The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

classic - guys have to lose their jobs after this - some think that firing coaches is a knee jerk reaction

anyone under Snyder that doesn't do their jobs as well as they're capable should not be a part of this franchise

SkinsJock wrote:

aswas71788 wrote:Well, that seals it for the Giants. I was really glad to see Gruden come here but now he needs to leave.

you obviously didn't get the memo - there's a bunch of fans here that want to keep things the same - it's not the FO and it's not the coaching

we just have had some bad luck and things will turn around here .. maybe not soon but eventually ...

We had something going... Maybe a full reset is in order; if thats the case prepare for disaster next year and few wins if any

SkinsJock wrote:see ya - you're embarrassing yourself - I'd love for you to meet anyone in the armed service and refer to our anthem as "The f$ck song"

you're on the blocked list - bye ass

I was in the armed services for twenty years. That doesn't obligate me to call this the land of the free and the home of the brave when all evidence is to the contrary. The land of the free would allow players to kneel during the national anthem. The brave would sign Colin Kaepernick. Being blocked because you'd rather not think about why the Redskins organization is a festering pile of *sh$t* from top to bottom doesn't bother me. I've been waiting for you to add something of value to the conversation for years. It never happens.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:see ya - you're embarrassing yourself - I'd love for you to meet anyone in the armed service and refer to our anthem as "The f$ck song"

you're on the blocked list - bye ass

I was in the armed services for twenty years. That doesn't obligate me to call this the land of the free and the home of the brave when all evidence is to the contrary. The land of the free would allow players to kneel during the national anthem. The brave would sign Colin Kaepernick. Being blocked because you'd rather not think about why the Redskins organization is a festering pile of *sh$t* from top to bottom doesn't bother me. I've been waiting for you to add something of value to the conversation for years. It never happens.

As a fellow veteran of 21 years I fully support your stance! What I've never understood is veterans/civilians who don't afford that same freedom to NFL teams who exercise their freedom of who they want and don't want to employ. Were you "free" to protest the flag in your employers uniform when you served?

Anyone who thinks the Skins would have won if Johnson started (or Kaepernick for that matter) doesn’t know football!! This was a HS game with a running clock, Johnson got to come in and play against the vanilla JV team!
Blame injuries all you want, injuries don’t cause 10 men on the field, false starts and a host of other mental errors. This team was not prepared to play a game yesterday…That is squarely on Gruden!!

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

welch wrote:Gruden could have signed Colin Kaepernick to back up Colt McCoy. He would know some plays by now. Instead...Josh Johnson, on grounds that Johnson can run a little?

No, on the grounds that Johnson won't kneel during the national anthem. They'd rather get their asses handed to them by the Giants than suffer the indignity of their QB kneeling for a meaningless propaganda song that has no business being played at sporting events in the first place.

DEHog wrote:As a fellow veteran of 21 years I fully support your stance! What I've never understood is veterans/civilians who don't afford that same freedom to NFL teams who exercise their freedom of who they want and don't want to employ. Were you "free" to protest the flag in your employers uniform when you served?

Our oath was to the Constitution, Brother, not the flag. Having said that we agreed to the UCMJ and refusing a direct order to salute the flag would have been insubordination.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

DEHog wrote:As a fellow veteran of 21 years I fully support your stance! What I've never understood is veterans/civilians who don't afford that same freedom to NFL teams who exercise their freedom of who they want and don't want to employ. Were you "free" to protest the flag in your employers uniform when you served?

Our oath was to the Constitution, Brother, not the flag. Having said that we agreed to the UCMJ and refusing a direct order to salute the flag would have been insubordination.

And what was present during taking the oath? I do respect a person right to kneel, but I can't have it both way, I also have to respect a person's right to not want to employ that person...both are responsible for and have to suffer the consequences of their actions.

IF we keep doing what we've been doing and adding great players regardless of fit and having them be coached by guys like Jay Gruden that are the best you can get because nobody wants to come work here this franchise is going to continue to win 8 or less games no matter who the QB is

IF we don't bring in a new President and GM and give them the authority to manage this franchise it doesn't matter if we have the best HC and the best QB - we're going to continue to be a mediocre franchise - this is who we are under Dan Snyder's management



things aren't suddenly going to get better here - it's going to take a while to fix this mess but that is better than just continuing to be mediocre

DEHog wrote:

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

DEHog wrote:As a fellow veteran of 21 years I fully support your stance! What I've never understood is veterans/civilians who don't afford that same freedom to NFL teams who exercise their freedom of who they want and don't want to employ. Were you "free" to protest the flag in your employers uniform when you served?

Our oath was to the Constitution, Brother, not the flag. Having said that we agreed to the UCMJ and refusing a direct order to salute the flag would have been insubordination.

And what was present during taking the oath? I do respect a person right to kneel, but I can't have it both way, I also have to respect a person's right to not want to employ that person...both are responsible for and have to suffer the consequences of their actions.

