The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

markshark84 wrote:This all being said, Gruden is still going to be our guy in 2016.

His contract alone says that's the case. I can't see us paying a guy $15 million not to coach, and then pay another $x million for a new head coach.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:let's be clear

Why start now?

PulpExposure wrote:

markshark84 wrote:This all being said, Gruden is still going to be our guy in 2016.

His contract alone says that's the case. I can't see us paying a guy $15 million not to coach, and then pay another $x million for a new head coach.

Agree, but that hasn't stopped Danny boy before. The HC contract doesn't go against the cap and Danny doesn't understand the concept of money. That being said, I think that it would take a VERY special candidate in order for our FO to make a move --- and there isn't one.

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:let's be clear

Why start now?

#savage

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:let's be clear

Why start now?

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:let's be clear

Why start now?

I like to be different - especially with those that require a little 'help' ...

and especially with smart asses

riggofan wrote:

mastdark81 wrote:For a coach that is 10-19 there are 100s of college coaches available and a dozen NFL guys ready. Jay Gruden is not my friend he is replaceable.

Good point. Ron Rivera was 13-19 after his first two seasons with the Panthers. They should have gotten rid of him while they had the chance.

There are always exceptions to the rule, but I can name 5x the amount of coaches who did not have success in their first 2 seasons thats were worse their 3rd.

Big difference is Ron was 6-10 with a ROOKIE qb that many felt couldnt learn a Prostyle system in a solid division at the time. Secondly, you remember Ron the player or better yet Ron the coordinator? He is a defensive mind. At 6-10 his defense while not great was the strength on the team.

Second year Ron was 7-9 and his defense was one of the best Defense in the league. They lacked off talent and still do. But he had faith in his qb stuck with him and his values and they look to be on right track.

On our end Jay was 4-12 and looked clueless his first year. Things that once were a strength no longer was...brought in to improve a 3rd year qb and failed with pretty good talent on offense.

6-7 should be 8-5 at least, yet I feel he has improved as a coach...but maybe not to put him in my mind as a future SuperBowl winning coach..if you watched the games. Again Im not saying fire him bc he is a young coach that can improve too, im just saying he is replaceable.

Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

just my opinion - hopefully, Scot is in charge here ... I have faith in his judgement of what will be best for us going forward - I don't think that Jay Gruden being the HC here for another year or 2 is a really bad thing either - there's a bunch of guys that could come in and do as well - I'm really hoping we don't have to find a QB

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

just my opinion - hopefully, Scot is in charge here ... I have faith in his judgement of what will be best for us going forward - I don't think that Jay Gruden being the HC here for another year or 2 is a really bad thing either - there's a bunch of guys that could come in and do as well - I'm really hoping we don't have to find a QB

Yea, Gruden really needs to step up his game. I mean, never mind we've had six or more wins only four times in the last decade, including this season. Never mind Shanahan, Zorn, Spurrier, and Gibbs all had seasons with fewer wins. Never mind the last coach to not have a losing season with the Redskins was Marty Schottenheimer, right before Dan Snyder summarily dismissed him for the aforementioned Spurrier. Never mind RGIII isn't a pocket passer and the team got lucky with having Kirk Cousins on the roster thanks to the also summarily dismissed Shanahan.

Scot McCloughan is in charge. That's not a thought. It's a fact. He wouldn't have taken the job otherwise.

We don't have to find a quarterback. The one starting right now is the best one the team has had since Mark Brunell. Get over it.

What is the point of a post that criticizes Gruden at every turn and then concludes that his being here another season or two isn't a bad thing? He is going to be here another season at minimum. Get over that, too.

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

Oh my god man, just stop while you're ahead!

Any question how Scot McCloughan feels about his head coach today?

riggofan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

Oh my god man, just stop while you're ahead!

Any question how Scot McCloughan feels about his head coach today?

Nice pic.

I'm not 'ahead' or 'behind' - I'm just NOT a Jay Gruden fan and I could care less whether he's here next year or not ...

I am liking what I'm seeing here this season and I like the obvious enthusiasm - I just happen to think we might be even better ......

I'm fine with Jay Gruden staying here - I'd be happier if we had a different HC

it's not a big deal to me ...

