The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

Cappster wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Cappster wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Cappster wrote:I say wait until mid season to lock up Rogers. Lets get some of the "contract year performances" from him first and then lock him up.

You run the risk of him running up his own price. I wouldn't want that to be a distraction during the year and would prefer to get it out of the way before the season starts. He's performed better and better by the year; I don't see why this year won't follow the trend.

True that you run the risk of him running up his asking price, but hopefully he would learn how to catch better if big money is on the line. I mean he should have plenty of opportunities this year if our pass rush performs up to the hype. I see it is a catch 22 situation (no pun intended).

So the only thing you're looking for is contract year motivation? I would rather have the consistancy and improvement he currently has than the type of character it takes to be motivated to go above and byond solely because it's a contract year.

By your illustration, next year, after he gets his contract, he should regress b/c it's no longer motivated by potential contract salary negotiations?

Contract year motivation is not entirely what I am looking for, but it is a part of my "performance theory." I am hoping the same happens for Campbell as he will perform his best in his contract year. I am not saying that CR should regress after getting the big contract, but just in my observations, players tend to put a little more umph into what they are doing when a new contract is on the line. This is, after all, professional sports and everyone wants a piece of the cash pie. After he gets his *BIG* contract, I would hope that he wants to prove why he worth all of the money given to him.

So in theory, play crazy out of the mind football to get the contract and then play crazy out of the mind football to prove you are worth the contract. I am hoping that is what Haynesworth does this year and if it works for him then it can work for other players.

In theory, I would agree. That goes against how the NFL operates though. Lots of long term contracts go against that 'performance boost' for contract years by not having as many contract years to milk that extra effort out of. Just sign 'em all to two year contracts and Super Bowl here we come!!!!

Disclaimer: I'm just messin with ya, Capp. It's finally sunny out for more than 1/2 a day and I don't have homework to do tonite, so I can clean one of my disgustingly filthy vehicles!

Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Man, just give Carlos the money and cut the bull. The man is a good DB. We've gave MORE money to lesser talent.

Why be a cheap youknowhat with our own players?

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Man, just give Carlos the money and cut the bull. The man is a good DB. We've gave MORE money to lesser talent.

Why be a cheap youknowhat with our own players?

Agree. Lock him up now. It's hard to top his coverage skills, and anyone who thinks his hands will improve if there is money on the line is just not thinking. Pay the man. Now.

Countertrey wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Man, just give Carlos the money and cut the bull. The man is a good DB. We've gave MORE money to lesser talent.

Why be a cheap youknowhat with our own players?

Agree. Lock him up now. It's hard to top his coverage skills, and anyone who thinks his hands will improve if there is money on the line is just not thinking. Pay the man. Now.

If we all think alike then no one is thinking at all. I agree that the guy has cover skills and I won't argue that point. My whole argument is that players somehow seem to rise above and have their best years when they are playing for that big contract extension. Lets get some of that contract year play out of him before we give him the big money.

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Cappster wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Cappster wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Cappster wrote:I say wait until mid season to lock up Rogers. Lets get some of the "contract year performances" from him first and then lock him up.

You run the risk of him running up his own price. I wouldn't want that to be a distraction during the year and would prefer to get it out of the way before the season starts. He's performed better and better by the year; I don't see why this year won't follow the trend.

True that you run the risk of him running up his asking price, but hopefully he would learn how to catch better if big money is on the line. I mean he should have plenty of opportunities this year if our pass rush performs up to the hype. I see it is a catch 22 situation (no pun intended).

So the only thing you're looking for is contract year motivation? I would rather have the consistancy and improvement he currently has than the type of character it takes to be motivated to go above and byond solely because it's a contract year.

By your illustration, next year, after he gets his contract, he should regress b/c it's no longer motivated by potential contract salary negotiations?

Contract year motivation is not entirely what I am looking for, but it is a part of my "performance theory." I am hoping the same happens for Campbell as he will perform his best in his contract year. I am not saying that CR should regress after getting the big contract, but just in my observations, players tend to put a little more umph into what they are doing when a new contract is on the line. This is, after all, professional sports and everyone wants a piece of the cash pie. After he gets his *BIG* contract, I would hope that he wants to prove why he worth all of the money given to him.

So in theory, play crazy out of the mind football to get the contract and then play crazy out of the mind football to prove you are worth the contract. I am hoping that is what Haynesworth does this year and if it works for him then it can work for other players.

In theory, I would agree. That goes against how the NFL operates though. Lots of long term contracts go against that 'performance boost' for contract years by not having as many contract years to milk that extra effort out of. Just sign 'em all to two year contracts and Super Bowl here we come!!!!

Disclaimer: I'm just messin with ya, Capp. It's finally sunny out for more than 1/2 a day and I don't have homework to do tonite, so I can clean one of my disgustingly filthy vehicles!

