Skins trade 4th rounder for...(not official)

everydayAskinsday · Post by **everydayAskinsday** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:34 am

I just read the article on www.profootballtalk.com and it mentioned how Kendall plays on a bunch of pain medication .. is this true? and if so that doesnt bode well for him playing a full season.. i guess its good to have a player that plays in pain but I dont know that worrys me a bit

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:34 am

Anybody watching Joe Gibbs Press Conferences this week would NOT have thought of this even as a possibility. When pressed on the issue of Pucillo v. Wade, Joe kept on giving his standard responses without giving the slightest hint. Same Joe of always. :lol:

Ladies and gentlemen, I do confess that I do NOT understand this team anymore. I have no idea whether:

1) We are in a "win now" or death situation;

2) We are adding veterans in the last year of their careers as emergency measures to plug-in holes to avoid a disaster;

3) We are adding veterans to groom rookies in a "building to the future" situation;

4) Add your desperation thoughts here ...

The situation is that these late hirings show a lack of VISION and PLANNING that a General Manager should have fixed LONG TIME AGO.
If a General Manager had been around, he should have told Joe NO to the hiring of Todd Wade and not to this hiring. Let us bring a quality young LG, or better yet, offer an early contract to Dock at the -beginning- of last season to keep him. What do they do with Todd now?

In any event, losing a 4th round pick HURTS. It was too good to be true to get into the next Draft with our full roster of picks.

Do not worry guys, the Skins might be fine. It is only me that does not understand at all what is team doing and where it is really heading. 8-[

everydayAskinsday · Post by **everydayAskinsday** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:39 am

Redskin in Canada wrote:Anybody watching Joe Gibbs Press Conferences this week would NOT have thought of this even as a possibility. When pressed on the issue of Pucillo v. Wade, Joe kept on giving his standard responses without giving the slightest hint. Same Joe of always.

Ladies and gentlemen, I do confess that I do NOT understand this team anymore. I have no idea whether:

1) We are in a "win now" or death situation;

2) We are adding veterans in the last year of their careers as emergency measures to plug-in holes to avoid a disaster;

3) We are adding veterans to groom rookies in a "building to the future" situation;

4) Add your thoughts here ...

The situation is that these late hirings show a lack of VISION and PLANNING that a General Manager should have fixed LONG TIME AGO.
If a General Manager had been around, he should have told Joe NO to the hiring of Todd Wade and not to this hiring. Let us bring a quality young LG, or better yet, offer an early contract to Dock at the -beginning- of last season to keep him. What do they do with Todd now?

In any event, losing a 4th round pick HURTS. It was too good to be true to get into the next Draft with our full roster of picks.

Do not worry guys, the Skins might be fine. It is only me that does not understand at all what is team doing and where it is really heading.

orginally I was under the impression we would be fine without Dock and that it wasnt a huge loss.. but I sure am feeling differently on that one now

.. I personaly have felt that this team is planning on going all or nothing this year.. kind of a superbowl or bust mentality.. so the recent additions of Godfrey and Kendall dont really suprise me..

IMO this is the last year this team is together win or lose.. after this year I have this feeling its going to be broken up and the team will start from scratch again.. again is just an opnion but more and more im feeling that way

Paralis · Post by **Paralis** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:39 am

I don't see what's not to like here. A second-day pick for a guard who had a career year last year and, at his peak, is at least as good as Dockery?

The team needs to get younger, especially in the trenches, but it's not like there's been a recent streak of success with developing late-round talent. So while it's nice to hope that the Skins will score on every pick in the 2008 draft, it bears asking: who would you rather have? Pete Kendall or Robert McCune?

ChocolateMilk · Post by **ChocolateMilk** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:42 am

i dont understand why we are making all these roster moves now... it seems like mr Gibbs convinced Dan Snyder that our team was good and we didnt need any one. and then he saw the 1st 2 games and freaked out. Signed Pinkston after the 1st. now Godfrey and Kendell.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:45 am

Paralis wrote:I don't see what's not to like here. A second-day pick for a guard who had a career year last year and, at his peak, is at least as good as Dockery?

He's 34.

He doesn't know the system.

He'll be 35 before he knows the system.

There's no long or even mid term future for this guy. Plus he's been injured a bit.

It doesn't make sense and I'm trying to be optimistic.

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:46 am

RIC notes:

In any event, losing a 4th round pick HURTS. It was too good to be true to get into the next Draft with our full roster of picks.

True, RIC, but how much would losing Campbell for the year hurt? How important is it to be able to run off tackle to the left?

I think it was a matter of "pay now or pay later, but one way or the other, you will pay"... I don't know that there was a choice. Left Guard was a major problem.

The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...

Fios · Post by **Fios** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:50 am

Countertrey wrote:RIC notes:
In any event, losing a 4th round pick HURTS. It was too good to be true to get into the next Draft with our full roster of picks.

