Draft Calvin Johnson??

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:32 pm

IMO the Redskins will either be able to draft a top defensive lineman or a top WR at their spot in the draft, and also IMO, those are the two biggest needs we have.

Getting an awesome player at either position will do more for us than any other move we could make.

Redskins Rule · Post by **Redskins Rule** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:36 pm

die cowboys die wrote:if calvin johnson is the most outstanding athlete in the draft, a potential superstar or at least star, you don't pass on him just to fill a position of "need" with a substantially lesser athlete. you put the most talent possible on the field and let them make plays and change the game for you.

the saints already had a great RB in deuce mcallister when reggie bush fell to them at #2 last year. did they give up a game-changing player just to fill a position of need with an average player?

that has worked out very well for them, hasn't it?

i think the only question about drafting johnson is whether he is really as good as the hype. if he is, you don't hesitate to draft him.

he sure seems like it to me, though i'm obviously no expert.

I don't think Calvin Johnson is all that! I watched a full game of his about halfway into the season and the corner that was covering him locked him down for the whole game! I can't remember who they were playing, but it doesn't matter. That guy locked him down and if a college corner can lock him down a pro corner can to........Its a waste of a pick if you ask me.

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:37 pm

We want Calvin!! We want Calvin !! We want Calvin!!!

sch1977 · Post by **sch1977** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 7:55 pm

HEROHAMO wrote:We want Calvin!! We want Calvin !! We want Calvin!!!

No we don't!! :wink:

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:24 pm

sch1977 wrote:
HEROHAMO wrote:We want Calvin!! We want Calvin !! We want Calvin!!!

No we don't!!

No... We Don't (no wink)

JPM36 · Post by **JPM36** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:55 pm

I definitely, definitely do not want Calvin. That would be a terrible move.

Of course he isn't going to be there anyways so it doesn't matter.

USAFSkinFan · Post by **USAFSkinFan** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 10:10 am

As far as I'm concerned no position is safe on this team... this is their only impact pick since they don't pick again until the 5th round... if they don't trade down they just have to take the best guy on the board, offense or defense...

JPM36 · Post by **JPM36** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 12:06 pm

USAFSkinFan wrote:As far as I'm concerned no position is safe on this team... this is their only impact pick since they don't pick again until the 5th round... if they don't trade down they just have to take the best guy on the board, offense or defense...

I understand where you are coming from but how can you possibly justify taking a WR when we are already paying top dollar to Moss, Lloyd, and Randle-El, and Patten, and have one of the best pass catching TEs in the NFC in Cool

ey.

Now we use our only high draft pick to add yet another receiver into the mix and pay him a huge salary? The only person dumb enough to do that is Matt Millen.

I think it would be crazy to use our only first day draft choice to add another WR to a team full of them and pass on young DL players like Branch, Anderson, and/or Adams when we have a GLARING need at defensive line as evidenced by our 32nd ranked rush defense.

It's all a moot point anyway. Johnson will be gone by the time we pick and I'm sure that our FO isn't even considering him. I think he is a good player, he just makes no sense for us.

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:11 am

1niksder wrote:
sch1977 wrote:
HEROHAMO wrote:We want Calvin!! We want Calvin !! We want Calvin!!!

No we don't!!

No... We Don't (no wink)

Why not? Why draft bums like Gaines adams. He aint that good. Who else Alan Branch? He isnt that great either. Who is available that u can truly say is worthy of a number six pick and will really help us next year? Look at what happened to the Texans the got Mario Williams and got Screwed in the process. The guy did next to nothing. Calvin Johnson is one of a kind talent we cant pass this oppurtunitie up. Can u think of any Defensive lineman who was drafted this year who really made a difference on their respective teams? NOt really huh. Only way we should take defensive player in first round is,we trade down for two additional picks. Other than that I think it is vital for us to pick this guy up. Think of the Possibilities with a stud like that on our squad. Moss will be open more often so will Lloyd. The opposing defenses will not know what to do. Evinvision it people wake up . Calvin is the Truth. The truth shall set you free. Amen... [-o<

sch1977 · Post by **sch1977** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 11:09 am

HEROHAMO wrote:
1niksder wrote:
sch1977 wrote:
HEROHAMO wrote:We want Calvin!! We want Calvin !! We want Calvin!!!

No we don't!!

