nfl.com on portis/bailey trade

Post by **admin** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:24 am

DEHog wrote:How many 1000 yards back are there?

How many guys have had consecutive 1500 yard seasons?

how many had 1500+ their first TWO seasons in the NFL?

How many guys had 1500 yards in 13 games last year?

How many RBs had 5 rushing TDs in one game?

How many guys did Champ shut down last year?

How much pass rush can you get for the 8-9 million a year that Champ's going to get?

hailskins666 · Post by **hailskins666** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:26 am

i don't know DE, i've always known we were on the same side, but we've never even hit close on this subject in the past... coincidence i guess.

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:33 am

We still have to see Portis' contract before we know how much we will have of Champ 6.8 we can't really say 8-9 mil because we never paid him or offered him that.

Yes 1500 is alot of yards but wasn't this a record year for 1000 yard backs??

If the trade goes down as it now, we are giving up a potential D-Lineman with th 2nd pick.

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:50 am

DEHog wrote:We still have to see Portis' contract before we know how much we will have of Champ 6.8 we can't really say 8-9 mil because we never paid him or offered him that.

Say 7 mil on Champ if you want, but please put the disclaimer on it that if Champ had played at the 6.8 million one year figure that the franchise tag carries... without renegotiating a longer term deal, he would have still been disgruntled... really disgruntled. How well do you think he would have played?

The Broncos are apparently going to give him an average of $8 mil per year for the first 3 years. That's what it would have taken to make Champ HAPPY... and there ain't no point in playing somewhere unhappy... he proved that in 2003.

That's without even going into the fact that at 6.8 mil in annual salary for the tag, there's no relief of spreading out a signing bonus over a long term.

I doubt very much portis' will have a 2004 cap hit of more than $2 mil EVEN if we give him a big, new contract... so I'd call it a difference of about 5 mil but I guess we'll have to wait and see what Clinton does about his contract.

You keep talking about 1000 yards... I'm talking about 1500 yards... thery aren't even comparable. IT'S HALF AS MUCH AGAIN.

How many 1500 yard seasons did Stephen Davis have?

0

How many times has a Redskin rushed for 1500 yards?

0

It's a very significant difference.

... and Portis' NFL career average of 5.5 yards a carry in the NFL is just lights out.

skinsfaninroanoke · Post by **skinsfaninroanoke** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:57 am

Jim Brown kind of lights out...

Isn't he the third most prolific TD scoring RB behind Holmes and Alexander?

That's worth a second rounder to me

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 12:57 am

I can live with 2 mil

As for the 1500 yards...

18 Backs had 1000 yards or better last year.

Half (9) of them had over 1400...

6 had 1500 or better...doesn't excactly put Portis in a class by himself??

I know the Skins will get the most they can get for Champ. I like Portis, I don't like giving up the pick.

skinsfaninroanoke · Post by **skinsfaninroanoke** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:06 am

We fuss about not having a running game while our opponents run all over us. We fuss about not having a pass rush while our opponents pass all over us.

We had to give up two people, primarily, to get fixes for these situations, cap wise. One was a burnt out, used up, selfish DE. One was a top notch but egotistical non team playing CB.

That is the way I look at it. And if we win with the combination that they are putting together, I know that you all will too

hailskins666 · Post by **hailskins666** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:09 am

very true sfr, whatever is best for the TEAM. i'm a skins fan, not a players fan, although it is hard to get rid of some of the emotional attachments with some of these guys....

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:14 am

hailskins666 wrote:very true sfr, whatever is best for the TEAM. i'm a skins fan, not a players fan, although it is hard to get rid of some of the emotional attachments with some of these guys....

Really T-6 The way they come and go it's hard for me to get attached.

I too believe whatever is best for the team. I feel much better knowing Gibbs is behind the things going on right now

BossHog · Post by **BossHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:14 am

What does how many RBs ran for 1500 yards last year have to do with it? That just means that 6 backs had great years in my opinion.

