The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Bob 0119 wrote:Is this what we get for having a "real NFL head coach and GM"?

No, that side of it has shown it's positives. This is a personality trait of Mike as an individual. There's never anything wrong with having a "real" coach and GM. Now do we have the right HC? I hope so, hopefully he'll learn and grow from this too.

I know we're all steamed. I was in shock when REX went in. I think it was a major mistake. I'd like to make a few points. Disagreements with good arguments are welcome.

As much as I'd like to have run the clock out with a 5 point lead, I'm not in dream land. Perhaps we have not run enough in general but against the Lions, if you take away DM's long scamper we ran 18 times for 44 yards. We got the ball with 5:21 left - a virtual eterniity in today's NFL. We ran for no gain on 1st down. We snapped the ball on 2nd down with 4:40 left. If we run two more times and punt they have PLENTY of time AND their timeouts. The best way to eat clock at this point was to make first downs. Time reallly was not the primary issue ... YET. So I don't have a problem with passing there. I would have preferred something quick in the slot that is high percentage and amounts to a run if you complete it but have no problem with a pass in general. The pass called seemed unwise and, of course, the decision to throw where he did simply made things worse.

Now for the 2-minute fitness thing with calling two plays at a time, etc. We got it on our 30, down 6, with 1:45 to go. Even if we make 3 15-yard completions UP THE MIDDLE we have nearly 45 seconds left after a spike and we are at their 25. This requires neither extra fitness nor extra memory above what DM had already displayed in the game. In other words, to quote another poster, either "HE IS A LIAR," "HE IS AN IDIOT," or both.



DarthMonk

As much as I can't stand Donny...his benching with less than 2 minutes to go was ridiculous. A guy who had no preparation with the 1st team gets brought in during a pivotal time in the game....unbelievable. With that being said, Donny was atrocious. That interception was absolutely unforgivable. But the one thing that seemed to stand out to me more than anything else was a seemingly innocuous play. Here's the set-up....

- The announcers are talking about Kyle Shanahan when they pan to him while he's calling a play....
- They then go over to Donny who receives the play and goes to the huddle
- Back to Kyle on the sidelines who sees the team come to the line of scrimmage and puts his hands up in amazement like he can't believe what he's watching...

The result - A 5 yd loss on a Torrain "run" as Kyle berates Donny when the next play comes in.

So, what does this mean: I don't know, but it looked like built up frustration..big time frustration. So when Donny got benched, this was the scene that came into my head.

No way around it, the Shanahans don't trust Donny.

When your offensive line is that bad, why not call quicker hitting pass plays though? That interception was on 2nd and 10 and was a 5 step drop. He called those slow developing 5-7 step drops all game. He did it again when Rex was in the game. Did he not see what was happening to our offensive line??

Seems like Kyle just didn't put 2 and 2 together and go to something that maybe they didn't practice this week, but would have been better suited for the pressure.

Agreed, I don't see how Rex's cardio helped him feel the pass rush when he got murdered at the end of the game. Donovan was fine, he just wasn't running things like Kyle wanted and Kyle threw a BF like a whiny girl. Daddy listened to his daughter and made a horrid mistake. Now he's trying to lie his way out of it and it's making matters worse. This cannot be good for the locker room.

You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

The Hogster wrote:You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

I hope he gets further embarrassed cus he deserves it! I hope it makes headlines all the way up to the game and gets dissected like crazy. Both of their ego's need to take a nose dive.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

I hope he gets further embarrassed cus he deserves it! I hope it makes headlines all the way up to the game and gets dissected like crazy. Both of their ego's need to take a nose dive.

You will get your wish. Our first game back is on Monday Night Football against the Eagles. All eyes would have been on McNabb already. Now they will be squarely on Mike TAN-ahan.

And, since when has Rex Grossman been in any shape except Round?? He's the Janikowski of QB's. I guess he's really been hitting the Shake Weight hard lately. Working on "ball security" I guess.