We all know Snyder goes against how the NFL operates as a whole

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Can anyone answer my question?

skinsfan#33 wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Can anyone answer my question?

Do you mean $4 million under the cap before cutting JT? So cutting Taylor would put them about $12.5 million under after cutting Taylor. I believe the answer is D. Hall. He agreed to his contract on 2/27, with a cap number for 2009 of $5.3 million, more than the available cap space at the time. Taylor was cut on March 2, and Hall officially signed his contract that day, taking the available cap space to about $7 million.

SnyderSucks wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Can anyone answer my question?

Do you mean $4 million under the cap before cutting JT? So cutting Taylor would put them about $12.5 million under after cutting Taylor. I believe the answer is D. Hall. He agreed to his contract on 2/27, with a cap number for 2009 of $5.3 million, more than the available cap space at the time. Taylor was cut on March 2, and Hall officially signed his contract that day, taking the available cap space to about $7 million.

Well that explains it. They anounced his signing way before they released JT. How were they actually going to be able to sign him if they didn't cut JT. Sounds fishy!

Marcus Washington to play LB on passing downs...if he agrees to take a haircut.

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Let's see Jason Taylor was released 3/2/09

The Redskins ...


Signed Punter Dirk Johnson on 3/5/09
Re-Signed UFA Linebacker Alfred Fincher and UFA Safety Reed Doughty on 3/10/09
Kicker Shaun Suisham Signed His Tender and signed Defensive Lineman Renaldo Wynn on 3/16/09
Defensive Tackle Anthony Montgomery Signed His Tender on 3/25/09
Signed Defensive End Phillip Daniels on 3/30/09
Signed Linebacker Robert Thomas on 4/2/09
Defensive Tackle Kedric Golston Signed His Tender on 4/10/09
Signed Punter Hunter Smith on 4/23/09
Signed Offensive Tackle Mike Williams on 4/24/09

On 4/27/09 they Signed Missouri Quarterback Chase Daniel, Center Edwin Williams, Offensive Lineman Scott Burley, Tight Ends Robert Agnone and Devin Frischknecht , Defensive Tackles Antonio Dixon and Brigham Harwell, Cornerback Doug Dutch, Wide Receivers John Halman and Jaison Williams, Safety Lendy Holmes as Undrafted Free Agents.

They also Claimed Running Back Marcus Mason Off Of Waivers on 4/26/09

And signed street free agents Defensive Lineman Vaka Manapuna, Offensive Lineman Jeremy Bridges, Wide Receiver Trent Shelton, Signed Wide Receiver Roydell Williams, Defensive End J.D. Skolnitsky, Linebacker Darrel Young and Wide Receiver Keith Eloi between 5/1/09 and 5/7/09

I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting someone. They have signed players since Taylor was cut

I missed it when we resigned Fincher. I like this guy!

skinsfan#33 wrote:Well that explains it. They anounced his signing way before they released JT. How were they actually going to be able to sign him if they didn't cut JT. Sounds fishy!

Of course it does. He was a dolphin for years.

tcwest10 wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:.. How were they actually going to be able to sign him if they didn't cut JT. Sounds fishy!

Of course it does. He was a dolphin for years.

- smells fishy too -

you guys are wack.. we need to fire EVERYONE except for Jason Campbell and rebuild the team around him.. duuuuuh

1niksder wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Let's see Jason Taylor was released 3/2/09

The Redskins ...


Signed Punter Dirk Johnson on 3/5/09
Re-Signed UFA Linebacker Alfred Fincher and UFA Safety Reed Doughty on 3/10/09
Kicker Shaun Suisham Signed His Tender and signed Defensive Lineman Renaldo Wynn on 3/16/09
Defensive Tackle Anthony Montgomery Signed His Tender on 3/25/09
Signed Defensive End Phillip Daniels on 3/30/09
Signed Linebacker Robert Thomas on 4/2/09
Defensive Tackle Kedric Golston Signed His Tender on 4/10/09
Signed Punter Hunter Smith on 4/23/09
Signed Offensive Tackle Mike Williams on 4/24/09

On 4/27/09 they Signed Missouri Quarterback Chase Daniel, Center Edwin Williams, Offensive Lineman Scott Burley, Tight Ends Robert Agnone and Devin Frischknecht , Defensive Tackles Antonio Dixon and Brigham Harwell, Cornerback Doug Dutch, Wide Receivers John Halman and Jaison Williams, Safety Lendy Holmes as Undrafted Free Agents.

