Redskins QB Situation for 2011

funbuncher · Post by **funbuncher** » Sun May 01, 2011 3:53 am

The free agent ex-49er Troy Smith can play ball and would fit our scheme. I've seen him have some really good stretches, and some really bad. Kind of like Rex.

cleg · Post by **cleg** » Sun May 01, 2011 7:20 am

1. The drafting of the receivers makes me have a suspicion that the coaching staff is trying to appease McNabb by "apologizing" to him by trying to bring in some play makers.

2. While I could very well be wrong on the first point if McNabb is truly out of here (which I could live with either way) I would prefer they start with Beck. I know he is older but the rest of the FA QB's are dreck and WE KNOW they can't play. Beck was never given a fair shot at Miami so maybe there is a 2% chance he, at 30, could have a bit of a career revival a la Rich Gannon.

3. No trade for Carson Palmer, please. Whoever said he is better than McNabb is on crack. I don't want either but no more trading picks for older players on the back end of their career.

4. Snyder truly does appear to be letting Shanny and Allen do what they do. He is occupying his time by suing small newspapers. Maybe next he can buy some summer camps for dying kids and evict them - dude is the devil.

P.S. Despite my optimism above I wanted them to draft Mallet.

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Sun May 01, 2011 8:49 am

The Rumor Mill is churning and the word is, we might trade Albert Haynesworth for Kyle Orton. That's definitely the best we could do, and the best actual player Denver could get for Orton. The Broncos could still try and trade him for a 2nd or 3rd round pick, but with Haynesworth they know they would get an elite DT in a 4-3...

Worth looking at.

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Sun May 01, 2011 9:02 am

I think that Allen & Shanahan have a plan - they most likely would have added Locker or Ponder but they were NOT going to reach on a QB in this draft

PLAN B - they are either bringing in someone or are going with Grossman and Beck - McNabb is out of here

I doubt that Grossman is here although part of my doubts about him were because I don't think he would be a good mentor - don't need that now!
Grossman is not a bad QB at all - I just don't have a good feeling about him as our starting QB

I understand that Beck has shown promise, I just cannot fathom a 30 year old QB going from #3 QB to #1 QB without a series of unforseen things forcing #1 & #2 out
Has anyone ever been the #1 QB at 30 AND at the start of the season, having never been the starting QB?
there's always a first time .. NOT

they've made up their minds about Grossman and he's either the starting QB or they are bringing someone in - I just don't buy the "I love John Beck" stuff from Mike
I think Beck is a very solid QB & I have NOTHING against him - I just don't buy it

overall though these guys did a good job in not reaching for a QB and trying to add some players here - time will tell

we still need our future great QB

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:29 am

Smithian wrote:I don't want McNabb acting moody as our starting QB and dealing with drama every time anything bad happens

Since he never did that in Philly, he never did thatin the challenging year we had last year and he never did that no matter how much some Redskin "fans" called for and continue to call for him act like that, what possible rational reason do you have to worry suddenly he'd do it next year? Other then the part that some "fans" want him to?

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:33 am

Red_One43 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:I'm still pulling for us to return to McNabb and will continue until we don't have him or we have an actual better option.
"Donovan will never take another snap for me again," so said Kyle. I don't think DMac's agent made that up. We know Mike said, “Donovan McNabb would be welcomed back next year as a backup.” Are you sure you want to Keep Hope Alive!

His agent said that so we can accept it as fact, that's just too funny. Oh, and the check's in the mail...

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:36 am

Skinsfan55 wrote:The Rumor Mill is churning and the word is, we might trade Albert Haynesworth for Kyle Orton. That's definitely the best we could do, and the best actual player Denver could get for Orton. The Broncos could still try and trade him for a 2nd or 3rd round pick, but with Haynesworth they know they would get an elite DT in a 4-3...

Worth looking at.

I have to say finally a rumor I'd like to believe. Assuming we're not going to McNabb, who is our best option, Orton is OK which rates him ahead of our other choices and he's at least competent if we're going to continue to be a D team. I do think he best path to the superbowl is great D, good O. I hope the discussion Beck is actually decent is true, but I'm still having a hard time getting my brain wrapped around that one.