This has nothing to do with this thread, but I had to add it somewhere.

As much as I can't stand Mike Wise, he had a great name for Carlos Rogers. He called him "Washington's Hands Free Device". I couldn't stop laughing when I read it

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/11/01/mike-shanahan-not-happy-with-how-donovan-mcnabb-practices/
[url]
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/player ... 728&id=704[/url]

What is going on??? One bad loss and everything is Effed up now....I am not going to put to much into Mortenson as he has been wrong before (a lot) but what the hell?! Were 4-4 going into the bye week....The sky isnt falling and it seems like were trying to pull it down!

Shannahan said that McRib couldn't practice 2 min drills since week 2 due to hammy issues. Only a dolt like Mortenson could turn that into "not happy how he practices", as if he didn't put the effort in.

DarthMonk wrote:I know we're all steamed. I was in shock when REX went in. I think it was a major mistake. I'd like to make a few points. Disagreements with good arguments are welcome.

As much as I'd like to have run the clock out with a 5 point lead, I'm not in dream land. Perhaps we have not run enough in general but against the Lions, if you take away DM's long scamper we ran 18 times for 44 yards. We got the ball with 5:21 left - a virtual eterniity in today's NFL. We ran for no gain on 1st down. We snapped the ball on 2nd down with 4:40 left. If we run two more times and punt they have PLENTY of time AND their timeouts. The best way to eat clock at this point was to make first downs. Time reallly was not the primary issue ... YET. So I don't have a problem with passing there. I would have preferred something quick in the slot that is high percentage and amounts to a run if you complete it but have no problem with a pass in general. The pass called seemed unwise and, of course, the decision to throw where he did simply made things worse.
DarthMonk

I can't emphasize this enough. Please read this if you question passing the ball with 4:40 left.

DarthMonk wrote:I know we're all steamed. I was in shock when REX went in. I think it was a major mistake. I'd like to make a few points. Disagreements with good arguments are welcome.

As much as I'd like to have run the clock out with a 5 point lead, I'm not in dream land. Perhaps we have not run enough in general but against the Lions, if you take away DM's long scamper we ran 18 times for 44 yards. We got the ball with 5:21 left - a virtual eterniity in today's NFL. We ran for no gain on 1st down. We snapped the ball on 2nd down with 4:40 left. If we run two more times and punt they have PLENTY of time AND their timeouts. The best way to eat clock at this point was to make first downs. Time reallly was not the primary issue ... YET. So I don't have a problem with passing there. I would have preferred something quick in the slot that is high percentage and amounts to a run if you complete it but have no problem with a pass in general. The pass called seemed unwise and, of course, the decision to throw where he did simply made things worse.
DarthMonk

That's a totally fair assesment. So why is McNabb being singled out?

Why about the LG and C who got ABUSED and SKOOLED all game long?
What about Galloway giving up on his routes?
What about Fred Davis dropping to passes that hit his hands?
What about Kyle not adjusting to what the defense is doing? Where were the shorter routes? Oh, I saw a couple but Galloway dropped one of them.

In a game where the ENTIRE OFFENSE IS HORRIFIC?!?!?! Why wait to the last min and make a move that singles out the one player who brings life and confidence to the entire team and fan base IN SPITE OF HIS SHORT-COMINGS?? Why? Why single him out?

The Hogster wrote:When your offensive line is that bad, why not call quicker hitting pass plays though? That interception was on 2nd and 10 and was a 5 step drop. He called those slow developing 5-7 step drops all game. He did it again when Rex was in the game. Did he not see what was happening to our offensive line??

Seems like Kyle just didn't put 2 and 2 together and go to something that maybe they didn't practice this week, but would have been better suited for the pressure.

This is just not true. Re-watch the game. He took his first 7 step drop on the 5th drive at the end of the 2nd qtr. and he only did it once.

I agree that you shouldn't do that if your O-line sucks, but he did make those adjustments. I thought it was pretty awesome actually. He started running draws, screens, and putting Donovan in shotgun.

