The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

SnyderSucks wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

SnyderSucks wrote:Okay, because the people involved had the good sense not to come out and say "I don't want to work for Dan Snyder", one cannot infer that his ownership played a role in not creating an environment in which coaches want to work? You have multiple coaches withdrawing from consideration and Snyder played no role in this? When you have multiple people turning down a promotion, it is reasonable to infer that they don't want to work there and that the boss is probably playing a role in them not wanting the job. I guess, after interviewing, each of them decided they didn't want a promotion and a massive raise because they thought working for Snyder would be too much fun.

Or, after the interview, Snyder/Cerrato told them that they weren't in serious contention to be the next head coach of the Redskins. I mean, that's the problem; you don't know what happened behind closed doors (and neither do I)...but you're stating as if it's established fact that the reason that "top coaching candidates" won't come here is because of Snyder. You don't know that; you think it, but you can't be sure. All we get is little bits of media dribble, and importantly, none of it is from Snyder's side (as he doesn't talk to the press much)...so it's presenting a lopsided story.

Sorry for using a quote from that rag the Washington Post. I guess next time I'll find a quote from a paper with some credibility like the National Enquirer.

Now you're just being petulant. It's not the Post; it that it was from La Canfora and his silly Redskins Insider blog, which was rife with his sniping and inaccuracies.

Because you don't think Gardner should have gotten a contract, none of them should have? The problem isn't that one in particular didn't get a contract, it was that none of them did.

Who would you have given a contract to, from the Redskins drafts of 2004-2005?

I said you could argue the case about Gardner (for or against) not that they absolutely should have signed him. He was more productive than any #2 the team has had since then.

His production was okay (it's about Randle-El production), but that says more about the sorry state of the Redskins WR corps, than it does about Gardner. But also, Gardner dropped many, many passes...he was just too damn inconsistent. Again, after Gardner left the Redskins, he caught a total of 15 NFL passes.

In the end, the only constant on the team since Snyder took over is Snyder. In that time, no one, not even a hall of fame coach, has succeeded in making the team consistently good. I guess Snyder played no part in any of that.

Never would argue against any of that. This team was a disaster when he took over, and continued to be a disaster until he hired Gibbs. However, since 2004, the management has been markedly better (better player personnel acquisitions, better drafting (when they keep their draft picks), and less public exposure of the ownership). There's absolutely been improvement; granted, there was a LOT of room for improvement. But many people are stuck on the idea that Snyder is a terrible owner, and will always be a terrible owner. A more casual, less personally-involved observer with a more open mind would look at the evolution of Snyder as an owner over the past half decade, and conclude otherwise.

But I know I can talk all I want about how I, and many others, see improvement in him. The sad fact is that I'm still talking to someone who has chosen to call himself "SnyderSucks." After all, choosing a nickname like that is the hallmark of an open mind on this particular matter. Let's just agree to disagree.

04/05 - Obviously extenstions to Taylor and ey. Ideally, you shouldn't allow a starter to get to the last year of a contract unless you intend to let them walk, just as head coaches rarely coach on the last year of a contract. So that would mean Rogers and Campbell should have been extended as well.

Thanks for the comments - I enjoy the back and forth.

And F.Y.I., I used to be a Snyder supporter, especially for his willingness to spend whatever it takes. As time has gone on, my view has changed to believe that he does more harm than good. A big part of that change has come from work experience with people who behave the way he does and seeing the damage they do to a company.

Last I checked, the jury's out on JC still.

SkinsJock wrote:I thought that with the opening of training Camp, it would be appropriate to hear a response to the challenge?

Redskin in Canada wrote:The RECORD speaks for itself.

If we all put aside speculation and our own personal analysis, it really comes to the following:

The Redskins will continue this season with a record of mediocrity and prove the point on our side of the argument

Or ...

The Redskins will have a winning season, make the playoffs and have a good run at them. And those perennial optmists will be proven right.

I am willing to admit that I was wrong if the Skins prove me and others on our side the mistake of our interpretation. So far, we have about a decade of record to prove our point.

I challenge the posters on the opposite side of the argument to be honest enough to concede our argument if we add another mediocre season to the list.

That's it. Who is willing to accept the challenge?

The proof is on the ... RECORD.

c'mon guys - this is going to be a fantastic season - we have upgraded both lines and the QB is looking at a huge payday if he does well - let's hear some support from the faithful

No takers ... they break my heart.