Smithian · Post by **Smithian** » Sun May 01, 2011 11:04 am

From all the stuff swirling from Redskins camp about the QB situation here is what I think happened; they told themselves there were 5 or 6 good QBs. They could afford to be picky. They traded back a couple times thinking, "We'll get our guy next time", and eventually realized they missed out on every QB from Gabbert to Mallett to Ricky Stanzi.

We crapped the bed.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 11:25 am

Smithian wrote:From all the stuff swirling from Redskins camp about the QB situation here is what I think happened; they told themselves there were 5 or 6 good QBs. They could afford to be picky. They traded back a couple times thinking, "We'll get our guy next time", and eventually realized they missed out on every QB from Gabbert to Mallett to Ricky Stanzi.

We crapped the bed.

That makes no sense. No coach thinks any of 5 or 6 guys is OK for the most important position on their team in their particular system. It's just preposterous. As is that they'd play games like that with someone they liked at the most important position to get guys who don't play the most important position. And that they thought a quality starting quarterback would fall to them at #10 in the second round is just laughable. The only crapping being done is by you on the team and it's frankly lame.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 12:22 pm

1niksder wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:I'm still pulling for us to return to McNabb and will continue until we don't have him or we have an actual better option.
"Donovan will never take another snap for me again," so said Kyle. I don't think DMac's agent made that up. We know Mike said, “Donovan McNabb would be welcomed back next year as a backup.” Are you sure you want to Keep Hope Alive!
It could happen...

Yes, anything is possible.

Donovan said,

“Things would obviously have to change. Relationships would have to be better. Conversations would have to be better.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... statement/

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Sun May 01, 2011 12:36 pm

Just go with Beck. I'm perfectly fine with the "Suck and Luck" strategy.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 12:43 pm

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:I'm still pulling for us to return to McNabb and will continue until we don't have him or we have an actual better option.
"Donovan will never take another snap for me again," so said Kyle. I don't think DMac's agent made that up. We know Mike said, “Donovan McNabb would be welcomed back next year as a backup.” Are you sure you want to Keep Hope Alive!
His agent said that so we can accept it as fact, that's just too funny. Oh, and the check's in the mail...

“I support my agent and his thoughts,” McNabb said on ESPN 980, per the Washington Post. “When I read the whole thing, I didn’t see nothing wrong with it.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... statement/

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 12:53 pm

funbuncher wrote:
Redskin in Canada wrote:
Countertrey wrote:It's becoming clear that Shanahan doesn't feel a powerful need to address the quarterback situation via this draft. I have to imagine that he is confident that a quarterback, either currently with the team, or that will be available by trade or FA, will be running this team this year... It's also increasingly apparent that he is taking a long term view of building the team... We are likely to see only modest improvements in team performance this year, as he continues to build a foundation for the future. Many here have opined that we won't see real gains until the 2012 season... that may be. But, a price must be paid for 2 decades of short term building, and knee jerk player management. There's light at the end of the tunnel, now...

The question is, how well has this front office done in evaluating the talent they are collecting? That answer won't be available in any post draft report card that comes out tomorrow or Monday... we'll just have to wait.

Regardless... Shanahan and Allen came into this draft with a plan... and, it's clear that they have followed it. How refreshing to see.
Good analysis which reflect my views exactly.

I could have put money that Shanny was going to pick a QB in the Draft. How wrong I was. He has priorities and a plan. He was disciplined not to take one at a higher cost to other weak positions.
You guys are high. Yes it was so "refreshing" to see us repeatedly ignore a need we have at the most important position on the field. Much better to end up with way more wr's and rb's than we could ever possibly carry on a 53 man roster. Glad you're all so confident in their "plan". Last year's gay plan to give our draft picks to our rival for their notoriously inaccurate qb has really instilled a lot of confidence in me. Transforming our top d into one of the last ranked units by switching to a system we didnt have the personnel for was pretty sweet too. Loved how we wasted Andre Carter who the year before had double digit sacks, but had struggled mightily the last time he was forced to play standing up. That was pretty cool how we weren't able to coach that other guy to play nose tackle or any position, you know that one we had 100 million invested in.

