The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Irn-Bru wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

StorminMormon86 wrote:He was shut down to protect him.

You don't really believe that, do you?

Call me naive if you want, but I do. I don't think the Machiavellian Shanahan narrative has much traction. He's talked about how he discussed these moves with Snyder and Allen and everyone was on board to do what he's decided to do. It would be stupid to lie about something like that, which is so easily verified/denied by Snyder or Allen.

His actions also appear to have the team's long-term interest in mind, IMHO, which wouldn't necessarily be the case if he was just looking to get his $7 million and leave town. Shanahan let the team take a bigger hit this year so that we wouldn't have lots of dead cap money going into 2014 and 2015. I actually do think he's trying to protect Griffin for next year's offseason and preseason.

Maybe it will turn out that this thing was rotten to the core, and the players were just doing a good job of saying the right things while waiting for things to change. I could be wrong. But right now I don't really see it. I see the media fueling a lot of this because it's a great story to pick at.

THANK YOU!

This is a non story. Snyder agreed to shut him down. He's done for the season. It's Kirk's time now. That's about it. I don't buy into the report (after today's presser with Shanahan) anymore. I don't buy that the locker room is lost. There may be a rift between Snyder and Shanny, but I think it hs more to do with the team's record rather than other things that keep popping up in articles and the media.

Shanahan is being vilified for no apprent reason other than shutting down the beloved Griffin. And if he REALLY wanted to get fired, I doubt he would have went to Snyder first...he would have just benched him.

StorminMormon86 wrote:What circus?

What circus??? Are you kidding me? Turn on ESPN.

Seriously what other 3-10 team is getting 15 minutes out of every half hour on Sports Center right now? Shanahan just held an EPIC press conference. I'm not arguing whether there is any machiavellian scheming going on or not. I just think this whole circus is stupid. And whether starting Cousins is the right thing to do or not, did we really need to add one more bearded lady and her juggling monkey to this freakshow?

I actually think starting Cousins against the Falcons is just going to make things worse here. They're nearly as bad as we are this year, so I won't be surprised at all if he goes out and plays well and wins. Just what we need, more fuel for the fire. Every game RGIII loses next year, we'll be treated to the local mouth breathers pointing out how clutch Cousins was against the 3-10 Falcons.

If Kirk comes in and plays lights out, then there's definitely going to be more fuel to the fire. And rightfully so. Because then it would showcase that Griffin was in fact holding the team back on offense because of his poor play and bad decisions.

This is a non story. Snyder agreed to shut him down. He's done for the season. It's Kirk's time now. That's about it. I don't buy into the report (after today's presser with Shanahan) anymore. I don't buy that the locker room is lost. There may be a rift between Snyder and Shanny, but I think it hs more to do with the team's record rather than other things that keep popping up in articles and the media.

Shanahan is being vilified for no apprent reason other than shutting down the beloved Griffin. And if he REALLY wanted to get fired, I doubt he would have went to Snyder first...he would have just benched him.

StorminMormon86 wrote:If Kirk comes in and plays lights out, then there's definitely goign to be more fuel to the fire. And rightfully so. Because then it would showcase that Griffin was in fact holding the team back on offense because of his poor play and bad decisions.

lol. Ok. Thanks for illustrating my point. We're going to compare Kirk Cousins playing against the 3-10 Falcons in a completely meaningless game to the games RGIII just played.

Kilmer72 wrote:

This is a non story. Snyder agreed to shut him down. He's done for the season. It's Kirk's time now. That's about it. I don't buy into the report (after today's presser with Shanahan) anymore. I don't buy that the locker room is lost. There may be a rift between Snyder and Shanny, but I think it hs more to do with the team's record rather than other things that keep popping up in articles and the media.

Shanahan is being vilified for no apprent reason other than shutting down the beloved Griffin. And if he REALLY wanted to get fired, I doubt he would have went to Snyder first...he would have just benched him.

Exactly. I like how he keeps pointing out that "Snyder agreed to shut him down" like these two guys have been putting their heads together and working together.

StorminMormon86 wrote:If Kirk comes in and plays lights out, then there's definitely going to be more fuel to the fire. And rightfully so. Because then it would showcase that Griffin was in fact holding the team back on offense because of his poor play and bad decisions.

If he does it for all three games, maybe. But not this one game against a team with the same record as us.

Irn-Bru wrote:I actually do think he's trying to protect Griffin for next year's offseason and preseason.

Then why start him in the snow, against a great D like the Chiefs, when we were already eliminated?

riggofan wrote:lol. Ok. Thanks for illustrating my point. We're going to compare Kirk Cousins playing against the 3-10 Falcons in a completely meaningless game to the games RGIII just played.

You do realize that Griffin has played against worse pass defenses than the Falcons, right? Cowboys, Packers, Vikings, Lions, and Chargers. We only won one of those games, BTW.

riggofan wrote:Exactly. I like how he keeps pointing out that "Snyder agreed to shut him down" like these two guys have been putting their heads together and working together.

