The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

SouthLondonRedskin wrote:Yes, that's the ONLY reason they brought in Colt McCoy.

If they knew 100% Kirk is here for the season then they'd bring in a talent or a project type QB or someone with a similar style to RGIII (where is Pat White right now..?) instead of someone with starting experience that potentially may have to become the main backup.

For OTAs and training camp they may even add a 4th QB, but nothing that will affect the final roster (barring injury).

I see the point you're making, but its still just wild(ly unlikely) speculation, and I'll just have to disagree with your use of the word "only".

There is no unwritten rule that the third QB in training camp is supposed to be some project guy with no hope of making the roster. If you watched Gruden on Hard Knocks last year, you know that his three QBs going into camp were Dalton, Josh Johnson and John Skelton. They had a fourth guy who was more of the longshot/talent QB. Johnson and Skelton were both QBs with legit NFL experience who were battling for the backup job.

And yes, I do remember Pat White. He was the fourth QB in camp last year.

- Colt is a camp arm and up for evaluation
- Whomever they draft will be a camp arm and up for evaluation

IF someone is interested in Kirk and the stars align, we might ship him out if Colt/Draftee looks promising.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:- Colt is a camp arm and up for evaluation
- Whomever they draft will be a camp arm and up for evaluation

IF someone is interested in Kirk and the stars align, we might ship him out if Colt/Draftee looks promising.

Skins fans and media are crazy with the speculation. We could have signed Seneca Wallace, and we'd still be reading the same "What does this mean for Kirk Cousins?" articles. lol.

Seems pretty simple to me - we have a really good back up QB in Cousins - I really doubt that we're going to trade him - there's no reason to do that

The QB is the most important part of the franchise and we have a good back up - why would you 'give' that away ....

SkinsJock wrote:Seems pretty simple to me - we have a really good back up QB in Cousins - I really doubt that we're going to trade him - there's no reason to do that

The QB is the most important part of the franchise and we have a good back up - why would you 'give' that away ....

I totally agree ... and particularly for a 2nd round pick? No way would I trade him, unless he has already decided to leave next year to seek a starting job. Then, you might have to look at it.

Given the style of play RG3 is known for which puts him at risk, the #2 is a key spot, and consideration must be given to carrying 3 QB's on the roster for the same reason ... if Robert goes down ... even with a minor injury, you need that #3, because he could quickly become #2.

RayNAustin wrote:Given the style of play RG3 is known for which puts him at risk, the #2 is a key spot, and consideration must be given to carrying 3 QB's on the roster for the same reason ... if Robert goes down ... even with a minor injury, you need that #3, because he could quickly become #2.

Yeah I have been wondering about that too. I think CLL is right about McCoy being a camp arm, but for the reasons you wrote we're probably more likely than most teams to carry three QBs on the final roster.

http://riggosrag.com/2014/04/03/colt-mc ... -redskins/

Sums it up

I really like McCoy being a part of our depth. I'm huge on having depth at QB, RB and DB. That being said I'd put QB at the number concern and RG3, Cousins and McCoy will definitely help me sleep better at night when september hits.

Punu wrote:I really like McCoy being a part of our depth. I'm huge on having depth at QB, RB and DB. That being said I'd put QB at the number concern and RG3, Cousins and McCoy will definitely help me sleep better at night when september hits.

DING DING DING DING

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Punu sighting!

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Not too crazy about the pick up. Anybody who couldnt suit up for a National Championship I question his heart. He looked healthy on the sidelines while he was at Texas yet did not play.

The only thing that makes me happy about this signing is that it looks like we are preparing to trade Kirk for a draft pick or player.

HEROHAMO wrote:Not too crazy about the pick up. Anybody who couldnt suit up for a National Championship I question his heart. He looked healthy on the sidelines while he was at Texas yet did not play.
The only thing that makes me happy about this signing is that it looks like we are preparing to trade Kirk for a draft pick or player.

