Does anyone know french?

[UK Skins Fan]

Bigot!

[Redskin in Canada]

Okay, so it seems that we're all agreed: Every generalization is always wrong.

Except for the few ones that are actually always right.

[skinsfan#33]

Your friend sounds like one tuff Frog, but just a little hint; linking a Frenchman to the Air Force does nothing to make him more macho, in fact it does just the opposite. I mean, I hold the Coast Guard in much higher reguard than the Air Force. As far as maleness goes you have the USMC first, USN second, then the Army and USCG (yes, I know their DoT and DoD), and then ............ the Air Force or maybe the Eagle Scouts!

This thread is not about speaking French. It is about -generalisations-. Forgive me if I do not share the view that EVERY Marine is more of a man than a Navy man who is more than a man then an Army man and then ... You get the picture.

The Air Forces of the world have different kinds of guys in different positions. There are highly decorated Air Force pilots whose accomplishments and courage on and off the battlefield can not be matched by many Marines (just to take an example).

Surely if you are a Marine or a former Marine (and there are several in this board) you feel differently out of pride and knowledge of what was going around you. But -generalisations- do not fly with me. They tend to reflect biases and sometimes even prejudices.

Why would a Naval intelligence officer who infiltrates and operates -alone- on enemy-held territory be less of a courageous man than a Marine on the battlefield?

Why would a bombing raid through a Firewall (the original one) in Vietnam take less courage than a Naval officer under the protection of his Aircraft Carrier and the Battle group that goes with it? Just asking...

I am not taking away -anything- from one part of the armed forces in favour of another. I am proud to have known MANY Marines. I just feel that the overall characterisation is not only unfair, it is untrue.

RiC,
I am active Navy.

Here is how a general beachfront assault typically goes.
The Seals (and other special force) take out specific targets that have to be nuetralized first.
That Marines land (brought by the Navy under the cover of Ship and aircraft fire from Navy ships and aircraft). The Marines secure the beachfront.
The Army comes and secures the area (if it is a massive invasion like Normandy then the USMC and Army get there at the same time)
And once, all of the area is relatively safe and the Navy CBs and Army core of engineers have built a runway the Airfirce finally shows up!

That senario is a little dates, since now that Airforce can bomb all the way from Guam and Montana.

The statement was a generalization about the over all "manlyness" of a particular branch of service, and in that respect the Air Force is greatly lagging!

Navy and Marine Corps Pilots usally take on the hairest of targets as well.

[Redskin in Canada]

Here is how a general beachfront assault typically goes ...

That senario is a little dated, since now that Airforce can bomb all the way from Guam and Montana ...

There are very old and traditional scenarios that fit the above but not anymore. Not in Iraq, -twice-. Precisely due to your second point you make above. Actually, Air Force has been -first- recently. Air Force takes strategic targets and establishes complete air supremacy.

But even in the past, not all scenarios fit the "traditional" picture that you paint (although the "scenario" can often be traced back to several of the bloodiest battles in the XX century).

Take Vietnam. Look at this decoration and the list of recipients:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_ ... ted_States)

It does not include Air Force staff who got other decorations. Please keep in mind that there are fewer pilots than members of other armed forces.

The statement was a generalization about the over all "manlyness" of a particular branch of service, and in that respect the Air Force is greatly lagging!

Navy and Marine Corps Pilots usally take on the hairest of targets as well.

I am aware of the general feeling among the armed forces. I am not Air Force. I only have known some of them mainly in the US and Canada but also in a few other countries. They come in every kind.

[DESkins]

Personally, I like the Air Force's way of doing things (as a former enlisted man in the Army), because they send their officers up to get shot at!

[jazzskins]

Personally, I like the Air Force's way of doing things (as a former enlisted man in the Army), because they send their officers up to get shot at!

Hooah!

[skinsfan#33]

There are very old and traditional scenarios that fit the above but not anymore. Not in Iraq, -twice-. Precisely due to your second point you make above. Actually, Air Force has been -first- recently. Air Force takes strategic targets and establishes complete air supremacy.

But even in the past, not all scenarios fit the "traditional" picture that you paint (although the "scenario" can often be traced back to several of the bloodiest battles in the XX century).

During Desert Storm (I was in the Persian Gulf on the USS Roosevelt) the war time senario was a mixture of old and new. The Battleships and planes (the vast majority of the bombs were delivered by USN/USMC aircraft) pounded the Iraqi forces for about a month and the Marines did do a Amphib landing in Kuwait. This was all old school. B-52s bombed from Guam and Stealth bombers delivered LASER Guided bomb (so did the F-15, F-16, F-A-18, A-6 and A-7 aircraft). But the Navy aircraft could do it day or night no matter the weather. The new toys (read Stealth) only bombed during perfect weather conditions. Often there would be an A-6 over a target, with the bomb to destroy that target, and they would not be allowed to take out the target because the it was a perfect target and the new toy would get it later.