Shanahan went to Snyder and told him he was thinking about shutting Griffin down. He said if Snyder or Allen objected he wouldn't do it. He said if they weren't committed to it 100% he wouldn't do it. Guess what? Griffin is inactive.

I have also read (I think on WaPo) that Snyder was po'ed that Griffin started in week 1.

Deadskins wrote:

Irn-Bru wrote:I actually do think he's trying to protect Griffin for next year's offseason and preseason.

Then why start him in the snow, against a great D like the Chiefs, when we were already eliminated?

He's already explained that on Monday. The Chiefs D is good, but they weren't sacking QBs. They only had 2 sacks in the previous 4 or 5 games I think. Against us they had 6. That's alarming. The sacks are not all on the o-line. Some were on Griffin, and that's why Shanny wants to shut him down.

StorminMormon86 wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

Irn-Bru wrote:I actually do think he's trying to protect Griffin for next year's offseason and preseason.

Then why start him in the snow, against a great D like the Chiefs, when we were already eliminated?

He's already explained that on Monday. The Chiefs D is good, but they weren't sacking QBs. They only had 2 sacks in the previous 4 or 5 games I think. Against us they had 6. That's alarming. The sacks are not all on the o-line. Some were on Griffin, and that's why Shanny wants to shut him down.

yeah our Oline has been kicking tail all year. I blame most of the sacks on Robert. Now we will have a real QB take over and show everyone just how great they are.

riggofan wrote::roll:

You can roll your eyes, but that is the explanation Shanny gave on Monday and at today's press conference. He actually claims that part of him wanted to sit Griffin for the Chiefs game, and that he had talked to Snyder/Allen about the possibility of doing so (again, something he'd be crazy to lie about). He compared it a bit to the Seattle playoff game, when he had a gut feeling that he should take Griffin out but made the wrong decision, and said that if Griffin had been hurt playing against KC he'd be sick about it.

If you watch the press conference, I think you'll see that Shanahan is generally being open and giving frank answers. Maybe people won't like what he says and will have disagreements with his POV, but I just don't get the sense that he's trying to cover up some larger, insidious thing. It sounds to me like he's still working according to a plan and trying to make decisions that will benefit the team come 2014 and beyond. (Again, not the work of a guy just looking to get his before getting the hell out of Dodge.)

Kilmer72 wrote:

StorminMormon86 wrote:He's already explained that on Monday. The Chiefs D is good, but they weren't sacking QBs. They only had 2 sacks in the previous 4 or 5 games I think. Against us they had 6. That's alarming. The sacks are not all on the o-line. Some were on Griffin, and that's why Shanny wants to shut him down.

yeah our Oline has been kicking tail all year. I blame most of the sacks on Robert. Now we will have a real QB take over and show everyone just how great they are.

I can't tell whether you're being serious or sarcastic, but I actually posted a breakdown of the entire season's worth of sacks to THN this past week. Roughly 1/3rd of them can respectively be blamed on Griffin, blown o-line assignments and blocks, and WRs not getting open. I really don't expect to see much change when Cousins gets in — he's already been in a few times this year and there was no insta-provement.

I agree with FFA - I find it very intriguing that Mike is doing things because he thinks it will be better for the franchise and for Robert NEXT YEAR

I'm not at all sure that Mike will be back but that is not the typical thought process of a guy that's "playing out the string" IMO

Irn-Bru wrote:

Deadskins wrote:

StorminMormon86 wrote:He was shut down to protect him.

You don't really believe that, do you?

Call me naive if you want, but I do. I don't think the Machiavellian Shanahan narrative has much traction. He's talked about how he discussed these moves with Snyder and Allen and everyone was on board to do what he's decided to do. It would be stupid to lie about something like that, which is so easily verified/denied by Snyder or Allen.

His actions also appear to have the team's long-term interest in mind, IMHO, which wouldn't necessarily be the case if he was just looking to get his $7 million and leave town. Shanahan let the team take a bigger hit this year so that we wouldn't have lots of dead cap money going into 2014 and 2015. I actually do think he's trying to protect Griffin for next year's offseason and preseason.

Maybe it will turn out that this thing was rotten to the core, and the players were just doing a good job of saying the right things while waiting for things to change. I could be wrong. But right now I don't really see it. I see the media fueling a lot of this because it's a great story to pick at.

I call you "someone who thinks the way I do"!

Given that Griffin was hurt badly last season, had surgery, and has played in a knee brace all year, why put him into these last three games? Let the kid heal.

The Post sees every decision, and every blink or twitch as a sign of some plot by Shanahan. It plays up the rumpor that Snyder is tryoing to find a "cause" for firing Shanahan...so everything gets fitted into that story.

What if this is simply a good idea, and in the best interests of Griffin and the Redskins? Mike Rizo "stubbornly" shut down Zimmermann, Strasburg, Samy Solis, and Lucas Giolito after each had Tommy John surgery. The sports entertainment talkers yelped and howled, but Rizzo intended to protect the pitchers and the future of the Nats.