No... We Don't (no wink)
Why not? Why draft bums like Gaines adams. He aint that good. Who else Alan Branch? He isnt that great either. Who is available that u can truly say is worthy of a number six pick and will really help us next year? Look at what happened to the Texans the got Mario Williams and got Screwed in the process. The guy did next to nothing. Calvin Johnson is one of a kind talent we cant pass this oppurtunitie up. Can u think of any Defensive lineman who was drafted this year who really made a difference on their respective teams? NOt really huh. Only way we should take defensive player in first round is,we trade down for two additional picks. Other than that I think it is vital for us to pick this guy up. Think of the Possibilities with a stud like that on our squad. Moss will be open more often so will Lloyd. The opposing defenses will not know what to do. Evinvision it people wake up . Calvin is the Truth. The truth shall set you free. Amen...

Okay, then why not trade down an add extra picks in later rounds? WR is NOT a position of need, and if Calvin is as good as you seem to think-other teams will put up the farm to get him. Remember Ricky Williams? The best move we ever made in the draft!

JPM36 · Post by **JPM36** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:02 pm

Calvin Johnson is not going to be there athe #6.... Why are we talking about this?

If you think Alan Branch and Gaines Adams are bums you haven't watched Michigan or Clemson play this year. A player does not have to score TDs and be on SportsCenter to be good.

WR might be the last thing the Redskins need. Why would we use our only high pick to get another one?

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 3:35 pm

HEROHAMO wrote: Why not?

A better question is WHY.

Why spend the #6 pick on a guy that's going to be your #2 WR at best, who'll still need to get his timing down with a young QB while he adjust to the NFL speed?

HEROHAMO wrote: Why draft bums like Gaines adams. He aint that good. Who else Alan Branch? He isnt that great either. Who is available that u can truly say is worthy of a number six pick and will really help us next year?

Gaines isn't a bum and neither is Branch, Gaines would better fill a postiton of need better than Branch because he's a DE which is a postition that the team needs to upgrade, unlike WR where you have a clear #1 and plenty of depth. Jamaal Anderson out of Arkansas would be the pick at #6 if the team stayed at six.

HEROHAMO wrote:Look at what happened to the Texans the got Mario Williams and got Screwed in the process. The guy did next to nothing.

Williams isn't Gaines, Branch or Anderson and we aren't the Texans

HEROHAMO wrote:Calvin Johnson is one of a kind talent we cant pass this oppurtunitie up.

If he's that good I'm sure Atlanta and Tampa (who both are in bigger need of a wideout than the Skins) feel the same way. Mel Kiper has him as the top pick in the draft and knowing Matt the Lion King, CJ will be gone by the time the Skins are on the clock

HEROHAMO wrote:Can u think of any Defensive lineman who was drafted this year who really made a difference on their respective teams? NOt really huh.

Haloti Ngata had a pretty good year in B-more, Manny Lawson had even a better year,but if you just need a name I'd say Tamba Hali who had 58 tackles and 8 sacks he also forced 5 fumbles and he was a second rounder

HEROHAMO wrote:Only way we should take defensive player in first round is,we trade down for two additional picks. Other than that I think it is vital for us to pick this guy up.

The only reason we should pick Johnson is if Gaines Adams, Alan Branch, Quentin Moses, Patrick Willis, Jamaal Anderson and LaMarr Woodley are all off the board. Considering that's six player and we pick sixth I see no reason not to go defense at number six. Trading down would'nt be a bad option if we can get the right trade partner

HEROHAMO wrote:Think of the Possibilities with a stud like that on our squad. Moss will be open more often so will Lloyd. The opposing defenses will not know what to do.

I agree with all of this... Moss and Lloyd would be open because they would be on one sideline and the opposing defenses would be on the other sideline (bored wondering what to do) while our defense would be on the field having the clock run out on them week in and week out because of no present on the d-line

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 12:23 am

If there was a true defensive stud available at number six I would take him in a heartbeat. I just dont think the talent on the defensive side is that good coming out this year. Obviously we only have one pick in the first day or until the 5th round. My thinking is we take the best possible player who is available. We are not the Texans but my point is the same thing that happened to the Texans can happen to us. Anyhow its all a matter of opinion obviously if we go defense I would go with Anderson from Arkansas but I still dont think hes worth a number six pick. My pick still goes to Calvin if available. I am hoping on this. IF we go defense I hope I am wrong and the guy we draft is the next coming of Reggie WHite.