As much as I think Jay Gruden is a moron and way in over his head and the Redskins being on the precipice of a playoff appearance is actually due to other team's failures and not Gruden actually being remotely a decent HC, I don't think you cant fire a guy if he wins the division.

Cousins' very impressive stat line today doesn't do anything to remove the fact that he disappears against good competition. Kirk's noodle arm barely got it to DJax but he is a great WR and he his great play can mask the physical limitations of his QB (see just 1 week ago on MNF). But 5 TDs is 5 TDs and he hasn't been throwing picks.

Unfortunately, Gruden will never take us anywhere. The crazy NFC East should have naturally eliminated this guy by NFL Darwinism but unless the Iggles beat us next week and take over first place, we will be stuck with him and his static style for a bit longer until everyone can see his incompetence. Cousins remains fool's gold, but when he plays crap teams or teams going in the wrong direction, he is shiny. Hopefully they do not commit too much money in him.

Too bad, it's looking like Sean Payton would have been available. That would be a great coach to have. Who would have thought Tony Romo's injury would have screwed the Redskins so badly and left us with an Arena Coach and a Great B-U QB who can't get it done against good teams? So Sad.

riggofan wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

Oh my god man, just stop while you're ahead!

Any question how Scot McCloughan feels about his head coach today?

Looks to me like Jay likes Scot more than the other way around. "You gave me a team and saved my ass!"

hitmandm wrote:As much as I think Jay Gruden is a moron and way in over his head and the Redskins being on the precipice of a playoff appearance is actually due to other team's failures and not Gruden actually being remotely a decent HC, I don't think you cant fire a guy if he wins the division.

Cousins' very impressive stat line today doesn't do anything to remove the fact that he disappears against good competition. Kirk's noodle arm barely got it to DJax but he is a great WR and he his great play can mask the physical limitations of his QB (see just 1 week ago on MNF). But 5 TDs is 5 TDs and he hasn't been throwing picks.

Unfortunately, Gruden will never take us anywhere. The crazy NFC East should have naturally eliminated this guy by NFL Darwinism but unless the Iggles beat us next week and take over first place, we will be stuck with him and his static style for a bit longer until everyone can see his incompetence. Cousins remains fool's gold, but when he plays crap teams or teams going in the wrong direction, he is shiny. Hopefully they do not commit too much money in him.

Too bad, it's looking like Sean Payton would have been available. That would be a great coach to have. Who would have thought Tony Romo's injury would have screwed the Redskins so badly and left us with an Arena Coach and a Great B-U QB who can't get it done against good teams? So Sad.

Dude. Really?

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

SkinsJock wrote:Jay Gruden has not done well enough this season - this franchise is all about accountability and he has not stepped up
plus, I'm still mad that he did not handle the QB situation V well at all and that was a big reason he was brought in ...

just my opinion - hopefully, Scot is in charge here ... I have faith in his judgement of what will be best for us going forward - I don't think that Jay Gruden being the HC here for another year or 2 is a really bad thing either - there's a bunch of guys that could come in and do as well - I'm really hoping we don't have to find a QB

Yea, Gruden really needs to step up his game. I mean, never mind we've had six or more wins only four times in the last decade, including this season. Never mind Shanahan, Zorn, Spurrier, and Gibbs all had seasons with fewer wins. Never mind the last coach to not have a losing season with the Redskins was Marty Schottenheimer, right before Dan Snyder summarily dismissed him for the aforementioned Spurrier. Never mind RGIII isn't a pocket passer and the team got lucky with having Kirk Cousins on the roster thanks to the also summarily dismissed Shanahan.

Scot McCloughan is in charge. That's not a thought. It's a fact. He wouldn't have taken the job otherwise.

We don't have to find a quarterback. The one starting right now is the best one the team has had since Mark Brunell. Get over it.

What is the point of a post that criticizes Gruden at every turn and then concludes that his being here another season or two isn't a bad thing? He is going to be here another season at minimum. Get over that, too.

If you haven’t guest by now I started this thread to prove a point. I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

DEHog wrote:If you haven’t guest by now I started this thread to prove a point. I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

But you're killing the Gruden hater / RGIII apologist narrative.

