Colt Brennan

[Bob 0119]

Based on his college performance, what do you think of the Colt Brennan draft selection in the late rounds? Worst case it was a wasted selection but does he remind you of Brett Farve?

I think he only reminds me of Brett Favre in his side-arm throwing style and unconventional (read:risky) "get it done" play style.

Favre obviously didn't blow anybody's doors off his first year either otherwise he'd have stayed with the Falcons.

[Bob 0119]

Hey, where is Patrick Ramsey?

He's a back-up in Denver

[yupchagee]

Here is what I see. Colt Brennan - is a rookie and learning a new system just like JC and Collins are. But Brennan is also learning the speed of the NFL on top of it, and so far, has looked more impressive than JC or Collins, albeit against inferior defensive opponents. But that doesn't take away the fact that he's thrown some really sharp balls, and seems to be picking up the system quickly. He is still a rookie and rookie mistakes should be expected. So far, his mistakes have been minimal, and everyone should be excited about his knack for making things happen. Statistics don't win ballgames....points do...and so far, Brennan has one more TD than Campbell and Collins combined.

Todd Collins - looks like a career backup under the new system, as opposed to the surprise star that he showed last year. It's too early to make any harsh judgments, though if it were me, and I had to choose between Collins and Brennan, Brennan gets the nod at this point.

Jason Campbell - Looks like Jason Campbell. Sharp one series, and out of sync the next. Overall stats are decent, but fails to put points on the board (story of JC's career thus far, and entering his 4th year, that is not a good sign in my opinion). And the stats often lie. I see a large percentage of the completions are very short throws of under ten yards. His down field success is still in the poor category, as his ability to put up scores.

Conclusion: Barring injury, Campbell is the defacto starter at this point, and rightfully so. However, the question remains who is the backup, Collins or Brennan, and I'd be giving some snaps with the first team to Brennan over the next two preseason games to evaluate him. If he continues to shine, he moves up to # 2.

Campbell should be put on notice that NFL starting QB's remain starters by scoring points and winning games, period. This business of crowning Campbell undisputed king and starter for life is unjustified based on his lack of performance in the area most important....scoring points and winning games. He has a losing record as a starter and I haven't seen anything that indicates improvement in this area. It's time to stop talking about potential and start delivering the goods, otherwise, a change needs to be made.

And I wouldn't wait till game 8 of the 2008 season to notice that no wide receivers have caught a TD pass from Jason Campbell like we did in 2007. By that time the season will be over (based on out schedule this year).

If Campbell struggles over the next two preseason games, and into the first two or three regular season games, he should be benched, PERIOD. Enough for the Campbell experiment that's beginning to look a lot like Kyle Boller.

A little impatient are we, Ray?

For better or worse, this season the QB position belongs to Jason Campbell. I´m as sceptic as you are about his grasp of yet another offense in his short NFL carrer. Any way you cut it, he should at least be given the chance to see what he can do playing a COMPLETE season.

Next season (09) you can start the controversy if Campbell underperforms.

No way Brennan plays this year. The decisive factor is experience. Even if JC and Campbell go down, Zorn would sign a journeyman QB than to start Brennan if there are still meaningful games remaining. You don´t want to shock the kid by throwing him into the fire to early.

I agree. Campbell starts this year. If he does well he continues to start. If not, Zorn will deal with that after the season.

[cvillehog]

I agree. Campbell starts this year. If he does well he continues to start. If not, Zorn will deal with that after the season.

Maybe Zorn is just trying to snow everyone, but it sure sounds like he thinks Colt is going to take at least a couple of years to improve enough to be a starter. And then that's only if he believes in the coaches enough to do what it takes to learn the pro game. We had better hope that Campbell builds on the success he's already had, because if he fails it doesn't sound like Brennan will be ready to step in next year.

[brad7686]

I don't expect them to be any more explosive in the passing game than they were last year because they can't play the new receivers yet, and unfortunately they may never pan out. If theres one position to attack in free agency, its WR, and not people like El and Lloyd. That said, Brennan has looked accurate and has enough zip. Campbell looked great until the jets game. Maybe they should see what Brennan can do with Moss and El against a starting D in the upcoming preseason games. Either way, I think Campbell is safe this year.

