Skins @ Pats post game (dropped balls - check the pressure)

[SkinsJock]

we all knew two weeks ago that we would lose this game and people would immediately be on here complaining that it was Kirk Cousins' fault. ... We got beat by a team that is light years beyond us at this point. Let's not be stupid about it.

not sure that there are many here complaining about Kirk Cousins play or that it was Kirk Cousins' fault

I'm just pissed with how we played - we were down 14-0 and had run 1 play on offense - GIVE ME A BREAK

as far as Kirk Cousins is concerned, he's playing well ... hooray for Captain Kirk Cousins - we don't need a QB that can play well or is a capable starting QB or, as OldSchool says "he's composed out there .." are you freaking kidding me - go be a starting QB for the Browns -- we want a freaking leader as a QB - this is the Redskins we don't just want a QB we want a leader

I want to see him encouraging his players when it's time and getting on them when that is needed - TAKE THE NEXT STEP

[riggofan]

I want to see him getting upset that his WRs are dropping the ball or his HC is calling all these pass plays - be the leader of the team & encourage or cajole your teammates - set the example

So basically, you want him to go the Griffin route and throw his teammates and coaches under the bus. That's leadership???

[riggofan]

as far as Kirk Cousins is concerned, he's playing well ... hooray for Captain Kirk Cousins - we don't need a QB that can play well or is a capable starting QB or, as OldSchool says "he's composed out there .." are you freaking kidding me - go be a starting QB for the Browns -- we want a freaking leader as a QB - this is the Redskins we don't just want a QB we want a leader

I want to see him encouraging his players when it's time and getting on them when that is needed - TAKE THE NEXT STEP

I get that you're frustrated, but your criticism is just goofy. We didn't lose yesterday because Kirk wasn't a good enough cheerleader.

You know what Kirk Cousins needs to do? Go out this Sunday and execute against a terrible New Orleans Saints defense.

[Deadskins]

Yes he played well, but those around him did not. He should be in their ear and letting them know he expects more. You know, be a leader.

Wow, now his leadership skills are being questioned. This is hilarious. In a game where Cousins played well, and the offense let him down, it's still somehow Kirk's fault due to lack of leadership.

He should have just came out and said this in the post game presser, "It doesn’t take one guy, and that’s proven. If you want to look at the good teams in this league and the great quarterbacks, the Peytons and the Aaron Rodgers, those guys don’t play well if their guys don’t play well. They don’t." You know, leadership.

Not what I said at all. This type of thing definitely needs to be kept "in house." And, I'm not calling for RGIII here, either. You asked a question, and I answered it. That is all.

[StorminMormon86]

Yes he played well, but those around him did not. He should be in their ear and letting them know he expects more. You know, be a leader.

Wow, now his leadership skills are being questioned. This is hilarious. In a game where Cousins played well, and the offense let him down, it's still somehow Kirk's fault due to lack of leadership.

He should have just came out and said this in the post game presser, "It doesn’t take one guy, and that’s proven. If you want to look at the good teams in this league and the great quarterbacks, the Peytons and the Aaron Rodgers, those guys don’t play well if their guys don’t play well. They don’t." You know, leadership.

Not what I said at all. This type of thing definitely needs to be kept "in house." And, I'm not calling for RGIII here, either. You asked a question, and I answered it. That is all.

How do you know he isn't doing this?

[Deadskins]

Yes he played well, but those around him did not. He should be in their ear and letting them know he expects more. You know, be a leader.

Players lead in different ways. Cousins leads by example. He does his job. That's a good way to lead. I don't know that open hostility toward other players would achieve better results.

Who's talking about hostility? And different players require different motivation. Some require a stick, and some a carrot. I have no idea that Kirk didn't speak to anyone about picking up their play, though they didn't show him on the sidelines talking to anyone. SM asked a question, and I answered it. He asked what Kirk should have done, and I gave an option. Again, not arguing for RGIII to start, just want Kirk to step up and take ownership of the team.

[Countertrey]

You can have that BS - get me a QB that looks like a leader and get your story straight ...

Awwww, Jocko, this is a complete load. Cousins was on his game... SEVEN passes, each of which would have extended drives, dropped by receivers. 2 plays when the receiver did not run the route Cousins expected... He cannot do both.

This was absolutely not on Cousins.

[Burgundy&GoldForever]

Yes he played well, but those around him did not. He should be in their ear and letting them know he expects more. You know, be a leader.

Players lead in different ways. Cousins leads by example. He does his job. That's a good way to lead. I don't know that open hostility toward other players would achieve better results.