I don't see that at all - we need Griffin and Cousins - I do not see this pick up as anything more than a need for a 3rd QB ... at this time

what Colt did in the past is not at all relevant, .. all that matters is what he might contribute here - we need 3 QBs & we're NOT trading Cousins .... at this time

Id love to have RG3 and Cousins forever on our team. I just dont see that happening. Eventually Kirk is going to want to be a starter. You just cant have two starting QBs on your roster for very long. You have to eventually choose one of them. That decision will happen when Kirks contract comes up or if a team offers us a high draft choice for Kirk.

I just don't see Kirk Cousins being traded away at this time - maybe next season but not before this season

having a really good back up QB is much more important than adding 1 good player

we are not a player or 2 away from being a playoff contender - these FO guys are building for the future not just to make the team better ASAP

Colt was not brought in because we might get a great offer for Kirk - he's a #3 QB and is not likely to be here after the pre season unless something unforeseen happens

SkinsJock wrote:I just don't see Kirk Cousins being traded away at this time - maybe next season but not before this season

having a really good back up QB is much more important than adding 1 good player

we are not a player or 2 away from being a playoff contender - these FO guys are building for the future not just to make the team better ASAP

Colt was not brought in because we might get a great offer for Kirk - he's a #3 QB and is not likely to be here after the pre season unless something unforeseen happens

You know SkinsJock how can you make such an assumption? You have to wait until the season starts and see if Kirk is still on the Roster by then. You never know the Skins may get an offer for Kirk? Just saying...

I'm not 'assuming' anything ...

1 having a really good back up QB is very important to the franchise

2 Colt McCoy is not here as a possible #2 QB

HEROHAMO wrote:You know SkinsJock how can you make such an assumption? You have to wait until the season starts and see if Kirk is still on the Roster by then. You never know the Skins may get an offer for Kirk? Just saying...

I don't really get your argument, man. Its not an assumption on his part at all. SkinsJock is completely right that Colt McCoy was not brought in here BECAUSE we might get an offer for Cousins. We needed a 3rd QB in any case. Why does that have to have anything to do with possible trades for Cousins?

I completely agree with you that we may get an offer for Cousins this year. Who knows? But whether or not that happens, the team still needs a third QB for camp this year, and McCoy is the guy they've signed.

it's possible that Cousins could get traded but I really don't see that happening and as has been pointed out Colt McCoy was not brought in as a possible #2

if they do trade Cousins they are going to have to find a #2 QB

Cousins might not be a Redskin QB for much longer but I'd be surprised if he's not here this season

*flashes in for a brief message board appearance*

Why would the Redskins bring in Colt Mccoy, to shop Kirk Cousins, and then if they are successful, go get a number two?

That seems silly to me.

Look, if you are on the side that they brought Colt McCoy in to allow them to allow for a trade of Kirk Cousins if it arises, you CAN'T say with any certainty that they didn't bring Colt McCoy in to be the second QB, not in my opinion. They don't likely want to go through the rigamarole of finding another number two even later in the offseason process, if they DO get rid of Cousins. IMO, they're going to have McCoy be the backup if that happens.

And they'll likely only move Cousins for a second or 3rd round pick, so they can grab a quarterback that is serviceable there or anywhere else in the draft for a 'camp arm', so that isn't ALL Colt McCoy was brought in to be either.

I think the truth of it is, that you are ALL right.

1) Colt McCoy WAS brought in to be 'an arm' at camp.

2) An arm that is significant enough, that he CAN fill the number two role, if a good deal for Cousins pops up. He has career NFL starts under his belt - he qualifies, I assure you. You may not think the world of it, but there isn't much to suggest that he's much less capable than Kirk Cousins, is there?

3) if they don't get a deal, and they keep Cousins, not only do they have an arm at camp, but they have a soft enough contract that Colt can fill the clipboard carrying 3rd QB role. This guy isn't here to disappear either, so he has something to prove - even if its just that he has a good attitude, a good work ethic, and the desire to try and keep working for a shot... here OR somewhere else.