During 9-11, it was USN aircraft flying CAP over New York City even though the aircraft carreer (the USS George Washington) was stripped down getting ready to go into the ship yards. They flew jets from Virginia Beach and mostly used the GW as a gas station. I still don't know what the branch of the Millitary who's main goal is Strategic Defense of US airspace was doing!

I have been in the Persian Gulf 3 times 91, 98, 2004 and each time we dropped bombs on Iraq.

The frist question the President usually asked when there might be a need to bomb someone is, "Where is the closest aircraft carreer?" and the Air Force, still is almost always last to the action, with the exception of a few Stealth aircraft.

Take Vietnam. Look at this decoration and the list of recipients:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_ ... ted_States)

Take a look at this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Medal_of_Honor_recipients:_Korean_War
or this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Medal_of_Honor_recipients:_Vietnam_War

and my favorite
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Medal_of_Honor_recipients:_Peacetime

there were 132 Medal of Honor decorated service men from the Korean War 3 were USAF. The Vietnam War the total was 246, 14 were USAF.

The USN total were low but Korea and Vienam aren't exactly know for their Navys!

Prior to World War II, the Medal of Honor could be awarded for actions not involving direct combat with the enemy; 193 men earned the medal in this way. ALL except seven were Sailors.

[Redskin in Canada]

Well done!

I do not take anything away from any branch of the service, which goes to prove that there are courageous men in all of them.

Interestingly, I was under the impression that Diego Garcia had been used in -three- major wars over the last decade or so by a certain branch of the armed forces not mentioned in your message. Maybe I am wrong.

By the way, how many Stealth aircraft and B52s does the Navy and USMC have?

The US Air Force is a much more specialized branch of the armed forces now. And if you ever want to be rescued from enemy held territory, chances are that a USAF PJ will pick you up. They picked up some tough Rangers in Somalia. See, for example:

http://www.pjsinnam.com/Medals/AFC/Wilkinson_AFC.htm

You may have watched the movie.

[Countertrey]

Personally, I like the Air Force's way of doing things (as a former enlisted man in the Army), because they send their officers up to get shot at!

Army officers don't get shot at?

The statement was a generalization about the over all "manlyness" of a particular branch of service, and in that respect the Air Force is greatly lagging!

During 9-11, it was USN aircraft flying CAP over New York City even though the aircraft carreer (the USS George Washington) was stripped down getting ready to go into the ship yards. They flew jets from Virginia Beach and mostly used the GW as a gas station. I still don't know what the branch of the Millitary who's main goal is Strategic Defense of US airspace was doing!

I know that Naval Air did some CAP. However, you may wish to do some fact checking regarding the rest of your statement.

I'm sorry, but, frankly, this discussion has turned into a junior high school death match. Friendly interservice debate is one thing... baselessly challenging the courage or "manliness" of an entire branch because most don't get muddy boots is quite another.

Personally, I'd like to see it stop. I spent 4 years in the Navy, and 28 years in Army service, both enlisted and commissioned, and am insulted that any service member would make such broad statements. Keeping score, by branch, of recipients of the Medal of Honor? Someone is missing the point.

When you are ready to man up, our brother Zoomies on the site might appreciate an appology.

Thank you, RIC, for your effort to introduce some reason.

And, what the heck does any of this have to do with speaking French?

[skinsfan#33]

Personally, I like the Air Force's way of doing things (as a former enlisted man in the Army), because they send their officers up to get shot at!

Army officers don't get shot at?

The statement was a generalization about the over all "manlyness" of a particular branch of service, and in that respect the Air Force is greatly lagging!

Frankly, this discussion has turned into a junior high school death match. Friendly interservice debate is one thing... baselessly challenging the courage of an entire branch because most don't get muddy boots is quite another.

Personally, I'd like to see it stop. I spent 4 years in the Navy, and 28 years in Army service, both enlisted and commissioned, and am insulted that any service member would make such broad statements. Keeping score, by branch, of recipients of the Medal of Honor? Someone is missing the point.

Thank you, RIC, for your effort to introduce some reason.

And, what the heck does any of this have to do with speaking French?

