Moss is Out?

[GSPODS]

If my analogy makes sense???

Dunno... maybe if it is a blue cocktail dress with a stain on it?

Oh, come off it, now. (The dress, that is)

[Fios]

Folks, please stay on-topic and avoid the type of non-PG discourse that might force this thread to be moved to Smack. Gracias!

[1niksder]

I heard on the radio yesterday that Lloyd might even be inactive this week. Can't be on the field if your not in uniform.

I haven't heard that but I did find this odd:

Also, forgot to mention this yesterday, but well afer practice Campbell and Todd Collins were working with the receivers in shorts and t-shirts, running lots of routes, working on timing. Now, Santana Moss - who very well could miss Sunday's game with a groin injury - was not taking part, obviously, and neither was one other wide receiver, for what it's worth.

Randle El, Thrash, McCardell, and Caldwell were excitedly doing the extra work. Maybe it doesn't mean anything, but the omission of the other healthy wideout did not go un-noticed around here, with hiim back in the locker room while the rest of his position group was working.

[roybus14]

Folks, please stay on-topic and avoid the type of non-PG discourse that might force this thread to be moved to Smack. Gracias!

Yeah!!! What he said, dag-nabbit.....

[CanesSkins26]

I heard on the radio yesterday that Lloyd might even be inactive this week. Can't be on the field if your not in uniform.

I haven't heard that but I did find this odd:

Also, forgot to mention this yesterday, but well afer practice Campbell and Todd Collins were working with the receivers in shorts and t-shirts, running lots of routes, working on timing. Now, Santana Moss - who very well could miss Sunday's game with a groin injury - was not taking part, obviously, and neither was one other wide receiver, for what it's worth.

Randle El, Thrash, McCardell, and Caldwell were excitedly doing the extra work. Maybe it doesn't mean anything, but the omission of the other healthy wideout did not go un-noticed around here, with hiim back in the locker room while the rest of his position group was working.

And then people wonder why Lloyd doesn't get passes thrown his way during games.

[Irn-Bru]

And then people wonder why Lloyd doesn't get passes thrown his way during games.

Close, but not quite accurate, in my view. This is a symptom of the same problem, whatever it is, not the cause of Lloyd's not playing on Sunday, as JLC (and here you) insinuate. Whatever is happening now started earlier and is showing up in situations like this one.

It's a little to easy to look at this and conclude "Oh, that's why he hasn't been active!" There is a history to this developing mess. We'll see if things can get cleaned up.

[CanesSkins26]

And then people wonder why Lloyd doesn't get passes thrown his way during games.

Close, but not quite accurate, in my view. This is a symptom of the same problem, whatever it is, not the cause of Lloyd's not playing on Sunday, as JLC (and here you) insinuate. Whatever is happening now started earlier and is showing up in situations like this one.

It's a little to easy to look at this and conclude "Oh, that's why he hasn't been active!" There is a history to this developing mess. We'll see if things can get cleaned up.

Based on what we have seen and heard the mess seems to be a result of Lloyd's poor attitude since he has been here. This is just another example of it. Gibbs almost deactivated him for a game last November after Lloyd's helmet throwing and outburst on the sidelines. Then after the season CP called Lloyd out for his poor attitude. Last week CP said that Lloyd wasn't playing because he was inconsistent, suggesting that he wasn't getting it done in practice. Now he isn't out on the field taking extra work with the other receivers. To me it all has to do with Lloyd's immaturity and poor attitude. He had this reputation in San Fran and the 49ers seemed very happy to get rid of him. And Lloyd has done nothing since getting here to indicate that his attitude has improved.

[CanesSkins26]

We'll see if things can get cleaned up.

The Skins should clean it up by deactivating him for the rest of the season and then getting rid of him in the off season.

[SkinsFreak]

I'll just say this. First, I believe Moss will play this weekend. Second, regarding Lloyd, Gibbs is a Christian man with deep faith. Redemption is a Christian principle and ideology that I'm sure Gibbs recognizes. That said, I gotta believe Gibbs would extend the benefit of the doubt and allow Lloyd to redeem himself, assuming Lloyd wanted to take that step. We'll see.

[Irn-Bru]

Based on what we have seen and heard the mess seems to be a result of Lloyd's poor attitude since he has been here. This is just another example of it.

I think it's more complex than this. How many opportunities has Lloyd gotten? How has that been affected by his attitude? How has he played when he has gotten his limited opportunities? Could things be better handled — and I mean that concerning both parties? Are both parties open to reconciliation? Is Lloyd being "punished" and not being given opportunities that he could use to help the team? Is Lloyd ready for those opportunities, should the team give them to him?

Some of those questions have obvious answers, some do not (well, not in my view, anyway). The Redskins' / Lloyd's feedback and the Redskins' / Lloyd's history to/with each other will impact future possibilities in ways that it perhaps shouldn't. Sometimes players get in the doghouse, and even though they deserve some discipline what they get is entirely disproportionate to the original problem.

Gibbs almost deactivated him for a game last November after Lloyd's helmet throwing and outburst on the sidelines. Then after the season CP called Lloyd out for his poor attitude. Last week CP said that Lloyd wasn't playing because he was inconsistent, suggesting that he wasn't getting it done in practice. Now he isn't out on the field taking extra work with the other receivers.