Cousins is a decent backup for sure - so i am sure that the Redskins will want to see a pretty high draft pick to run the risk of going in another direction at backup quarterback - after all, quarterback number one DID have pretty significant knee surgery.

Just one more thing to think about... if you concede that the backup in Washington IS more significant because of Bob's injury - then how do you not also at least think about the fact that another coach may not share the Shanahan philosophy of just two quarterbacks on the roster? After all - it's a rough game out there. if Gruden differs in that, and that alone - it's justification for Colt McCoy being signed JUST TO BE THE NUMBER THREE GUY.

So you see... maybe you can't figure out which one of you is correct because you're trying too hard to be the one who is "right". Personally, i think there's an element of truth to all of the scenarios. And if that weren't true, then it wouldn't create any extra "market value" for Cousins, because the other teams GMs would just see McCoy as window dressing.

That's what makes the Colt McCoy signing such an excellent one, in my opinion.

2 cents

I agree on all accounts Boss!!
Thanks for posting, i know u are busy and lerk in the shadows.. and hopefully getting a laugh or two from our silly banter.

One stick I feel needs to be added to tho fire...

McCoy doesn't get enough credit imo. He had a terrible supporting cast, and even worse leadership. He reminds me of Campbell- has the talent but was put in an impossible situation. I think he still has what it takes to be serviceable, certainly in a back up role.

Another thought we need to consider- if we don't dish Cousins out now, we very well could lose that chance at the end of the season when FA hits...

Last point is RGIII has been praised as the hardest working player by nearly every coach who has had an opportunity to speak to it... the kid isn't nearly as frail as some of y'all like to suggest. He takes UN needed risks Ya... he tries to do to much, sure.. but we've added some pieces to help him distribute the load, and in turn less will be required for him to be successful in winning.

Jus my thoughts on the situation; trade him while you can get something for him, roll w Griff/ McCoy, and call it good!!

I get what BH is getting at and I agree, a little - I just can't see these guys trading a really good back up QB UNLESS it's a V high pick
I don't think they brought in McCoy for that reason - he's needed as another QB at this time

I understand that we're not getting anything for Cousins after this season - I'll let the FO guys figure that out ...

ACTUALLY - we could trade Cousins - then we're going to need another QB and I don't think that's happening

Colt is here and he'll get a shot at proving he's a back up QB - it could happen

McCoy is a quality back up qb.
This is good with rg3's injury history.
If we need a back up behind Cousins or what not (who is performing better gets the start if rg3 gets hurt).
If we get something for Cousins in a trade, we have are fine with the back up qb.
McCoy didn't kill the wallet.

In end: This creates more options!

BossHog wrote:*flashes in for a brief message board appearance*

Why would the Redskins bring in Colt Mccoy, to shop Kirk Cousins, and then if they are successful, go get a number two?

That seems silly to me.

Look, if you are on the side that they brought Colt McCoy in to allow them to allow for a trade of Kirk Cousins if it arises, you CAN'T say with any certainty that they didn't bring Colt McCoy in to be the second QB, not in my opinion. They don't likely want to go through the rigamarole of finding another number two even later in the offseason process, if they DO get rid of Cousins. IMO, they're going to have McCoy be the backup if that happens.

And they'll likely only move Cousins for a second or 3rd round pick, so they can grab a quarterback that is serviceable there or anywhere else in the draft for a 'camp arm', so that isn't ALL Colt McCoy was brought in to be either.

I think the truth of it is, that you are ALL right.

1) Colt McCoy WAS brought in to be 'an arm' at camp.

2) An arm that is significant enough, that he CAN fill the number two role, if a good deal for Cousins pops up. He has career NFL starts under his belt - he qualifies, I assure you. You may not think the world of it, but there isn't much to suggest that he's much less capable than Kirk Cousins, is there?