Ryan Mallett apparently is so worthless that we passed on him 4 times. Not worth the risk I guess, when it will cut into the number of wr's we can draft. Apparently our o-line is not in need of too much help either. Casey Rabach probably got better in the off-season. At least we got another safety, too bad we couldn't squeeze out another TE too.

Before hhis draft I heard at least 6 different reports that this draft was top heavy, and that there was a serious drop-off in quality after about the first 50 picks. So what do we do but start trading back at 49 like we've strangely never been able to before. Suddenly this year there was always a taker to move up. Coincidence I guess, or my bad, I forgot the topic of this thread for a moment, it was due to the masterful planning efforts of shrewd and shrewderer. John Beck rules.

Ok that was a bit harsh, but most of it was true. If Vinny had presided over this embarrassingly bad last year and draft you'd be pulling your hair out right now, but instead it feels so good to have a plan in place. A plan to empower a division rival and ignore our needs at O-line and QB. You even went as far as giving a free pass to suck in 2012 as well, because hey, not even genius 1 and 2 could be expected to clean up the previous decades mess that fast. Then why is he getting 8 gazillion per? Shouldn't we maybe hold off on that til we get to .500 or something?

Off season isn't over yet. There is free agency (at some point it will happen) and there are undrafted free agents - there could be another "Rod Smith" among the undrafted free agents. Look for Mike to work free agency just like the draft - only going after work ethic guys - if they are a star, great, but that won't be the goal to just sign studs. The OJ signing is an example of of the type of guys Mike is looking for in free agency.

As far as the QB, if the guy is not your guy, don't take him. Mike learned a hard lesson in the McNabb trade..

So yes, based on passed events, we are high and we should be.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:00 pm

funbuncher wrote:If we can re-sign Grossman, that will be the top move of our off-season. I say that only half in jest, as I really do like the guy. Would love to see him get a chance to shut all the experts mouths. That's how you get respect as an organization, win with guys that others couldn't win with. Have a system that breeds success and adapt it to your players strengths when necessary. Don't go sign Troy Aikman to throw the bally for us and Emmit Smith to run it. We don't have green uniforms with wings on the helmet. We don't need any of their players, especially not the over-rated face of their franchise.

It is very important that we sign Grossman. The evidence points to it being very important to have a QB that is confident with this offense.
Where Grossman broke down last year is not handling the pass rush. Fumbles and interceptions marred what otherwise was a good perfomance in the three games. But, Mike still might go out and sign a guy like Bulger to have two guys on the roster more talented as Grossman at QB. One has not proven himself, Beck. The FA would have to learn the offense in a very short time. That leaves Grossman if Beck falters.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:01 pm

funbuncher wrote:No I obviously still can't let that go. It was so gay. As bad or worse than when we signed Deion.

Let it goooooooooooooooo!

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:03 pm

funbuncher wrote:The free agent ex-49er Troy Smith can play ball and would fit our scheme. I've seen him have some really good stretches, and some really bad. Kind of like Rex.

Any QB that is brought in would be expected to run the offense to precision. Not sure that Smith, though probably more talented than Grossman, would fit that bill.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:21 pm

Concerning Donovan as our QB for 2011. I would love to see that happen, but a lot of things were said that indicate that there are some deep issues dividing the Shanahans and Donovan. If it was just about personalities then they could all sit down together, the Shanahans, Donovan and his agent, and have a Kumbaya moment; however, there are professional issues here - footwork, work ethic (this is not to say Donovan's is poor, but just not what Mike expects of his QB), and improvising on the plays called. Mike and Kyle demand precison for their offense. That is not McNabb's style. The Shanahans are immovable objects on this issue. The Detroit coaching decision and the statements made following it are indicators of just how frustrated they were with McNabb. McNabb simply is not a fit here. Just like we saw Mike do "magic" with the draft and turn 8 draft choices into 13 draft choices, he will find a way to move Donovan to another team and I believe that his plan has already been worked out. When Mike said that Donovan would be welcomed back as a back up, that was an indication that he was ready to move on. Donovan does not deserve to be a back up. In the right system with a coach willing to make adjustments to his style, Donovan will once again play at a Pro Bowl level. We say it in the Houston game. Don't forget Galloway was a finger tip away from catching a game clinching bomb form McNabb. Yes, he will always throw balls in the dirt - that is McNabb being McNabb, but that never stopped him from being an star QB. I wish him well.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:38 pm

