The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

CanesSkins26 wrote:

Also, look at all the players who jumped up to his defense as a leader.

Which players? You mean ey, who today said that there is no offensive leadership on the Redskins?

ey never said that. Are you in your own little world? He said it was hard for Campbell to show his leadership since he got no support from the front office. Also this is from the post:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redski ... clear.html

In texts I received from several of Campbell's teammates, they told me they were glad Campbell spoke out. Regardless of what anyone thinks of Campbell as a quarterback, his teammates wrote, he leads by example, and his toughness and dedication to his teammates is considered second to none in the locker room...

If Portis didn't want his comments about Campbell's leadership abilities to be misconstrued, one player told me, he shouldn't have said anything about Campbell.

fleetus wrote:Offense - this is Shanahan's background. He worked for SF, under Seifert, and brought the West Coast system to Denver.
1. QB - Campbell is an enigma. He's a solid player physically, has solid character on and off the field, but has not developed markedly. Sort of a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. If you let him go, who do you replace him with? I don't think it would be smart to burn the #4 pick on a QB, especially with the QB's in this years draft. I see Shanny keeping Campbell to see what he can do with an imporoved O-line. Then maybe drafting a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round or waiting until next years draft.

do you really think that we can get an effective offensive line here this season - I mean anything is an improvement but an effective line takes longer than that - we should stop making plans that are unrealistic - having a line that can play effectively against the teams in the NFC East is going to take more time - by the time the line is playing well Campbell will have been replaced by somebody else - he's a good QB but he's not good enough behind any line

now if Shanahan thinks that Bradford can be a very good QB for 10 - 12 years he should bring him in and IF Campbell is the best option at QB then he should be kept on here until Bradford gets a line he can play behind

SKINFAN wrote:ah, so we need to add more linemen up front? Nah just jesting, I didn't know what ZBS was either. So do the TE and FB do Blocking duties too? Or the line just moves more lateral than the usual pushing forward.

They block forward, sideways, whatever the play calls for. But instead of being assigned a man to block, heads up, they block an area. So when the guard comes off the line, he may block the DT, or he may fire into the LB's 5 yards deep. This means the OL has to be quick and agile to get to those areas and it requires they be smart so they know how to recognize what they're teammates are blocking and to stay within the unit scheme. This gives the RB some consistency because he's not depending on one lineman to open a hole.

Skinsfan55 wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:

Also, look at all the players who jumped up to his defense as a leader.

Which players? You mean ey, who today said that there is no offensive leadership on the Redskins?

ey never said that. Are you in your own little world? He said it was hard for Campbell to show his leadership since he got no support from the front office. Also this is from the post:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/redski ... clear.html

In texts I received from several of Campbell's teammates, they told me they were glad Campbell spoke out. Regardless of what anyone thinks of Campbell as a quarterback, his teammates wrote, he leads by example, and his toughness and dedication to his teammates is considered second to none in the locker room...

If Portis didn't want his comments about Campbell's leadership abilities to be misconstrued, one player told me, he shouldn't have said anything about Campbell.

Actually, that is exactly what ey said. His exact words:

"Well, I'll tell you, the problem with our team is we haven't had a lot of offensive leadership," ey said.

BAsed in the Shanny press conference, I would say he does have final say. He begrudgingly admitted that fact. But he stressed that he always had that in Denver too, but that he always worked with the GM on everything.

Also, B-Mitch stated that he thinks Shanahan hired Bruce Allen, not the other way around. It certainly sounded that way in the press conference.

If you want to try and read into Shanny's comments, I would say:

He somewhat endorsed JC17. and somewhat avoided giving any endorsement of Portis.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

He can power the ball into tight windows or get it deep on long throws as well as showing good touch on shorter routes

I stopped reading right here. You don't have to be a professional scout to see that JC has trouble with his accuracy on down field throws. That is obvious to anyone that watches the Redskins.

Classic. You use Scouts Inc. to backup your opinion, but quit reading them when they don't support what you're saying! C'mon, man...

I kind of agree with Canes on this one though. Campbell has a big arm, but his deep ball has just been woefully off target. I always get excited when he takes a shot downfield, then he overthrows or underthrows the WR by eight yards. If you're just going by what we've seen in games, I don't think that's really disputable.

CanesSkins26 wrote:Actually, that is exactly what ey said. His exact words:

"Well, I'll tell you, the problem with our team is we haven't had a lot of offensive leadership," ey said.

Yeah you did a great job of cutting out one sentence in a lengthy interview. Let me give it a shot:

So it's tough for a guy to take that offseason and really step in and say 'Oh yeah, I'm gonna run this team.' "

ey's exact words.

riggofan wrote:

CanesSkins26 wrote:Actually, that is exactly what ey said. His exact words:

"Well, I'll tell you, the problem with our team is we haven't had a lot of offensive leadership," ey said.

