Illegal immigrants

[UK Skins Fan]

My idea is to let the immigrants come in. They're all willing to work for less money and more hours than I ever will. Plus, I hate my job.

Then when they're all over here, I'll move over to their place. The climate's better over there, and the cost of living is less. With my savings, I could buy a big slice of land, and get myself a private army.

As the UK military is being run down to a skeleton force, I'll just wait a little while, and then invade the UK with my private army (possibly taking France on the way).

Then I could legislate against a minimum wage, conscript all the immigrants into a much bigger army, and take out the rest of Europe.

It can't possibly fail.

[InsaneBoost]

Only problem with this, is the "Native Americans" were never Native to America. As we all learned back in History class, the first people who came to what is now aday America, came across what was called a Land Bridge, so the first humans to step foot on America, were immigrants themselves.

Well, not really, simply because there was nobody in the New World when they came over. They might have been emmigrants, but they weren't immigrants.

Immigrate: To enter and settle in a country or region to which one is not native

Emigrate: To leave one country or region to settle in another


If you look at both of these, you could say the people who did this were more on the Immigrate. Why you may ask, back in the time of the land bridge, nobody actually stayed in one place at a time, they were constantly moving around, kind of like animals do in herds.

Anyways, break it down, my whole point is that people claim that we took it away from the people who were here first, the "Native Americans," but when looking both at immigrate and emigrate, they both prove that either way, they came here on there own too, just as the Europeans did, so technically, nobody was really ever Native to North America, they all came here.

[1niksder]

My idea is to let the immigrants come in. They're all willing to work for less money and more hours than I ever will. Plus, I hate my job.

Then when they're all over here, I'll move over to their place. The climate's better over there, and the cost of living is less. With my savings, I could buy a big slice of land, and get myself a private army.

If you plan this just right, you'll save even more buy supplying your private army with goods produced by the cheap labor in you old place

As the UK military is being run down to a skeleton force, I'll just wait a little while, and then invade the UK with my private army (possibly taking France on the way).

You use the UK military as a primary source for a ready made army and save still more. Planning on fighting a war to take France will prove to be a waste of time, when you get there there will be no one to oppose you

Then I could legislate against a minimum wage, conscript all the immigrants into a much bigger army, and take out the rest of Europe.

It can't possibly fail.

If all goes well you'll start with 3 under you control, let me know how it turns out and I might give it a shot on this side of the pond

[ATV]

Anyways, break it down, my whole point is that people claim that we took it away from the people who were here first, the "Native Americans,".

Ok.

but when looking both at immigrate and emigrate, they both prove that either way, they came here on there own too, just as the Europeans did,

Uhh, yes, they both came here. The first ones came here when it was empty. The European ones came here when the continents were already inhabited.

so technically, nobody was really ever Native to North America, they all came here

Uhh.....if you say so.

[InsaneBoost]

Anyways, break it down, my whole point is that people claim that we took it away from the people who were here first, the "Native Americans,".

Ok.

but when looking both at immigrate and emigrate, they both prove that either way, they came here on there own too, just as the Europeans did,

Uhh, yes, they both came here. The first ones came here when it was empty. The European ones came here when the continents were already inhabited.

so technically, nobody was really ever Native to North America, they all came here

Uhh.....if you say so.

Native - Being a member of the original inhabitants of a particular place

Doesnt say anything about coming from another place.

So I my friend am a genius, the Native Americans were never Native at all

Damn im good

[UK Skins Fan]

You're a genius? You hide it so well.

[InsaneBoost]

You're a genius? You hide it so well.

[hailskins666]

had to chime in here.

i'm in the construction business, and believe me when i say this, if it weren't for hispanic labor, NOTHING would ever get built in this country. EVER. americans are either too lazy or think they are better than a hard physical days labor. i hear the few blacks and whites that i work around complaining, slacking off, and bitching about their jobs and how they should be doing something else. the work gets done when hispanics are on the job, even in the most crappy situations, and at a fraction of the cost.

my dad was a contractor as well, so i've been around this industry all my life. about 25 years ago, it was mainly american labor. but in the last 15 years, the face of the business has changed. and while not all are paying taxes, i know that every single one of the hispanics on my job sites are paying, because i take care of the books in my company. none of them will probably ever draw any social security, but they are paying it. they are also paying in federal and state income taxes. they are in such a low income bracket, that most of the money paid in, would be refunded, IF they file their taxes. but most don't. so the gov't keeps all that money. and if you think the gov't is going to pass a law and just give up all of that free money, you really should have your head examined.