Agreed but in order to legally have a leg upon which to stand it has to be in the contract before it is signed that such behavior is required. That way players know whether or not to sign the agreement. The NFL is trying to create ex post facto law. Teams can release players for not standing for the anthem but they will have to pay the players according to their contract terms. The difference is we knew that flag was part of the contracts we signed. For the record I love that for which the flag is supposed to stand. It's the politicization of it as being patriotism that bothers me. A flag is not patriotism. A flag is a symbol. Like the swastika it represents different things to different people. To Colin Kaepernick and many others it is a constant reminder of how what we claim to be is not what we are. Liberty and justice for all, you say? I wish more Americans understood I and many others fought for our rights to do any damn thing we want as long as it doesn't infringe upon the rights of the next person to do the same. I didn't fight for a bible or a flag or any other symbol. I fought for your right to say things I don't have to agree with or even like hearing. My right to have the flag bronzed should not interfere with your right to wipe your ass with it if you so choose. The flag has absolutely nothing to do with playing the game of football. It's not an essential job function to stand for the national anthem. Frankly, I think they would be doing us all a favor to stop that nonsense before meaningless sporting events.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:
Agreed but in order to legally have a leg upon which to stand it has to be in the contract before it is signed that such behavior is required. That way players know whether or not to sign the agreement. The NFL is trying to create ex post facto law. Teams can release players for not standing for the anthem but they will have to pay the players according to their contract terms. The difference is we knew that flag was part of the contracts we signed. For the record I love that for which the flag is supposed to stand. It's the politicization of it as being patriotism that bothers me. A flag is not patriotism. A flag is a symbol. Like the swastika it represents different things to different people. To Colin Kaepernick and many others it is a constant reminder of how what we claim to be is not what we are. Liberty and justice for all, you say? I wish more Americans understood I and many others fought for our rights to do any damn thing we want as long as it doesn't infringe upon the rights of the next person to do the same. I didn't fight for a bible or a flag or any other symbol. I fought for your right to say things I don't have to agree with or even like hearing. My right to have the flag bronzed should not interfere with your right to wipe your ass with it if you so choose. The flag has absolutely nothing to do with playing the game of football. It's not an essential job function to stand for the national anthem. Frankly, I think they would be doing us all a favor to stop that nonsense before meaningless sporting events.

Well said, I agree with just about all that you said. If the flag/anthem is not all that you say, why did CK use it to protest? I think if he could change things he would choose another venue to conduct his protest. I think had he done so the NFL would have applauded him. You don't see the NFL punishing Ben Watson for being very outspoken...I don't know many employers who would be happy about their employees protesting on company time and pissing off half their customer base?? Another issue and I believe it may be the biggest issue for not signing CK is that Alex is here. I don't think you bring in CK while Alex is still your QB of the future. They have a history and I'm sure Alex wouldn't feel comfortable with him here.

DEHog wrote:

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:
Agreed but in order to legally have a leg upon which to stand it has to be in the contract before it is signed that such behavior is required. That way players know whether or not to sign the agreement. The NFL is trying to create ex post facto law. Teams can release players for not standing for the anthem but they will have to pay the players according to their contract terms. The difference is we knew that flag was part of the contracts we signed. For the record I love that for which the flag is supposed to stand. It's the politicization of it as being patriotism that bothers me. A flag is not patriotism. A flag is a symbol. Like the swastika it represents different things to different people. To Colin Kaepernick and many others it is a constant reminder of how what we claim to be is not what we are. Liberty and justice for all, you say? I wish more Americans understood I and many others fought for our rights to do any damn thing we want as long as it doesn't infringe upon the rights of the next person to do the same. I didn't fight for a bible or a flag or any other symbol. I fought for your right to say things I don't have to agree with or even like hearing. My right to have the flag bronzed should not interfere with your right to wipe your ass with it if you so choose. The flag has absolutely nothing to do with playing the game of football. It's not an essential job function to stand for the national anthem. Frankly, I think they would be doing us all a favor to stop that nonsense before meaningless sporting events.

Well said, I agree with just about all that you said. If the flag/anthem is not all that you say, why did CK use it to protest? I think if he could change things he would choose another venue to conduct his protest. I think had he done so the NFL would have applauded him. You don't see the NFL punishing Ben Watson for being very outspoken...I don't know many employers who would be happy about their employees protesting on company time and pissing off half their customer base?? Another issue and I believe it may be the biggest issue for not signing CK is that Alex is here. I don't think you bring in CK while Alex is still your QB of the future. They have a history and I'm sure Alex wouldn't feel comfortable with him here.

I don't want to put words into Kaepernick's mouth but I think he's smart enough to know that simple-minded people are the reason for injustice and simple-minded people care far more about disrespecting the flag so it is far more likely to get their attention kneeling for the national anthem on a national stage than it is holding a kumbaya meeting at his house during the off-season. I'm not saying the NFL should be happy about "half" of their fans being pissy but the NFL has far bigger issues than the flag and the anthem. I've also read that dissent is the highest form of patriotism from all of the Framers and Founders people like to quote out of context so the self-labeled patriots upset about flag disrespect should be supporting Kaepernick. It takes a tremendous amount of bravery to place one's personal values above one's own personal safety and security. It has also been said those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. I don't know if Alex will play another snap in the NFL. He's 34, he's had a Joe Theismann type injury. He has a post-surgical infection. I just don't think the team can afford to base their decisions on whether or not Alex Smith is on the roster. They're paying him either way so he has nothing about which to complain.

Nothing this team does ever makes any empirical sense. Everything is a snap judgment from rationalization. The signing of Alex Smith was a snap judgment. You don't sign a 34 year old stopgap quarterback to a fully guaranteed injury contract. That's bad business. The latest in two decades of bad business practices. Kaepernick is 31 so he's not exactly a spring chicken but he's more likely to accept any role because he's demonstrated football is not his top priority. He can take it or leave it and the Redskins need him more than he needs them.