Yeah you did a great job of cutting out one sentence in a lengthy interview. Let me give it a shot:

So it's tough for a guy to take that offseason and really step in and say 'Oh yeah, I'm gonna run this team.' "

ey's exact words.

Right, I understand that he qualified his statement. But the main issue is whether there was offensive leadership and the answer is "no." There might be explanations for why that is, but none of that changes the fact that we lacked leadership on offense.

CanesSkins26 wrote:

He can power the ball into tight windows or get it deep on long throws as well as showing good touch on shorter routes

I stopped reading right here. You don't have to be a professional scout to see that JC has trouble with his accuracy on down field throws. That is obvious to anyone that watches the Redskins.

Can you stop reading right there? ... it's the same source you quote years earlier. You take what they said 4 years earlier but four years later you can't read the whole review

They were right in 2005 and saw improvement over the next 3 to 4 years. Showing improvement is a good thing but JC was so bad with the deep ball improvement doesn't actually equal accurate he just gets the ball closer to where it's should be now, still doesn't get there but he gets it closer.

You can't say he can't throw the deep ball, look at all the deep passes the WRs can't catch up to

CanesSkins26 wrote:, I understand that he qualified his statement. But the main issue is whether there was offensive leadership and the answer is "no." There might be explanations for why that is, but none of that changes the fact that we lacked leadership on offense.

There was no Leadership on the Washington Redskins, doesn't matter what side of the ball we are talking about

Joe Gibbs said in Campbell's post-draft introduction that they liked his deep accuracy in particular. This was to compliment Gibb's running game. Can't believe everything you read about. It's impossible to describe all of his deep throws for his college career in one sentence. The writer is someone who sifts through lots of players in the same manner. Gibbs spent time watching Campbell's games and it meant more to him.

Gibbs was wrong about a few things when he came back to the NFL after many years in NASCAR - Campbell was one of his mistakes - no big deal - we just need to move forward and learn from what we have seen

Shanahan and his crew will evaluate what we have then they will plan what they want to do and finally decide which players here can be coached to execute that plan

while we will add "the best player available" (as we have tried to do in the past) the caveat to that will be as long as that player suits the plan and the other players already here

this is what we have been missing here - we have just added "the best player available"

What Jason needs most is a running game...remember last year he was in the talk for MVP after the first half of the season...

I do have one problem. Didnt we have a coach that hired some of his family a couple of years ago? Im not sure but that scares me. Ecspecially hiring your son. I know what he has accomplished, but should it go that far?

jimmiesfan48 wrote:I do have one problem. Didnt we have a coach that hired some of his family a couple of years ago? Im not sure but that scares me. Ecspecially hiring your son. I know what he has accomplished, but should it go that far?

The last coaches son that was hired had never coached in the NFL, his dad had the same amount of time in the league. This isn't the same thing.

All this current team needs is a new coaching staff on both sides of the ball that will challenge these guys or get them out, a few pieces on the OL, RB and defense and we good.

This team is in desparate need of, get this people, COACHING.... Someone that is going to motivate them and hold them accountable. That means the entire coaching staff needs to go and Coach Shanny rebuild with his own.

If Coach and Bruce suddenly get stupid, then I see a deep playoff run in 2011 and most definitely in 2012 for sure with a stablized franchise.

roybus14 wrote:All this current team needs is a new coaching staff on both sides of the ball that will challenge these guys or get them out, a few pieces on the OL, RB and defense and we good.

This team is in desparate need of, get this people, COACHING.... Someone that is going to motivate them and hold them accountable. That means the entire coaching staff needs to go and Coach Shanny rebuild with his own.

If Coach and Bruce suddenly get stupid, then I see a deep playoff run in 2011 and most definitely in 2012 for sure with a stablized franchise.

Good Point, I think that replacing the whole catching staff would be the best option for the whole team. I think one of the problems was that the Coach Z was to much of a players coach. I think that the players liked him to much as a friend and not as a boss. That shows that the players stood up to him and didnt always listen. I think Coach S will be more of a boss and not as much as a friend. I think, if we have a good off season, then we might have something to offer this year. Go Skins.

roybus14 wrote:All this current team needs is a new coaching staff on both sides of the ball that will challenge these guys or get them out, a few pieces on the OL, RB and defense and we good.

This team is in desparate need of, get this people, COACHING.... Someone that is going to motivate them and hold them accountable. That means the entire coaching staff needs to go and Coach Shanny rebuild with his own.