Then when he lost Torain, he started using 21 packages on passes while the entire game he was using 11 packages for passes. That means he had to put two backs in the backfield to stay in on blocking because Williams was such a liability in the backfield.

PMG12569 wrote:http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/11/01/mike-shanahan-not-happy-with-how-donovan-mcnabb-practices/
[url]
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/player ... 728&id=704[/url]

What is going on??? One bad loss and everything is Effed up now....I am not going to put to much into Mortenson as he has been wrong before (a lot) but what the hell?! Were 4-4 going into the bye week....The sky isnt falling and it seems like were trying to pull it down!

It is not the bad loss. We have seen many of those in the past couple years. From the posts The issue for me is the Shanahans, the switch to Grossman (what did it take, all of 30 seconds for him to score for the Lions?), the conflicting stated reasons for it, the image of McNabb running for his life most of the time (He seemed healthy enough to me and wasn't he the leader in running yards gained!) and the debacle that has taken place since the end of the game. It is now world wide knowledge that the Shanahans and McNabb are on the outs. How is this problem going to effect the other members of the team. Has Shanahan now lost them? I see more of the players supporting McNabb than the Shanahans. It seems to me that the Shanahans are now viewed as liars and have lost the respect of the fans..

The Hogster wrote:

RedskinsFreak wrote:I thought this would be impossible but I believe Shanahan broke the record for Most Shame Caused to the Redskins Organization in a 24-Hour Period.

Now, he's not a candidate for the Cerrato Hall of Shame Fame quite yet, but this is beyond comprehension.

I don't know. I think the Jim Zorn fake punt, pass to nobody might have this beat slightly.

How about "being medium"....... let's be medium about all this stuff going on.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

DarthMonk wrote:I know we're all steamed. I was in shock when REX went in. I think it was a major mistake. I'd like to make a few points. Disagreements with good arguments are welcome.

As much as I'd like to have run the clock out with a 5 point lead, I'm not in dream land. Perhaps we have not run enough in general but against the Lions, if you take away DM's long scamper we ran 18 times for 44 yards. We got the ball with 5:21 left - a virtual eterniity in today's NFL. We ran for no gain on 1st down. We snapped the ball on 2nd down with 4:40 left. If we run two more times and punt they have PLENTY of time AND their timeouts. The best way to eat clock at this point was to make first downs. Time reallly was not the primary issue ... YET. So I don't have a problem with passing there. I would have preferred something quick in the slot that is high percentage and amounts to a run if you complete it but have no problem with a pass in general. The pass called seemed unwise and, of course, the decision to throw where he did simply made things worse.
DarthMonk

That's a totally fair assesment. So why is McNabb being singled out?

Why about the LG and C who got ABUSED and SKOOLED all game long?
What about Galloway giving up on his routes?
What about Fred Davis dropping to passes that hit his hands?
What about Kyle not adjusting to what the defense is doing? Where were the shorter routes? Oh, I saw a couple but Galloway dropped one of them.

In a game where the ENTIRE OFFENSE IS HORRIFIC?!?!?! Why wait to the last min and make a move that singles out the one player who brings life and confidence to the entire team and fan base IN SPITE OF HIS SHORT-COMINGS?? Why? Why single him out?

cuz Shanny is a liar.........

The Hogster wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

I hope he gets further embarrassed cus he deserves it! I hope it makes headlines all the way up to the game and gets dissected like crazy. Both of their ego's need to take a nose dive.

You will get your wish. Our first game back is on Monday Night Football against the Eagles. All eyes would have been on McNabb already. Now they will be squarely on Mike TAN-ahan.

There's no way to defend MS's decision to bench McNabb, without twisting the facts, like MS has done. However, at 4-4, with a division rival coming to town in two weeks, should Skins fans like Hogster and CLL really be pining for someone to check bring the Shannys' egos down a notch, while we're still in the thick of things in the NFC?