Who's talking about hostility? And different players require different motivation. Some require a stick, and some a carrot. I have no idea that Kirk didn't speak to anyone about picking up their play, though they didn't show him on the sidelines talking to anyone. SM asked a question, and I answered it. He asked what Kirk should have done, and I gave an option. Again, not arguing for RGIII to start, just want Kirk to step up and take ownership of the team.

Yes, and I am asking how you think he should do that. He hasn't earned the right to speak and have everyone else shut up yet. What should he do to lead, other than what he is doing by example, and where is the imaginary line he could wind up crossing with certain players? Vets don't typically take kindly to being told anything by players with less experience. It's easier to sell yourself as a leader when you're winning games. When you're losing it's dangerous to stand in a locker room and blame anyone other than yourself, whether it's actually your fault or not.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Ironically, Kirk gets the pass because of drops, and the Pats being unbeatable... Those aren't excuses, only if it were RG3 would those be excuses?

The double standard on here is what irks me the most... When I was posting similar posts defending Griffs play (Garçons drop, Niles fumbles etc etc) I was getting out on blast by the exact same posters who are doing what I did for their guy! Lmmfao the hypocrisy is hilarious.

I think the truth lies some where in between the two sides here...
While Kirk would've obviously benefited from less "drops" , I think his touch could've been better too. He was leading Crowder to a body bag on one drop, put to much mustard on a few short pass (unnecessarily so) , and had a few sail high on him. I think the ~50% completion percentage is on his receivers as well him, but he did a fair job; and isn't the "reason" we lost.
That said, the Ds are stopping the run and daring Kirk to beat em with his arm. He hasn't been accurate on intermediate to deep passes, and we MUST get that going in order to open up the run. I think we are dead last (or close) in pass plays over 20 yards, that is on coach and Kirk, not his wrs or the oline.

So while Kirk didn't do awful yesterday, he also isn't above criticism. We made the Pats depleted D look like the legion of boom yesterday, and that's on everyone involved.


*Kirk needs to find a way to let the wild man "You like THAT?! YOU like that!!!" Out more often, and not wait until after a horrible play like the sack strip fumble for 6 that possessed him 2 weeks ago. We lacked mojo, confidence, and fire on O. Even after a big momentum shift and/or turnover we would still come out stale, no good

[StorminMormon86]

Ironically, Kirk gets the pass because of drops, and the Pats being unbeatable... Those aren't excuses, only if it were RG3 would those be excuses?

No, if Griffin had the same identical game that Cousins did against the Pats, he too would be absolved, IMO.

The double standard on here is what irks me the most... When I was posting similar posts defending Griffs play (Garçons drop, Niles fumbles etc etc) I was getting out on blast by the exact same posters who are doing what I did for their guy! Lmmfao the hypocrisy is hilarious.

Come on, the Garcon drop was during the preseason. The Niles fumble was a horrid pass from Griffin. There is no hypocrisy here, unless you are viewing this through a lens which just shows bias for Cousins/Griffin. There was never a game played by Griffin like the one Cousins had yesterday. Whereas the offense looked inept all day despite good throws from the QB. So you cannot compare the two.

I think the truth lies some where in between... While Kirk would've obviously benefited from less "drops" I think his touch could've been better too. He was leading Crowder to a body bag on one drop, put to much mustard on a few short pass (unnecessarily so) , and had a few sail high on him. I think the ~50% completion percentage is on his receivers as well him, but he did a fair job, and isn't the "reason" we lost. That said, the Ds are stopping the run and daring Kirk to beat em with his arm. He hasn't been accurate on intermediate to deep passes, and we MUST get that going in order to open up the run. I think we are dead last (or close) in pass plays over 20 yards, that is on coach and Kirk, not his wrs or the oline.

We literally just got Jackson back for the first time. Jackson is our only deep threat. That's why the Skins are dead last. And that Carrier pass was right on the money.

So while Kirk didn't do awful yesterday, he also isn't above criticism. We made the Pats depleted D look like the legion of boom yesterday, and that's on everyone involved

And to touch on your "hypocrisy" point, if Griffin played yesterday, I can guarantee you that this would have never been uttered.

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

You can't guarantee Jack bud. Kirk wasn't anything special yesterday. The drops weren't all on his wrs. Griffin sure has put up decent games and lost like vs HOU last year, and losses because of his play makers...

My point is that the qb play was far from excellent yesterday, so let's not pretend it was. I accept that the biases will continue, and that I'll have to just laugh at the excuse kettle that was calling me a pot for the same reason.

Again, Kirk did ok yesterday- we just need better then that to win, especially vs the top tier teams

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

Carrier pass was def a good one... The fact that coach drew that up for HIM is partly the problem. Reed or Garçon or Thompson or Crowder or Ross make that catch, not our blocking TE.

