Monk vs Irvin

BRAVEONAWARPATH · Post by **BRAVEONAWARPATH** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 11:19 am

tcwest10 wrote:Hmmm...
I'm gonna watch this one, kids.
Watch the old man. He won't be drawn into a peeing contest by a newbie.

Good..because I don't wanna be drawn
into one as well...but anyway,..let's start all over.
How are you TC?

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 11:39 am

BRAVEONAWARPATH wrote:...but anyway,..let's start all over.
How are you TC?

Well, just darned ducky, BOAW. Funny you should ask. Now, I'm gonna dump on you.
This is the beginning of yet another four months of nail-biting tension for me. Every year, Monk comes up for induction. Every year, he makes the next to last cut. Every year, he is denied.
And every year, I have to listen to somebody else tooting sombody else's horn about how this guy or that guy should be in on the first ballot with his name on it.
It seems to me that if you aren't going induct the man into the HOF based on what he did and what he meant to the teams he played on, then the criteria is skewed.
Here's a short list of what questions I'd ask myself if I were considering a player for the HOF.
1.) Did he consistently perform to a higher level at his position ?
2.) Where did his team finish in the standings while he was there ? (or...)
Where would his team have finished in the standings were he not there ?
3.) Did he change the way his position is played, and change the way coaches select players for that position ?
4.) Did he represent the league, his team and himself in a favorable fashion ?
5.) Did he consistently make teams have to game plan around him ?
6.) Is he worthy of enshrinement amoung the all-time greats ?

Go ahead. Find a word in there that you don't like, and beat me over the head with it. I don't care.
Hell, if Monk goes in, I'll help you.

BRAVEONAWARPATH · Post by **BRAVEONAWARPATH** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 3:37 pm

tcwest10 wrote:
BRAVEONAWARPATH wrote:...but anyway,..let's start all over.
How are you TC?

Well, just darned ducky, BOAW. Funny you should ask. Now, I'm gonna dump on you.
This is the beginning of yet another four months of nail-biting tension for me. Every year, Monk comes up for induction. Every year, he makes the next to last cut. Every year, he is denied.
And every year, I have to listen to somebody else tooting sombody else's horn about how this guy or that guy should be in on the first ballot with his name on it.
It seems to me that if you aren't going induct the man into the HOF based on what he did and what he meant to the teams he played on, then the criteria is skewed.
Here's a short list of what questions I'd ask myself if I were considering a player for the HOF.
1.) Did he consistently perform to a higher level at his position ?
2.) Where did his team finish in the standings while he was there ? (or...)
Where would his team have finished in the standings were he not there ?
3.) Did he change the way his position is played, and change the way coaches select players for that position ?
4.) Did he represent the league, his team and himself in a favorable fashion ?
5.) Did he consistently make teams have to game plan around him ?
6.) Is he worthy of enshrinement amoung the all-time greats ?

Go ahead. Find a word in there that you don't like, and beat me over the head with it. I don't care.
Hell, if Monk goes in, I'll help you.

I'd like to think Monk would go in before I draw social security...but i'm not so sure..

reggiebrooks4life · Post by **reggiebrooks4life** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 4:14 pm

i wish you weren't a liar brave....im sick of your lies

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 5:29 pm

Reggie, I've been reading what you've posted tonight.
Do you have anything to add to these topics, or are you being a sniper ?

welch · Post by **welch** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 7:18 pm

There seem to be two Irvin/Monk/HOF threads here. We've been through this before, but I would hate to miss a chance to praise Art Monk.

- Deep threat, drew double coverage, allowing Gary Clark and / or Ricky Sanders to get free

- He was not just a short-yardage possession receiver, no matter how many times Dr Z repeats that. Dr Z knew so much that he predicted the Bills over the Redskins in SB 26.

- Great hands

- Tough over the middle or in a corner surrounded by defenders. Monk would wrestle it away from them

- Better than anyone except Charlie Taylor or Bobby Mitchell once he caught the pass. Strong, hard runner

- Solid blocker

- Acknowledged by the not-humble Joe Theismann: "Art Monk made me look good".

Though stats are not worth much outside of fantasy leagues, Monk broke the important records:

- Set the league record with 106 catches in a season, in a balanced offense that had John Riggins and other receivers.

- Set the league record for total catches

- Set the league record for most games with a catch

- Failed in only one area: he was failed to be a showboating self-promoter. ("Bo knows baseball"..."I'm Dennis Leary, and I've gotta talk about Deon Sanders and the new Sylvania TV set...").

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 7:21 pm

Man, the Welch is really comin' on strong now.

welch · Post by **welch** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 7:26 pm

...thought I would take the weekend off, kind of, and surprise myself with all the Hogs.net posts.

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sun Oct 24, 2004 7:27 pm

We didn't let you down, did we, old timer !

JansenFan · Post by **JansenFan** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:34 am

Hey fellas, lets keep the bickering to a dull roar. If you want to continue, I can split the offending posts into a new thread in the smack forum for you. Just let me know.

Thanks for your cooperation.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:27 am

JansenFan - I think the thread should be combined BUT this was really an opportunity for TC to vent (on both threads!!)and during the bye week too! I don't know about the rest of you but I am glad for all our sakes that we've got a game coming up - TC is about to bust a gasket!!

It is absolutely unbelievable to me that Art is not in the HOF. I completely agree with TC (and many others) about this and it really is not about Irvin vrs Monk, Art belongs in the HOF, end of story, not before or after anyone, he earned it on the field, NOT debatable.
This is just a very difficult time for those of us that hear that another receiver is being considered BEFORE Art goes in. He will be there - it's just incredible that they have not done it yet.

JansenFan · Post by **JansenFan** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:29 am

Venting is great as long as it stays within the guidelines. Also, let me just say my comments weren't only directed at TC.

No one jumped over the line, but several walked it.

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:08 pm

Oh, believe me. No blown gaskets here.
Nor did I start either thread. I'm simply drawn like a moth to a lamp to anything that bears the name "Art Monk" here.
I know the rules, and I try to follow 'em.
Sorry to make more work for you, JF.