brad7686 wrote:Um, no not at all.
Moss rarely gets open downfield anymore, and he dropped many catchable balls when he did. Why? Because he has bad hands, doesn't adjust to the ball, and is short. Randle El is never open downfield. Thomas didn't get open downfield. Kelly got hit in the chest with one and dropped it. That's a summary of our downfield passing this year. Maybe JC messed up 3 or 4, but more were just balls no one made a play on. I don't know if you have ever watched T.O., Plax, or Fitz play, or even Rowdy Roddy, Jennings, Andre Johnson, Houshmandzadeh, Colston, etc., but we do not have anyone half as good in a jump ball situation as they are, and they also have the physicality to keep corners off them downfield. It would be one thing if Moss still had young speed like DeSean Jackson, but he no longer does.
T.O. ? T.O. ? Doesn't he lead the league or close to leading it in dropped passes? And Campbell missed 3 or 4 plays ALL YEAR ????
First, this critique of Santana Moss is absurd, and he's open down field in virtually every game with Campbell failing to even notice him (which also obliterates the nonsense that Campbell only fouled up 3 or 4 passes all year. The truth is more like 3-4 passes or more PER GAME). And unlike last year, when Moss's nagging injuries were being used as an excuse, he remained relatively healthy this year, and was constantly getting behind the secondaries DEEP. Had he had a QB on his team, he'd have finished in the top 5 receivers in the league. As it turned out, he still had more catches and more yards than many of the names you mentioned that are supposedly so superior to him.
brad7686 wrote:Look at Favre with Greg Jennings and then without like this year in New York. Rodgers played much better than Favre did. Why? Greg Jennings is a beast. The jets have a better version of Moss/El in Cotchery/Coles, but they still aren't big playmakers downfield. That's why Favre struggled. Other than Drew Brees after Colston got hurt, there is no one in the league putting up big passing numbers without an elite receiver in the NFL.
Greg Jennings had 1 more catch than Santana, and 250 more yards for the year. And I contend that the difference is that Rodgers performed head and shoulders above Campbell. I'd also contend that there is not an elite receiver out there that doesn't have a solid QB throwing to him. And yes, let's do look at Favre without the 'beasts' that Rodgers apparently has, he still threw 22 TD's compared to Campbell's paltry 13.
Another case in point: look at Randy Moss 2007 numbers with Brady and then look at his numbers in 2008 with Cassel. Did Randy lose a step or forget how to get open? That's what they were saying about him when he was with the Raiders, but as soon as he landed in New England with Brady, he put that nonsense to bed. No. Brady is just a superior QB, as is Brees, Warner, Rivers, Cutler, and the first year starter Rodgers who had never started an NFL game in his life before this year and still threw for over 4,000 yards and 28 TDs......which should also dispel the lame notion that it takes 4 years for a young QB to BEGIN TO PERFORM at a high level.
brad7686 wrote:If JC's release was as slow as you say, all his downfield throws would have been picked by safeties. That didn't happen. He does however, get out of the snap slowly which prevents quick passing. That would be a key problem that needs to be fixed. Especially watching Warner pick apart the Eagles blitz the other day with quick passes.
Ridiculous. Quite often his throws are well overthrown down field, and fall incomplete. Other times he doesn't even throw it or see the open receiver, and when he does, he waits too long, allowing the secondary to close and defend the play, so I doubt that he'd become a wizard with the fade passes even if he had a 6' 5" jump ball snatcher. His accuracy and touch on balls is highly suspect and very inconsistent. And given the number of dirt balls he throws, I don't think taller would help much.
brad7686 wrote: In general, the passing game is inept at all positions, including playcalling, and until everyone pulls their weight, we won't have a passing game. No more dropping 4 3rd down passes, No more holding the ball, no more calling routes that end before the first down, no more running routes that end before the first down, etc. And someone needs to become a playmaker. Otherwise, no. Same as last year.
That's what was said last year. Yet, Collins managed to overcome the bad play calling and the poor o-line and the midget receivers with bad hands. And this year we had a new set of coaches and a new approach to offense with Zorn, and Campbell still showed the same difficulties. Campbells relatively decent yardage and completion percentage stats (which is the primary cause of the decent QB rating) this year have more to do with the short, high percentage passing attack, and yards after catch than his QB skills which were more accurately defined by his lack of scoring and ability to make the big play.
Yesterday's Super Bowl illustrates the significance of the skills and ability that Campbell has failed to demonstrate. Big Ben was harassed and chased quite a bit all day, yet he scrambled, avoided sacks and made the big plays when he needed them (no blame the o-line game going on in Pittsburgh). And Warner defeated the pressure of the Steelers defense by finding the open receiver and getting rid of the ball quickly even though his number one and number two receivers were taken out of play for almost the entire first half. He still managed to find his third and fourth options .. picked up on the blitzes and pressure and made plays all day long while being knocked to the ground after releasing the ball. And without a running game (33 yards), Warner threw for 377 yards against the number 1 defense in the NFL. Think the Cardinals would have made it to the Super Bowl and come close to winning it with Leinart at the helm? No. They'd have finished below 500 and would have been watching the playoffs on TV just like the Redskins, even with those great receivers. Just take a look at the numbers for Boldin and Fitzgerald in 2006 with Leinart, and compare that to their numbers with Warner.
Keep in mind something here. Yesterday's game proves that one or two plays can dramatically alter the results of a game. Take away that 1 interception, and that 1 great pass/catch to Holmes for a TD, and the Cardinals win the Super Bowl 30 to 13. 2 plays!
Now tell me that having a QB that can make a couple of plays on his own each game wouldn't dramatically change the entire season and the poor offensive results we've become accustomed to seeing over the past three years?
Thanks for that opinion, Ray, but it's only that... an opinion, and one that is definitely not grounded in fact or reality.