They also Claimed Running Back Marcus Mason Off Of Waivers on 4/26/09

And signed street free agents Defensive Lineman Vaka Manapuna, Offensive Lineman Jeremy Bridges, Wide Receiver Trent Shelton, Signed Wide Receiver Roydell Williams, Defensive End J.D. Skolnitsky, Linebacker Darrel Young and Wide Receiver Keith Eloi between 5/1/09 and 5/7/09

I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting someone. They have signed players since Taylor was cut

Most of those players had little or no impact on cap status. The players that signed their tenders were already included in the cap figure as soon as they were offered the tenders - so no impact. Additionally, only the top 51 contracts count against the cap, so most of the rest of those players again had no impact on the cap - they weren't in the top 51. The guys like Fincher who were in the top 51 only displaced the difference between their salary (Fincher 510,000) and whoever got bumped out of the top 51 - someone like Horton at 395,000. That's also why signing the draft picks, aside from Orakpo, will have no impact on the cap - they will be making the minimum and displacing someone make at least as much or more.

Barnes may show up, too.

SnyderSucks wrote:

1niksder wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Let's see Jason Taylor was released 3/2/09

The Redskins ...


Signed Punter Dirk Johnson on 3/5/09
Re-Signed UFA Linebacker Alfred Fincher and UFA Safety Reed Doughty on 3/10/09
Kicker Shaun Suisham Signed His Tender and signed Defensive Lineman Renaldo Wynn on 3/16/09
Defensive Tackle Anthony Montgomery Signed His Tender on 3/25/09
Signed Defensive End Phillip Daniels on 3/30/09
Signed Linebacker Robert Thomas on 4/2/09
Defensive Tackle Kedric Golston Signed His Tender on 4/10/09
Signed Punter Hunter Smith on 4/23/09
Signed Offensive Tackle Mike Williams on 4/24/09

On 4/27/09 they Signed Missouri Quarterback Chase Daniel, Center Edwin Williams, Offensive Lineman Scott Burley, Tight Ends Robert Agnone and Devin Frischknecht , Defensive Tackles Antonio Dixon and Brigham Harwell, Cornerback Doug Dutch, Wide Receivers John Halman and Jaison Williams, Safety Lendy Holmes as Undrafted Free Agents.

They also Claimed Running Back Marcus Mason Off Of Waivers on 4/26/09

And signed street free agents Defensive Lineman Vaka Manapuna, Offensive Lineman Jeremy Bridges, Wide Receiver Trent Shelton, Signed Wide Receiver Roydell Williams, Defensive End J.D. Skolnitsky, Linebacker Darrel Young and Wide Receiver Keith Eloi between 5/1/09 and 5/7/09

I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting someone. They have signed players since Taylor was cut

Most of those players had little or no impact on cap status. The players that signed their tenders were already included in the cap figure as soon as they were offered the tenders - so no impact. Additionally, only the top 51 contracts count against the cap, so most of the rest of those players again had no impact on the cap - they weren't in the top 51. The guys like Fincher who were in the top 51 only displaced the difference between their salary (Fincher 510,000) and whoever got bumped out of the top 51 - someone like Horton at 395,000. That's also why signing the draft picks, aside from Orakpo, will have no impact on the cap - they will be making the minimum and displacing someone make at least as much or more.

SS,
You beat me to it. When I said we hadn't signed anyone since letting JT go, I meant people that would impact the cap. You explained it very well.

SnyderSucks wrote:

1niksder wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Let's see Jason Taylor was released 3/2/09

The Redskins ...


Signed Punter Dirk Johnson on 3/5/09
Re-Signed UFA Linebacker Alfred Fincher and UFA Safety Reed Doughty on 3/10/09
Kicker Shaun Suisham Signed His Tender and signed Defensive Lineman Renaldo Wynn on 3/16/09
Defensive Tackle Anthony Montgomery Signed His Tender on 3/25/09
Signed Defensive End Phillip Daniels on 3/30/09
Signed Linebacker Robert Thomas on 4/2/09
Defensive Tackle Kedric Golston Signed His Tender on 4/10/09
Signed Punter Hunter Smith on 4/23/09
Signed Offensive Tackle Mike Williams on 4/24/09

On 4/27/09 they Signed Missouri Quarterback Chase Daniel, Center Edwin Williams, Offensive Lineman Scott Burley, Tight Ends Robert Agnone and Devin Frischknecht , Defensive Tackles Antonio Dixon and Brigham Harwell, Cornerback Doug Dutch, Wide Receivers John Halman and Jaison Williams, Safety Lendy Holmes as Undrafted Free Agents.

