The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

frankcal20 wrote:I can agree with that but just to add to that, if you fail to leave out the fact that a very decent QB - like Pat Ramsey - were put on some very bad teams and set up to fail b/c of the system(s) they were in were never going to work mostly due to personel or lack thereof.

Jason Campbell didn't start out with a knucklehead like Spurrier as Head Coach ... he started with Joe Gibbs who won three Super Bowls with three different QBs.

And let me replay your least favorite record ... the 2007 Shuffle ... where that terrible oline and too short receivers didn't seem to derail future hall of famer Todd Collins as much as it did unlucky Jason. Remember that?

Ray, I'm worried about you. Now that Campbell is a Raider, you've lost your one and only Redskins related posting topic!

PulpExposure wrote:Ray, I'm worried about you. Now that Campbell is a Raider, you've lost your one and only Redskins related posting topic!

Really, I don't recall ever starting a Jason Campbell thread? Though I do recall posting several very logical, and prophetic observations of which coincidentally came to pass. Including the prediction that changing the color of his jersey would do little to change the statistical shortcomings which revolve around his well documented allergy to scoring points.

And, just a little trivia quiz .... what do Donavan McNabb and Rex Grossman have that Jason Campbell doesn't have? (aside from a Mike Shanahan playbook) .... a touchdown pass after two preseason games with his new team.

Eerily familiar, don't you think?

RayNAustin wrote:I do recall posting several very logical, and prophetic observations of which coincidentally came to pass. Including the prediction that changing the color of his jersey would do little to change the statistical shortcomings which revolve around his well documented allergy to scoring points.

And, just a little trivia quiz .... what do Donavan McNabb and Rex Grossman have that Jason Campbell doesn't have? (aside from a Mike Shanahan playbook) .... a touchdown pass after two preseason games with his new team.

Eerily familiar, don't you think?

Well Pulp, he hasn't lost the topic, it's just not a Redskins topic anymore!

I don't know how prophetic it was Ray. Lots of us actually were of the opinion that JC sucked.

JCam did well vs. da Bears.....

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:I do recall posting several very logical, and prophetic observations of which coincidentally came to pass. Including the prediction that changing the color of his jersey would do little to change the statistical shortcomings which revolve around his well documented allergy to scoring points.

And, just a little trivia quiz .... what do Donavan McNabb and Rex Grossman have that Jason Campbell doesn't have? (aside from a Mike Shanahan playbook) .... a touchdown pass after two preseason games with his new team.

Eerily familiar, don't you think?

Well Pulp, he hasn't lost the topic, it's just not a Redskins topic anymore!

I don't know how prophetic it was Ray. Lots of us actually were of the opinion that JC sucked.

Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right? Is that too logical? We must have disagreed at some point .. or was it ALL my imagination? I'm just at a loss as to how we could have agreed that he sucked all this time and not realized it? Must have been just a big misunderstanding ... that's it ... a mis-communication for 4 years and 100 posts. Wouldn't it have been easier to say hey Ray ... let's not argue, because I agree with you that he sucks? Nah, you just love arguing too much, don't you. Of course you do.

I mean, I used to set my watch by you .... all I had to do is post "the sky is blue" and in 5 minutes or less you were giving me a weather report of rain.

But my belated thanks to you for agreeing with me (it really means a lot to me) ... and now I feel bad for what I was thinking ... cuz you really are a smart fellow after all ... and a prophet too !

RayNAustin wrote:Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right?

Yes, there was a difference. The difference was that we thought he needed to play better, but he was our best option and you ripped him without really proposing anything. So Ray, if you're teaching a pre-school class and ask, "what is 2 + 2?" One kid screams and does hand stands and shouts "FOUR" at the top of his lungs. Another kid quietly at the same time says "four." Now, was the one who shouted the answer and did all the antics more correct?

But in fairness, you do "recall" ihow we were all JC's itches and had put him in the HOF on draft day and despite your inability to come up with more then a couple a quotes (none from me) saying that, I do believe you'd pass a lie detector test that you believe it.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right?

Yes, there was a difference. The difference was that we thought he needed to play better, but he was our best option and you ripped him without really proposing anything.

That's totally inaccurate, Kaz. You claim we had no better option and I claim that another option was never tried except when it was forced by injury. Remember that?

I recall pointing to Campbell as the common denominator for the Skin's offense going an entire half a season in 2007 without a single TD pass to a wide receiver ..... the response was ... lousy receivers and no time to throw. And to suggest that I was not confronted, and often ridiculed by a MAJORITY consensus that it was not the QB that was the problem is pure revisionist history on your part.

And without the injury to Campbell, and the 180 turnabout in the performance of the offense with Collins at QB, the debate would have remained subjective opinion, with no evidence to to support either contention. Of course, we all saw what happened. Didn't we?

And, even after that experience, the majority rejected the idea of an open competition for the position in the 2008 offseason ... with the majority stubbornly dismissing that evidence for various reasons, while maintaining the consensus opinion that Campbell was still the best option we had.

The reality is, the Redskins organization made the decision to to sink or swim with Campbell based on the investment made in him, though the futility of their position became apparent after the 2008 season in which they tried to shop him unsuccessfully, and failed in two attempts to replace him (Sanchez and Cutler). And even then, many suggested how poorly Campbell was being treated by the organization, claiming that he was never given a fair chance to succeed due to poor talent around him, coaching changes that were responsible for his slow development ... on and on. 2009 was a lame duck season for both Campbell and Zorn who was brought in as a desperate attempt to coach him up. The results were the blind leading the blind, and as I recall, while the Redskins suffered one of their worst seasons in memory, still, Campbell fans were pointing to his statistical improvements in spite of being the most unfortunate QB in the NFL to be stuck with a lousy team around him.