True, RIC, but how much would losing Campbell for the year hurt? How important is it to be able to run off tackle to the left?

I think it was a matter of "pay now or pay later, but one way or the other, you will pay"... I don't know that there was a choice. Left Guard was a major problem.

The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...

I agree with all of that save for the last sentence, Dockery is simply not worth the $49 million (at least) that it would have cost to sign him. We can't have it both ways, we can't praise the team's discipline and then get angry when they don't throw a ton of money at a player. We can't bemoan the hole on the left side and then whine when the team works to address that. This is not aimed at you Trey but the sheer amount of inconsistency on this site drives me batty,

Gnome · Post by **Gnome** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:50 am

Guess the off season move of NOT signing a starting caliber guard is coming back to haunt them.

But at least the FO is willing to do what it takes to address the situation. I'm actually relieved because the O-Line has been a major bust this pre-season.

blchizzleke · Post by **blchizzleke** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:56 am

rumor has it that we arent even giving up a 4th rounder in this deal, but rather a conditional pick....likely a 5th or 6th rounder

terpsez11 · Post by **terpsez11** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:57 am

Countertrey wrote:RIC notes:
In any event, losing a 4th round pick HURTS. It was too good to be true to get into the next Draft with our full roster of picks.

True, RIC, but how much would losing Campbell for the year hurt? How important is it to be able to run off tackle to the left?

I think it was a matter of "pay now or pay later, but one way or the other, you will pay"... I don't know that there was a choice. Left Guard was a major problem.

The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...

you say that..we had everything intact..actually I believe we owe Denver something still that hasn't been determined..

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:00 pm

After some thought, I think it makes perfect sense. Some of you guys were crying about the left side of the o-line in the past half dozen threads. Now we get someone to help and you cry about that too. So which is it?

I don't think the age factor is as significant for a guard as it may be for a skilled position. Ray Brown comes to mind. As far as knowing the system, again, I don't think it's the same for a guard as it is for a skilled position. Buges can coach up anyone. "See that DT in front of you... knock him on his butt!" Saunders system employs more zone blocking than Gibbs style of pulling guards and tackles. System wise, Kendall will be fine.

Samuels will be back soon and if Kendall succeeds at winning the starting LG position, then I believe our o-line will be in good shape. Kendall is definitely better than Puch and Wade, and Wade is better suited at the tackle position.

Kendall and Thomas will be solid at the guard positions.

Chris Luva Luva · Post by **Chris Luva Luva** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:02 pm

SkinsFreak wrote:Buges can coach up anyone.

So why do we need this guy? :twisted:

blchizzleke wrote:rumor has it that we arent even giving up a 4th rounder in this deal, but rather a conditional pick....likely a 5th or 6th rounder

Probally will end up being a 1st round pick if he makes the probowl. :lol:

terpsez11 · Post by **terpsez11** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:02 pm

everydayAskinsday wrote:I just read the article on www.profootballtalk.com and it mentioned how Kendall plays on a bunch of pain medication .. is this true? and if so that doesnt bode well for him playing a full season.. i guess its good to have a player that plays in pain but I dont know that worrys me a bit

Advil is pain medication too..Pete is a professional..I believe his base was about 1.25 million after allowing the Jets to restructure..he was under the impression he had another million coming..I think he will be signing a 2-year with some guaranteed money..that will buy enough Ibuprofen to get him by..

DaRealistJoka · Post by **DaRealistJoka** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:03 pm

terpsez11 wrote:
DaRealistJoka wrote:If I am not mistaken our 4th is already gone because of the TJ Duckett trade.

Not..we had all of 2008's picks still in hand..Duckett was this year

Am not sure you could be right but we gave up a 3rd and a 4th for Duckett. The 3rd was for last season and the 4th is for this season because last years 4th when to the B.Lloyd Trade. But then again I could be wrong.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:04 pm

Countertrey wrote:True, RIC, but how much would losing Campbell for the year hurt? How important is it to be able to run off tackle to the left?

This is a gamble at best. Here's the dilemma, -IF- the guy stays healthy -and- his play does not drop -and- he develops enough chemistry in time with his new OL, you may get a player for -ONE- year.

But, -IF- the guy gets hurt (as he has in previous years) or he has a drop in his play (lack of consistency should not come as no surprise at this age) or does not develop chemistry with his new OL, we may be back at square one.

Countertrey wrote:I don't know that there was a choice. Left Guard was a major problem.

The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...

You are right. There is no choice NOW. A General Manager would not have waited to see $49M on the table to keep Dock, he would have acted with VISION and PLANNING way ahead of the end of the 2006 season.

terpsez11 · Post by **terpsez11** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:04 pm

Gnome wrote:Guess the off season move of NOT signing a starting caliber guard is coming back to haunt them.