If Coach and Bruce suddenly get stupid, then I see a deep playoff run in 2011 and most definitely in 2012 for sure with a stablized franchise.

very good point and coaching and being challenged is what they need.
wait and see and i,m ready.

I think the most important change we need is an Attitude change..and get younger at key positions so that they can stay healthy throughtout the season. Some players need to go that are going to say a lot about the direction of this team. PLayers like Philip Daniles who I like...Wynn..Randy Thomas, Ranle El, Rogers to name some have shown that they dont belong. I blieve coach S will make his point and show us how to build a team that can compete in the NFC East.

Now that Coach S expressed himself well about Campbell and it seems like Jason will have a very good shot at staying here, who really would you like to see gone?
Personally I think some players that have been with the team for a long time will be gone. For different reasons but it is all with the purpose of getting better.
For Example, Randy Thomas has to go, he cant stay healthy and it has cost us too much. He is up there in age he was a fan favorite and I always liked him when he was younger, but too many injuries and too expensive to keep. Another player is Phillip Daniles...I always liked him and admire his courage and toughness, but we need to get another guy there younger and faster so that we have have another guy that can rush the passer on first and second downs as well. Carlos Rogers is a players that I used to get excited about and defended him whenever he got burned. But after all this years, I have come to the conclusion that he just does not have it him, he is too inconsistent and has no heart to play at a high level for 16 games. He got benched and burned and all that and he still acts like he is a top corner in the league. HE HAS TO GO!!!
Randle El has lot his place in the line up and he is not good returner, he is a nice guy and I like him as a person, but as a player his best years have come and go ..
Samuels for obious reasons...I always like him but you just cant rely on him anymore plus his injury can affect him for the rest of his life if he keeps playing so he might just retire and go his way.
Other players I still dont know but there are at least 3 or 4 more that might go to ...

Merged

jimmiesfan48 wrote:I do have one problem. Didnt we have a coach that hired some of his family a couple of years ago? Im not sure but that scares me. Ecspecially hiring your son. I know what he has accomplished, but should it go that far?

I think you are going to be very happy we got kyle shanahan. That kid can flat out run an offense. The Texans went from 28th in 2006 to 14th in 2007. Kyle took over in 2008 and they were the #3 and #4 offense the last two years. Obviously some of that is Schaub's maturation, but I think it's in large part because of Kyle.

I studied every potential Xs and Os play and issue possible. I spent my whole life working on that. My goal was that any question a player could have about anything on the field, I'd be able to answer it. ”
—Kyle Shanahan

From what I gathered from his press confrence and interviews. He is going to take a look at the roster and make a playbook according to the Rosters strengths.
Like some have already mentioned this is the NFC East. The Eagles have the leagues biggest offensive line. The Cowboys also have a big offensive line. The Giants are not far behind either. So Shanahan and Allen may assemble a hefty offensive line as well? We will just have to see.

I wont be surprised if the final Roster does not resemble what he had in Denver.

All in all I like what I hear.

what ever the o line will be, alot of this 2010 season will fall on the shoulders of Clinton Portis.

Skinsfan55 wrote:Okay, and here's what that same Scouts Inc. says before the 2009 season:

Comment: Campbell had a very solid season as the Redskins' starting signal caller in 2008. He has progressed over his four years in the league. He adjusted to a new system under first-year head coach Jim Zorn and showed the ability to be patient in the pocket to find second and third options in the passing game. He can power the ball into tight windows or get it deep on long throws as well as showing good touch on shorter routes. He has improved his vision and ability to read defenses over the past two seasons which has made him a much more efficient passer in Zorn's West Coast offense. He runs well for his size and position and can ball the ball down to move the chains. He has improved his improvising in 2008 but needs to continue to improve in this area. Campbell has all the tools to be an excellent quarterback in the NFL and should continue to improve in his second season in Washington's new offensive philosophy. .

So, professional scouts say he's improved since college, and predict he'll improve in 2009 (he did). They also praise his accuracy and long pass ability. They tout his patience and his physical tools.

They kind of pass over the fact that he's had so many systems to learn and he's managed a degree of success in all of them. He's arguably the toughest QB in the league both physically and mentally. Also, look at all the players who jumped up to his defense as a leader.

There's not really any denying his talent. He just had the best season of a Redskins QB in nearly 20 years.

One of the top five most inaccurate posts I have read on this board since joining. No question.

BurgundyandGoldfaith wrote:Joe Gibbs said in Campbell's post-draft introduction that they liked his deep accuracy in particular. Gibbs spent time watching Campbell's games and it meant more to him.

This is exactly why Gibbs has NEVER been a GM. He is a superb coach, but never has had the ability to scout talent. If you actually think that Gibbs was the driving force behind those SB teams, you are sadly mistaken.