The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Steve Spurrier III wrote:So if I point out the fact that Keyshawn Johnson was kicked off the defending Super Bowl Champions for being an overrated pain in the ass with six less touchdowns in the last three years than Bill Schroeder, are you going to admit that is the truth, or are you going to say that whole thing was a percieved assumption by someone with their own agenda?

Yeah that is the truth, but he and Gruden were bumping heads on how he was going to be used. Gruden wanted him to be a deep threat, when Keyshawn new that he could not help the team by stretching the field that way. Keyshawn has said it himself he is a short to intermediate route runner, not a downfield speed burner. (Example if you are at a job and they hire you to be a puchasing manager and they paying you $50k a year and after you get there, you end up in the mail room stuffing envelopes 2 or 3 times a week all day, no matter how much they paying you. You know that you are not helping the company with your best abiltiy and you are not getting any job satisfication. So you either lash out or sneak around and find a new job)


Also IMO, I think Gruden had problems with alot of other players there. Hence the MASS EXODUS from Tampa.

gambit187 wrote:Gruden wanted him to be a deep threat, when Keyshawn new that he could not help the team by stretching the field that way. Keyshawn has said it himself he is a short to intermediate route runner, not a downfield speed burner.

But who's the coach??? It's his job to be a wide-reciever and be used how the coach says he should be used..... if he's never going deep, doesn't that take away the element of surprise??? I mean if you know the guys not going deep, doesn't that give you an advantage on defense?

BringThePain! wrote:

gambit187 wrote:Gruden wanted him to be a deep threat, when Keyshawn new that he could not help the team by stretching the field that way. Keyshawn has said it himself he is a short to intermediate route runner, not a downfield speed burner.

But who's the coach??? It's his job to be a wide-reciever and be used how the coach says he should be used..... if he's never going deep, doesn't that take away the element of surprise??? I mean if you know the guys not going deep, doesn't that give you an advantage on defense?

But I have to be honest, keyshawn is not beating anyone deep down field. Sometimes not all coaches know everything. You see what the trade was for a possesion reciever for a speed receiver. I sometimes think and i have experienced that people that speak there opinions and do not stop until they are taken seriously have a tendacy to be labeled trouble makers or head cases.

Gruden finds somebody to be his whipping boy on every team he coaches. Keshawn was simply the obvious choice.

gambit187 wrote:Sometimes not all coaches know everything.

True.. we've experienced that here

But a coach who brought one team to the AFC Championship game.... and then Came over and Brought another team (who had struggled to get over the hump for years), to a Super Bowl victory..... well, I would tend to shut up and listen to him Something Keyshawn has a problem doing to almost every coach he's been with

BringThePain! wrote:

gambit187 wrote:Sometimes not all coaches know everything.

True.. we've experienced that here

But a coach who brought one team to the AFC Championship game.... and then Came over and Brought another team (who had struggled to get over the hump for years), to a Super Bowl victory..... well, I would tend to shut up and listen to him Something Keyshawn has a problem doing to almost every coach he's been with

I would not say that he did not have any problems with John Robinson at USC,,,,,he and Parcells kinda bumped heads, but Parcells being a Jersey guy knows all about bumping heads with people and differences of opinions. Hummm lets see how long it will be before Tampa gets back into the superbowl. I would say our 2 teams will be there before Gruden does.

That's a fair assumption. Tampa's at the end of a player cycle while Dallas is in the middle of one and Washington is now building a new one. It might be a few years before they can even think about contending again. Or, as the Bucs first coach Jim McKay said, "Things are going to get worse before they get worse."

Gambit, while I respect Keyshawn turning his life around, it's no reason for him to act as arrogant and cocky as he does. I wish he would act his age and not act so angry at people. I'm sure his childhood is the fuel of his anger but he needs to learn how to control it.

Donovan McNabb and Kordell Stewart all went through tough childhoods, they are two of the classiest players in the league right now. Not everyone's childhood was perfect, so why should we make an exception for Keyshawn?

