Kelly Gimpy Once Again?

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 7:53 pm

LOL so the facts say that they're equally fast, what is there to debate?

Heck, how can one determine Thomas is a step slower when he's never been in a foot race to the endzone in his career? There is very little to no footage of him running at full speed.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:00 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:One 40 time does not mean that they are equally as fast.

Oh... okay. Two football players with identical 40 times at the combine doesn't mean they're equally as fast. Got it. And running on a track is equivalent to running on grass or turf. Got it.

ROTFALMAO

This IS a stupid conversation. See ya... ROTFALMAO

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:07 pm

PulpExposure wrote:I don't really care either way, because this is a stupid conversation, but, let's go back to your original assertion:

Sorry but Thomas isn't anywhere close to being in Andre Johnson's class when it comes to speed.

4.32 and 4.34 at their pro days, and 4.4 at the combine sounds pretty close to me...certainly in the same class.

And as I previously noted, Thomas also posted a 4.34 time on one of his passes at the combine. But like CanesSkins26 said, that's not "anywhere close to being in Andre Johnson's class when it comes to speed."

:roll:

That's more like hyperbole...

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:53 pm

http://www.facebook.com/people/Kelly-Gi ... /732271139

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Sat Jun 06, 2009 11:21 pm

SkinsFreak wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:One 40 time does not mean that they are equally as fast.

Oh... okay. Two football players with identical 40 times at the combine doesn't mean they're equally as fast. Got it. And running on a track is equivalent to running on grass or turf. Got it.

This IS a stupid conversation. See ya...

Different surfaces, different conditions, etc. are why it's difficult to compare two times from different players.

Even though Devin received an official time of 4.40, he did make a pass at 4.34.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

In addition, since Andre Johnson posted his time of 10.29 seconds at the BIG EAST outdoor championship in 2003 in the 100-yard dash, no other runner from that conference has topped his time. So if you want to keep thinking that Thomas is as fast as Andre Johnson go right ahead.

brad7686 · Post by **brad7686** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:31 am

I think its safe to say they are both fast, the question is whether Thomas can catch and run routes like Johnson can. That's what will impress me, not .08 seconds difference in forties.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:54 am

I'm just happy that both are practicing for OTAs...

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 1:12 am

CanesSkins26 wrote:I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

It a significant difference between running at the combines and running in your comfort zone (Pro Days). Under the same conditions they both ran 4.4...

what da problem is

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:12 am

1niksder wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

It a significant difference between running at the combines and running in your comfort zone (Pro Days). Under the same conditions they both ran 4.4... what da problem is

I don't think that it was the same conditions since Andre Johnson didn't work out at the Combine in 2003. In fact, I'm not even sure where the 4.4 time came from. The only official one that Ive seen is the 4.32 from his UM Pro Day.

PulpExposure · Post by **PulpExposure** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:09 am

CanesSkins26 wrote:
1niksder wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

It a significant difference between running at the combines and running in your comfort zone (Pro Days). Under the same conditions they both ran 4.4... what da problem is

I don't think that it was the same conditions since Andre Johnson didn't work out at the Combine in 2003. In fact, I'm not even sure where the 4.4 time came from. The only official one that Ive seen is the 4.32 from his UM Pro Day.

A quick Google search shows that while Johnson didn't do the position specific drills, it appears that he did run the 40 at the NFL Combine. That's probably where that 4.4 came from.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 9:37 am

CanesSkins26 wrote:I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

What are you talking about? Devin's OFFICIAL time at the 2008 combine was a 4.40, an identical time ran by Johnson at the 2003 combine... run on the same surface.

CanesSkins26 wrote:In addition, since Andre Johnson posted his time of 10.29 seconds at the BIG EAST outdoor championship in 2003 in the 100-yard dash, no other runner from that conference has topped his time. So if you want to keep thinking that Thomas is as fast as Andre Johnson go right ahead.

And a time recorded at a track meet in the 100 meter sprint is relevant to football how? Speed for FOOTBALL players is measured for comparison purposes in a 40 yard dash run on grass or turf. Johnson ran that 4.40 at the combine in 2003, 6 years ago, and I'm quite sure humans get faster with age... right?