I know it's reactionary, and deservedly so, but I'm not ready to turn on THIS coach, not after only half a season.

Right now, the team is average (.500), with half a season to go. Are y'all really ready to jump ship?

Wahoo McDaniels wrote:This has nothing to do with this thread, but I had to add it somewhere.

As much as I can't stand Mike Wise, he had a great name for Carlos Rogers. He called him "Washington's Hands Free Device". I couldn't stop laughing when I read it

I prefer my creation. "Catch-22"

REDEEMEDSKIN wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

I hope he gets further embarrassed cus he deserves it! I hope it makes headlines all the way up to the game and gets dissected like crazy. Both of their ego's need to take a nose dive.

You will get your wish. Our first game back is on Monday Night Football against the Eagles. All eyes would have been on McNabb already. Now they will be squarely on Mike TAN-ahan.

There's no way to defend MS's decision to bench McNabb, without twisting the facts, like MS has done. However, at 4-4, with a division rival coming to town in two weeks, should Skins fans like Hogster and CLL really be pining for someone to check bring the Shannys' egos down a notch, while we're still in the thick of things in the NFC?

I know it's reactionary, and deservedly so, but I'm not ready to turn on THIS coach, not after only half a season.

Right now, the team is average (.500), with half a season to go. Are y'all really ready to jump ship?

I really hate it when people quote you and then end their response with a mischaraterization of what you actually said to make their own point.

Jump ship??? Who is jumping ship?? I'm a fan. I have the right to call B.S. on these Shan-anagins. That does not mean that I am "jumping ship". I have played team sports before, and I know that the men in the locker room are not idiots. They talk about the coaches decisions. And, I have the opinion that Shanahan's decision could have been dealt with, but he is compounding the problem by LYING and DIGGING a DEEPER HOLE. His credibility is seriously in doubt. And, players notice that. As a fan, I would prefer that he not do anything that could fracture the locker room. How is that "jumping ship"?

REDEEMEDSKIN wrote:

The Hogster wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

The Hogster wrote:You could see the look of embarrassment on Kyle's face when he was talking to Rex Grossman.

McNabb looked like he had a cross between an "I'm Mad" and "I told you so you little sh.t" look on his face.

I hope he gets further embarrassed cus he deserves it! I hope it makes headlines all the way up to the game and gets dissected like crazy. Both of their ego's need to take a nose dive.

You will get your wish. Our first game back is on Monday Night Football against the Eagles. All eyes would have been on McNabb already. Now they will be squarely on Mike TAN-ahan.

There's no way to defend MS's decision to bench McNabb, without twisting the facts, like MS has done. However, at 4-4, with a division rival coming to town in two weeks, should Skins fans like Hogster and CLL really be pining for someone to check bring the Shannys' egos down a notch, while we're still in the thick of things in the NFC?

I know it's reactionary, and deservedly so, but I'm not ready to turn on THIS coach, not after only half a season.

Right now, the team is average (.500), with half a season to go. Are y'all really ready to jump ship?

I really hate it when people quote you and then end their response with a mischaraterization of what you actually said just to make their own point.

Jump ship??? Who is jumping ship?? I'm a fan. I have the right to call B.S. on these Shan-anagins. That does not mean that I am "jumping ship". Tthe men in the locker room are not idiots. They talk about the coaches decisions. And, I have the opinion that Shanahan's decision could have been dealt with, but he is compounding the problem by LYING and DIGGING a DEEPER HOLE. Not only did he give the most ridiculous post game answer for benching McNabb. He threw the man under the bus by suggesting that he wasn't smart enough to run the 2 minute drill. That he didn't know the "terminology." Really? Sure seems like he knew it well enough to be in there against Green Bay, and Indy. He says that Rex Grossman, a backup who hasn't played or practiced the 2 minute drill this season gave us a better chance to win. I'm supposed to believe that?