Jake wrote:Gambit, while I respect Keyshawn turning his life around, it's no reason for him to act as arrogant and cocky as he does. I wish he would act his age and not act so angry at people. I'm sure his childhood is the fuel of his anger but he needs to learn how to control it.

Donovan McNabb and Kordell Stewart all went through tough childhoods, they are two of the classiest players in the league right now. Not everyone's childhood was perfect, so why should we make an exception for Keyshawn?

Arrogance and cockiness are labels people place upon others. Have you ever met him or anything like that. Thats like saying becuase i wear timberland boots and baggy jeans i am a hood. People used to percieve me as being arrogant or stuck and cocky, but once they got to know me they realized it was CONFIDENCE....NEVER JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER , JAKE YOU ARE TOO YOUNG TO BE MAKING PRE CONCEIVED NOTIONS OF OTHERS IN THIS DAY AND AGE.......open you heart and mind and you will go far in this world.

If keyshawn isn't arrogant or cocky... then who in the NFL is???

gambit187 wrote:Arrogance and cockiness are labels people place upon others. Have you ever met him or anything like that. Thats like saying becuase i wear timberland boots and baggy jeans i am a hood. People used to percieve me as being arrogant or stuck and cocky, but once they got to know me they realized it was CONFIDENCE....NEVER JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER , JAKE YOU ARE TOO YOUNG TO BE MAKING PRE CONCEIVED NOTIONS OF OTHERS IN THIS DAY AND AGE.......open you heart and mind and you will go far in this world.

dont judge a book by it's cover? well the title of his book (Throw me the damn Ball) didn't help peoples perception. Keshawn comes off as arrogant and cocky and he probaly likes it that way It and really hasn't hurt him.

and Gambit stop taking my signature so seriously some of us need to your rambalings to pass the time

now I'll go back to just laughing at most of them and not responding

Keshawn.. Meshawn whatever he's gonna be alright

That was a nice article thanks for posting it

Keyshawn is cocky, self centered, and arrogant. He also likes to win. He plays his heart out. I think last year was his wake up call. He has now found out that there is a fine line between arrogance for the better and arrogance for the worse. Being reunited with Bill Parcells is a definite upgrade at Wide Reciever for the cowboys. He is the only person on the Cowboys offense that does scare me.

That is my two cents on Keyshawn.

gambit187 wrote:

Jake wrote:Gambit, while I respect Keyshawn turning his life around, it's no reason for him to act as arrogant and cocky as he does. I wish he would act his age and not act so angry at people. I'm sure his childhood is the fuel of his anger but he needs to learn how to control it.

Donovan McNabb and Kordell Stewart all went through tough childhoods, they are two of the classiest players in the league right now. Not everyone's childhood was perfect, so why should we make an exception for Keyshawn?

Arrogance and cockiness are labels people place upon others. Have you ever met him or anything like that. Thats like saying becuase i wear timberland boots and baggy jeans i am a hood. People used to percieve me as being arrogant or stuck and cocky, but once they got to know me they realized it was CONFIDENCE....NEVER JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER , JAKE YOU ARE TOO YOUNG TO BE MAKING PRE CONCEIVED NOTIONS OF OTHERS IN THIS DAY AND AGE.......open you heart and mind and you will go far in this world.

That's really hypocritical, Gambit. You tell me don't judge a book by it's cover and yet you tell me that I'm too young to make preceonceived notions about somebody. But here's the thing, you've never met me before.

I may be 16 but I'm not stupid. You're basically telling me that I don't have the intelligence to tell who acts arrogant and has horrible character traits. I have met A LOT of football players over the years and not just Redskins. But then, there are those who choose to be arrogant and reject the fact that there are fans there that want their auttograph and would like to talk to them.

Having saying that we don't know him isn't making much of a statement. When fans make statements like "he is arrogant", they say that because that's all the fans have to go by. 99% of the fans will never get to meet the players or spend a day in their shoes.