I thought there would be posters capable to take a challenge on the opposite side of the argument but no. All I am challenging you to is YET ANOTHER mediocre season. I say yes. Let me know if there are any takers in the future.

SJ,

you see, theyare waiting for the END of the training camp, perhaps the preseason, perhaps YET another season, who knows. I am here. I am going nowhere. One day somebody will grow something to accept the challenge. In the meantime ...

VetSkinsFan wrote:Sorry, SJ, haven't you figured out that we're doomed? I mean, look at our roster. The most sought after defensive player in the game to head up with a guy who has the most tackles this DECADE, along with the best blocking RB in the game. I mean, just at those three positions ALONE, we're doomed...

No Vet, nobody is taking away the many positives this team has. Nobody has argued that we are doomed to utter failure. Here you have it:

I predict that the season will NOT be an utter disaster.

The challenge is different:

I predict YET ANOTHER -mediocre- season.

In other words, the many positives are unfortunately balanced enough by the old, questionable and injury prone to make it even at about close to 8 - 8 and one of the last two spots in the NFC East.

A fan is no less of a fan if he attempts to create what in his mind are realistic expectations. Those expectations can be different from fan to fan but overall, I stand by my prediction.

It might be interesting to see IF they bring Michael Vick though. There are many ramifications (positive and negative) from that potential move. Do I believe that such amove would be a masterful marketing ploy from the Danny? Of course! Would it work? What a gamble with the future of the entire team!

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:I thought that with the opening of training Camp, it would be appropriate to hear a response to the challenge?

Redskin in Canada wrote:The RECORD speaks for itself.

If we all put aside speculation and our own personal analysis, it really comes to the following:

The Redskins will continue this season with a record of mediocrity and prove the point on our side of the argument

Or ...

The Redskins will have a winning season, make the playoffs and have a good run at them. And those perennial optmists will be proven right.

I am willing to admit that I was wrong if the Skins prove me and others on our side the mistake of our interpretation. So far, we have about a decade of record to prove our point.

I challenge the posters on the opposite side of the argument to be honest enough to concede our argument if we add another mediocre season to the list.

That's it. Who is willing to accept the challenge?

The proof is on the ... RECORD.

c'mon guys - this is going to be a fantastic season - we have upgraded both lines and the QB is looking at a huge payday if he does well - let's hear some support from the faithful

No takers ... they break my heart.

I thought there would be posters capable to take a challenge on the opposite side of the argument but no. All I am challenging you to is YET ANOTHER mediocre season. I say yes. Let me know if there are any takers in the future.

SJ,

you see, theyare waiting for the END of the training camp, perhaps the preseason, perhaps YET another season, who knows. I am here. I am going nowhere. One day somebody will grow something to accept the challenge. In the meantime ...

I more than accepted the challenge a dozen pages ago. In fact, I accepted the challenge before you made it. I hognosticated the Skins would win the NFC East this season in another thread, over a month ago. But I more specifically repeated the prediction in this thread to answer your challenge. So .

Deadskins wrote:I more than accepted the challenge a dozen pages ago. In fact, I accepted the challenge before you made it. I hognosticated the Skins would win the NFC East this season in another thread, over a month ago. But I more specifically repeated the prediction in this thread to answer your challenge. So .

So, I take it that you have not only disagreed with my prediction BUT you have accepted the consequences and the price in case you arewrong. In other words, the FULL thing. Right?

So that we are clear. This is not a Hognostication. It is not only about the the final result in the standings. It is about acknowledgement of the root causes for the final result.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

Deadskins wrote:I more than accepted the challenge a dozen pages ago. In fact, I accepted the challenge before you made it. I hognosticated the Skins would win the NFC East this season in another thread, over a month ago. But I more specifically repeated the prediction in this thread to answer your challenge. So .

So, I take it that you have not only disagreed with my prediction BUT you have accepted the consequences and the price in case you arewrong. In other words, the FULL thing. Right?

So that we are clear. This is not a Hognostication. It is not only about the the final result in the standings. It is about acknowledgement of the root causes for the final result.

So if they finish 8-8 and in the bottom half of the division, I have to say it's all The Danny's fault, even if I don't really believe that? I guess I can live with that.

Redskin in Canada wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:I thought that with the opening of training Camp, it would be appropriate to hear a response to the challenge?

Redskin in Canada wrote:The RECORD speaks for itself.

If we all put aside speculation and our own personal analysis, it really comes to the following:

The Redskins will continue this season with a record of mediocrity and prove the point on our side of the argument

Or ...