Red_One43 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Red_One43 wrote: "Donovan will never take another snap for me again," so said Kyle. I don't think DMac's agent made that up. We know Mike said, “Donovan McNabb would be welcomed back next year as a backup.” Are you sure you want to Keep Hope Alive!
His agent said that so we can accept it as fact, that's just too funny. Oh, and the check's in the mail...

“I support my agent and his thoughts,” McNabb said on ESPN 980, per the Washington Post. “When I read the whole thing, I didn’t see nothing wrong with it.”
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... statement/

McNabb supports his agent. Wow, you're on to an expose there. I'm thinking if he didn't his agent wouldn't be his agent.

So what you have is that his agent said he'll never take a snap from Kyle and McNabb supports his agent, who is...his agent. And from that you get money in the bank. Actually isn't still not even a coupon in the Sunday Paper.

The coaches are evaluating every option, including McNabb. McNabb's agent is in that decision circle as deeply as Danny's limo driver. Actually between the word of the two I'd take the limo driver because his ear is a lot closer to the right mouths then McNabb's idiot agent.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:45 pm

Red_One43 wrote:Concerning Donovan as our QB for 2011. I would love to see that happen, but a lot of things were said that indicate that there are some deep issues dividing the Shanahans and Donovan. If it was just about personalities then they could all sit down together, the Shanahans, Donovan and his agent, and have a Kumbaya moment; however, there are professional issues here - footwork, work ethic (this is not to say Donovan's is poor, but just not what Mike expects of his QB), and improvising on the plays called. Mike and Kyle demand precison for their offense. That is not McNabb's style. The Shanahans are immovable objects on this issue. The Detroit coaching decision and the statements made following it are indicators of just how frustrated they were with McNabb. McNabb simply is not a fit here. Just like we saw Mike do "magic" with the draft and turn 8 draft choices into 13 draft choices, he will find a way to move Donovan to another team and I believe that his plan has already been worked out. When Mike said that Donovan would be welcomed back as a back up, that was an indication that he was ready to move on. Donovan does not deserve to be a back up. In the right system with a coach willing to make adjustments to his style, Donovan will once again play at a Pro Bowl level. We say it in the Houston game. Don't forget Galloway was a finger tip away from catching a game clinching bomb form McNabb. Yes, he will always throw balls in the dirt - that is McNabb being McNabb, but that never stopped him from being an star QB. I wish him well.

The only thing we know for sure is McNabb's agent is an idiot

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 1:48 pm

Smithian wrote:From all the stuff swirling from Redskins camp about the QB situation here is what I think happened; they told themselves there were 5 or 6 good QBs. They could afford to be picky. They traded back a couple times thinking, "We'll get our guy next time", and eventually realized they missed out on every QB from Gabbert to Mallett to Ricky Stanzi.

We crapped the bed.

Since you are speculating, how about speculate who the "guy" was the couple of times Mike missed out. Just curious as to who you think that Mike wanted.

As far as how accurate you your thoughts are - We just watched a coach orchestrate a plan during this draft, it is highly improbable that this coach did not go after his guy with all the picks he had. It is clear that his priority was number of players to fit needs. When he did want a particular player that he felt that he might not get, he traded up for him (Helu). You provided no basis for your thinking except a rumor. Why not base your thinking on what actually happened?

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 2:24 pm

To me a QB was not drafted because, Mike saw Beck as his QB in waiting last year. He sat for a year, like a rookie usually does, and now it is his time to try to win the job. It is his to take. Grossman, seemed to prove that he is a capable back up, so he will be offered a contract. An undrafted rookie will be brought into camp as is will all teams. I can also see Mike signing a vet like Bulger - much like his rational in signings of fast Willie Parker and Larry Johnson.