[Deadskins]

Who's talking about hostility? And different players require different motivation. Some require a stick, and some a carrot. I have no idea that Kirk didn't speak to anyone about picking up their play, though they didn't show him on the sidelines talking to anyone. SM asked a question, and I answered it. He asked what Kirk should have done, and I gave an option. Again, not arguing for RGIII to start, just want Kirk to step up and take ownership of the team.

Yes, and I am asking how you think he should do that. He hasn't earned the right to speak and have everyone else shut up yet. What should he do to lead, other than what he is doing by example, and where is the imaginary line he could wind up crossing with certain players? Vets don't typically take kindly to being told anything by players with less experience. It's easier to sell yourself as a leader when you're winning games. When you're losing it's dangerous to stand in a locker room and blame anyone other than yourself, whether it's actually your fault or not.

First, when you are the starting QB, everyone pays attention to what you have to say, regardless of how long you have been playing, so yes, he has earned that right. But it isn't like Kirk is a rookie, either. Also, I didn't say he should call individuals out or anything like that. There's nothing wrong with addressing the team, and saying everyone needs to pick up their game, including me. You know they are all thinking the same thing, so when your team's leader says it out loud, then you gotta respect that. I don't care if you've been in the league 20 years.

[riggofan]

The drops weren't all on his wrs.

WHAT????

You guys are freaking nuts.

[SkinsJock]

You can have that BS - get me a QB that looks like a leader and get your story straight ...

Awwww, Jocko, this is a complete load. Cousins was on his game... SEVEN passes, each of which would have extended drives, dropped by receivers. 2 plays when the receiver did not run the route Cousins expected... He cannot do both.

This was absolutely not on Cousins.

sorry 'trey - you're taking that comment out of context - I totally agree that there were an inordinate number of passes dropped - most of which were incredibly easy - had to be very frustrating and especially after the beginning which was not entirely his fault either - what I was referring to was that John Lynch referred to Kirk Cousins " he has a very good arm and looks set to be the Redskins starter for the future" ... OK? ... AND then he said "Kirk needs to take the next step and he has failed to do that ..." - IMO he mean't that Kirk needs to show clearly that he is the leader, he wants to be accountable and be all the things a starting QB needs to be - Lynch felt that Kirk was playing well this season but that he needs to do more than just play well in order to be a starting QB

Kirk played well yesterday, and he's played well some this season - if he just wants to be a starting QB that's OK, he is that, - he's clearly the best we have and he's better than many others - if he wants to be a good starting QB he needs to "take the next step" and show that he's not just a good back up QB who has a turnover issue ... .

btw - I have to believe that Belicheat called that onside kick play - that was insulting - YES, we should have recovered the kick, but to do that at that stage of the game was really putting the Redskins players and staff on notice - a "we do not respect you" play call IMO

[riggofan]

My point is that the qb play was far from excellent yesterday, so let's not pretend it was.

Is there somebody on here who is arguing that Cousins was excellent or "anything special"? I haven't seen that anywhere, but clearly he wasn't.

My biggest issue with Cousins yesterday is that I think he could have taken some shots downfield a few times but he was too conservative. The guys calling the game on the radio definitely pointed that out once or twice. I think its the downside of all of the interception criticism. Sometimes you have to take risks with the ball, especially in a game like that. Unfortunately for him, if he takes a shot and throws a pick the entire DMV goes ape-sh**.

[riggofan]

Cousins was on his game... SEVEN passes, each of which would have extended drives, dropped by receivers.

Drive killers, man. 100%. It affected everything you'd like to see the team do. We've seen the offense when they get a little rhythm going and start to move the ball. They never had a chance to get that going. Hurt the running backs too.

[OldSchool]

No one here knows what Kirk was saying in the huddle to his teammates. I think it is a plus Kirk stayed composed and didn't chew Carrier or any others out on the field.

RGBust fanboys are really reaching for things to complain about.

[SkinsJock]

you may be right riggofan - Kirk Cousins gets the opportunities to throw the ball long but he may be tentative because of the ramifications

He's clearly our starter here and he has 8 games to make the most of it - I'm not sure that Gruden will be back & maybe he doesn't want to ..

Kirk Cousins has shown glimpses of good play he just needs to become more consistent and show a little bit of leadership

[cowboykillerzRGiii]

The drops weren't all on his wrs.

WHAT????

You guys are freaking nuts.

There is no guyS it's me.. contrary to popular belief there is no alliance against cousins, like there is vs Griff. We all want Kirk to be elite , ok?

Blaming the drops for our loss and excusing Kirks day is freaking nuts.