The Redskins will have a winning season, make the playoffs and have a good run at them. And those perennial optmists will be proven right.

I am willing to admit that I was wrong if the Skins prove me and others on our side the mistake of our interpretation. So far, we have about a decade of record to prove our point.

I challenge the posters on the opposite side of the argument to be honest enough to concede our argument if we add another mediocre season to the list.

That's it. Who is willing to accept the challenge?

The proof is on the ... RECORD.

c'mon guys - this is going to be a fantastic season - we have upgraded both lines and the QB is looking at a huge payday if he does well - let's hear some support from the faithful

No takers ... they break my heart.

I thought there would be posters capable to take a challenge on the opposite side of the argument but no. All I am challenging you to is YET ANOTHER mediocre season. I say yes. Let me know if there are any takers in the future.

Speaking for myself, it's useless to even try to debate this with you, as you've clearly already made up your mind and your obstinance on this issue is well known.

I may just as well try to convince my 3 year old that Buzz Lightyear isn't a real person. It'd have the same result.

SnyderSucks wrote: And F.Y.I., I used to be a Snyder supporter, especially for his willingness to spend whatever it takes. As time has gone on, my view has changed to believe that he does more harm than good. A big part of that change has come from work experience with people who behave the way he does and seeing the damage they do to a company.

oh! well spoken and articulated

so many of us that are now perceived as being completely out of touch (see! we of the 'dark side' also can use hyperbole ) also feel the same - just not for the same reason



we would be better off without the guys who have been participating in the decision making - that is a fact - we, for sure would not have as bad a record

PulpExposure wrote:Speaking for myself, it's useless to even try to debate this with you, as you've clearly already made up your mind and your obstinance on this issue is well known.

I may just as well try to convince my 3 year old that Buzz Lightyear isn't a real person. It'd have the same result.

I'm not sure that this was an offer to 'debate' Pulp - this is about the possibility for our team's success - it really comes down to a question of whether you really feel that we have a good chance to have a winning season, make the playoffs and win 1 playoff game - that will "prove" that the prediction for another mediocre season because of who is in charge here is completely without any merit.

just come right out and say that you think we who predict another medioce season are wrong or not - we are done with all the 'debating' here

this is not about anyone being obstinate or trying to convince 3 year olds of anything other than the fact that this team deserve's better guys in charge here

SkinsJock wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:Speaking for myself, it's useless to even try to debate this with you, as you've clearly already made up your mind and your obstinance on this issue is well known.

I may just as well try to convince my 3 year old that Buzz Lightyear isn't a real person. It'd have the same result.

I'm not sure that this was an offer to 'debate' Pulp - this is about the possibility for our team's success - it really comes down to a question of whether you really feel that we have a good chance to have a winning season, make the playoffs and win 1 playoff game - that will "prove" that the prediction for another mediocre season because of who is in charge here is completely without any merit.

just come right out and say that you think we who predict another medioce season are wrong or not - we are done with all the 'debating' here

this is not about anyone being obstinate or trying to convince 3 year olds of anything other than the fact that this team deserve's better guys in charge here

I like to subscribe to this thing called reality. Pretty much, Snyder is not going anywhere. Either learn to deal with him as the owner of the Redskins, find a new team to cheer for, or spend the rest of your life with an ulcer while you complain about him unendingly. I get it. You don't like Snyder. I think I understood that after your (and when I say "your," I'm referring to not just you) first 5000 posts (and more specifically, your first 8000000219539 use of the word "bozos"). And then you (back to the collective you) press your opinion as if it's fact...when it's just what it is. Another opinion.

And lest you forget, it could always be much worse. I mean, don't you remember the pre-Snyder days? I'm not talking Gibbs I, I'm talking 1993-1998. Because I sure as hell do. We had a different owner, his name was John Kent Cooke. It was truly awful being a Redskins fan back then.

Or hell, we could get someone like William Clay Ford, who since buying the Lions in 1963 has led that team to a grand total of 1 playoff victory in 45 seasons.

On a sidebar, I just don't get this sense of entitlement some people have here. The team "deserves" a better owner? Why is that? What makes the Redskins so special that the team deserves a better owner? If you want to talk about deserving a better owner, the Niners are way ahead of us on that list...

Never mind me. The unrelenting negativity here from some posters is really frustrating. I just can't imagine being the fan of a team that causes so much anger and frustration. It's masochistic imho.