But whatever man, like always, you spewed a bunch of hyperbole (about a former Hurricane player I might add) and now you're trying to back-peddle. Football players run the 40 on grass/turf and every factual report indicates Johnson and Thomas ran identical times. That is fact and cannot be disputed.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:13 pm

But whatever man, like always, you spewed a bunch of hyperbole (about a former Hurricane player I might add) and now you're trying to back-peddle. Football players run the 40 on grass/turf and every factual report indicates Johnson and Thomas ran identical times. That is fact and cannot be disputed.

Actually every factual report doesn't indicate that. From this very site...

The receivers were disappointing although Andre Johnson, Charles Rogers, Bryant Johnson and Taylor Jacobs did not work out. None of the receivers blazed up the 40 with Tyrone Calico posting the fastest time at around 4.33. Ryan Hoag from little Gustavus-Adolphus provided probably the biggest surprise running very well (4.42), catching everything thrown at him and he stood out in a day of mediocrity. Two other small schools also provided some of the day's brightest performances as Utah State's Kevin Curtis and East Tennessee State's Cecil Moore both performed well both in the dash and in the passing drills. Florida State's Anquan Boldin hurt his draft value the most with a 4.7 40 time and then struggling to catch the ball.

Also, a list of participants from the 2003 Combine from this site...

Wide Receivers

Sam Aiken - North Carolina
Arnaz Battle - Notre Dame
Ronald Bellamy - Michigan
Jamal Burke - Boston College
Nate Burleson - Nevada
Mike Bush - Washington St
Tyrone Calico - Middle Tennessee
Kevin Curtis - Utah St
LaTarance - Dunbar TCU
Terence Edwards - Georgia
Lee Evans - Wisconsin
Doug Gabriel - Central Florida
Justin Gage - Missouri
Talman Gardner - Florida St
Ryan Hoag - Gustavas College
Keenan Howry - Oregon
Taylor Jacobs - Florida
Bethel Johnson - Texas A&M
Bryant Johnson - Penn St
Kareem Kelly - USC
Adrian Madise - TCU
Junior Mahe - BYU
Billy McMullen - Virginia
Cecil Moore - East Tennessee St
Carl Morris - Havard
Kaseem Osgood - San Diego St
Antwone Savage - Oklahoma
Kyle Shanahan - Texas
Dan Stricker - Vanderbilt
J.R. Tolver - San Diego St
Chris Vance - Ohio St
Bobby Wade - Arizona
Kerry Watkins - Georgia Tech
Walter Young - Illinois

1niksder · Post by **1niksder** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:43 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
1niksder wrote:
CanesSkins26 wrote:I'm not quite sure what you mean by "make a pass at 4.34," but 4.34 was his unofficial time at the combine I believe. The official time was 4.4. Andre Johnson's official Pro Day time of 4.32 was as fast as Darren McFadden's combine run. There is a significant difference between a 4.4 and a 4.32.

It a significant difference between running at the combines and running in your comfort zone (Pro Days). Under the same conditions they both ran 4.4... what da problem is

I don't think that it was the same conditions since Andre Johnson didn't work out at the Combine in 2003. In fact, I'm not even sure where the 4.4 time came from. The only official one that Ive seen is the 4.32 from his UM Pro Day.

Johnson didn't workout but he did particapate in the 40 and the verticle jump. Thomas did the opposite at his pro day.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 8:55 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:Actually every factual report doesn't indicate that. From this very site...

What... was it too difficult or too much work to actually click the links that PulpExposure provided for you? :roll:

Andre Johnson; 1st Round, 2003; 4.40

The receivers picked in the top 20 were 10 pounds heavier, on average, than those in the late first or early-to-mid second round (209 pounds vs. 199). One would expect they would run a slightly slower 40, the 4.4 speed of 230-plus pound receivers like Andre Johnson and Calvin Johnson notwithstanding.

It's tough going when your river of hyperbole starts to dry up, huh? :roll:

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 10:02 pm

It's tough going when your river of hyperbole starts to dry up, huh? Rolling Eyes

Wow you can cherry pick links to post. Congratulations.

André Johnson (4.32 @ University of Miami Pro Day)

This is true, but how much of a genius do you have to be to pull the trigger on a 230 pound wide receiver that runs a 4.32 40 yard dash and has a vertical of 41 inches?

