), I suspect that Horton will, as well. Calling Doughty "the worst Safety ever" doesn't make Horton ready to start, nor is is true.

Taylor was starting by week 4. In addition, that season we had Matt Bowen and Ryan Clark. While neither is Pro Bowl caliber, both are way better than Doughty, so that season we at least had some options.

First of all, it's not week 4 yet. Second, I suspect that the coaching staff will release Horton when THEY feel he is ready... and noting that Bowen and Clark were/are better than Doughty still doesn't make Horton ready.

I guess I just don't get the rush. Horton is an investment, clearly a late round jewel... he is already exceeding expectations... and DB's must be brought along just like any other skilled player.

Well, after that Fitz touchdown, Blache benched Doughty for Horton for the rest of the game.

JSPB22 wrote:This video shows the play at about 0:21. Rocky hits him in the back, but it is Reed's hit that knocks the ball out. He put his helmet squarely on the ball.

Now that I see the video again, you just may be right. It's hard to see any detail in that tiny video, though. I swear I saw Rocky pop him and the ball come out after that, but like I said, I'm starting to rethink it.

Let him get properly groomed, then let him loose. Reed is serviceable, plus they rotate in and out anyway.

I want Horton starting but in due time, I am not sure he has the whole defense down yet. I am one who believes in putting the best athletes on the field but not if he does not get the whole playbook yet.

Split the reps is what I want to see. If Horton keeps making plays then give him more reps as he goes.

JSPB22 wrote:

joebagadonuts wrote:Nah, Fitzgerald had Reed beat right from the out move, Warner only needed a few seconds back there. The only way that pass isn't a TD is if Warner is sacked right away, or he overthrows. It wasn't like he had all day (or needed it).

You're just mad because of my comments on your blog.

J/K JBD. Reed definitely was toasted on the play, but Warner is still sitting in the pocket waiting for some pressure.

More pressure would be better obviously, but I don't think that Warner had (or needed) an extraordinary amount of time to throw the ball on that play. I know you want to blame it on the d-line for not sacking Warner immediately, but Doughty has to stay with his guy for more than a split second if he wants to prevent the TD.

We'll see Horton this week, I'm sure of it. I'm sure we'll see a lot of that heralded "cobra package". If Horton puts the mash on Witten, Reed's days are numbered.

PulpExposure wrote:Well, after that Fitz touchdown, Blache benched Doughty for Horton for the rest of the game.

JSPB22 wrote:This video shows the play at about 0:21. Rocky hits him in the back, but it is Reed's hit that knocks the ball out. He put his helmet squarely on the ball.

Now that I see the video again, you just may be right. It's hard to see any detail in that tiny video, though. I swear I saw Rocky pop him and the ball come out after that, but like I said, I'm starting to rethink it.

No big deal, the replay they showed during the game was much more conclusive (it was from the angle of the still shot), but that was the only video of the play I could find.

JSPB22 wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

JSPB22 wrote:

Fios wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

JSPB22 wrote:

Gibbs4Life wrote:Reed was responsible for 14 points at least the Fitz td and the Boldin td.

Reed also forced a fumble in the 1st quarter that we turned into three points.

I thought McIntosh was the one who forced the fumble...Reed was holding onto James, and McIntosh flew in there and forced the fumble?

I believe you're correct

Nope, you're both wrong.

Associated Press

Running back Edgerrin James fumbles when hit by Reed Doughty on Sunday. It was the Cardinals' first turnover of the season.

I noted it at the time because of this very thread.

The official boxscore for the game[url=[url=http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/boxscore?game_id=29567&displayPage=tab_box_score&season=2008&week=REG3]disagrees with you[/url] and agrees with the Cup and I. It lists Rocky McIntosh as forcing a fumble, and Reed Doughty with 0 forced fumbles.

The title of your AP screenshot just may be wrong.

Isn't Rocky #52 and Reed #37? The picture doesn't lie. And like I said, I noted it at the time because of this thread.

Per Redskins.com....

Apparently Rocky has been given the stat for the FF.

He also forced running back Edgerrin James into a fumble recovered by Carlos Rogers in the first quarter and combined with Andre Carter to sack Kurt Warner with just under 11 minutes left in the game.

Yep, we've been over that already in this thread.

PulpExposure wrote:Well, after that Fitz touchdown, Blache benched Doughty for Horton for the rest of the game...

I heard differently. According to Jason Reid (??) Blache benched Doughty after he guessed wrong on a Fitzgerald seam route. Reed jumped the deep out and was burned badly, but it wasn't the play LF scored on.

Rogers's interception came one series after Fitzgerald's long catch made it 17-17, and embodied the overall approach. Springs was playing man on the right side of the field; Rogers was in zone on the other side, with Fitzgerald lined up wide, and rookie safety Chris Horton and Landry helping with responsibilities on Fitzgerald's side.

Reed Doughty had been caught too shallow on the previous series. He tried to jump a route and misread the play ("I was exposed," he said), so Blache benched him for the duration of the game, using Springs at strong safety for a few plays and turning to Horton in the nickel package.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 456&s_pos=

The article here is by Jason La Canfora. The wording is a little confusing, but Doughty was the safety who got burned by Fitzgerald for the long TD. I'm sure he was out of the game after that, so I do believe that was the play that got him benched for the rest of the game.

Verdict... Doughty.

I love the screenshot... with jansenFan's avatar in the background, it's like Jackson is actually cheering for the play.

Rocky forced the fumble, Reed was tackling the guy already and Rocky came in and laid the hit.

Someone said above that they want to see Horton starting but he doesn't have the defense down....Well Reed doesn't have the "athlete" part down.
The guy is too slow period. That's it. Reed Doughty is too slow get over it.

If we start him tomorrow (and it looks like we will) we are in trouble.


Oh yeah and he's weak. Not a hitter.

It was Reed's helmet that knocked the ball out. CLL confirmed it.

Doughty looks good enough. He played well last year, and he played today. I don't really care which one starts, but it sure is helpful having a few safeties.

Horton looks sooooooo much better.

Horton is Rookie of The Year