SkinsJock wrote:we would be better off without the guys who have been participating in the decision making - that is a fact - we, for sure would not have as bad a record

Seeing as our record with the previous ownership (John Kent Cooke) was actually worse, I don't see how you can make that claim.

PulpExposure wrote:

SkinsJock* wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:Speaking for myself, it's useless to even try to debate this with you, as you've clearly already made up your mind and your obstinance on this issue is well known.

I may just as well try to convince my 3 year old that Buzz Lightyear isn't a real person. It'd have the same result.

I'm not sure that this was an offer to 'debate' Pulp - this is about the possibility for our team's success - it really comes down to a question of whether you really feel that we have a good chance to have a winning season, make the playoffs and win 1 playoff game - that will "prove" that the prediction for another mediocre season because of who is in charge here is completely without any merit.

just come right out and say that you think we who predict another medioce season are wrong or not - we are done with all the 'debating' here

this is not about anyone being obstinate or trying to convince 3 year olds of anything other than the fact that this team deserve's better guys in charge here

I like to subscribe to this thing called reality. Pretty much, Snyder is not going anywhere. Either learn to deal with him as the owner of the Redskins, find a new team to cheer for, or spend the rest of your life with an ulcer while you complain about him unendingly. I get it. You don't like Snyder. I think I understood that after your (and when I say "your," I'm referring to not just you) first 5000 posts (and more specifically, your first 8000000219539 use of the word "bozos"). And then you (back to the collective you) press your opinion as if it's fact...when it's just what it is. Another opinion.

And lest you forget, it could always be much worse. I mean, don't you remember the pre-Snyder days? I'm not talking Gibbs I, I'm talking 1993-1998. Because I sure as hell do. We had a different owner, his name was John Kent Cooke. It was truly awful being a Redskins fan back then.

Or hell, we could get someone like William Clay Ford, who since buying the Lions in 1963 has led that team to a grand total of 1 playoff victory in 45 seasons.

On a sidebar, I just don't get this sense of entitlement some people have here. The team "deserves" a better owner? Why is that? What makes the Redskins so special that the team deserves a better owner? If you want to talk about deserving a better owner, the Niners are way ahead of us on that list...

Never mind me. The unrelenting negativity here from some posters is really frustrating. I just can't imagine being the fan of a team that causes so much anger and frustration. It's masochistic imho.

I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

PulpExposure wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:Speaking for myself, it's useless to even try to debate this with you, as you've clearly already made up your mind and your obstinance on this issue is well known.

I may just as well try to convince my 3 year old that Buzz Lightyear isn't a real person. It'd have the same result.

I'm not sure that this was an offer to 'debate' Pulp - this is about the possibility for our team's success - it really comes down to a question of whether you really feel that we have a good chance to have a winning season, make the playoffs and win 1 playoff game - that will "prove" that the prediction for another mediocre season because of who is in charge here is completely without any merit.

just come right out and say that you think we who predict another medioce season are wrong or not - we are done with all the 'debating' here

this is not about anyone being obstinate or trying to convince 3 year olds of anything other than the fact that this team deserve's better guys in charge here

I like to subscribe to this thing called reality. Pretty much, Snyder is not going anywhere. Either learn to deal with him as the owner of the Redskins, find a new team to cheer for, or spend the rest of your life with an ulcer while you complain about him unendingly. I get it. You don't like Snyder. I think I understood that after your (and when I say "your," I'm referring to not just you) first 5000 posts (and more specifically, your first 8000000219539 use of the word "bozos"). And then you (back to the collective you) press your opinion as if it's fact...when it's just what it is. Another opinion.

Exactly. Snyder is the owner, he isn't going anywhere. SkinsJock has also admitted, many times, that it's getting better. So while it was Gibbs that was credited for getting the ship back on course, the current path in which SJ admits is getting better is credited to Vinny. During the Gibbs 2 era, Vinny was merely a scout. So if you're frustrated, at least point that frustration in the correct direction. Prior to Zorn's hiring and Vinny's promotion, Gibbs was the man in charge. So if some don't like the mediocrity under Gibbs' leadership... blame Gibbs. Zorn lead his team to an 8-8 record in his first year, and I seriously doubt many expected much better than that. I specifically remember most predicted somewhere between a 7-9 or a 9-7 record for Zorn in his first year.