Did I mention Johnson has 4.32 speed?

2. Andre Johnson ** Miami (Fla.), 6-2, 230, 4.28

Is the complete package. Has size, speed and strength. Plays fast. Is aggressive. Gains yards after the catch. Gets open downfield. Catches passes away from his body. Adjust well to underthrown passes. Has the versatility to line up in different places. Will contribute quickly. Must improve blocking skills.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 8:01 am

Do you have links for any of those official times?

All I've ever said is that they both ran a 4.40 at the combine, which is an absolute fact. I then posted reports from his combine 40 times. That isn't cherry picking, that's providing proof of my initial claim. You've said he didn't run at the combine, which is false, or that those times weren't accurate, which also happens to be false.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 8:23 am

CanesSkins26 wrote:
It's tough going when your river of hyperbole starts to dry up, huh? Rolling Eyes

Wow you can cherry pick links to post. Congratulations.

André Johnson (4.32 @ University of Miami Pro Day)

This is true, but how much of a genius do you have to be to pull the trigger on a 230 pound wide receiver that runs a 4.32 40 yard dash and has a vertical of 41 inches?

Did I mention Johnson has 4.32 speed?

2. Andre Johnson ** Miami (Fla.), 6-2, 230, 4.28

Is the complete package. Has size, speed and strength. Plays fast. Is aggressive. Gains yards after the catch. Gets open downfield. Catches passes away from his body. Adjust well to underthrown passes. Has the versatility to line up in different places. Will contribute quickly. Must improve blocking skills.

I googled those references... strong support there, guy. ROTFALMAO

We all know now that Johnson ran a 4.4 at the combine, same as Thomas. So... Andre may have run a 4.32 at a pro day event. Well, Thomas ran a 4.34 at the combine... I saw him post that number with my own eyes.

That still doesn't support you original hyperbole statement of... "Sorry but Thomas isn't anywhere close to being in Andre Johnson's class when it comes to speed."

But I guess 0.02 seconds isn't in the same class. Nor are the identical OFFICIAL combine times of 4.40. You're just all about hyperbole.

But whatever... let's get this thread back on topic. The last 2 1/2 pages have been complete nonsense not related to the topic. I admit fault for not keeping the thread on-topic by thinking CanesSkins26 might man up and admit he was blowing smoke... I was wrong.

Back on topic, please...

It is wise for the team and coaches to take it slow with Kelly. I believe they... or Kelly himself, rushed back a bit too early last year. Kelly needs to take it slow and build strength in his knee, and if successful, could have an incredible year.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:28 pm

Well, Thomas ran a 4.34 at the combine... I saw him post that number with my own eyes.

Wrong. Thomas ran an unofficial time of 4.34 at the combine. That time was later adjusted to 4.4. Nice try though.

VetSkinsFan · Post by **VetSkinsFan** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 2:29 pm

Jesus, who gives a damn about less than one tenth of a second? Really, is it that life threatening? They're both fast. It's not that serious.

CanesSkins26 · Post by **CanesSkins26** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 5:17 pm

VetSkinsFan wrote:Jesus, who gives a damn about less than one tenth of a second? Really, is it that life threatening? They're both fast. It's not that serious.

Yea this thread has gotten out of hand. I guess SkinsFreak and I will have to agree to disagree (as usual).

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:45 pm

CanesSkins26 wrote:
Well, Thomas ran a 4.34 at the combine... I saw him post that number with my own eyes.

Wrong. Thomas ran an unofficial time of 4.34 at the combine. That time was later adjusted to 4.4. Nice try though.

Just for clarification, players make more than one attempt at the 40 yard dash at the combine. Thomas did run a 4.34 on one of his attempts, as I said... I know, I watched him do it on TV. His final or "official" time was a 4.40, as I've said all along... that same exact OFFICIAL time Andre Johnson posted in 2003 at the NFL Combine.

There's nothing to disagree with, those statements are FACT.

But whatever... we all recognize hyperbole when we see it, Canes. Please keep this thread on topic. If you want to continue this extremely stupid conversation to keep denying the obvious facts, start a new thread.