Countertrey and RiC,
I take great pride in my service and have the a great amount of respect for all of the Armed Forces. Army , Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force and Coast Guard (They are part of the armed forces to me). I like to kid around about the Air Force, because they are easy targets I know they fill an important role in the defense of this country and there are brave men in women in all services. I bust the chops of Marines most often because I am around them the most, but there is no service that I have greater respect for than the USMC. I have been in Naval Aviation for 20+ years, so that is why I like to bust the Air Forces chops too. I haven't been around the Army much so I don't pick on them.
If I have offended anyone, I am sorry, just having a little fun.

[Countertrey]

Smilies, bro.

Lots of them.

[Redskin in Canada]

I personally feel that the Cup in this forum is the Cupiest Cup of all Cups among all the Cups which ever posted in this board.

Who needs manliness?

[Countertrey]

A cup, without a sentient mind, is just a vessel.

[Redskin in Canada]

A cup, without a sentient mind, is just a vessel.

OUCH!!!

[Irn-Bru]

. . .the cup than which none greater can be conceived?

[Englands Team]

But what about the French.

[Countertrey]

But what about the French.

Well, they have their cheese. I'm sure they're happy.

[welch]

But what about the French. Laughing

Well, they've stolen the name of "french fries", which were invented in Belgium as "frites".

And a million idiots believe that the French invented "French toast", taking the honor away from an English colonist named "French", who ran a tavern outside Albany in the 1720's. It was "French's toast" originally.

Theft!!!

[Englands Team]

Im going to France for my holidays this year.

Staying by the DDay beaches.

Hope they remember why they still speak French and not German.

[UK Skins Fan]

Im going to France for my holidays this year.

Staying by the DDay beaches.

Hope they remember why they still speak French and not German.

You're going to France? Are you going to accept their surrender?

[Englands Team]

I am going to accept their wine, beer and I quite like baguettes.




Did you get tickets for Wembley. HAve you seen how much they are being sold on Ebay for. Outrageous.

[Countertrey]

Im going to France for my holidays this year.

Staying by the DDay beaches.

Hope they remember why they still speak French and not German.

You're going to France? Are you going to accept their surrender?

That's rediculous...


They only surrender when you raise your voice.

[Redskin in Canada]

But what about the French. Laughing

Well, they've stolen the name of "french fries", which were invented in Belgium as "frites".

And a million idiots believe that the French invented "French toast", taking the honor away from an English colonist named "French", who ran a tavern outside Albany in the 1720's. It was "French's toast" originally.

Theft!!!

Actually, the name "French Fries" does not exist in the French language (in any of its existing versions in North-America, Africa and Europe) or any other language that I know of with the exception of English, US and Canadian English to be precise.

Along the same line, the name "French Toast" does not exist in the French language (in any of its existing versions in North-America, Africa and Europe) or any other language that I know of with the exception of English, USA and Canadian English to be precise.

So, if this is theft, and it probably is, somebody in the USA stole the name of French to put a name on something the French people themselves do not eat as part of a French diet in any region of France.

Let us be fair. If some US guy invents the name French Fries or French Toast, it is fine but the French have -nothing- to do with it.

By the way, while some who have visited France like the food, please watch the recent movie by Russell Crowe "A Good Year" for a good bunch of reasons why many English and Americans fall in love with more than that.

[UK Skins Fan]

I am going to accept their wine, beer and I quite like baguettes.




Did you get tickets for Wembley. HAve you seen how much they are being sold on Ebay for. Outrageous.

I certainly did - I'll be there, cheering for the Dolphins. Well OK, I won't actually be cheering for them, but I'll be wanting the Giants to lose, just like every week.

[UK Skins Fan]

But what about the French. Laughing

Well, they've stolen the name of "french fries", which were invented in Belgium as "frites".

And a million idiots believe that the French invented "French toast", taking the honor away from an English colonist named "French", who ran a tavern outside Albany in the 1720's. It was "French's toast" originally.

Theft!!!

Actually, the name "French Fries" does not exist in the French language (in any of its existing versions in North-America, Africa and Europe) or any other language that I know of with the exception of English, US and Canadian English to be precise.

Along the same line, the name "French Toast" does not exist in the French language (in any of its existing versions in North-America, Africa and Europe) or any other language that I know of with the exception of English, USA and Canadian English to be precise.

So, if this is theft, and it probably is, somebody in the USA stole the name of French to put a name on something the French people themselves do not eat as part of a French diet in any region of France.

Let us be fair. If some US guy invents the name French Fries or French Toast, it is fine but the French have -nothing- to do with it.

By the way, while some who have visited France like the food, please watch the recent movie by Russell Crowe "A Good Year" for a good bunch of reasons why many English and Americans fall in love with more than that.

Would you mind awfully if I asked you not to bring reason into this - I'm enjoying wallowing in my own bigotry here.