The backs that had over 1500 yards last year were Portis, Holmes, Lewis, Tomlinson, McAllister, and Fred Taylor.

I'd take any of them, except for maybe Taylor.

Incidentally, portis had at least 20 fewer carries than any of the other backs to get his yardage.

I agree that 1000 yards isn't much of a benchmark... but I do think 1500 is. If you have a RB rush for 100 yards a game, you have a good chance of winning... especially in a Gibbs' run ball control offense.

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:22 am

You brought up the fact that Portis had 1500 yards...I just pointed out he wasn't the only one.

Not sure what we are debating...I like Portis. My point was how much are we going to have to pay him?? And I don't like giving up the pick and Bailey.

BringThePain! · Post by **BringThePain!** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:28 am

BossHog wrote:What does how many RBs ran for 1500 yards last year have to do with it? That just means that 6 backs had great years in my opinion.

The backs that had over 1500 yards last year were Portis, Holmes, Lewis, Tomlinson, McAllister, and Fred Taylor.

I'd take any of them, except for maybe Taylor.

Incidentally, portis had at least 20 fewer carries than any of the other backs to get his yardage.

I agree that 1000 yards isn't much of a benchmark... but I do think 1500 is. If you have a RB rush for 100 yards a game, you have a good chance of winning... especially in a Gibbs' run ball control offense.

Just to add to this...he only played in 13 games last year so he averaged 122+ yrds per game, stick that into a full season and he would be just under 2000 yrds...only J. Lewis did better then him and they both had 14 TD's each, but Lewis with a full season...

The more and more I think about Portis being here...the longer the offseason gets

bigredskinfan63 · Post by **bigredskinfan63** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:52 am

i'd like to see the skins trade betts,cut canidate,keep rock and johnson and try to sign mike anderson to a decent cap friendly salary.
having portis,and anderson in the backfield as
broncos was hard to top in my view.i also think that with bugel coaching the next generation of hogs,that portis has a great chance of joining simpson,dickerson,sanders,lewis,and terrel davis in the 2000 yard season club.

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 9:41 am

BTP...point taken and Boss also added the he had less carries. I'll also add that amoung the 1000 yard backs he had the highest yards per carry average @ 5.5...I love that.

Guys not sure why your defending Portis to me I like the guys..heck what's not to like?? I only questioned the cost for him and the fact that 1000 yards rushers aren't as rare today. Plus I feel an average back will do good in Gibbs system...so you can only imagine what a guy like Portis will do. This has nothing to do with keeping Champ...I just want the most we can get for him. Boss you said we might be able to sign him for around 2-3 mil a year...I with that.

Of the 18 teams that had 1000 yard rushers only 8 made the playoffs and we all know the Pats didn't have one, so it's not a requirement to have one to win, of course it increases your chances and of course the Pats will look to upgrade.

Remember everyone talked about how we will get all these great defensive players with the money and picks we get for Champ?? All I'm doing is reserving my judgement on the trade until I see Portis' contract and what the pick turns out to be. Of course I want to see a guy like Portis in B&G. Someone said here that we don't need a good D if we get Portis cause or Offense will be able to run the clock more with him...very true assuming we can stop the other teams and get the ball!!

tcwest10 · Post by **tcwest10** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 11:08 am

Somebody somewhere made an analogy that made it easier for me to swallow. He said (I paraphrase) to picture it this way. Champ was gone anyway. The only thing we really lost was the pick. In essence, we traded a second round pick for Portis, and Champ signed with Denver as a free agent.

hailskins666 · Post by **hailskins666** » Sat Feb 28, 2004 2:44 pm

Somebody somewhere made an analogy that made it easier for me to swallow. He said (I paraphrase) to picture it this way. Champ was gone anyway. The only thing we really lost was the pick. In essence, we traded a second round pick for Portis, and Champ signed with Denver as a free agent.

that was me. if you look at it that way, it makes it a little easier to swallow :lol: