The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Deadskins wrote:

See this is what you still fail to understand. If he restructures (meaning move the money around, but the overall value stays the same), he stands to make $63 million plus whatever new signing bonuses there are. If he hits the FA market he will never make that much.

I normally don't respond to you because your posts are generally random and ridiculous. But, here you go.

I don't fail to understand what 1niksder is saying by that. I don't fail to understand what you're quoting. But, it's so unrealistic that nobody who knows anything would even waste brain energy thinking about it. Peyton has a snowball's chance to "move money around" with the "overall value staying the same." You obviously don't know what agents, lawyers, NFL players, & Owners do in real life. This ain't it. He can't go into Irsay's office and say, "Hey Jim!!! Let's move $63M around bud!!! Yippey ca-yeh!! I'll still get the $63M, but only if my neck heals. That allows me to maybe get the $63M or maybe not. And, that allows you to look like you want me!!! I'm so smart why didn't I think of dis soonuh!!"

Like I said before 1niksder knows more than the average guy about the salary cap, but he's too short sighted to realize he makes no sense spewing nonsense like the above.

Peyton has virtually no chance to move that $63M around with the Colts. If he does a restructure, it will essentially be a new contract. It will include a lot less guaranteed money given his injury. In fact, Peyton stands a BETTER chance of tricking another team into believing that his nerves will re-generate quickly enough to help them compete for a title for the next 3-4 years. He stands a better chance in free agency--with the plausible reality that he can land a better deal elsewhere--where he doesn't have to compete with the younger, healthier version of HIM.

Some geniuses want that team to be the Skins. I'll leave it here for you. Tom Condon is one of the best in the business. If he's doing what I'm telling you is the best thing here, maybe you should check your ego and sit down. I'm sure you're an expert at whatever it is you do. Be happy with that.

Deadskins wrote:

This is where your reading comprehension has failed you. 1niksder never said any such thing. He said he should restructure, not renegotiate. Two totally separate concepts. Restructuring means Peyton would still get all the money from his current contract, plus any new signing bonuses to move the money around so that the team can more easily manage his cap hit.

This post is so stupid. Peyton can't restructure without renegotiating. Peyton has no right to the money on the current deal--it only exits on paper. The same paper we all believe the Colts will rip up shortly. It's not a birth right for him to go in--and restructure that deal--no questions asked--and get the money. SMH I'm assuming you're a Skins fan, maybe Clinton Portis and other guys on our team used to restructure without any negotiations--at a time when we were managed by a moron, and when they were healthy and ensured of being on next year's roster. Peyton is injured, and nobody knows whether he'll be worth $28M ever again. Oh, and the Colts have the #1 pick. Vinny--that you??

Ask yourself this before posting something ignorant next time: Does what I'm about to say make sense? In this case, why would the Colts do what you're suggesting? If you can't come up with a good reason that convinces you--don't say whatever it is you were about to. Have a seat.

The Hogster wrote:Deadskins wrote:

See this is what you still fail to understand. If he restructures (meaning move the money around, but the overall value stays the same), he stands to make $63 million plus whatever new signing bonuses there are. If he hits the FA market he will never make that much.

I normally don't respond to you because your posts are generally random and ridiculous. But, here you go.

I don't fail to understand what 1niksder is saying by that. I don't fail to understand what you're quoting. But, it's so unrealistic that nobody who knows anything would even waste brain energy thinking about it. Peyton has a snowball's chance to "move money around" with the "overall value staying the same." You obviously don't know what agents, lawyers, NFL players, & Owners do in real life. This ain't it. He can't go into Irsay's office and say, "Hey Jim!!! Let's move $63M around bud!!! Yippey ca-yeh!! I'll still get the $63M, but only if my neck heals. That allows me to maybe get the $63M or maybe not. And, that allows you to look like you want me!!! I'm so smart why didn't I think of dis soonuh!!"

Like I said before 1niksder knows more than the average guy about the salary cap, but he's too short sighted to realize he makes no sense spewing nonsense like the above.

I'm short sighted based on your opinion? That's cool considering your opinion is almost always wrong, and you do obviously still don't get it.

Your pretending to be smart has pretty much showed everyone reading this just how bright you are. Calling others short sighted, calling yourself right or the victor and yelling I won, only will have some people go back and re-read this thread.... Then they'll find the stupidity they missed the first time. Then even more people will see the truth.

Have you thought about getting a smaller horse? You might land on your head as often.