Like u mentioned later about the deep ball, playing timid. But watch each drop and tell me that's 100% on the wr and u are lying.
Garçons was a little to hard for that short of a pass, no defender to slide it past so uncalled for. The Crowder drop was Kirk leading him into a concussion so I don't blame him for peeking up field. Carrier pass was pretty good, I seem to recall his balance being off so not sure if it was him adjusting to the pass or just that he is a blocking TE who doesn't normally lay out for 20+ yard passes.


Maybe it seems like I'm bashing Kirk.. I'm not intending to. Just not giving him a pass, just like RG3 never got a pass for his unit while he was out there .

[Burgundy&GoldForever]

First, when you are the starting QB, everyone pays attention to what you have to say, regardless of how long you have been playing, so yes, he has earned that right. But it isn't like Kirk is a rookie, either. Also, I didn't say he should call individuals out or anything like that. There's nothing wrong with addressing the team, and saying everyone needs to pick up their game, including me. You know they are all thinking the same thing, so when your team's leader says it out loud, then you gotta respect that. I don't care if you've been in the league 20 years.

I think you're right in that if he wants to demonstrate he plans on keeping the job long-term he should start getting some teammates' attention. Maybe a generic "Every one of us has to step up and do his job" and "We're only as good as our worst individual performance" type of banality would get some players to step up their games. Or maybe the team just needs to show a lot of folks the door this offseason.

[riggofan]

Just not giving him a pass, just like RG3 never got a pass for his unit while he was out there .

You've pretty clearly defined the basis of your opinion. Enough said.

[StorminMormon86]

You can't guarantee Jack bud. Kirk wasn't anything special yesterday. The drops weren't all on his wrs. Griffin sure has put up decent games and lost like vs HOU last year, and losses because of his play makers...

My point is that the qb play was far from excellent yesterday, so let's not pretend it was. I accept that the biases will continue, and that I'll have to just laugh at the excuse kettle that was calling me a pot for the same reason.

Again, Kirk did ok yesterday- we just need better then that to win, especially vs the top tier teams

Who has said Kirk was excellent yesterday? The majority of people have said that he was not the reason we lost, or the reason why we were never in the game to begin with.

And there was a ton of hypocrisy absolving Griffin's play for the past 3 years. For example:

Maybe if our special teams didn't crap the bed we could've seen more helu.. rgiii missed some throws but didn't lose this game... Or any of the others for that matter.

Stats don't tell all, but I really feel like Robert was one of the few players giving his all every Sunday.. once he is surrounded by people that do the same, we will see.more Ws.

let's let this play out a bit before we think he's not going to be a very good QB

It's to acknowledge that the team around him (or any qb you put back there) isn't quite championship material and our weaknesses even he can't cover up for ever.

Rgiii tried to force some things to help this craptastic team win, leading to UNCHARACTERISTIC ints but he put up more yards then any of the other read option qbs this year. You think Kap is playing better?? Doesn't matter if you view the cup half full or half empty if you don't like what's in the cup. Was he as fun as last year? No. As accurate as the most accurate rookie ever was last year? No. Was he awful? Not even close.

This TEAM is the problem... Qb is one of the very few positions we don't have to worry Bout

I really think that last season was a big wake up call for RG3 and he will do what he needs to to be the QB we all expect ...

Are you predisposed to root AGAINAST the starter? Not that I think u hate Griff, just think you have trouble accepting him playing well but not great.

Last year was up and down. He was decent. Middle of the pack on most stats, not as fun as the year before.. but not as terrible as some like to imagine.

Like wise, he played a lot better then people will give him credit for on Sunday. He executed the game plan to a T, very accurately short pass or not. If the whole team knows where the ball is gowing- then maybe the blockers get some heat on those screens or reverses?

Did he play lights out or amazing? Nope. Has anyone suggested as much? Nope.
Was hisbplay enough to win? Yes. Was he good at managing the game plan? Yes.
^by those accounts YES he did play good.

before we give up on this kid, someone needs to determine that it's either going to take too long or it's not going to happen ...

there are many here who are just anti RG3 and don't seem to want to give him a shot at playing here ...

it's going to take time to fix this mess - why not give some of these guys some more time to get better

you may be right but when I look at who we have at QB, I prefer RG3 ...

I could go on and on, but here's a few examples of the hypocrisy from the Griffin homers when comparing their games. And not surprisingly, Cousins doesn't get the same treatment.

[Deadskins]

My point is that the qb play was far from excellent yesterday, so let's not pretend it was.

Is there somebody on here who is arguing that Cousins was excellent or "anything special"?

OldSchool?

[StorminMormon86]

My point is that the qb play was far from excellent yesterday, so let's not pretend it was.

Is there somebody on here who is arguing that Cousins was excellent or "anything special"?

OldSchool?

Come on. Really?