This version of history explains why this is your conclusion:

To me it all has to do with Lloyd's immaturity and poor attitude.

Surface explanations. . .the kind of thing that I'd expect to see from a journalist but probably not what best reflects reality.

And Lloyd has done nothing since getting here to indicate that his attitude has improved.

. . .and, by the way, that's simply false.

[1niksder]

The Skins should clean it up by deactivating him for the rest of the season and then getting rid of him in the off season.

How can they deactivate him?
If it were that simple they wouldn't still be looking for another WR. With Moss hobbled he's subject to be deactivated at anytime. That would leave the team with five WR (normal size for most teams), but of those five two play special teams and are at risk of injury on more than just offensive plays, one of them is the one of the five that has actually caught a pass this year. The other two have never taken the field has a Redskin.

Considering Thrash is a special teamer and and 3rd/4th receiver at best, Randle El is at best a no. 2, The Lions have the 31st ranked pass D in the League and the Colts are the only undefeated team not on the upcoming schedule, this might be the week to rest Moss (it's like getting two games off). Brandon would have to put in some type of appearance. Caldwell and/or McCardell would be a bonus.

[VetSkinsFan]

How many chances do you want to give Lloyd??!?? He's NOT performed in the chances he gotten.... bottom line. There are people who don't perform in certain circumstances, and I think this is one of them. As I've said before, he's young enough to perform in a different system. I just don't think he's gonna do it here. Cut him and let him take his chance elsewhere, becuase he's done exactly jack in a starting role here to date. I'm not down on Lloyd as a whole, I'm down on #85 burgandy and gold.

[Fios]

I want to give him A chance, a legitimate chance, not four pass attempts. If his on-field performance is awful, fine, bench him, cut him, whatever. But for a team that is thin at wideout to not even try to recoup some of their investment in a player is ridiculous.

[Irn-Bru]

I want to give him A chance, a legitimate chance, not four pass attempts. If his on-field performance is awful, fine, bench him, cut him, whatever. But for a team that is thin at wideout to not even try to recoup some of their investment in a player is ridiculous.

I agree. I don't see why it's out of the question whether Lloyd might break out if he gets the chance. Who here at THN was big on Antwaan Randle El having a breakout year? You just don't know what's going to happen until they get on the field.

And, like I've been saying all along in this thread, there is clearly a back-and-forth here between Lloyd and the coaches / other players that is preventing him from getting a reasonable chance come Sunday. That's why I really hope that no bridges have been burned and that they will work through whatever issues are at play. Maybe an ailing Moss will open a window for him.

[VetSkinsFan]

Last time I checked, he started at #2 last year. He CAME here with a jaded history, and hasn't really turned over a new leaf. Granted, he hasn't has much opportunity THIS year, but I'm almost positive that it is a reflection of last year. How can you wipe the slate clean. He's shown NO progress IMO from last year on the field. yes, he's kept his mouth shut and his helmet under control, but he's not had ad much face time as lsat year, either. The largest thing that sticks out from his adolescent temper tantrum last year was in an interview after he and JG had a few 'meetings.' He STILL said he didn't regret anything he did, an interview referring to his tantrum and what had happened that year. I'm sure JG remembers that as well. Send him packing and wish him good luck!! He's all out of chances IMO.



The example of Archeleta is EXACTLY what I mean. He's doing better elsewhere than here. A new chance in a new system....

[Fios]

How can you possibly determine whether he has regressed on-the-field? You have essentially nothing to go on this year. Isn't wiping the slate clean in the best interests of the team, i.e. determining whether he has any value in this system?

[1niksder]

Last time I checked, he started at #2 last year. He CAME here with a jaded history, and hasn't really turned over a new leaf. Granted, he hasn't has much opportunity THIS year, but I'm almost positive that it is a reflection of last year.

What was his jaded history? He had a fight with two teammates because he wants to be a rapper and the 9ers FO didn't like his lyrics when he referred to the SF press. I haven't seen those problems here in the whole one year he's been here.

How can you wipe the slate clean. He's shown NO progress IMO from last year on the field. yes, he's kept his mouth shut and his helmet under control, but he's not had ad much face time as lsat year, either.

Wasn't the slate wiped clean last year? He played the following week didn't he?

The largest thing that sticks out from his adolescent temper tantrum last year was in an interview after he and JG had a few 'meetings.' He STILL said he didn't regret anything he did, an interview referring to his tantrum and what had happened that year.

Yeah but you have to take the full text of what he said and not just three or four words from the statement. He said:

Just control my emotions. . . . It sends bad signals to the quarterback, bad signals to the players," and "I don't regret anything I've ever done. I think I've made some pretty good decisions in my time, and nothing so bad that I would regret it. So it happened, and you have to own up to it and move on... "I don't want it to happen, and I'll do my best for it not to happen."

Sounds like he sat down with the coach and they got the air clear

I'm sure JG remembers that as well. Send him packing and wish him good luck!! He's all out of chances IMO.

The coach and QB seems to have gotten over it maybe others outside the team should follow that lead.