I don't believe that Mike sees Beck as his QB of the future. I think that Mike is scheming right now on how to get enough ammo to make a run on Luck next year.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 2:28 pm

Red_One43 wrote:To me a QB was not drafted because, Mike saw Beck as his QB in waiting last year. He sat for a year, like a rookie usually does, and now it is his time to try to win the job. It is his to take. Grossman, seemed to prove that he is a capable back up, so he will be offered a contract. An undrafted rookie will be brought into camp as is will all teams. I can also see Mike signing a vet like Bulger - much like his rational in signings of fast Willie Parker and Larry Johnson.

I don't believe that Mike sees Beck as his QB of the future. I think that Mike is scheming right now on how to get enough ammo to make a run on Luck next year.

Why can't the coaches just have thought the guys available were all toss ups and they couldn't pass on players they actually liked at other positions over a roll of the dice on guys likely to be no better then the guys we have? It's not always complicated you know.

Red_One43 · Post by **Red_One43** » Sun May 01, 2011 3:02 pm

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:To me a QB was not drafted because, Mike saw Beck as his QB in waiting last year. He sat for a year, like a rookie usually does, and now it is his time to try to win the job. It is his to take. Grossman, seemed to prove that he is a capable back up, so he will be offered a contract. An undrafted rookie will be brought into camp as is will all teams. I can also see Mike signing a vet like Bulger - much like his rational in signings of fast Willie Parker and Larry Johnson.

I don't believe that Mike sees Beck as his QB of the future. I think that Mike is scheming right now on how to get enough ammo to make a run on Luck next year.
Why can't the coaches just have thought the guys available were all toss ups and they couldn't pass on players they actually liked at other positions over a roll of the dice on guys likely to be no better then the guys we have? It's not always complicated you know.

Why can't the coaches have just went into the draft decided that they weren't going to draft a QB? That way the coaches could entertain all offers of teams wanting to move up and acquire lots of draft choices. It just can't get any simplier than that.

KazooSkinsFan · Post by **KazooSkinsFan** » Sun May 01, 2011 3:51 pm

Red_One43 wrote:
KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Red_One43 wrote:To me a QB was not drafted because, Mike saw Beck as his QB in waiting last year. He sat for a year, like a rookie usually does, and now it is his time to try to win the job. It is his to take. Grossman, seemed to prove that he is a capable back up, so he will be offered a contract. An undrafted rookie will be brought into camp as is will all teams. I can also see Mike signing a vet like Bulger - much like his rational in signings of fast Willie Parker and Larry Johnson.

I don't believe that Mike sees Beck as his QB of the future. I think that Mike is scheming right now on how to get enough ammo to make a run on Luck next year.
Why can't the coaches just have thought the guys available were all toss ups and they couldn't pass on players they actually liked at other positions over a roll of the dice on guys likely to be no better then the guys we have? It's not always complicated you know.
Why can't the coaches have just went into the draft decided that they weren't going to draft a QB? That way the coaches could entertain all offers of teams wanting to move up and acquire lots of draft choices. It just can't get any simplier than that.

You're still making a flagrant assumption though that they had made a decision not to draft a QB. Is it "possible?" Sure, but you still pulled it out of your...

Skinsfan55 · Post by **Skinsfan55** » Sun May 01, 2011 4:02 pm

Food for thought:

Gus Frerotte was the last QB drafted by the Redskins to be elected to the Pro Bowl as a member of the team. He was drafted in the 6th round out of Tulsa in 1994. He only has 12 TD passes that year, so he may have been an alternate. Can't remember. Before him, it was Mark Rypien drafted in the 6th round in 1986. He went twice.

Eddie LeBarron and Sammy Baugh are the only guys every drafted by the Redskins to go to the Pro-Bowl 4 or more times, and I would strongly argue that Baugh is the only star QB the Redskins have ever drafted (and short of Theismann) the only star they've ever had.

Let's hope they can change this some day soon.