They also Claimed Running Back Marcus Mason Off Of Waivers on 4/26/09

And signed street free agents Defensive Lineman Vaka Manapuna, Offensive Lineman Jeremy Bridges, Wide Receiver Trent Shelton, Signed Wide Receiver Roydell Williams, Defensive End J.D. Skolnitsky, Linebacker Darrel Young and Wide Receiver Keith Eloi between 5/1/09 and 5/7/09

I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting someone. They have signed players since Taylor was cut

Most of those players had little or no impact on cap status. The players that signed their tenders were already included in the cap figure as soon as they were offered the tenders - so no impact. Additionally, only the top 51 contracts count against the cap, so most of the rest of those players again had no impact on the cap - they weren't in the top 51. The guys like Fincher who were in the top 51 only displaced the difference between their salary (Fincher 510,000) and whoever got bumped out of the top 51 - someone like Horton at 395,000. That's also why signing the draft picks, aside from Orakpo, will have no impact on the cap - they will be making the minimum and displacing someone make at least as much or more.

He said no one was signed he didn't say no one was signed that impacted the cap. Wynn, Daniels, Fincher and others recieved signing bounuses so the they did have some impact on the bottom line but thanks for the knowledge

1niksder wrote:

SnyderSucks wrote:

1niksder wrote:

skinsfan#33 wrote:Someone answer me how we were like $4M over the cap before we cut JT saving $8.5M and we haven't signed anyone since, yet we have less than $8M left when the cap just went up another $850K

Let's see Jason Taylor was released 3/2/09

The Redskins ...


Signed Punter Dirk Johnson on 3/5/09
Re-Signed UFA Linebacker Alfred Fincher and UFA Safety Reed Doughty on 3/10/09
Kicker Shaun Suisham Signed His Tender and signed Defensive Lineman Renaldo Wynn on 3/16/09
Defensive Tackle Anthony Montgomery Signed His Tender on 3/25/09
Signed Defensive End Phillip Daniels on 3/30/09
Signed Linebacker Robert Thomas on 4/2/09
Defensive Tackle Kedric Golston Signed His Tender on 4/10/09
Signed Punter Hunter Smith on 4/23/09
Signed Offensive Tackle Mike Williams on 4/24/09

On 4/27/09 they Signed Missouri Quarterback Chase Daniel, Center Edwin Williams, Offensive Lineman Scott Burley, Tight Ends Robert Agnone and Devin Frischknecht , Defensive Tackles Antonio Dixon and Brigham Harwell, Cornerback Doug Dutch, Wide Receivers John Halman and Jaison Williams, Safety Lendy Holmes as Undrafted Free Agents.

They also Claimed Running Back Marcus Mason Off Of Waivers on 4/26/09

And signed street free agents Defensive Lineman Vaka Manapuna, Offensive Lineman Jeremy Bridges, Wide Receiver Trent Shelton, Signed Wide Receiver Roydell Williams, Defensive End J.D. Skolnitsky, Linebacker Darrel Young and Wide Receiver Keith Eloi between 5/1/09 and 5/7/09

I'm pretty sure I'm forgetting someone. They have signed players since Taylor was cut

Most of those players had little or no impact on cap status. The players that signed their tenders were already included in the cap figure as soon as they were offered the tenders - so no impact. Additionally, only the top 51 contracts count against the cap, so most of the rest of those players again had no impact on the cap - they weren't in the top 51. The guys like Fincher who were in the top 51 only displaced the difference between their salary (Fincher 510,000) and whoever got bumped out of the top 51 - someone like Horton at 395,000. That's also why signing the draft picks, aside from Orakpo, will have no impact on the cap - they will be making the minimum and displacing someone make at least as much or more.

He said no one was signed he didn't say no one was signed that impacted the cap. Wynn, Daniels, Fincher and others recieved signing bounuses so the they did have some impact on the bottom line but thanks for the knowledge

Misread that at first. Fincher, Wynn, Daniels, Albright were all signed under the rule that you pay them the veteran minimum and a small bonus, but they only count $510,000 against the cap. Wynn got a $50,000 bonus and $845,000 salary.

skinsfan#33 wrote:
SS,
You beat me to it. When I said we hadn't signed anyone since letting JT go, I meant people that would impact the cap. You explained it very well.

Robert Thomas, Reed Doughty, Mike Williams, Hunter Smith, Wynn, Daniels and Fincher all were signed and had a impact on the cap after Taylor was released. Jason Campbell, Carlos Rogers and Mike Sellers reached performance escalators last year and those figures were added to the cap after Jason Taylor got the axe

SnyderSucks wrote:Misread that at first. Fincher, Wynn, Daniels, Albright were all signed under the rule that you pay them the veteran minimum and a small bonus, but they only count $510,000 against the cap. Wynn got a $50,000 bonus and $845,000 salary.

They all moved into the top 51, so they impacted the cap

BTW, if I recall, 1nik is our cap guru here...

VetSkinsFan wrote:BTW, if I recall, 1nik is our cap guru here...

Yeah... but what does he know?

1niksder wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:BTW, if I recall, 1nik is our cap guru here...

Yeah... but what does he know?

Where did you find all the signings with dates? I couldn't find anything with dates without searching each player individually.