i don't even want to begin thinking about all of the cost of a new home without the cheap labor. most of the cost involved with a new project is labor, or sub-contractor costs(also labor). only about 30 - 35% of a new home is material cost. i think it would be a safe bet to say it would almost DOUBLE the cost of a new home. and all i hear about the market now is how expensive everything is.

yea, i know, i hear about all of these immigrants who are commiting all of these criminal acts, gangs etc. no crap. you don't say. go figure... there are a few bad apples in the bunch. but from what i've seen first hand, is that most are just out there trying to earn a living just like the rest of us.

taking jobs. what a joke. i'll tell you what, if you think immigrants are taking your jobs away, come to greenville. i'll hire you. right now. on the spot. i'll pay you the same $6 per hour i pay all of my new guys. i'll put you in a position for advancment. and i'll also bet that you don't last a week doing some of the things that these guys do on my sites. the fact of the matter is no americans really want to do these jobs.

[1niksder]

Native - Being a member of the original inhabitants of a particular place

Had you and your group be the first to arrive in America (regardless of how you got here) if you stayed would you not be a native?

Doesnt say anything about coming from another place.

Doesn't say anything about NOT coming from somewhere else.

So I my friend am a genius, the Native Americans were never Native at all

So who are the Natives of America? Someone had to be 1st.

Damn im good

Not really but you do have a nice video collection

[InsaneBoost]

Native - Being a member of the original inhabitants of a particular place

Had you and your group be the first to arrive in America (regardless of how you got here) if you stayed would you not be a native?

Doesnt say anything about coming from another place.

Doesn't say anything about NOT coming from somewhere else.

So I my friend am a genius, the Native Americans were never Native at all

So who are the Natives of America? Someone had to be 1st.

Damn im good

Not really but you do have a nice video collection

Yea you better like my video collection

Land bridge connected the Western world to the Eastern, thats how the people got here, its in one of my history book things, but ill have to find it an quote it for you.

[Deadskins]

I don't think its fair that we currently pay taxes to support people who don't give back.

Actually, it's the other way around. Illegals often pay payroll taxes, and always pay sales taxes, but do not see the benefits of such, as they are illegals.

Not true, at least around here. Alot of illegals get paid using the "white envelope" which employers don't report. This is mainly what makes them illegal. If they have a child born in the US (I'm talking two illegals having a baby) the child gets all the benifits of US citizenship (Food stamps, Medicare, WIC, Housing, Free Lunch).

If they paid payroll taxes then they would be eligible for a EIN (Employee Identification Number) which would give them access to many of these programs, but as it stands now the majority of them come here to work have a kid for the benefits and then send the money back to Mexico. Which is why Western Union is also raising thier price on money transfers to Mexico.

Actually you're the one who does not understand how the process works. I know of several illegals who have EINs (many use a fake). As long as the employer gets a number, they can plausibly deny the knowledge that the worker is illegal. That's the way the law is written. So most illegals DO pay payroll taxes. Also, as I stated, everyone pays sales taxes whenever they buy goods. All of these taxes go towards US citizens not to illegals. If you want to fix the problem, it is the employer who should be prosecuted, not the illegal who is just trying to better his, and his family's lives.

As for the child born to illegals in the US; are you saying they should not be citizens, even though they were born in the US?. The parents do not get benefits, the child does.

[1niksder]

Land bridge connected the Western world to the Eastern, thats how the people got here, its in one of my history book things, but ill have to find it an quote it for you.

Regardless how they got here if they were first to get here and stayed (meaning the area/land was uninhibited prior to their arrival) until others arrived would that not by definition make them the natives?

[TincoSkin]

had to chime in here.

i'm in the construction business, and believe me when i say this, if it weren't for hispanic labor, NOTHING would ever get built in this country. EVER. americans are either too lazy or think they are better than a hard physical days labor. i hear the few blacks and whites that i work around complaining, slacking off, and bitching about their jobs and how they should be doing something else. the work gets done when hispanics are on the job, even in the most crappy situations, and at a fraction of the cost.

my dad was a contractor as well, so i've been around this industry all my life. about 25 years ago, it was mainly american labor. but in the last 15 years, the face of the business has changed. and while not all are paying taxes, i know that every single one of the hispanics on my job sites are paying, because i take care of the books in my company. none of them will probably ever draw any social security, but they are paying it. they are also paying in federal and state income taxes. they are in such a low income bracket, that most of the money paid in, would be refunded, IF they file their taxes. but most don't. so the gov't keeps all that money. and if you think the gov't is going to pass a law and just give up all of that free money, you really should have your head examined.