Now, he is gone .... finally .... and now Jim Zorn is back where he started ... giving yoga lessons and throwing pillows at QB's ... in Baltimore.

At least that's what I remember happening.

Even though he's in Oakland, I still think he spells his name Jason CamPbell.

RayNAustin wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right?

Yes, there was a difference. The difference was that we thought he needed to play better, but he was our best option and you ripped him without really proposing anything.

That's totally inaccurate, Kaz. You claim we had no better option and I claim that another option was never tried except when it was forced by injury. Remember that?

...

And, even after that experience, the majority rejected the idea of an open competition for the position in the 2008 offseason

Yes I do, and I remember my rebuttal. There was always an open competition. It was on the....practice field..... You always ignored that and wanted to start guys who we had no reason to believe were in any way ready to take over the helm. Colt blows. You take late round shots and usually they don't pan out, like Colt. Todd is a never was and never gonna be.

Jason has the physical skills. He may have the raw intelligence. But he doesn't have the quick mental reaction necessary to be an NFL quarterback and no amount of practice was going to change that. But it was a better shot to try then switch to guys who couldn't even do it on the practice field.

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right?

Yes, there was a difference. The difference was that we thought he needed to play better, but he was our best option and you ripped him without really proposing anything.

That's totally inaccurate, Kaz. You claim we had no better option and I claim that another option was never tried except when it was forced by injury. Remember that?

...

And, even after that experience, the majority rejected the idea of an open competition for the position in the 2008 offseason

Yes I do, and I remember my rebuttal. There was always an open competition. It was on the....practice field..... You always ignored that and wanted to start guys who we had no reason to believe were in any way ready to take over the helm. Colt blows. You take late round shots and usually they don't pan out, like Colt. Todd is a never was and never gonna be.

Jason has the physical skills. He may have the raw intelligence. But he doesn't have the quick mental reaction necessary to be an NFL quarterback and no amount of practice was going to change that. But it was a better shot to try then switch to guys who couldn't even do it on the practice field.

Kaz.. that's the most ACCURATE thing I've ever seen you type my friend.. and welcome back by the way!

langleyparkjoe wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:

KazooSkinsFan wrote:

RayNAustin wrote:Well Kaz ...that's really quite interesting ... I recall you and several others having a different opinion than I, otherwise we would have been in agreement all along ... right?

Yes, there was a difference. The difference was that we thought he needed to play better, but he was our best option and you ripped him without really proposing anything.

That's totally inaccurate, Kaz. You claim we had no better option and I claim that another option was never tried except when it was forced by injury. Remember that?

...

And, even after that experience, the majority rejected the idea of an open competition for the position in the 2008 offseason

Yes I do, and I remember my rebuttal. There was always an open competition. It was on the....practice field..... You always ignored that and wanted to start guys who we had no reason to believe were in any way ready to take over the helm. Colt blows. You take late round shots and usually they don't pan out, like Colt. Todd is a never was and never gonna be.

Jason has the physical skills. He may have the raw intelligence. But he doesn't have the quick mental reaction necessary to be an NFL quarterback and no amount of practice was going to change that. But it was a better shot to try then switch to guys who couldn't even do it on the practice field.

Kaz.. that's the most ACCURATE thing I've ever seen you type my friend.. and welcome back by the way!

Thanks! Oh, and Thanks! I'm excited about the year coming up. I'm only looking for a decent year record wise, but improvement. If we're in the games up to the end and show discipline and improve through the year, I'd be thrilled. And it's so cool we get the reset on the cap. Hopefully the new regime does a better job then the old one on that.

He apparently tweaked his wrist during the game.

Yeah. He got slammed to the ground and was carted off. He either busted up his hip or knee. I can't remember.

frankcal20 wrote:Yeah. He got slammed to the ground and was carted off. He either busted up his hip or knee. I can't remember.

I heard a stinger and a wrist injury.

That's right. It was a stinger where he was numb yet again like last year. Thats what I get for watching 3 games at once.

frankcal20 wrote:That's right. It was a stinger where he was numb yet again like last year. Thats what I get for watching 3 games at once.

How long is he out?

He was actually back throwing at practice today.

Too bad for the Raiders.

I think they traded him to another team with an awful o-line so no one would blame last year on their terrible roster building, just the qb.

brad7686 wrote:I think they traded him to another team with an awful o-line so no one would blame last year on their terrible roster building, just the qb.

I think we traded him to the Raiders because they actually gave us a #4 for him when no one else was offering anything...

brad7686 wrote:I think they traded him to another team with an awful o-line so no one would blame last year on their terrible roster building, just the qb.

The most desperate defend Campbell at all costs post in history...

Countertrey wrote:

brad7686 wrote:I think they traded him to another team with an awful o-line so no one would blame last year on their terrible roster building, just the qb.

The most desperate defend Campbell at all costs post in history...

I'm sorry, that's just an excuse - Campbell just never showed any ability to be:
1) an NFL QB, except perhaps as a back-up - but that remains to be seen
2) able to give an offense an ability to score from anywhere on the field at any time
3) a leader

there is nobody in the NFL or a fan of the NFL EXCEPT for maybe some Campbell family members that think that Campbell could EVER be a successful NFL QB

are you kidding me?

we absolutely made a terrific deal to get a draft choice for this guy - he was going to be available for nothing

brad7686 is just kidding you - he knows better - Jason Campbell is NOT an NFL starting QB

SkinsJock wrote:there is nobody in the NFL or a fan of the NFL EXCEPT for maybe some Campbell family members that think that Campbell could EVER be a successful NFL QB

There are a few people on the site who defend him endlessly. If brad was kidding there are too many people who say those things for real for it to be clear it's a joke. Isn't Ray a JC homey constantly sticking up for him? I know there are a few on the site...