It's also hypocritical to tell us to not talk trash about one of your players when, on the other hand, you talk plenty of trash regarding ours.

Edit: Oh yeah, what IS the right age to start making preconceived notions? Isn't it wrong to do it at any age?
I can't wait until you tell me because then I can start counting the days.

Jake wrote:

gambit187 wrote:

Jake wrote:Gambit, while I respect Keyshawn turning his life around, it's no reason for him to act as arrogant and cocky as he does. I wish he would act his age and not act so angry at people. I'm sure his childhood is the fuel of his anger but he needs to learn how to control it.

Donovan McNabb and Kordell Stewart all went through tough childhoods, they are two of the classiest players in the league right now. Not everyone's childhood was perfect, so why should we make an exception for Keyshawn?

Arrogance and cockiness are labels people place upon others. Have you ever met him or anything like that. Thats like saying becuase i wear timberland boots and baggy jeans i am a hood. People used to percieve me as being arrogant or stuck and cocky, but once they got to know me they realized it was CONFIDENCE....NEVER JUDGE A BOOK BY ITS COVER , JAKE YOU ARE TOO YOUNG TO BE MAKING PRE CONCEIVED NOTIONS OF OTHERS IN THIS DAY AND AGE.......open you heart and mind and you will go far in this world.

That's really hypocritical, Gambit. You tell me don't judge a book by it's cover and yet you tell me that I'm too young to make preceonceived notions about somebody. But here's the thing, you've never met me before.

I may be 16 but I'm not stupid. You're basically telling me that I don't have the intelligence to tell who acts arrogant and has horrible character traits. I have met A LOT of football players over the years and not just Redskins. But then, there are those who choose to be arrogant and reject the fact that there are fans there that want their auttograph and would like to talk to them.

Having saying that we don't know him isn't making much of a statement. When fans make statements like "he is arrogant", they say that because that's all the fans have to go by. 99% of the fans will never get to meet the players or spend a day in their shoes.

It's also hypocritical to tell us to not talk trash about one of your players when, on the other hand, you talk plenty of trash regarding ours.

Edit: Oh yeah, what IS the right age to start making preconceived notions? Isn't it wrong to do it at any age?
I can't wait until you tell me because then I can start counting the days.

The right age is ummmmmm NEVER.....and when I am pretty sure when i talk about redskin player(s), I am just stating facts or what i have seen or experienced. I dont think I have said one player on the skins is stuck up,arrogant, mean spirited, a jerk, a homo, lazy or anything else that I dont know to be true. Oh and when you say thats what the fans go by, well ihave met alot of Jets fan that love Keyshawn up in good Ole NY.

gambit187 wrote:well ihave met alot of Jets fan that love Keyshawn up in good Ole NY.

They also love Jeremy Shcokey. What's your point?

Jets fans love Shockey?

KEYSHAWN LIVING IN THE PAST?



Word out of Big D is that receiver Keyshawn Johnson, who was traded to the Cowboys after getting sent home in November by the Bucs last season, isn't looking very good in offseason drills.



In the opinion of one league source, Johnson appears to be "living off of his hype."



It remains to be seen whether and to what extent coach Bill Parcells will tolerate Johnson if he doesn't step it up. Their history together, including several successful seasons in New York, suggests to us that the Tuna will be patient -- at least until the regular season starts.



And Johnson's spot in the starting lineup is by no means etched in stone, given that holdovers Terry Glenn and Antonio Bryant are looking sharp to date.

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

thought i'd throw this in there just to shpice things up. it's in writing, so it must be true.

General Failure wrote:Jets fans love Shockey?

My apologies. New York Giants fans love Jeremy Shcokey, and I think everyone can agree that he is an arrogant poopy head.

I would like to say this about Keyshawn. For all his antics there is one thing I respect him for: his blocking. That dude gets after it. In fact, he is probably the best blocking wide reciever in the league since Cris Carter retired...

Gambit, you don't go around saying players are arrogant, but we all have guys that we don't like on any team.

Also, I didn't say EVERY fan goes by what they see.