i don't even want to begin thinking about all of the cost of a new home without the cheap labor. most of the cost involved with a new project is labor, or sub-contractor costs(also labor). only about 30 - 35% of a new home is material cost. i think it would be a safe bet to say it would almost DOUBLE the cost of a new home. and all i hear about the market now is how expensive everything is.

yea, i know, i hear about all of these immigrants who are commiting all of these criminal acts, gangs etc. no crap. you don't say. go figure... there are a few bad apples in the bunch. but from what i've seen first hand, is that most are just out there trying to earn a living just like the rest of us.

taking jobs. what a joke. i'll tell you what, if you think immigrants are taking your jobs away, come to greenville. i'll hire you. right now. on the spot. i'll pay you the same $6 per hour i pay all of my new guys. i'll put you in a position for advancment. and i'll also bet that you don't last a week doing some of the things that these guys do on my sites. the fact of the matter is no americans really want to do these jobs.

right on! i painted houses for years. all migrant labor, and i live in NH! what a bunch of mexicns are doing in NH is beyond me but no one else wants the job. the only other people that worked with me were college students who needed an extra buck.

the only people who are stealing jobs from us are our bosses who fire the whole work force and send our jobs over seas in mass.. the party in power (or that was in power) tells its constituents that a vote for them means a vote against immigration one that will secure your job. but the same people are the rich business owners who ship your job over seas... i never under stood why people never saw that the republican leadership takes advantage of its constituency. they use the good god fearing people of this land for personal gain. not that the dems are any better! HA!! i just dont know who to vote for any more.

[welch]

Hailskins said, among many other persausive things,

and while not all are paying taxes

I'll just add: no matter whether illegal immigrants are paying income taxes, and some, as we can read, are paying, every one of them is paying sales tax. And various fees. And cigarette taxes if they smoke. And property taxes, at least indirectly.

By contrast, an awful lot of True Americans contrive to duck their income tax.

[InsaneBoost]

Land bridge connected the Western world to the Eastern, thats how the people got here, its in one of my history book things, but ill have to find it an quote it for you.

Regardless how they got here if they were first to get here and stayed (meaning the area/land was uninhibited prior to their arrival) until others arrived would that not by definition make them the natives?

No native is something thats there from the time it was built made, bla bal.

Like grass, grass would have been native, trees, dirt.

[UK Skins Fan]

Land bridge connected the Western world to the Eastern, thats how the people got here, its in one of my history book things, but ill have to find it an quote it for you.

Regardless how they got here if they were first to get here and stayed (meaning the area/land was uninhibited prior to their arrival) until others arrived would that not by definition make them the natives?

No native is something thats there from the time it was built made, bla bal.

Like grass, grass would have been native, trees, dirt.

Why would grass have been native? Are you telling me that it sprang out the ground at the same time as the rock was laid down?

By your original logic, no human was ever native to anywhere. Indeed, no mammal was ever native to anywhere. In fact, no living organism was native.

[joebagadonuts]

I didn't use to feel like that until I moved here. Now my wife can't find a job because the only people that are hired are illegals because they can and will work for less than minimum wage, and off the books.

Just curious - what type of work does you wife do?

Shes a CNA

After the explanation (thanks to all who educated me), I find it difficult to believe that someone who doesn't have legal standing can secure a CNA job, and get paid under the table. Especially with a hospital. Would they allow someone who has no papers to draw blood on someone? Yikes. Talk about asking for a law suit. Not that I'm calling you a liar, but I'm just saying it's difficult to believe.

[Fios]

had to chime in here.

i'm in the construction business, and believe me when i say this, if it weren't for hispanic labor, NOTHING would ever get built in this country. EVER. americans are either too lazy or think they are better than a hard physical days labor. i hear the few blacks and whites that i work around complaining, slacking off, and bitching about their jobs and how they should be doing something else. the work gets done when hispanics are on the job, even in the most crappy situations, and at a fraction of the cost.

my dad was a contractor as well, so i've been around this industry all my life. about 25 years ago, it was mainly american labor. but in the last 15 years, the face of the business has changed. and while not all are paying taxes, i know that every single one of the hispanics on my job sites are paying, because i take care of the books in my company. none of them will probably ever draw any social security, but they are paying it. they are also paying in federal and state income taxes. they are in such a low income bracket, that most of the money paid in, would be refunded, IF they file their taxes. but most don't. so the gov't keeps all that money. and if you think the gov't is going to pass a law and just give up all of that free money, you really should have your head examined.

i don't even want to begin thinking about all of the cost of a new home without the cheap labor. most of the cost involved with a new project is labor, or sub-contractor costs(also labor). only about 30 - 35% of a new home is material cost. i think it would be a safe bet to say it would almost DOUBLE the cost of a new home. and all i hear about the market now is how expensive everything is.