[RayNAustin]

Here is what I see. Colt Brennan - is a rookie and learning a new system just like JC and Collins are. But Brennan is also learning the speed of the NFL on top of it, and so far, has looked more impressive than JC or Collins, albeit against inferior defensive opponents. But that doesn't take away the fact that he's thrown some really sharp balls, and seems to be picking up the system quickly. He is still a rookie and rookie mistakes should be expected. So far, his mistakes have been minimal, and everyone should be excited about his knack for making things happen. Statistics don't win ballgames....points do...and so far, Brennan has one more TD than Campbell and Collins combined.

Todd Collins - looks like a career backup under the new system, as opposed to the surprise star that he showed last year. It's too early to make any harsh judgments, though if it were me, and I had to choose between Collins and Brennan, Brennan gets the nod at this point.

Jason Campbell - Looks like Jason Campbell. Sharp one series, and out of sync the next. Overall stats are decent, but fails to put points on the board (story of JC's career thus far, and entering his 4th year, that is not a good sign in my opinion). And the stats often lie. I see a large percentage of the completions are very short throws of under ten yards. His down field success is still in the poor category, as his ability to put up scores.

Conclusion: Barring injury, Campbell is the defacto starter at this point, and rightfully so. However, the question remains who is the backup, Collins or Brennan, and I'd be giving some snaps with the first team to Brennan over the next two preseason games to evaluate him. If he continues to shine, he moves up to # 2.

Campbell should be put on notice that NFL starting QB's remain starters by scoring points and winning games, period. This business of crowning Campbell undisputed king and starter for life is unjustified based on his lack of performance in the area most important....scoring points and winning games. He has a losing record as a starter and I haven't seen anything that indicates improvement in this area. It's time to stop talking about potential and start delivering the goods, otherwise, a change needs to be made.

And I wouldn't wait till game 8 of the 2008 season to notice that no wide receivers have caught a TD pass from Jason Campbell like we did in 2007. By that time the season will be over (based on out schedule this year).

If Campbell struggles over the next two preseason games, and into the first two or three regular season games, he should be benched, PERIOD. Enough for the Campbell experiment that's beginning to look a lot like Kyle Boller.

A little impatient are we, Ray?

For better or worse, this season the QB position belongs to Jason Campbell. I´m as sceptic as you are about his grasp of yet another offense in his short NFL carrer. Any way you cut it, he should at least be given the chance to see what he can do playing a COMPLETE season.

Next season (09) you can start the controversy if Campbell underperforms.

No way Brennan plays this year. The decisive factor is experience. Even if JC and Campbell go down, Zorn would sign a journeyman QB than to start Brennan if there are still meaningful games remaining. You don´t want to shock the kid by throwing him into the fire to early.

I don't think I'd call it impatience. There is a short time line available to wait for a player to perform.....otherwise the talent around him will age and suffer through it.

I've never seen so many excuses being made for an underachieving player before Campbell. It's almost an obligatory caveat to include the number of "systems" Campbell has had to learn whenever we speak of his performance. It's almost as if Campbell is the perpetual rookie. But hitting an open receiver down field with an accurate, catchable pass has nothing whatsoever to do with anyone's system. The system is terminology, formations and plays and knowing the progressions and reading the defenses and understanding where you should go with the ball. Once that has been decided (when the QB throws the ball) it's a matter of QB skill and execution.

Not that I'm comparing the two...but take Favre....he was with the Jets for all of a couple of days and came out and engineered a TD drive. That is an example of a QB executing his skills. There is no way he had the time to learn the Jets "system", but that didn't stop him from making solid throws and putting points on the board.