3) if they don't get a deal, and they keep Cousins, not only do they have an arm at camp, but they have a soft enough contract that Colt can fill the clipboard carrying 3rd QB role. This guy isn't here to disappear either, so he has something to prove - even if its just that he has a good attitude, a good work ethic, and the desire to try and keep working for a shot... here OR somewhere else.

Cousins is a decent backup for sure - so i am sure that the Redskins will want to see a pretty high draft pick to run the risk of going in another direction at backup quarterback - after all, quarterback number one DID have pretty significant knee surgery.

Just one more thing to think about... if you concede that the backup in Washington IS more significant because of Bob's injury - then how do you not also at least think about the fact that another coach may not share the Shanahan philosophy of just two quarterbacks on the roster? After all - it's a rough game out there. if Gruden differs in that, and that alone - it's justification for Colt McCoy being signed JUST TO BE THE NUMBER THREE GUY.

So you see... maybe you can't figure out which one of you is correct because you're trying too hard to be the one who is "right". Personally, i think there's an element of truth to all of the scenarios. And if that weren't true, then it wouldn't create any extra "market value" for Cousins, because the other teams GMs would just see McCoy as window dressing.

That's what makes the Colt McCoy signing such an excellent one, in my opinion.

2 cents

Personally I dont care if I am right. I only seek the truth in matters. Once I believe the truth is found or some logic or common sense in matters then I am satisfied. That being said you bring up some good points.

You may be right. Gruden may just like to have as many QBs as possible on the roster.

From my point of view. I really dont put much value in the backup QB position. So you can imagine what I think of the third string QB.

Anyhow I should have said that we have the flexibility or more options with the draft approaching to aquire draft picks or players. Truth is only Allen and Gruden know what they are planning. But from my view aquiring Mccoy gives us a backup in case we trade Kirk.

With the draft approaching. Believe me there is going to be a team who leaves the draft without a solid QB. I guarantee at least one team will inquire about Kirk. When that happens we are now in better position to give up Kirk if the deal makes sense.

I mean how many teams need a QB? I can think of at least ten and this QB class in the draft isn't the strongest either.

Ehhh I guess I just think Mccoy is a panzy. Ever since that National Championship in which I seen him sit out the game. I never liked him after that. Then seeing him get lit up by Harrison didnt help either. I dont know him personally but as a football player I dont like him.

But if you guys are happy with the signing. Dont let me poop in your corn flakes. LOL!

I dont mind being wrong if Mccoy can help us win games.

HEROHAMO wrote:You may be right. Gruden may just like to have as many QBs as possible on the roster.

What does it have to do with Gruden? Can you name a single team that is going to go into training camp without three or four QBs on the roster. Of course not. Its not some personal quirk unique to Jay Gruden.

HEROHAMO wrote:Anyhow I should have said that we have the flexibility or more options with the draft approaching to aquire draft picks or players. Truth is only Allen and Gruden know what they are planning. But from my view aquiring Mccoy gives us a backup in case we trade Kirk.

All true. I don't think you'll find anybody who disagrees with that. You could say the exact same thing about Rex Grossman last year. If we had traded Kirk Cousins last July, we would have had Grossman ready to move from #3 to #2 QB.

HEROHAMO wrote:With the draft approaching. Believe me there is going to be a team who leaves the draft without a solid QB. I guarantee at least one team will inquire about Kirk. When that happens we are now in better position to give up Kirk if the deal makes sense.

I don't disagree with anything you've written here. Somebody could inquire about Cousins, and yes we are in better position to trade Kirk because we have three QBs.

Here's a thought though for everybody. If we traded Cousins tomorrow, would you rather have Colt McCoy as your backup to RGIII or would you rather have Grossman as the backup? Might be a tossup now that the Shanahans are gone.

I don't think Grossman is even on the roster right now.

Deadskins wrote:I don't think Grossman is even on the roster right now.

No, he's not and he's not expected to be. Pretty sure they're paying McCoy less money too!

Hope I didn't imply that Grossman was still on the roster.

What did you think about that question though? If Cousins was traded, would you rather have Grossman or McCoy backing up RGIII?