yea, i know, i hear about all of these immigrants who are commiting all of these criminal acts, gangs etc. no crap. you don't say. go figure... there are a few bad apples in the bunch. but from what i've seen first hand, is that most are just out there trying to earn a living just like the rest of us.

taking jobs. what a joke. i'll tell you what, if you think immigrants are taking your jobs away, come to greenville. i'll hire you. right now. on the spot. i'll pay you the same $6 per hour i pay all of my new guys. i'll put you in a position for advancment. and i'll also bet that you don't last a week doing some of the things that these guys do on my sites. the fact of the matter is no americans really want to do these jobs.

Please stop injecting logic and reality into this discussion

[REDEEMEDSKIN]

I didn't use to feel like that until I moved here. Now my wife can't find a job because the only people that are hired are illegals because they can and will work for less than minimum wage, and off the books.

Just curious - what type of work does you wife do?

Shes a CNA

After the explanation (thanks to all who educated me), I find it difficult to believe that someone who doesn't have legal standing can secure a CNA job, and get paid under the table. Especially with a hospital. Would they allow someone who has no papers to draw blood on someone? Yikes. Talk about asking for a law suit. Not that I'm calling you a liar, but I'm just saying it's difficult to believe.

JBD - Perhaps she can't find work in hospitals, since they need Spanish-spekaing CNA's, to treat the large number of hispanics in requiring treatment. Then, since she can't find job at hospitals, she has to go looking for a trade, and THOSE are all taken up by illegals.


That's the only way I can see the CNA industry being affected by illegals.

[Cappster]

had to chime in here.

i'm in the construction business, and believe me when i say this, if it weren't for hispanic labor, NOTHING would ever get built in this country. EVER. americans are either too lazy or think they are better than a hard physical days labor. i hear the few blacks and whites that i work around complaining, slacking off, and bitching about their jobs and how they should be doing something else. the work gets done when hispanics are on the job, even in the most crappy situations, and at a fraction of the cost.

my dad was a contractor as well, so i've been around this industry all my life. about 25 years ago, it was mainly american labor. but in the last 15 years, the face of the business has changed. and while not all are paying taxes, i know that every single one of the hispanics on my job sites are paying, because i take care of the books in my company. none of them will probably ever draw any social security, but they are paying it. they are also paying in federal and state income taxes. they are in such a low income bracket, that most of the money paid in, would be refunded, IF they file their taxes. but most don't. so the gov't keeps all that money. and if you think the gov't is going to pass a law and just give up all of that free money, you really should have your head examined.

i don't even want to begin thinking about all of the cost of a new home without the cheap labor. most of the cost involved with a new project is labor, or sub-contractor costs(also labor). only about 30 - 35% of a new home is material cost. i think it would be a safe bet to say it would almost DOUBLE the cost of a new home. and all i hear about the market now is how expensive everything is.

yea, i know, i hear about all of these immigrants who are commiting all of these criminal acts, gangs etc. no crap. you don't say. go figure... there are a few bad apples in the bunch. but from what i've seen first hand, is that most are just out there trying to earn a living just like the rest of us.

taking jobs. what a joke. i'll tell you what, if you think immigrants are taking your jobs away, come to greenville. i'll hire you. right now. on the spot. i'll pay you the same $6 per hour i pay all of my new guys. i'll put you in a position for advancment. and i'll also bet that you don't last a week doing some of the things that these guys do on my sites. the fact of the matter is no americans really want to do these jobs.

Please stop injecting logic and reality into this discussion

Just another example of the white man holding the mexican down!

Slightly more expensive than slave labor but they have their own home to go to at night to stay with 25 of their closest relatives.

[crazyhorse1]

I don't think its fair that we currently pay taxes to support people who don't give back.

Actually, it's the other way around. Most illegals pay payroll taxes, and all of them pay sales taxes, but do not see the benefits of such, as they are illegals.

I'm against people illegally coming into the U.S. for a number of reasons but illegals getting a free ride is not one of them. They are vastly underpaid and overworked and easily put more into the economy than they take out, mostly in relation to lower prices of commidities. This is fact, and has been repeatedly established. lThe problem is that we exploit illegals and rob the American worker as a result of our having failed thus far to come up with an advantageous policy for everyone concerned.
Instead of pointing fingers of blame and forming irrational groups of bigots with attack dogs, we should focus on solutions to the problem that effective address Mexican-America relations, the Mexican and American worker, American and Mexican business concerns, and the effect on the American consumer.