The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

This is really a simple game - a good team is able to run the ball when they want to AND stop the run when they have to

Some like to point to the fact that we have a RB that is close to the lead in rushing yards as a proof that we can run the ball - the problem is that when you want to be able to run the ball most is in the 4th quarter when the team is in front AND you are trying to control the clock - IF you are not in the lead and you need to score points quickly, having the best RB in the NFL is not going to score very many points

A good team that has the lead also has to be able to stop the other team from being able to run the ball. NOT in the first 3 quarters when it really does not matter BUT in the 4th quarter when the opposing team's really need to try and run the ball.

A great D can stop the run any time it wants to and especially in the 4th quarter.

A decent O can put points on the board through kicking or scoring TDs in the first 3 quarters and then turning it over to the D.

We are not there yet.

We need a DT and a DE BUT most importantly we need an upgrade on that offensive line - AND we need a punter and a placekicker

Even more importantly we need someone in the FO that has a brain

VetSkinsFan wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

PulpExposure wrote:Yeah, it's evident that our offense is putrid. The entire offense.

Our defense is good, but I also agree with DEHog's point that it's not great. We've seen 2 great defenses; the Steelers and the Ravens, and you honestly cannot say our defense is as good as either of those defenses.

However, our defense is good enough to win with, certainly.

We're 1 great DT away from there, IMO.

Yeah...but that's the kicker. It's one of the hardest positions to get.

Well, we're in the bidding for the Haynesworth sweepstakes.

No one's brought him up, but I like that NT from Cleveland. He gets penetration with a double team...Shaun Rogers. I know he's not out there, but man, this guy's a beast.

You guys know my position on Haynesworth; great player, but will be ungodly expensive, and is very injury prone.

The problem with Shaun Rogers is after he was traded, he signed a 6 year, 42 million contract with the Browns. He's not available.

The year in review?

Hmmmm....

Basically they shot our hopes up high then shot them back down. LOL!
Hey I cant say I am not used to it. I am already scouting out draft picks hoping we draft some beasts.

Another thing Jason Taylor is finally starting to look better. Hopefully he comes into next season healthy. Also we darn better draft some defensive lineman and Offensive lineman.

We need a DT and a DE BUT most importantly we need an upgrade on that offensive line - AND we need a punter and a placekicker

I think we have serviceable (or better) ends. We need a DT to not give QBs a pocket to step in to. Our ends can get around the OTs, but all the OTs have to do is keep our ends on the outside and it's gravy for the QB stepping up.

VetSkinsFan wrote:

DEHog wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

markshark84 wrote:

DEHog wrote:Also everyone talks about how great our D is...they aren't great...great D's create TO's

While I think that our defense is good.........

Defenses that pressure the QB create TOs. Our defensive line is incapable of pressuring the QB and therefore we don't create TOs. The two sacks against Philly were embarrasing --- typical coverage sacks.

I remember JT celebrating after his sack on McNabb. My reaction was "why are you celebrating? it took you 6 seconds to get there?".

The strength of the defense is the secondary, not the front 4. I thought that was all understood. That covers the pressure and the lack of turnovers due to QBs making hurried mistakes. I thought that horse was dead and buried and not needed ot be discussed anymore. Some people can't let go of the obvious...

Ok...than how bout some picks??? Again my argument is that we are a good not great D. We has this this agrument about pass rush vs. coverage back when Bailey got traded...I argued to keep Bailey becuase of the lack of pass rush I got crucified on here...people said it didn't matter who was at corner when you have a pas rush?? Well I happen to think both are important you can no more have a one demensional D then you can an O

I think Rogers hands of stone has also contributed to the lack of INTs. This keeps him from being an intinidating threat to a QB. He has come around in all aspects of being a starting corner EXCEPT INTs.

Note, I'm not arguing that we're the best D. I'm arguing that putting as much blame on the defense as some people like to do when the offense moves like pond water is silly.

I also believe that the implosion has to do with Zorn not being as dynamic as people once believed. I pointed out numerous times in the beginning that with no game tape, Zorn may look better than he actually is. Couple that with CP getting driven in to the ground (he was on par for 380+ carries for the year. Not the Redskins, but PORTIS), is all intsrumental to the offensive implosion. THIS is Zorn's year to prove.

In summary, I acknowledge that the defense is not perfect. My point is when you have a "not great, but good" portion and "anemic" portion, why beat up the better of the two?

This article speaks to what I mean about our D...

No other defense ranked in the NFL's top 11 in yards allowed enters the final week of the regular season without at least faint hopes of advancing to the playoffs. As strong as the Redskins' defense has been -- and the unit was at its best in Sunday's 10-3 victory over Philadelphia -- it lacks something the players and coaches can't pin down

Yet with only one remaining game, the Redskins have but 17 takeaways. Denver, which has 13, is the only NFL team with fewer. (San Francisco and Jacksonville also have 17.) The Redskins have 23 sacks, including two by Taylor against Philadelphia, his first multi-sack performance of the season. Yet only three teams have fewer sacks, and the Redskins rank 28th in the 32-team league in sacks per pass play.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/23/AR2008122302404.html

DEHog wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

DEHog wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

markshark84 wrote:

DEHog wrote:Also everyone talks about how great our D is...they aren't great...great D's create TO's

While I think that our defense is good.........

Defenses that pressure the QB create TOs. Our defensive line is incapable of pressuring the QB and therefore we don't create TOs. The two sacks against Philly were embarrasing --- typical coverage sacks.