Or am I supposed to believe my own eyes and conclude that Kyle Shanahan can't control McNabb and went and told Daddy. "Let's show him I'm right Dad. I may be a 32 year old professional accident of birth, but my scheme works. Let's show him daddy. Rex knows it. Get in there.":shock" Sack, Fumble, Touchdown, GAME. They went into damage control and in moments like this, a man shows his true character. Blame everyone but himself and his son. Would Joe Gibbs, the man on your avatar, EVER have done that?? Would any coach other than maybe Brad Childress or Steve Spurrier do that??

Then the next day, after time to reflect. Does is remove McNabb from under the bus. NO. He backs up and rolls over him again in different directions. Now, he's not in cardiovascular shape, and he's hurt. Yet, fat ass Rex Grossman is in great shape??? WTH.

His credibility is seriously in doubt. And, players notice that. As a fan, I would prefer that he not do anything that could fracture the locker room. How is that "jumping ship"?

Just for the record...I have no problem with Shanny benching McNabb. I think he made a decision to give this team what he thought was the best chance to win, even if it was a bad decision.

http://blog.redskins.com/2010/11/01/mike-shanahan-explains-why-rex-grossman-was-in-among-other-thin/

The link might sway some opinions that MS is just a liar that's trying to cover up a bad choice. I think the media is making this out to be worse than it really is but, then again whats new?

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

Shabutie wrote:I'm confused... Everyone was saying to trust the coaches and that Shannahan knows best. Now people are questioning his decisions? Is it possible that McNabb was not in good enough shape and Grossman does in fact no the two-minute offense better? It appears as if a combination of many factors played into his decision. It is clear that he felt Grossman gave the team a better chance to win.

Check my posts. I've called Mike out about Albert and his mishandling and egotistical ways in that situation. People here were too hell bent on wanting to feel like they were getting Albert back through Shanahan to see that Mike was hurting the team.

Mike just basically shined a light on himself.

-Did you watch Rex play yesterday?
-Did you see the offensive line block yesterday?
-Did you see McNabb extend plays with his escapability, none of which Rex has?!?
- But Mike says Donovan is tired and can't run.... Did you see him run for 45 yards yesterday to set up a TD?! But MIKE SAID HE CAN'T RUN?
- Did you see Rex get murdered behind the line? The same line that McNabb was able to somewhat work with yesterday?


It's plain and simple IF YOU WATCHED THE GAME.

Not sure why you are asking me all of these questions, but I guess I will answer.

-Yes
-Yes
-Yes, I also saw him sack himself twice and miss wide open receivers. He also threw a pick 6 ball that got dropped when we were driving to score. He has had several dropped INTs this year. His decision making and accuracy have been poor.
-Yes, it was his first play in the game. Players have to get used to speed, especially against a DL that is dominating.

That being said, the decision should not have been made when it was. That should have happened at halftime or before the game.

TeeterSalad wrote:Just for the record...I have no problem with Shanny benching McNabb. I think he made a decision to give this team what he thought was the best chance to win, even if it was a bad decision.

http://blog.redskins.com/2010/11/01/mike-shanahan-explains-why-rex-grossman-was-in-among-other-thin/

The link might sway some opinions that MS is just a liar that's trying to cover up a bad choice. I think the media is making this out to be worse than it really is but, then again whats new?

I disagree. The post game presser and this one greatly contradict. And some of the 'reasons' are shady at best. Donovan can scramble for 35 yards, take a beating all day, and all of the sudden he isn't good enough? Not fit enough? Not familiar enough? I call BS STILL...

How hard would it have been for Shanahan to just say. "We think a lot of Donovan, but in that situation, we believed that Rex could have given us the spark that we needed on offense. We struggled all day, and were looking for a spark. Unfortunately it didn't turn out that way."

PERIOD.

WHY IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK?

Maybe because it requires him to admit they were wrong. Blaming Donovan 4 different ways allows the coaches to remain "geniuses" even if only in their own heads.