DEHog wrote:If you haven’t guest by now I started this thread to prove a point. I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

Agreed - the key ingredient here is Scot McCloughan & the FO continuing to help this franchise get better - we are on a good path and hopefully we have the QB and HC back here for another season - I have faith that Scot will make things better here no matter who is playing or coaching

I really hope that Cousins is playing QB here because we've seen a lot of growth - and he has taken full advantage of his opportunity

SkinsJock wrote:I really hope that Cousins is playing QB here because we've seen a lot of growth

That's one way to put it. Another way to put it is that we've seen Cousins break three franchise records.

Move over, Jason Campbell. With an eight-yard pass to Matt Jones late in the first half of Sunday’s 35-25 win over the Bills, Kirk Cousins became the new Redskins record-holder for completions in a season with 336 and counting.

Step aside, Mark Rypien, Jay Schroeder and Sonny Jurgensen. With his sixth 300-yard passing game of 2015, Cousins broke the franchise single-season record he previously shared with that trio.

Cousins also joined Rypien, Trent Green and Norm Snead as the only Redskins quarterbacks since 1960 to throw for at least four touchdowns and run for at least one touchdown in a game. League-wide, that’s been done 36 times since 1960, including once by Jim Zorn in 1977. Newton has never done it.

He's also just two rushing TDs from tying RG3's franchise record which kind of surprised me.

Not taking a dig at you, SJ. The guy is playing really good football this year and has the potential to be even better. Its okay to enjoy it!

I like Jay Gruden, Kirk Cousins and Robert Griffin III ... mainly because they're all a part of the Washington Redskins

I'm really encouraged about what we're seeing from Kirk Cousins and I have a lot of faith in Scot & the FO making sure we bring him back and they will surround him with the best available players and coaches

Burgundy&GoldForever wrote:

DEHog wrote:If you haven’t guest by now I started this thread to prove a point. I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

But you're killing the Gruden hater / RGIII apologist narrative.

Not sure that will ever happen!

DEHog wrote:If you haven’t guest by now I started this thread to prove a point. I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

Agreed. Sean Payton might be the one coach who could unseat Gruden this offseason, but for any number of reasons I doubt it will happen.

On quarterbacks, I don't see how anyone could have watched the last 5-6 weeks of Redskins football and think that there is any better option for us at QB going into the offseason than Captain Kirk.

If Gruden is let go after next season or the one after, I'd be willing to be Washington will be seen as a highly desirable job. Somewhere a good coach can step in and immediately start competing at the highest level.

DEHog wrote: ... I’ve seen no real viable options posted for this team going forward next year. Getting rid of Gruden, Cousins or both would IMO set this team back yet again? With SM picking the talent and the 5-6 players we have coming back off IR this team is poise to continue to get better. And IF Gruden isn’t the coach to get them to the next level at least SM will have a much better product (and organizational structure) to attract a new coach.

to answer that question - No! Keeping Kirk Cousins is a big priority but keeping Jay Gruden is not as much a set back as some here might think
if Scot thinks that another HC would help both Kirk Cousins and this franchise, I'm fine with that

Kirk Cousins growth & play has been outstanding but also a bit limited by Jay Gruden's being over-protective & his game calling - I'm hopeful we can keep Cousins but I'll be OK either way as far as Gruden is concerned - we're getting better because of Scot, regardless - even though it's only been a relatively short time, I think this franchise is now looked at differently & we could indeed be more 'attractive' to a really good HC

Irn-Bru wrote:Agreed. Sean Payton might be the one coach who could unseat Gruden this offseason, but for any number of reasons I doubt it will happen.

Maybe that's true, not sure. I've never been a big fan of Payton personally. Probably because of the Dallas thing.

SkinsJock wrote:Kirk Cousins growth & play has been outstanding but also a bit limited by Jay Gruden's being over-protective & his game calling

Give me a break, man. This is the QB who was benched last year for his interception meltdowns, the same QB you felt compelled to call "Capt. Pick" for half this season. This is the QB that his COACH stuck his neck on the line for, benching a very high profile player and putting his own job even more at risk.

Was his play calling more conservative earlier this year? Of course it was. Why wouldn't it be? Cousins was basically a first year starter, given limited off season work with a VERY shaky hold on the job. He was 100% correct in his conservative approach and the proof is in what we've seen on the field the past six weeks.

Its ridiculous that you can't give his COACH some credit for developing him this year. Sour grapes.