Maybe Shanahan is doing the same?

Irn-Bru wrote:

Kilmer72 wrote:

StorminMormon86 wrote:He's already explained that on Monday. The Chiefs D is good, but they weren't sacking QBs. They only had 2 sacks in the previous 4 or 5 games I think. Against us they had 6. That's alarming. The sacks are not all on the o-line. Some were on Griffin, and that's why Shanny wants to shut him down.

yeah our Oline has been kicking tail all year. I blame most of the sacks on Robert. Now we will have a real QB take over and show everyone just how great they are.

I can't tell whether you're being serious or sarcastic, but I actually posted a breakdown of the entire season's worth of sacks to THN this past week. Roughly 1/3rd of them can respectively be blamed on Griffin, blown o-line assignments and blocks, and WRs not getting open. I really don't expect to see much change when Cousins gets in — he's already been in a few times this year and there was no insta-provement.

Yes I was joking and that is what I was referring to. I really hope Cousins a less mobile QB doesn't get killed out there. Not that I want our franchise QB getting killed but someone slower
wont save us when hes getting knocked around. I think what he (Cousins) has going for him is he has more pocket presence. He isn't seeing stars yet from, being on his back all day, like most good Ds we have faced this year. Hell even Denver's suffering pass defense thrived because we can't block for longer than 2 seconds and we don't have a quick release Peyton (coach on the field) Any QB would suffer behind this line.

Here is the good news. Now he wont be the star of the circus. He is safe from that I hope.

I don't think that the offensive game planning and line blocking assignments will be the same for Cousins as they were for Robert ..

I expect Kirk to be fine and hopefully Kyle and he will be on the same page and have a good game

I'm looking forward to having a lot of you guys be shown up a little by Kirk and Kyle this Sunday

Robert is STILL our starting QB but Kirk is a very good QB and Kyle will have a good game plan to suit his abilities

Hail

They should have started Cousins back on day 1 against the Eagles.

I think we'll see something similar to the Cleveland game. Cousins will start off shaky (kind of how he's looked in the mop up work this year), but once he gets into a groove, he'll do just fine.

Kilmer72 wrote:yeah our Oline has been kicking tail all year. I blame most of the sacks on Robert. Now we will have a real QB take over and show everyone just how great they are.

A lot of the sacks this year have been because of Griffin. Holding the ball too long, not stepping up, etc. He wasn't learning how to adjust so Shanny shut him down.

hanburgerheel wrote:They should have started Cousins back on day 1 against the Eagles.

I agree …. BUT - NOBODY (with any intelligence) knew how rusty Robert would be and that choice was not better for Robert's growth at QB

HOWEVER - Mike thought that the best 'path' for this franchise was to give Robert the job and help him learn, on the job, to be a much better all round QB
EVERYONE KNOWS - young QBs need to gain experience, as quickly as possible, on the field
there might have been some pressure on him to go in that direction as well, given the season Robert had and that the Drs and Robert felt his knee was not an issue

CLEARLY Robert has way more upside than Kirk as a QB - that's why the Redskins are trying so hard to help him be as good as he can be

did that help a little?

hanburgerheel wrote:They should have started Cousins back on day 1 against the Eagles.

Agreed. I feel like our starters outplayed opponents starters in the pre-season and when we went with Griff on opening day, we collectively relaxed and have never gotten our edge back. Compounding matters was Griff's health - dude was clearly not 100%. I feel like he's close now but so many other things are wrong with him ... and I attribute a lot of that to him rushing (being rushed) back.

I also think the minor foot injury Cousins suffered in pre-season slightly increased the pressure on Shanny to open with Griff.

I think Shanny and Cousins will both be elsewhere next September.

StorminMormon86 wrote:If Kirk comes in and plays lights out, then there's definitely going to be more fuel to the fire. And rightfully so. Because then it would showcase that Griffin was in fact holding the team back on offense because of his poor play and bad decisions.

Just remember whatever may happen this douchebag we have as a HC didn't have Cousins playing the Chiefs or 49ers defense....He chooses to start him against another 3-10 team in a DOME! I would think those are pretty much positive items, why didn't he start Cousins in the cold weather or even snow......

Karma is coming for Shanalobster and Cousins isn't going to protect him....Nothing will......

StorminMormon86 wrote:

Kilmer72 wrote:yeah our Oline has been kicking tail all year. I blame most of the sacks on Robert. Now we will have a real QB take over and show everyone just how great they are.

A lot of the sacks this year have been because of Griffin. Holding the ball too long, not stepping up, etc. He wasn't learning how to adjust so Shanny shut him down.

I don't know what games you have watched but 90% of those sacks came from Chester and Polumbus being unable to block. Even Manning would have been crushed. When it comes to Chester and Polumbus blocking that is like wet toilet paper holding back a turd, not happening my friend......