Campbell had a year and a half to study the game (let's forget the "system" right now because everyone had to learn, not just Campbell). Then he had a half year as the starter in 2006. Then all of the starter reps through camp and preseason, and half a season in 2007 in which he looked to digress instead of progress. His performance in 2007 was pitiful from a scoring standpoint. And the excuses continued. The receivers were too short...the system too complex....play calling too conservative....every conceivable excuse with the exception of Campbell performing poorly. He gets injured. Collins comes in (hadn't started a game in 10 years...no reps...no nothing and scores twice inside 3 minutes of play. Same short receivers, same coaches......but wait.....it's the "system". Collins knows the "system", that's why he did so well? No. He did so well because his passes hit their targets, and our play makers were able to make plays because the QB got the damned ball to them.

If last year didn't illustrate the difficulty with the Redskin offense to everyone...then it's simply a case of mass denial.

Now I hope Campbell comes through and becomes the fine QB everyone has convinced themselves that he is. After all, I want the Redskins to win as much as anyone. But at this point, to me, it will be a surprise if he does, and I would not bet MY farm on it.

[Gibbs4Life]

Its almost like Campbell is the perpetual rookie

Thats a by product of Jason not being allowed to hit the field right away, in reality this is his 2nd year going into it as the starter. I really prefer the way the Colts brought along Peyton, you draft him, you give him the playbook and he works his tail off knowing he's the man.
Making Jason sit behind Mark Brunell was the only decision Joe Gibbs ever made that I dissagreed with. Gibbs just had that loyalty to Brunell because the man saved his life, and also Gibbs would've looked really bad after going shopping for MB and paying top dollar.
Campbell has to get it done, I want 300 yard games from him this year.

[RayNAustin]

Its almost like Campbell is the perpetual rookie

Thats a by product of Jason not being allowed to hit the field right away, in reality this is his 2nd year going into it as the starter. I really prefer the way the Colts brought along Peyton, you draft him, you give him the playbook and he works his tail off knowing he's the man.
Making Jason sit behind Mark Brunell was the only decision Joe Gibbs ever made that I dissagreed with. Gibbs just had that loyalty to Brunell because the man saved his life, and also Gibbs would've looked really bad after going shopping for MB and paying top dollar.
Campbell has to get it done, I want 300 yard games from him this year.

No offense, but you're doing it too. It's like mass psychosis. This is not his second year as a starter, it's his third year as a starter. And he had a year and a half to acclimate to the NFL before becoming the starter in 2006. He's had a much better situation than many young QBs....he wasn't forced into playing right out of the blocks with a poor team around him. He's had a tremendous amount of coaching support and tutoring; an experienced QB like Brunell who was very gracious in his mentoring of Campbell; he's been given ample opportunity to shine without the quick hook waiting for his first mistake....so no, there is no "poor Jason Campbell, look what he's had to endure" going on here.

If things had gone such as you suggest, everyone would be saying that they forced him into playing before he was ready, and that's why he hasn't progressed.

The bottom line is that there are no guarantees that a drafted QB will become a success in the NFL. The fact is, the odds are against them. For every one of them that become star players, 2 dozen crash and burn.

Generally, you'd expect to see more highlights from a franchise QB at this stage in his career.....Rothlisberger comes to mind....Rivers comes to mind....Romo....Anderson.....Palmer....and a few others.

Let's keep something in mind here.....Joe Gibbs II is only considered a success story because of 2 trips to the playoffs in 4 years. But in 2005, it was Brunell and Portis and Moss and the defense that got them there. In 2007 it was Collins. Had Campbell not been injured, the Redskins would have most likely finished under 500, and not made the playoffs in 2007. If we see that sort of thing again this year......meaning 7 games without a TD pass, Campbell is DONE. He will be just another Boller, or Grossman who's respective teams just didn't know when to say when.

[El Mexican]

Its almost like Campbell is the perpetual rookie

Thats a by product of Jason not being allowed to hit the field right away, in reality this is his 2nd year going into it as the starter. I really prefer the way the Colts brought along Peyton, you draft him, you give him the playbook and he works his tail off knowing he's the man.
Making Jason sit behind Mark Brunell was the only decision Joe Gibbs ever made that I dissagreed with. Gibbs just had that loyalty to Brunell because the man saved his life, and also Gibbs would've looked really bad after going shopping for MB and paying top dollar.
Campbell has to get it done, I want 300 yard games from him this year.