I remember JT celebrating after his sack on McNabb. My reaction was "why are you celebrating? it took you 6 seconds to get there?".

The strength of the defense is the secondary, not the front 4. I thought that was all understood. That covers the pressure and the lack of turnovers due to QBs making hurried mistakes. I thought that horse was dead and buried and not needed ot be discussed anymore. Some people can't let go of the obvious...

Ok...than how bout some picks??? Again my argument is that we are a good not great D. We has this this agrument about pass rush vs. coverage back when Bailey got traded...I argued to keep Bailey becuase of the lack of pass rush I got crucified on here...people said it didn't matter who was at corner when you have a pas rush?? Well I happen to think both are important you can no more have a one demensional D then you can an O

I think Rogers hands of stone has also contributed to the lack of INTs. This keeps him from being an intinidating threat to a QB. He has come around in all aspects of being a starting corner EXCEPT INTs.

Note, I'm not arguing that we're the best D. I'm arguing that putting as much blame on the defense as some people like to do when the offense moves like pond water is silly.

I also believe that the implosion has to do with Zorn not being as dynamic as people once believed. I pointed out numerous times in the beginning that with no game tape, Zorn may look better than he actually is. Couple that with CP getting driven in to the ground (he was on par for 380+ carries for the year. Not the Redskins, but PORTIS), is all intsrumental to the offensive implosion. THIS is Zorn's year to prove.

In summary, I acknowledge that the defense is not perfect. My point is when you have a "not great, but good" portion and "anemic" portion, why beat up the better of the two?

This article speaks to what I mean about our D...

No other defense ranked in the NFL's top 11 in yards allowed enters the final week of the regular season without at least faint hopes of advancing to the playoffs. As strong as the Redskins' defense has been -- and the unit was at its best in Sunday's 10-3 victory over Philadelphia -- it lacks something the players and coaches can't pin down

Yet with only one remaining game, the Redskins have but 17 takeaways. Denver, which has 13, is the only NFL team with fewer. (San Francisco and Jacksonville also have 17.) The Redskins have 23 sacks, including two by Taylor against Philadelphia, his first multi-sack performance of the season. Yet only three teams have fewer sacks, and the Redskins rank 28th in the 32-team league in sacks per pass play.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/23/AR2008122302404.html

I've never denied that. I agree with you on that. I tend to focus on the strengths of the team as opposed to eternal negativity. Here.. I'll do this:

- Not enough take aways.. come on guys, Pop Warner could do better.
-JC sucks. He never had the talent to succeed in the NFL and never will.
-The FO are all idiots. I mean, really.
-The defense sucks...they don't score more than the offense. I mean really, guys, if you were GOOD, you'd score for the offense since they can't score.
-Offenseive line needs to be rebuilt THIS OFF-SEASON. Any idiot can put 5 300+ guys together to form a championship caliber offensive wall. Vinny's an idiot.
-Let's get Housh, Ocho Cinqo, and Roy Williams in the off-season. ARE/Moss/Thrash/rooks are BUSTS.
-While we're at it, let's get Ed Reed for our FS and move LL back to SS. he sucks as a FS & doesn't have the capacity to learn any other positions.
-The offense is fine. Let's focus on the defense.

How's that?

Yea Iknow Vet...it was more me explaining my point!!

DEHog wrote:Yea Iknow Vet...it was more me explaining my point!!

Sorry, the negativity expressed here sometimes gets the best of me...

VetSkinsFan wrote:

DEHog wrote:Yea, I know Vet ... it was more me explaining my point!!

Sorry, the negativity expressed here sometimes gets the best of me .....

I think that it has been worse this year - we got out to a 6-2 start and seemed to forget that we still had some issues - we have a HC that was still getting things in place and a defense that really was missing a couple of key guys. We had a RB that was leading the league and everyone thought it was partly due to a decent offensive line Portis is a very special RB - our offensive line this year was not one of our strengths.

At the begining of this season some of us were saying this team STILL needs another offseason with both free agency AND another draft of at least 5 players to get some young guys in to both contribute and get ready to play. We were looking at 8-8 or 9-7 as a decent record for this team and then we go out and win 2 games against the pukes and eagles (on the road, no less) and we all get excited.

We are who we are and we are not bad - but we need to be younger and deeper.




We also need someone in the FO that can manage things

SkinsJock wrote:

VetSkinsFan wrote:

DEHog wrote:Yea, I know Vet ... it was more me explaining my point!!

Sorry, the negativity expressed here sometimes gets the best of me .....

I think that it has been worse this year - we got out to a 6-2 start and seemed to forget that we still had some issues - we have a HC that was still getting things in place and a defense that really was missing a couple of key guys. We had a RB that was leading the league and everyone thought it was partly due to a decent offensive line Portis is a very special RB - our offensive line this year was not one of our strengths.

At the begining of this season some of us were saying this team STILL needs another offseason with both free agency AND another draft of at least 5 players to get some young guys in to both contribute and get ready to play. We were looking at 8-8 or 9-7 as a decent record for this team and then we go out and win 2 games against the pukes and eagles (on the road, no less) and we all get excited.

We are who we are and we are not bad - but we need to be younger and deeper.




We also need someone in the FO that can manage things

Yea..I think most here would have taken 9-7 at the begining of the season. Heck we could end of with a better record than two divion winner!!

Happy Christmas to all

for 2009, I hope we see an upgrade to both the offensive and defensive lines and an upgrade to our ability to score more points next year