El Mexican wrote:I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

Listen, Campbell hasn't proven anything to date. In this league, to field a consistently good team, you need a franchise quarterback; look at the dominant teams of this decade, and the one thing in common is they have a top tier QB. I don't think even the most ardent Campbell defender would say he qualifies as such.

The FO was looking at the availability of Cutler (let me know the last time a 25 year old probowl QB was available), because he's pretty much a proven commodity. And they liked Sanchez...and they weren't the only ones who did.

It's now a bad thing to try to improve the most critical position on the team? Tell me what happens to this team if Campbell throws 13 TDs again this year?

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

Listen, Campbell hasn't proven anything to date. In this league, to field a consistently good team, you need a franchise quarterback; look at the dominant teams of this decade, and the one thing in common is they have a top tier QB. I don't think even the most ardent Campbell defender would say he qualifies as such.

The FO was looking at the availability of Cutler (let me know the last time a 25 year old probowl QB was available), because he's pretty much a proven commodity. And they liked Sanchez...and they weren't the only ones who did.

It's now a bad thing to try to improve the most critical position on the team? Tell me what happens to this team if Campbell throws 13 TDs again this year?

Campbell has not proven anything. Agreed.

I was refering to the fact that Snyder was seriously close to bringing another flamboyant outsider instead of giving Campbell the chance he deserves. That, to me, is the owner trying to fix things the old way instead of trying to build some consistency with your team.

I think we can all agree that this is basically JC's last year with the team if he does not produce. But to bring in yet another QB to start the season would have been even more detrimental to the team. We have seen this in the past 10 years with the 10 different QBs that have suited up for the team.

El Mexican wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

Listen, Campbell hasn't proven anything to date. In this league, to field a consistently good team, you need a franchise quarterback; look at the dominant teams of this decade, and the one thing in common is they have a top tier QB. I don't think even the most ardent Campbell defender would say he qualifies as such.

The FO was looking at the availability of Cutler (let me know the last time a 25 year old probowl QB was available), because he's pretty much a proven commodity. And they liked Sanchez...and they weren't the only ones who did.

It's now a bad thing to try to improve the most critical position on the team? Tell me what happens to this team if Campbell throws 13 TDs again this year?

Campbell has not proven anything. Agreed.

I was refering to the fact that Snyder was seriously close to bringing another flamboyant outsider instead of giving Campbell the chance he deserves. That, to me, is the owner trying to fix things the old way instead of trying to build some consistency with your team.

I think we can all agree that this is basically JC's last year with the team if he does not produce. But to bring in yet another QB to start the season would have been even more detrimental to the team. We have seen this in the past 10 years with the 10 different QBs that have suited up for the team.

Why is that? Because we really couldn't get much worse on offense than we were last year...

Listen, I generally have defended Campbell in the past, and I think that he has potential. But, I also understand that potential unrealized is a season killer. And I think that the FO was smart in exploring other options this year.

Plus, even if Campbell has a fantastic season, who knows if he's going to stay with the team next year?

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

Listen, Campbell hasn't proven anything to date. In this league, to field a consistently good team, you need a franchise quarterback; look at the dominant teams of this decade, and the one thing in common is they have a top tier QB. I don't think even the most ardent Campbell defender would say he qualifies as such.

The FO was looking at the availability of Cutler (let me know the last time a 25 year old probowl QB was available), because he's pretty much a proven commodity. And they liked Sanchez...and they weren't the only ones who did.

It's now a bad thing to try to improve the most critical position on the team? Tell me what happens to this team if Campbell throws 13 TDs again this year?

Campbell has not proven anything. Agreed.

I was refering to the fact that Snyder was seriously close to bringing another flamboyant outsider instead of giving Campbell the chance he deserves. That, to me, is the owner trying to fix things the old way instead of trying to build some consistency with your team.

I think we can all agree that this is basically JC's last year with the team if he does not produce. But to bring in yet another QB to start the season would have been even more detrimental to the team. We have seen this in the past 10 years with the 10 different QBs that have suited up for the team.

Why is that? Because we really couldn't get much worse on offense than we were last year...

Listen, I generally have defended Campbell in the past, and I think that he has potential. But, I also understand that potential unrealized is a season killer. And I think that the FO was smart in exploring other options this year.

Plus, even if Campbell has a fantastic season, who knows if he's going to stay with the team next year?

I guess we'll have an interesting season, at the very least. So many interesting stories to follow, Campbell being no.1. Go Skins!

I know I’ll get hammered for this but I’m going to say it anyway. This isn’t directed to anyone inparticular…When did this place become the place for positive or factual Redskins news?? Last time I checked this was a Redskins message board that boasted…
Talk about the Washington Redskins here. Do you bleed burgundy and gold?

Isn’t that what we are doing?? It doesn’t say talk about everything positive or only things that can be proven true about the Washington Redskins. I can’t speak for anyone else but why do I get told….”You have no way of proving that…please provide a link” Of course I don’t…it’s my opinion. I have no more way of proving it then you do of not proving it!! And forget about providing a link (I stopped that a wile ago) because (unless it’s positive) it will be ripped to shreds.
Now before you start tearing the site apart to show me example to the contrary don’t I’m not asking for them and I’m not saying it’s the norm here but it seems it is headed in that direction.

I come here to read “opinions” I enjoy and respect everyone opinions (positive and negative) I don’t see them has right or wrong they’re just opinions. Snyder topics seem to bring out the worst in us. And if you say one thing negative you’re labeled a hater. Again speaking for me…nothing could be further from the truth. In fact I agree with more things that Snyder does than I disagree with. I think I have been pretty consistent….I hate giving up picks I want the team to draft and develop more of its own players. It was so nice to watch Kelly, Thomas and Orakpo on the field. I have given the FO credit for the moves (with exception of giving up a 2nd for Taylor) in the past few years. I don’t like big FA spending on guy to become the “savior” I would rather have a guy playing for a big contract. I prefer low key right priced guys that can be plugged into the system. We have many great example of that here, I know people (and I stopped) keep bringing up the past mistakes…but in all fairness, because as many here are quick to point out…we don’t know what goes on at Redskins Park… all we have to go by ( as RIC says) is the results on the field.
I don’t complain about ticket prices at Fedex just about the way the team goes about upgrades and holding back tickets that lead to events like what happened at last years Steeler game. I have witness first hand (and have been involved) with all the great charitable work that Snyder and the team does…I wish it was covered more!!
If you get tired of hearing how much Snyder stinks than why reply…because he is going to be our owner for the foreseeable future no one can give an opinion on him??
RIC likes to throw around the “A” word, while I really don’t agree with him some of you are headed in that direction. If this post bothers you that’s because a hit dog always yelps!!
Relax guys enjoy the season!!

DEHog wrote:I know I’ll get hammered for this but I’m going to say it anyway. This isn’t directed to anyone in particular…
When did this place become the place for positive or factual Redskins news?? Last time I checked this was a Redskins message board that boasted… Talk about the Washington Redskins here. Do you bleed burgundy and gold? Isn’t that what we are doing?? It doesn’t say talk about everything positive, or, only things that can be proven true about the Washington Redskins.
I can’t speak for anyone else but why do I get told….”You have no way of proving that…please provide a link” Of course I don’t…it’s my opinion. I have no more way of proving it then you do of not proving it!! And forget about providing a link (I stopped that a while ago) because (unless it’s positive) it will be ripped to shreds.

Now before you start tearing the site apart to show me example to the contrary don’t I’m not asking for them and I’m not saying it’s the norm here but it seems it is headed in that direction.

I come here to read “opinions” I enjoy and respect everyone opinions (positive and negative) I don’t see them has right or wrong they’re just opinions.

Snyder topics seem to bring out the worst in us. And if you say one thing negative you’re labeled a hater. Again speaking for me…nothing could be further from the truth. In fact I agree with more things that Snyder does than I disagree with. I think I have been pretty consistent….I hate giving up picks I want the team to draft and develop more of its own players. It was so nice to watch Kelly, Thomas and Orakpo on the field. I have given the FO credit for the moves (with exception of giving up a 2nd for Taylor) in the past few years. I don’t like big FA spending on a guy to become the “savior” I would rather have a guy playing for a big contract. I prefer low key right priced guys that can be plugged into the system. We have many great example of that here, I know people (and I stopped) keep bringing up the past mistakes…but in all fairness, because as many here are quick to point out…we don’t know what goes on at Redskins Park… all we have to go by ( as RIC says) is the results on the field.
I don’t complain about ticket prices at Fedex just about the way the team goes about upgrades and holding back tickets that lead to events like what happened at last years Steeler game. I have witness first hand (and have been involved) with all the great charitable work that Snyder and the team does…I wish it was covered more!!

If you get tired of hearing how much Snyder stinks than why reply…because he is going to be our owner for the forseeable future no one can give an opinion on him??

RIC likes to throw around the “A” word, while I really don’t agree with him some of you are headed in that direction.

If this post bothers you that’s because a hit dog always yelps!!

Relax guys enjoy the season!!

thanks DEHog - well said

we all have our opinions and not long ago I was one that defended Snyder - I have changed my mind. I think I'm allowed to use this site to find fault with the owner and while I do not mind some guys here trying to show me that I'm mistaken there are some here that use innuendo and almost insult you to try and make their point(s). While it's tiresome it certainly is not going to make me change my feelings about the team as it pertains to the players and coaches - I am just as fanatical about this team as I was when Snyder took over. I have stated many times that Snyder does not look like he's planning on selling the team but that does not mean we cannot criticize him all we want - he might be a fine father, husband and all-round great guy but as the owner of this team, in my opinion, he leaves a lot to be desired.




If you cannot stand me refering to Cerrato and Snyder as bozos, ad infinitum, then my intent to make you a little irritated is working - cheers

I am looking forward to seeing this team become successful again, I just am not convinced that Cerrato and Snyder have changed much - I will give credit where credit is due and as far as I'm concerned I will be more than happy to acknowledge that after this season, IF this team is very good.

I think we have made progress but unfortunately I do not think that Cerrato and Snyder have what it takes to be very good at running an NFL team.

HAIL - my biggest wish this year is that we have an injury free season - so that we get an opportunity to see how good we are and what we have to do to get even better

I would like to note that this is me posting as a member, and this is no way being put out as a staff directive or anything directly or indirectly related to a moderation/staff function.

I get tired of hearing the same old crap over and over and over with no new content.

Yes, the FO has a track record of bad decisions.

Yes, Snyder has a bad track record of bad decisions.

There are a plethora of other common opinions that are being reiterated again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again with nothing new added to the conversation. That's what I'm tired of. I have to weed thru all that crap just to see if there's anything constuctive added to the topic, because I DO care about discussing topics I may have not heard about or new details to a topic I'm interested in.

As for links... I could say I heard that we're picking up Tom Brady and Matt Ryan for an even trade of Collins and Campbell. I can't fault people for wanting to discuss FOUNDED rumors as opposed to some crap that someone wants to dream up to start drama. Providing links also gives other readers context and possibly new information about a topic the poster is already familiar with. I know I've learned a lot fom links people post detailing the topic at hand. If a poster is so knowledgable, then they should share their wealth of knowledge and resources to help the Redskins community.

VetSkinsFan wrote:I would like to note that this is me posting as a member, and this is no way being put out as a staff directive or anything directly or indirectly related to a moderation/staff function.

I get tired of hearing the same old crap over and over and over with no new content.

Yes, the FO has a track record of bad decisions.

Yes, Snyder has a bad track record of bad decisions.

There are a plethora of other common opinions that are being reiterated again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again with nothing new added to the conversation. That's what I'm tired of. I have to weed thru all that crap just to see if there's anything constuctive added to the topic, because I DO care about discussing topics I may have not heard about or new details to a topic I'm interested in.

As for links... I could say I heard that we're picking up Tom Brady and Matt Ryan for an even trade of Collins and Campbell. I can't fault people for wanting to discuss FOUNDED rumors as opposed to some crap that someone wants to dream up to start drama. Providing links also gives other readers context and possibly new information about a topic the poster is already familiar with. I know I've learned a lot fom links people post detailing the topic at hand. If a poster is so knowledgable, then they should share their wealth of knowledge and resources to help the Redskins community.

The good news is there should be lots of new content for you now that training camp has started. I've read more new stuff in the past three days than the past month.

This is true! I've read a lot more than just filler lately and I love it! Idle hands are the devil's work and we've had too much of that lately.

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

El Mexican wrote:I'll take constant critique towards the FO over blind fanatism. Any day.

I understand that what happened 10 years ago can't be the defining moment of the Snyder era, or any Front Office, for that matter. That's valid. People make mistakes and learn from them.

Yet, this very offseason the team was inches away from either signing Cutler or Sanchez, and with that, creating "au debut" another season of turmoil.

If it's true Snyder is changing, it's as slow as molasses.

Listen, Campbell hasn't proven anything to date. In this league, to field a consistently good team, you need a franchise quarterback; look at the dominant teams of this decade, and the one thing in common is they have a top tier QB. I don't think even the most ardent Campbell defender would say he qualifies as such.

The FO was looking at the availability of Cutler (let me know the last time a 25 year old probowl QB was available), because he's pretty much a proven commodity. And they liked Sanchez...and they weren't the only ones who did.

It's now a bad thing to try to improve the most critical position on the team? Tell me what happens to this team if Campbell throws 13 TDs again this year?

Campbell has not proven anything. Agreed.

I was refering to the fact that Snyder was seriously close to bringing another flamboyant outsider instead of giving Campbell the chance he deserves. That, to me, is the owner trying to fix things the old way instead of trying to build some consistency with your team.

I think we can all agree that this is basically JC's last year with the team if he does not produce. But to bring in yet another QB to start the season would have been even more detrimental to the team. We have seen this in the past 10 years with the 10 different QBs that have suited up for the team.

Why is that? Because we really couldn't get much worse on offense than we were last year...

Listen, I generally have defended Campbell in the past, and I think that he has potential. But, I also understand that potential unrealized is a season killer. And I think that the FO was smart in exploring other options this year.

Plus, even if Campbell has a fantastic season, who knows if he's going to stay with the team next year?

Exactly!. I see 2 possibilities:
1) He won't produce & we won't offer him another contract.
2) He will produce & will get tons of money to go elsewhere.

I'll be surprised if he is hear in '10.

DEHog wrote:I know I’ll get hammered for this but I’m going to say it anyway. This isn’t directed to anyone inparticular…When did this place become the place for positive or factual Redskins news?? Last time I checked this was a Redskins message board that boasted…
Talk about the Washington Redskins here. Do you bleed burgundy and gold?

Isn’t that what we are doing?? It doesn’t say talk about everything positive or only things that can be proven true about the Washington Redskins. I can’t speak for anyone else but why do I get told….”You have no way of proving that…please provide a link” Of course I don’t…it’s my opinion. I have no more way of proving it then you do of not proving it!! And forget about providing a link (I stopped that a wile ago) because (unless it’s positive) it will be ripped to shreds.
Now before you start tearing the site apart to show me example to the contrary don’t I’m not asking for them and I’m not saying it’s the norm here but it seems it is headed in that direction.

I come here to read “opinions” I enjoy and respect everyone opinions (positive and negative) I don’t see them has right or wrong they’re just opinions. Snyder topics seem to bring out the worst in us. And if you say one thing negative you’re labeled a hater. Again speaking for me…nothing could be further from the truth. In fact I agree with more things that Snyder does than I disagree with. I think I have been pretty consistent….I hate giving up picks I want the team to draft and develop more of its own players. It was so nice to watch Kelly, Thomas and Orakpo on the field. I have given the FO credit for the moves (with exception of giving up a 2nd for Taylor) in the past few years. I don’t like big FA spending on guy to become the “savior” I would rather have a guy playing for a big contract. I prefer low key right priced guys that can be plugged into the system. We have many great example of that here, I know people (and I stopped) keep bringing up the past mistakes…but in all fairness, because as many here are quick to point out…we don’t know what goes on at Redskins Park… all we have to go by ( as RIC says) is the results on the field.
I don’t complain about ticket prices at Fedex just about the way the team goes about upgrades and holding back tickets that lead to events like what happened at last years Steeler game. I have witness first hand (and have been involved) with all the great charitable work that Snyder and the team does…I wish it was covered more!!
If you get tired of hearing how much Snyder stinks than why reply…because he is going to be our owner for the foreseeable future no one can give an opinion on him??
RIC likes to throw around the “A” word, while I really don’t agree with him some of you are headed in that direction. If this post bothers you that’s because a hit dog always yelps!!
Relax guys enjoy the season!!

You're right... everyone has, and is entitled to their own opinions. But the question becomes whether or not those opinions are grounded in reality and are supportable by known facts.

There are many people in this world that are still of the opinion or belief that the world is flat and is only 5,000 years old, even though the known facts are quite to the contrary. If that is your opinion and you want to believe the world is flat and only 5,000 years old... fine, I'm not sure many people really care. Believe what you want to believe.

But when that person who believes such things endlessly shouts their baseless opinions from every street corner and mountain top, and assert such opinions as fact, over and over again, when known facts offer evidence to the contrary, they better be prepared to be challenged on the issue and asked to offer support for such claims.

That's the difference. Believe what you want to believe. But if you're going to endlessly shout those beliefs, impose them on others and assert them as fact -- when others have supportable facts contradicting your assertions -- don't expect others not to speak up and offer their proof of contradiction.