No offense, but you're doing it too. It's like mass psychosis. This is not his second year as a starter, it's his third year as a starter. And he had a year and a half to acclimate to the NFL before becoming the starter in 2006. He's had a much better situation than many young QBs....he wasn't forced into playing right out of the blocks with a poor team around him. He's had a tremendous amount of coaching support and tutoring; an experienced QB like Brunell who was very gracious in his mentoring of Campbell; he's been given ample opportunity to shine without the quick hook waiting for his first mistake....so no, there is no "poor Jason Campbell, look what he's had to endure" going on here.

If things had gone such as you suggest, everyone would be saying that they forced him into playing before he was ready, and that's why he hasn't progressed.

The bottom line is that there are no guarantees that a drafted QB will become a success in the NFL. The fact is, the odds are against them. For every one of them that become star players, 2 dozen crash and burn.

Generally, you'd expect to see more highlights from a franchise QB at this stage in his career.....Rothlisberger comes to mind....Rivers comes to mind....Romo....Anderson.....Palmer....and a few others.

Let's keep something in mind here.....Joe Gibbs II is only considered a success story because of 2 trips to the playoffs in 4 years. But in 2005, it was Brunell and Portis and Moss and the defense that got them there. In 2007 it was Collins. Had Campbell not been injured, the Redskins would have most likely finished under 500, and not made the playoffs in 2007. If we see that sort of thing again this year......meaning 7 games without a TD pass, Campbell is DONE. He will be just another Boller, or Grossman who's respective teams just didn't know when to say when.

Totally agree with you.

For now though, let´s give him at least until week 8 of the regular season before we (the fans) crucify him.

If he underperforms this season, I´ll be the first one to copy/paste your posts this time next year.

In my book, underperform means ending below and 80.0 rating and missing the playoffs.

[thrasher]

Its almost like Campbell is the perpetual rookie

No offense, but you're doing it too. It's like mass psychosis. This is not his second year as a starter, it's his third year as a starter. And he had a year and a half to acclimate to the NFL before becoming the starter in 2006. He's had a much better situation than many young QBs....he wasn't forced into playing right out of the blocks with a poor team around him. He's had a tremendous amount of coaching support and tutoring; an experienced QB like Brunell who was very gracious in his mentoring of Campbell; he's been given ample opportunity to shine without the quick hook waiting for his first mistake....so no, there is no "poor Jason Campbell, look what he's had to endure" going on here.

If things had gone such as you suggest, everyone would be saying that they forced him into playing before he was ready, and that's why he hasn't progressed.

The bottom line is that there are no guarantees that a drafted QB will become a success in the NFL. The fact is, the odds are against them. For every one of them that become star players, 2 dozen crash and burn.

Generally, you'd expect to see more highlights from a franchise QB at this stage in his career.....Rothlisberger comes to mind....Rivers comes to mind....Romo....Anderson.....Palmer....and a few others.

Let's keep something in mind here.....Joe Gibbs II is only considered a success story because of 2 trips to the playoffs in 4 years. But in 2005, it was Brunell and Portis and Moss and the defense that got them there. In 2007 it was Collins. Had Campbell not been injured, the Redskins would have most likely finished under 500, and not made the playoffs in 2007. If we see that sort of thing again this year......meaning 7 games without a TD pass, Campbell is DONE. He will be just another Boller, or Grossman who's respective teams just didn't know when to say when.

RAY you got to post your accurate analysis of JC on ES. Please do. I want to see the fireworks. Also throw in your two cent on CB5 to please. I need the entertainment . Plus its true. Let us know when you do.

[Hoss]

Welcome to the site thrasher. If you haven't already done so, please read the site rules here and also check out the main site.


Thanks, enjoy and happy posting.

[jmooney]

Both Quarterbacks ( Campbell and Brennan) are getting their best opportunity to become whatever it is they are going to be. Zorn made a quarterback out of Hasselbeck and I gotta believe he had less raw talent to work with than the QB's he currently has at his disposal. I agree though, its time for JC to get it done, new system or not! That doesnt mean Im rooting for Brennan to take his spot, he's simply not ready and maybe never will be, who knows?