PulpExposure · Post by **PulpExposure** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:32 pm

HeroHamo, how much money do you want tied up in the WR position? I mean, we've already got a substantial amount in Moss, Randle-El, and Lloyd. Now you want to toss in the contract that a #6 pick would get?

That's just stupid management. You'd have someone with a mega-contract playing as the #3rd AND someone playing as the #4th wide receiver.

We don't have enough cap room to sign a DE and a CB of any talent, so the smart move would be to get one from FA, and one from the draft. If we go the CJ route, we leave a gaping hole at one of those positions.

We'd end up significantly weakening our overall team, even if you think CJ can step in and outperform one of the WR vets he'd replace.

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:10 pm

PulpExposure wrote:HeroHamo, how much money do you want tied up in the WR position? I mean, we've already got a substantial amount in Moss, Randle-El, and Lloyd. Now you want to toss in the contract that a #6 pick would get?

"the Danny" has been known to have a $100M payroll, how about a $100M receiving corps.

PulpExposure wrote:That's just stupid management. You'd have someone with a mega-contract playing as the #3rd AND someone playing as the #4th wide receiver.

With no depth on the O-line any injury will result in the Redskins going to max protect and #3 and #4 won't even see the feild.
Just another reason why Johnson would be a bad move.

PulpExposure wrote:We don't have enough cap room to sign a DE and a CB of any talent, so the smart move would be to get one from FA, and one from the draft. If we go the CJ route, we leave a gaping hole at one of those positions.

We'd end up significantly weakening our overall team, even if you think CJ can step in and outperform one of the WR vets he'd replace.

The cap space won't be a problem after restuctures and cuts, but the pick at #6 of any WR just wouldn't make a lot of sense (and not limited to the reasons you and other's have pointed out). He'll learn a new system while trying to fit into a group that still learning each other. Drafting Johnson would mean we passed on a position of need and/or missed out on a chance to move down and get more picks

JPM36 · Post by **JPM36** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 4:00 pm

PulpExposure wrote:HeroHamo, how much money do you want tied up in the WR position? I mean, we've already got a substantial amount in Moss, Randle-El, and Lloyd. Now you want to toss in the contract that a #6 pick would get?

That's just stupid management. You'd have someone with a mega-contract playing as the #3rd AND someone playing as the #4th wide receiver.

We don't have enough cap room to sign a DE and a CB of any talent, so the smart move would be to get one from FA, and one from the draft. If we go the CJ route, we leave a gaping hole at one of those positions.

We'd end up significantly weakening our overall team, even if you think CJ can step in and outperform one of the WR vets he'd replace.

I said this earlier. WR really is just about the last thing we need.

I also think it's ridiculous to not draft a DL just because Mario Williams was somewhat disappointing this year. What does Mario Williams have to do with how Alan Branch or Jamaal Anderson do? It's also a little early to be calling Mario a bust. I think he's 22 years old.

A few years ago the Panthers took Julius Peppers 2nd overall. That worked out pretty well for them.

And for the 100th time, Calvin Johnson isn't going to be there at #6 anyways....

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:25 pm

PulpExposure wrote:HeroHamo, how much money do you want tied up in the WR position? I mean, we've already got a substantial amount in Moss, Randle-El, and Lloyd. Now you want to toss in the contract that a #6 pick would get?

That's just stupid management. You'd have someone with a mega-contract playing as the #3rd AND someone playing as the #4th wide receiver.

We don't have enough cap room to sign a DE and a CB of any talent, so the smart move would be to get one from FA, and one from the draft. If we go the CJ route, we leave a gaping hole at one of those positions.

We'd end up significantly weakening our overall team, even if you think CJ can step in and outperform one of the WR vets he'd replace.

I know it dosent make any sense at all,to even consider drafting Calvin J., We have money tied up in our number 1,2, and 3 receiver. Bad management has already been happening even before this draft. CJ probably wont be available at number six is most likely true. I just think this kid is special. Normally I would go defense, I am a defensive minded guy. I just think this kid could be the chosen one to bring back the skins to prominence. I would even consider trading awaying B. Lloyd or Randle El to Tampa to trade spots and keep our pick. Id trade them both to get CJ with stipulations that Tampa help pick up most of there salarys or any other team who is interested. Yes I believe in CJ Ive seen him play live he is that good. My best hoped for scenerio would be we trade one of our receivers or both are receivers need be, To gain one of the top four picks as well as a fourth rounder. I really think we need to make drastic moves to improve next year. There are a number of possibilities out there to obtain additional picks and getting favorable circumstances. THat is what D. Snyder pays our GM for. He just has to use some creativity and some buisness skills. IT can be done I am just hoping our G.M. can come through for us. It wont be easy but stranger things have happened before.