The example of Archeleta is EXACTLY what I mean. He's doing better elsewhere than here. A new chance in a new system....

That's not true either, at this point last year AA had played in more games as a Redskin than he has played in for the Bears this year (he didn't play last week due to injury ) Based on just three games he had more tackles in three games with the Skins than he has had in Chicago. At the same time Laundry's numbers are almost identical to AA last year at this point. Arch became a issuse when the rest of the league realized he couldn't cover. That hasn't been a issuse with the Bears because the whole secondary is beat up so he doesn't stand out.

[CanesSkins26]

What was his jaded history? He had a fight with two teammates because he wants to be a rapper and the 9ers FO didn't like his lyrics when he referred to the SF press. I haven't seen those problems here in the whole one year he's been here.

Well he has had problems with teammates here as well. Portis has been publicly critical of Lloyd's attitude and inconsistency on at least 2 occasions. Last season Portis criticized Lloyd's attitude and last week he mentioned that the team could benefit from Lloyd's talent but that his inconsistency has inhibited his number of opportunities.

[Chris Luva Luva]

That hasn't been a issuse with the Bears because the whole secondary is beat up so he doesn't stand out.

I think it has more to do with the Bears being able to use him as he should be used. Thats something we we forced into not being able to do due to injury.

[1niksder]

Well he has had problems with teammates here as well. Portis has been publicly critical of Lloyd's attitude and inconsistency on at least 2 occasions. Last season Portis criticized Lloyd's attitude and last week he mentioned that the team could benefit from Lloyd's talent but that his inconsistency has inhibited his number of opportunities.

That sounds more like it's Portis problem with Lloyd and something he needs to deal with.

Funny how both players in SF were also running backs yet in both instance that you site Lloyd hasn't responded has he did in San Fran. If anything Portis shouldn't be criticizing his teammates in the press. Fortunately Lloyd has learn to deal with teammates like that even if he doesn't get credit for it.

[Chris Luva Luva]

Question.

People are mad about Lloyd tossing the helmet. Understandable, last year. This year, not so much.

But!

Are these same people upset about Portis commenting on what's going on at the Park to the vultures (media)?

Just wondering...

Could Portis's comments make this situation worse? Could they make Lloyd shut everyone out?

There's so much that's wrong in this situation.

[1niksder]

Question.

People are mad about Lloyd tossing the helmet. Understandable, last year. This year, not so much.

But!

Are these same people upset about Portis commenting on what's going on at the Park to the vultures (media)?

Just wondering...

Could Portis's comments make this situation worse? Could they make Lloyd shut everyone out?

There's so much that's wrong in this situation.

It's ALL Lloyd's fault.

[CanesSkins26]

Question.

People are mad about Lloyd tossing the helmet. Understandable, last year. This year, not so much.

But!

Are these same people upset about Portis commenting on what's going on at the Park to the vultures (media)?

Just wondering...

Could Portis's comments make this situation worse? Could they make Lloyd shut everyone out?

There's so much that's wrong in this situation.

A few thoughts on this. I think that people weren't upset over CP's comments because he echoed many of the concern/problems that people saw with the team last year. His interview with John Thompson after last season showed CP's fire and his desire for this team to get better. It was refreshing, at least for me, to see that type of fire from one of our players. Not to mention the fact that CP basically carried this team to the playoffs in 2005. As for the helmet throwing incident, the reason that it didn't sit well with me was because it looked like Lloyd was showing up JC. Whether or not that was the case, that's how it looked to me. And afterwards he didn't seem too regretful of it happening. But like you said that was last season.

[Chris Luva Luva]

It's ALL Lloyd's fault.

Ive been exaggerating a bunch of my posts today but in all honesty...

This team is starting to appear to be in some disarray. I don't know what it is about this franchise and not being able to resolve situation internally but it's not going to end well.

We aren't the Pats, we can't afford to lose ANYBODY. We need all hands on deck at all times to even have a chance. Put the kool aid down.

I believe that our COACHES need to step up and put this situation to rest. But I don't think it'll happen.

[Chris Luva Luva]

A few thoughts on this. I think that people weren't upset over CP's comments because he echoed many of the concern/problems that people saw with the team last year. His interview with John Thompson after last season showed CP's fire and his desire for this team to get better. It was refreshing, at least for me, to see that type of fire from one of our players. Not to mention the fact that CP basically carried this team to the playoffs in 2005. As for the helmet throwing incident, the reason that it didn't sit well with me was because it looked like Lloyd was showing up JC. Whether or not that was the case, that's how it looked to me. And afterwards he didn't seem too regretful of it happening. But like you said that was last season.

I think you missed my point. I too didn't mind CP's comments when I heard them but...!

Did you stop to think what type of negative effect they may have had in the situation? Were those comments worth it? Do you feel your semi validation was worth that? Just so you can post it on a message board?

I find it funny that nobody complained about that. I find it ironic how people complain about how Lloyd hurt the team for tossing a helmet but yet when another player does something equally damaging it doesn't matter...

Was Portis reprimanded by Gibbs? Who knows... It's not the 1st time he's done it. And I love CP.