You could have just admitted the you didn't understand what a restructure was, or explain why he would be giving up money if he restructured but instead you come up with that.

The Hogster wrote:Peyton has virtually no chance to move that $63M around with the Colts. If he does a restructure, it will essentially be a new contract.

What the hell else would it be? When they restructure a contract the way the team saves money is by converting parts of the money into signing bonus money. What else would he sign, if not a new contract?

You really should look a that smaller horse...

The Hogster wrote: It will include a lot less guaranteed money given his injury.

WRONG.... he currently has ZERO money guaranteed. How can he have less (let alone a lot less)? That's the benefit to the player guaranteed money versus getting cut and starting from scratch.

The Hogster wrote: In fact, Peyton stands a BETTER chance of tricking another team into believing that his nerves will re-generate quickly enough to help them compete for a title for the next 3-4 years.

That could work... if he can find a team that has had everyone in it's front office on a Deserted Island for the last 6 to 8 months, that same team will allow Peyton to pick the teams doctors for them, he can show film instead of actually working out.

Why just leave horses alone and stick to what you know. Get a Donkey

The Hogster wrote:He stands a better chance in free agency--with the plausible reality that he can land a better deal elsewhere--where he doesn't have to compete with the younger, healthier version of HIM.

He's 36 years old, who's going to give him a deal better than on average $15.75M per year?

The Hogster wrote:Some geniuses want that team to be the Skins. I'll leave it here for you. Tom Condon is one of the best in the business. If he's doing what I'm telling you is the best thing here, maybe you should check your ego and sit down. I'm sure you're an expert at whatever it is you do. Be happy with that.

Tom is one of the best in the and Peyton should never be a member of the Redskins. Wow that's two things we can agree on


Deadskins wrote:

This is where your reading comprehension has failed you. 1niksder never said any such thing. He said he should restructure, not renegotiate. Two totally separate concepts. Restructuring means Peyton would still get all the money from his current contract, plus any new signing bonuses to move the money around so that the team can more easily manage his cap hit.

The Hogster wrote:This post is so stupid. Peyton can't restructure without renegotiating. Peyton has no right to the money on the current deal--it only exits on paper. The same paper we all believe the Colts will rip up shortly. It's not a birth right for him to go in--and restructure that deal--no questions asked--and get the money. SMH

You need to work on your skills..... You misunderstood what i was saying about the horse. I wasn't saying you should change horses in the middle of the race (going from he shouldn't to he can't) like you're trying to do. I meant you're still falling off that high one so think about downsizing, so these constant tumbles don't hurt so much.

The Hogster wrote: I'm assuming you're a Skins fan, maybe Clinton Portis and other guys on our team used to restructure without any negotiations--at a time when we were managed by a moron, and when they were healthy and ensured of being on next year's roster. Peyton is injured, and nobody knows whether he'll be worth $28M ever again. Oh, and the Colts have the #1 pick. Vinny--that you??

The agents for quarterback Ben Roethlisberger and outside linebacker James Harrison said their clients are agreeable to restructuring their contracts before the start of the NFL's new year.

Just to be clear.... Ben Roethlisberger and James Harrison haven't even been asked to restructure but are willing too, both got dinged up last year and the Steelers are not run by morons.

The Hogster wrote:Ask yourself this before posting something ignorant next time: Does what I'm about to say make sense?

Do you know how ignorant that sounds? Do you know how much more ignorant that sounds coming from you?

Thanks for the entertainment.

The personal issue of arrogance and sensitivity, etc., which was getting personal and not on topic, has been split and moved to Smack. If you want to keep that part of it up, carry on there, please.

Irn-Bru wrote:The personal issue of arrogance and sensitivity, etc., which was getting personal and not on topic, has been split and moved to Smack. If you want to keep that part of it up, carry on there, please.

Soon to be filled with a bunch of pictures and gifs

The Hogster wrote:Deadskins wrote:

This is where your reading comprehension has failed you. 1niksder never said any such thing. He said he should restructure, not renegotiate. Two totally separate concepts. Restructuring means Peyton would still get all the money from his current contract, plus any new signing bonuses to move the money around so that the team can more easily manage his cap hit.

This post is so stupid. Peyton can't restructure without renegotiating.

Now that is funny. Tell me you got more out of law school than that.

PS You also took my quote totally out of context. I was replying to this delusional response of yours to 1niksder where you proved you either have no reading comprehension skills, or you're too arrogant to believe the possibility that someone else might have an idea that hadn't crossed your mind:

The Hogster wrote:You're suggesting that Peyton give them a third option---pay him less and keep him around. That would be awesome for the Colts and borderline retarded for Peyton. That option would be precisely what the Colts want. But they can't have that unless Peyton does them that favor.

You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

You're like the American who buys elephant repellent, and is convinced it's working because he's never been trampled by one yet.

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this because they make no sense. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

We're intellectually fragile but you constantly prove that you can't follow the conversations, can't speak on a subject without getting personal (weather it's how right you are or how inferior those that don't agree with you are).

I can only speak for myself personally I think you and your post are a joke, and I know I'm not the only one....

Sometime after this post you'll state we're ganging up on you, which is why you grouped us together in your reply. You're repaving the road that you always go down whenever someone calls you on your stupidity.

That's right your arrogant still doesn't hide your lack knowledge or your uncontrollable stupidity.

Don't get mad get a clue.

1niksder wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

We're in intellectually fragile but you constantly prove that you can follow the conversations, can't speak on a subject without getting personal (weather it's how right you are or how inferior those that don't agree with you are). I can only speak for myself personally I think you and your post are a joke. And I know I'm not the only one....

Sometime after this post you'll state we're ganging up on you, which is why you grouped us together in our reply. You're repaving the road that you always go down whenever someone calls you on your stupidity.

That's right your arrogant still doesn't hide your lack knowledge or your uncontrollable stupidity.

Don't get mad get a clue.

I'm stupid, you're smart. The rest of the world just doesn't realize it yet. I'm sure Tom Condon will read this and realize how dumb he is. You pack so much knowledge and insight into your posts--I mean golly--your awesomeness just oozes through with every word. Thank God Tom Condon has your posts to resort to--how else would he see the light. Yayy for 1niksder

Who just ran off to smack to post some pictures, and weak minded insults?

All the name calling in the world won't erase the lack of knowledge you've displayed in this thread. But have at it those that have been here a while have seen you do this many many times. We almost expect it from you.

You still have said what Peyton has to lose by just talking to Irsay. You can't answer because the answer would be what most of your post show, you don't know what he has to lose.

You'd rather act like a child and screw up the whole thread instead simply admit you don't know something.

In the end you showed everybody that you don't know. You gonna kill yourself one of these days if you keep falling off that high horse of yours

Hey Redskins1, have you seen the thread about you in smack that the Hogster made?

PickSixerTWSS wrote:Hey Redskins1, have you seen the thread about you in smack that the Hogster made?

That's what children do. It's what smack is for.
Now hopefully we can get y to the topic of this thread without all of the nonsense.

I'll go smack him around when I get bored, right now I'm just helping him with his gif collection, so he'll have something to do at work Monday.

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this because they make no sense. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

Again, you may arrive at the same result, but for different reasons. So you can stop using Condon to justify your weak arguments.

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this because they make no sense. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

Again, you may arrive at the same result, but for different reasons. So you can stop using Condon to justify your weak arguments.

Yeah, my argument is so weak that it's actually what Peyton's agent is doing. It's called reality--live in it.

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You guys never cease to amaze me. I think Tom Condon knows what he's doing. And, he's not doing what you're suggesting. He's doing what I am suggesting. At the end of the day, your opinion is worth what it usually is--nothing.

I totally think Condon knows what he's doing. I just don't think he's doing it for the same reasons you think he is. See, it's actually your opinion of your own infallibility that won't let you understand that distinction.

Whatever you say. The problem you guys have is just exchanging opinions and leaving it there. I could care less about coming to an agreement, but you, 1niksder, Kazoo seem so intellectually fragile that you take offense to a contrary view. I'm not being condescending or arrogant, I'm just not persuaded by your arguments on this because they make no sense. Move on.

Nobody reasonable believes that Peyton can do anything to get any more money out of the Colts. Yet, you keep making this losing argument and getting frustrated because I don't buy it?? If you won't take my word for it, fine. But, just watch what Tom Condon does---he knows more than any of you on this.

Again, you may arrive at the same result, but for different reasons. So you can stop using Condon to justify your weak arguments.

Yeah, my argument is so weak that it's actually what Peyton's agent is doing. It's called reality--live in it.

I'd hate to add more facts to this rant fest of name calling, but I'll lead by example and continue relying on real life facts as stated by people who actually know a little bit about what goes on in the real world.

http://www.indystar.com/article/2012021 ... ar.com%7Cp

Irsay put himself in a corner with his comment to the NFL Network this season that if Peyton was healthy, he would be a Colt, that it had nothing to do with money.

Granted, if Irsay doesn't pay Manning, he's going to pay someone else. Either way, the Colts are going to pay right up to the cap, as they always have done in the past. But it's a bit disingenuous to say it's not about money when it is about the long-term cap hit.

Irsay doesn't want to pay the $28 million signing bonus, and I don't blame him, not given the questions about Manning's health.

So what happens next?

Probably nothing until after the NFL Scouting Combine -- which is too bad for Luck, who will have to answer some uncomfortable questions.

Yes, it's possible Manning goes to Irsay before then and says, "Look, I've made a decision,'' and the two walk hand-in-hand into a news conference to confirm he has been released.

But we're talking about two people who have been together more than 14 years, two friends who've been through the battles together, and they're not going to make this difficult decision on anybody else's timeline.

What needs to be remembered is that there's no "bad guy'' here, no heavy, nobody who deserves blame. This is not Irsay kicking Manning out the door. This is not Manning saying, "Heck no, I'm not taking less money and mentoring Luck, so I'm out of here.''

It's just life, just business.

It's just business. Peyton Manning should not restructure his contract to take less money--so that he can stick around and tutor Andrew Luck. That's assinine, assiten, assieleven, and assitwelve. I can't believe some of you continue making that unrealistic and weak argument. Nonetheless, find a valid reason why Peyton should do that, and perhaps this debate wouldn't be so lopsided in you-know-whose favor.

Nobody of sound mind believes that Peyton should restructure his deal to take an incentive based deal to remain with the Colts. Nobody but you guys. Your argument is so simple-minded, that you fail to even realize that if the Colts draft Luck, and Peyton isn't healthy by the beginning of the year--Manning might not even be on the field to reach any friggin incentives. Yet Condon should do this because the resident "Salary Cap Expert" 1nisder says so.. LOL God this is sad.

Yet more doses of reality for the gaggle of sensitive people who don't like the fact that I call them out on their baseless banter.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ycn-10967484

So news out of Indianapolis today is that Colts owner Jim Irsay has said that "he'd be excited" to have quarterback Peyton Manning stay with the franchise if he was able to return to full health. That is, of course, if Peyton will restructure his contract to reflect the uncertainty of his situation (meaning, if Peyton will forego his $28 million bonus he's scheduled to get in March in favor of a more incentive-laden contract).

With these comments Irsay is taking a new course in this (at times) contentious story involving Manning's protracted recovery from nerve damage in his throwing arm. Just a few weeks ago, both Irsay and Manning had a difficult few days in which some fairly unkind words were tossed around by both men. Ultimately, though, it didn't take long for them both to realize that a public feud wasn't in the best interests of the Colts.

AdChoices

However, Irsay is being a bit disingenuous with these comments that he'd be excited to have Manning back with the team. I can't imagine a scenario in which this would work out and I think Irsay knows that. There has been a massive turnover in Colts staff since the end of this past season. Just today, new head coach Chuck Pagano announced the hiring of 18 new coaches, 15 of which are new to the Colts. With this new staff, there is undoubtedly a new offensive philosophy. Peyton's days of running his special no-huddle offense calling crazy audibles like he's done for over ten years are over, especially if he stays in Indianapolis.

Another thing to consider is that the Colts have the first pick in the new draft in April. If Manning does somehow stay with the Colts and signs an incentive-laden contract, he'd need to be starting in order to earn any money. The Colts have already gone on record as saying that they believe young (rookie) quarterbacks should play, and I can't see how drafting Andrew Luck but still starting Manning would do anything but cause controversy.

I think this latest move is purely a public relations ploy by Irsay. He's taken off all the pressure from himself and placed it completely on Manning in regards to the quarterback's future. Irsay will simply decline paying Peyton his $28 million roster bonus that's due in March and say that Manning was unwilling to compromise. Manning knows that if he stays with the Colts there are absolutely no guarantees that he'd be starting or be on the field at all.

Irsay may also believe that Manning's career is over. If that's true, then this may also be an attempt to keep Manning in the fold so that they can use his expertise to help groom their next quarterback. It all depends on whether Manning is making any progress with his recovery.

I think ultimately Manning will turn down Irsay's offer at a compromise and leave the Colts. If he ever wants to play again in the NFL, leaving the Colts will be the only way he can do that. Fans will forgive him if he leaves in a way that reflects the respectful manner in which he's handled himself his entire career. Manning has never expressed interest in ending his career because of this injury, and he deserves the right to continue playing if he can.

Of course the geniuses here who hate my "high horse" and "harsh tone" or whatever won't care about facts. Facts and objective opinions are usually ignored on here. Way too much estrogen floating around here. If some of you would quit wearing your emotions on your sleeve, you'd realize that sometimes others are right and you're too emotional to realize you're wrong.

The Hogster wrote:Way too much estrogen floating around here. If some of you would quit wearing your emotions on your sleeve, you'd realize that sometimes others are right and you're too emotional to realize you're wrong.

OMG...

The Hogster wrote:It's just business. Peyton Manning should not restructure his contract to take less money

One last time. NO ONE HERE EVER SAID PEYTON SHOULD "RENEGOTIATE" TO TAKE LESS MONEY. So please stop trying to make that argument. It's a straw man you keep falling back on. Just like the Condon thing. Also, restructuring and renegotiating are two separate concepts.

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:It's just business. Peyton Manning should not restructure his contract to take less money

One last time. NO ONE HERE EVER SAID PEYTON SHOULD "RENEGOTIATE" TO TAKE LESS MONEY. So please stop trying to make that argument. It's a straw man you keep falling back on. Just like the Condon thing. Also, restructuring and renegotiating are two separate concepts.

Speak for yourself.

1niksder wrote:

Restructuring by definition is to rearrange, in this case restructuring his remaining contract or base salaries in 2012: $7.4 million, 2013: $8.4 million, 2014: $9.4 million, and 2015: $10.4 million, + the $28 million option bonus. With the Colts you're talking about $35M+ over the next four years and the bonus, with the base salaries as the starting point.
On the open market he's starting with nothing, zero, zelch. He only has leverage if he talks, because if not they're going to tell him to walk.

Like I said before, restructuring would require renegotiation, so you are mincing words. And, restructuring is not likely to happen because of that prohibitive bonus. This really isnt rocket science. Restructuring isn't a birth right for Peyton or anyone, so I'm not sure why you guys keep acting like he can or should be trying to restructure and stay in Indy when the team is rebuilding most likely around Andrew Luck.

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:It's just business. Peyton Manning should not restructure his contract to take less money

One last time. NO ONE HERE EVER SAID PEYTON SHOULD "RENEGOTIATE" TO TAKE LESS MONEY. So please stop trying to make that argument. It's a straw man you keep falling back on. Just like the Condon thing. Also, restructuring and renegotiating are two separate concepts.

Speak for yourself.

1niksder wrote:

Restructuring by definition is to rearrange, in this case restructuring his remaining contract or base salaries in 2012: $7.4 million, 2013: $8.4 million, 2014: $9.4 million, and 2015: $10.4 million, + the $28 million option bonus. With the Colts you're talking about $35M+ over the next four years and the bonus, with the base salaries as the starting point.
On the open market he's starting with nothing, zero, zelch. He only has leverage if he talks, because if not they're going to tell him to walk.

Like I said before, restructuring would require renegotiation, so you are mincing words.

You just proved my point. 1niksder's post only talks about restructuring (never about taking less money). And you are the one mincing words by saying that restructuring entails renegotiating. Obviously negotiations have to take place in any contract talks, but the word "renegotiate" implies starting over from zero, and negotiating from there. I don't believe you to be so ignorant as to not understand that concept. Especially if you really do for a living what you say you do.

The Hogster wrote:Restructuring isn't a birth right for Peyton or anyone, so I'm not sure why you guys keep acting like he can or should be trying to restructure and stay in Indy when the team is rebuilding most likely around Andrew Luck.

Here's why:
Restructure: $63 million + into Peyton's bank account over the rest of his career.

FA: Incentive laden contract with maybe a few million $ signing bonus into Peyton's bank account over the rest of his career. Probably not even a fifth of the restructure money.

As I've said all along, I don't believe the Colts want to restructure, or that Peyton's concerned about the money at this point in his career (which is why Condon is probably not talking to the Colts about a restructure deal). But Peyton has to know what he's potentially giving up to move on.
Also, you keep saying Peyton has all the leverage, but I say he has none, except what he has with the Colts' fan base in the way of a backlash against Irsay. The Colts have all the leverage in this situation.