PulpExposure · Post by **PulpExposure** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 10:39 pm

HEROHAMO wrote:[THat is what D. Snyder pays our GM for. He just has to use some creativity and some buisness skills. IT can be done I am just hoping our G.M. can come through for us.

Unfortunately, we don't really HAVE a GM

HEROHAMO · Post by **HEROHAMO** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:39 am

PulpExposure wrote:
HEROHAMO wrote:[THat is what D. Snyder pays our GM for. He just has to use some creativity and some buisness skills. IT can be done I am just hoping our G.M. can come through for us.

Unfortunately, we don't really HAVE a GM

True maybe Gibbs can bring in a consultant. Heck D snyder is heck of a buisness man why doesent he use some of his buisness saavy towards the draft. Have Gibbs evaluate the talent give snyder all the possible prospects. Let snyder go to work with his saavy.

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 3:05 am

HEROHAMO wrote:
PulpExposure wrote:
HEROHAMO wrote:[THat is what D. Snyder pays our GM for. He just has to use some creativity and some buisness skills. IT can be done I am just hoping our G.M. can come through for us.

Unfortunately, we don't really HAVE a GM
True maybe Gibbs can bring in a consultant. Heck D snyder is heck of a buisness man why doesent he use some of his buisness saavy towards the draft. Have Gibbs evaluate the talent give snyder all the possible prospects. Let snyder go to work with his saavy.

Throw Vinny C. in the mix and that's about how it works now :cry:

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 10:47 am

Question, as I'm not sure how this works.

If we were to trade Lloyd, does the other team assume his contract so we don't take a cap hit? What, if any, would be the cap implications for a move like this?

I think Patten will be gone. I really like Moss, El and can't say enough about Thrash and Cool

ey. Add Johnson to the mix as a #2, and damn, that sounds sweet!

I know, I know... we need defensive help, and I like J. Anderson with our #6 pick. But I can't help it, that set of receivers still sounds sweet and I'm not sold on Lloyd.

I think the Colts have shown us that a great QB and a great set of receivers can offset a lousy defense. I know they haven't yet won a SB, but their win-loss ratio of the past few years offers some credence to this perspective.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 10:58 am

SkinsFreak wrote:Question, as I'm not sure how this works.

If we were to trade Lloyd, does the other team assume his contract so we don't take a cap hit? What, if any, would be the cap implications for a move like this?

I think Patten will be gone. I really like Moss, El and can't say enough about Thrash and ey. Add Johnson to the mix as a #2, and damn, that sounds sweet!

I know, I know... we need defensive help, and I like J. Anderson with our #6 pick. But I can't help it, that set of receivers still sounds sweet and I'm not sold on Lloyd.

I think the Colts have shown us that a great QB and a great set of receivers can offset a lousy defense. I know they haven't yet won a SB, but their win-loss ratio of the past few years offers some credence to this perspective.

If we trade Lloyd, they take the cap hit for his future salary. The bonus(s) we already paid him though hit our cap immediately (this year and/or next depending on the exact date).

But why would we want to trade Lloyd?

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 11:54 am

KazooSkinsFan wrote:But why would we want to trade Lloyd?

I'm not saying we would. Just wanted to know the implications.

I'm just not sold on Lloyd, on the field OR in the locker room. Listen to what Portis had to say about Lloyd in his interview on the John Thompson show. I believe Portis to be right.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:08 pm

SkinsFreak wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:But why would we want to trade Lloyd?

I'm not saying we would. Just wanted to know the implications.

I'm just not sold on Lloyd, on the field OR in the locker room. Listen to what Portis had to say about Lloyd in his interview on the John Thompson show. I believe Portis to be right.

Sounds like we're not disagreeing. I'm not sold on Lloyd either. So far we had MB who couldn't throw past the line of scrimmage. JC was great, but young QBs are unlikely to go to their third or fourth option in the 2-3 seconds they have to throw the ball. He made some nice moves. But I do expect more next year or I will start to doubt.

Houligan26 · Post by **Houligan26** » Mon Feb 12, 2007 12:01 pm

I am sorry but can someone inform me what Portis said about Lloyd on the Thompson show????