But at least the FO is willing to do what it takes to address the situation. I'm actually relieved because the O-Line has been a major bust this pre-season.

who were all of the "starting caliber Guards"...out there to sign?

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:07 pm

terpsez11 wrote:
Gnome wrote:Guess the off season move of NOT signing a starting caliber guard is coming back to haunt them.

But at least the FO is willing to do what it takes to address the situation. I'm actually relieved because the O-Line has been a major bust this pre-season.

who were all of the "starting caliber Guards"...out there to sign?

Exactly. In a market where Dockery could pull in 49 million, the Skins weren't going to get a starting-caliber guard for cheap.

Besides, Wade had done a great job last year, and the coaches really thought he'd have a good chance at converting, starting, and excelling as a guard. We also brought in Whittacker, who ended up not working out (reports were that he wasn't tough enough, and the injury sunk him). It's not that the Redskins haven't done anything about it all along; this is simply another attempt to fix a leak that keeps on coming back.

Countertrey · Post by **Countertrey** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:08 pm

terpsez11 wrote:
Gnome wrote:Guess the off season move of NOT signing a starting caliber guard is coming back to haunt them.

But at least the FO is willing to do what it takes to address the situation. I'm actually relieved because the O-Line has been a major bust this pre-season.

who were all of the "starting caliber Guards"...out there to sign?

You want NAMES?????
That hardly seems fair. :wink:

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:09 pm

Redskin in Canada wrote:You are right. There is no choice NOW. A General Manager would not have waited to see $49M on the table to keep Dock, he would have acted with VISION and PLANNING way ahead of the end of the 2006 season.

I'm sorry, but I disagree, RiC. Dockery had a career year last year, and we didn't sign him long-term because, to be honest, his play was spotty in the few years before that. Dockery had the physical attributes and potential to be a great guard, but until last year we never saw the payoff.

I think some players get motivated in their contract year, and for Dockery it paid off big time. Let's see if he's an all-pro with the Bills before we pass judgment on the Skins.

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:10 pm

Redskin in Canada wrote:
Countertrey wrote:True, RIC, but how much would losing Campbell for the year hurt? How important is it to be able to run off tackle to the left?
This is a gamble at best. Here's the dilemma, -IF- the guy stays healthy -and- his play does not drop -and- he develops enough chemistry in time with his new OL, you may get a player for -ONE- year.

But, -IF- the guy gets hurt (as he has in previous years) or he has a drop in his play (lack of consistency should not come as no surprise at this age) or does not develop chemistry with his new OL, we may be back at square one.

Countertrey wrote:I don't know that there was a choice. Left Guard was a major problem.

The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...
You are right. There is no choice NOW. A General Manager would not have waited to see $49M on the table to keep Dock, he would have acted with VISION and PLANNING way ahead of the end of the 2006 season.

Gee, there's a surprise. :roll:

SkinsFreak · Post by **SkinsFreak** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:11 pm

Irn-Bru wrote:
Redskin in Canada wrote:You are right. There is no choice NOW. A General Manager would not have waited to see $49M on the table to keep Dock, he would have acted with VISION and PLANNING way ahead of the end of the 2006 season.

I'm sorry, but I disagree, RiC. Dockery had a career year last year, and we didn't sign him long-term because, to be honest, his play was spotty in the few years before that. Dockery had the physical attributes and potential to be a great guard, but until last year we never saw the payoff.

I think some players get motivated in their contract year, and for Dockery it paid off big time. Let's see if he's an all-pro with the Bills before we pass judgment on the Skins.

I agree, Irn. Damn near every expert said the Skins were right not to pay that amount for DD.

terpsez11 · Post by **terpsez11** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:12 pm

Redskin in Canada wrote:[quote= The mistake was ( as has often been the case lately) in not paying DD...

You are right. There is no choice NOW. A General Manager would not have waited to see $49M on the table to keep Dock, he would have acted with VISION and PLANNING way ahead of the end of the 2006 season.[/quote]

where was the 49 million coming from..and who knew Buffalo would be stupid enough to pay Dock 7 million a year??..they are saying he was Pro-Bowl caliber while here... on Bill's sites..that is a joke..in it's own right

sometimes I just roll over laughing at some of the stuff I read..vision and planning..yeah..injuries and contract negotiations are really a determined value before they happen..

terpsez11 · Post by **terpsez11** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:16 pm

repeat...is it September yet?

don't get worried even when they struggle vs Miami...

Deadskins · Post by **Deadskins** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:17 pm

Irn-Bru wrote:Let's see if he's an all-pro with the Bills before we pass judgment on the Skins.

Sorry IB, releasing veterans, signing free agents, trades, and drafts all have to be evaluated within a one week period. If you wait until the players actually play with their new teams, it takes all the guesswork out of the equation.