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:It's just business. Peyton Manning should not restructure his contract to take less money

One last time. NO ONE HERE EVER SAID PEYTON SHOULD "RENEGOTIATE" TO TAKE LESS MONEY. So please stop trying to make that argument. It's a straw man you keep falling back on. Just like the Condon thing. Also, restructuring and renegotiating are two separate concepts.

Speak for yourself.

1niksder wrote:

Restructuring by definition is to rearrange, in this case restructuring his remaining contract or base salaries in 2012: $7.4 million, 2013: $8.4 million, 2014: $9.4 million, and 2015: $10.4 million, + the $28 million option bonus. With the Colts you're talking about $35M+ over the next four years and the bonus, with the base salaries as the starting point.
On the open market he's starting with nothing, zero, zelch. He only has leverage if he talks, because if not they're going to tell him to walk.

Like I said before, restructuring would require renegotiation, so you are mincing words.

You just proved my point. 1niksder's post only talks about restructuring (never about taking less money). And you are the one mincing words by saying that restructuring entails renegotiating. Obviously negotiations have to take place in any contract talks, but the word "renegotiate" implies starting over from zero, and negotiating from there. I don't believe you to be so ignorant as to not understand that concept. Especially if you really do for a living what you say you do.

The Hogster wrote:Restructuring isn't a birth right for Peyton or anyone, so I'm not sure why you guys keep acting like he can or should be trying to restructure and stay in Indy when the team is rebuilding most likely around Andrew Luck.

Here's why:
Restructure: $63 million + into Peyton's bank account over the rest of his career.

FA: Incentive laden contract with maybe a few million $ signing bonus into Peyton's bank account over the rest of his career. Probably not even a fifth of the restructure money.

As I've said all along, I don't believe the Colts want to restructure, or that Peyton's concerned about the money at this point in his career (which is why Condon is probably not talking to the Colts about a restructure deal). But Peyton has to know what he's potentially giving up to move on.
Also, you keep saying Peyton has all the leverage, but I say he has none, except what he has with the Colts' fan base in the way of a backlash against Irsay. The Colts have all the leverage in this situation.

Herein lies the proof that you guys don't know what you're talking about. What do you think the chances are that the Colts will restructure Peyton's contract in such a way that he gets anything close to $63M dollars?? The Colts are NOT paying him that much money whether you think so or not. It's not about the structure, it's about the MONEY given his injury and the draft.



What you're saying is totally conceptual and nonsensical. Sure, you can say "restructure" until you're blue in the face. But, in REALITY the Colts do not intend to pay Peyton anything close to $63M regardless of how you structured the payments. He has (i) a nerve regeneration issue that has NO TIMETABLE, and (ii) the Colts have the #1 pick. Stop while you're behind. The more you repeatedly say this restructure nonsense the more you sound clueless to what it is you or I are actually saying.

If it were such a brilliant idea--why do you think that you and 1niksder are the only two who have figured it out. Don't you think Tom Condon would be going that route if you guys were right? Don't you think he'd know this?? This is a business decision that is about the amount of money, not the classification. The Colts have to move on because of the nature of the injury, and the circumstances that allow them to draft Andrew Luck--this isn't a problem with the Salary Cap. If the Colts release Peyton isn't NOT because they can't afford to keep him, it's because of the totality of the circumstances.


Redskin in Canada said essentially the SAME thing that I'm saying in this very thread. But, of course, I hurt feelings with my tone--so by default all of you guys think it's important to argue against the messenger rather than the message.

Peyton has as much leverage as he ever could have because he knows that he'll become a Free Agent sooner or later. He likely doesn't want to be on a Colts team that is being scrapped and rebuilt around another QB. Why would he when he can CHOOSE to go wherever he wants. Geezus

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:As I've said all along, I don't believe the Colts want to restructure, or that Peyton's concerned about the money at this point in his career (which is why Condon is probably not talking to the Colts about a restructure deal).

Herein lies the proof that you guys don't know what you're talking about. What do you think the chances are that the Colts will restructure Peyton's contract in such a way that he gets anything close to $63M dollars??

Jesus! can you even read?

Deadskins wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Deadskins wrote:As I've said all along, I don't believe the Colts want to restructure, or that Peyton's concerned about the money at this point in his career (which is why Condon is probably not talking to the Colts about a restructure deal).

Herein lies the proof that you guys don't know what you're talking about. What do you think the chances are that the Colts will restructure Peyton's contract in such a way that he gets anything close to $63M dollars??

Jesus! can you even read?

Dude. Just stop. It's getting sad.