You people make me laugh...

hkHog · Post by **hkHog** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:46 am

Chill out guys!!!

Boss Hog wasn't calling anyone out, he was just suggesting that people shouldn't overreact. Based on the replies I have seen in this thread that message has not gotten through.

With a team that has been so unsuccessful for so long it is ludacrous to believe that even the best coach can turn a team around in his first year!

Gibbs was 7-9 the last time around and won the SB the next year. Reid was 5-11 and then 11-5. Parcells was 3-12-1 with NYG before SB in year 4, 5-11 with Pats before SB loss in year 2. Even the mighty Bilichic was 5-11 in his first year with the Pats and 36-44 with the Browns.

Gibbs, Parcells, and Bilichek are considered three of the four brst coaches of all time!!! Reid and Bilichek are the best coaches right now!!!

Please, have some perspective people, 18 games is certainly not enough to judge a coach on. If it was, all of those coaches would have been fired!

This year Gibbs has won the first two games. It may not be pretty but we're WINNING!!! Isn't that the point!!! I think BH was just trying to say don't make snap judgements, allow things to play out! If you don't you're just as bad as Dan Snyder! Have some patience people.

box8276 · Post by **box8276** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:32 pm

Why the bashing of our O? These same CowPukes shut down LT , and beat a pretty good team in their house! Yes I expected our O to struggle because quite frankly any team on this night would have struggled. The Pukes only scored 13 at home.... Do i hear anyone bashing their O, hell no! ? You guys need to chill. We will play against less formidable D's and put up more points. Boss is right, we won alot of battles in this game. Anyone remember how we used to get run all over? Didnt happen, no choking by our D this time. I am proud of what they accomplished and most importantly how they did it. The look on their faces when just knew they had us was priceless. Whats wrong with winning like that, considering they did it to us like 15 freakin times!

Jake · Post by **Jake** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 3:03 pm

box8276 wrote:Why the bashing of our O?

Did you see the first 56 minutes of Monday's game? Or the first 60 minutes of the week before?

SCSkinsFan · Post by **SCSkinsFan** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:02 pm

The comments during the game, and in the days following, both positive & negative were pretty amazing. Some use stats to justify their opinions while others are posting based on their emotions which rise and fall with almost every play during the games. QB controversies have long been a topic of discussion throughout out the Skins past, and no doubt will continue to be dicsussed in the future. These discussions used to be battted back and forth around the water cooler or while having a cup of coffee with our workmates, our friends, or supporter of other teams during the days following a game. There will always be something to discuss and analyze for years to come. It's just that the internet and THN have now given us a common place to come and air these opinions. And thankfully so. I don't know any of you personally, but I have become very familiar with your names, and can pretty well tell which side of the topic you are on. Be thankful that we live in a country where we have freedom of speech. The one thing we all obviously want is for the Washington Redskins to be successful, and we voice our opinions when we feel like they aren't measurng up to what we perceive to be their capabilities. We also praise them when they come through with a victory. Even if it takes 55 minutes to get the "W". However, the coaching staff that we have is in the best position to make the best use of the talent of the players on this team.

As a side note I posted the reply below during the game when we were still down 0 - 14. Wonder if BH will give me any points for it?

Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2005 10:43 pm
Post subject:

Anyone keeping the faith? 2 TD's wins it!
_________________
Skins fan Stuck in Panther land

NikiH · Post by **NikiH** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:37 pm

I had the faith SC and maybe one or two others in that chat but it seemed like the majority either went to bed or wrote it off as a lose. If you have no faith in your team what the heck keeps you cheering in the first place?

SCSkinsFan · Post by **SCSkinsFan** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:43 pm

Exactly NikiH. There were a few of us during the game that were keeoing the faith, including me. As a die hard Skins fan, we all need to keep the faith during every game that the Skins will have the chance to win, until the game is over. Then we can analyze and discuss what went right, and what went wrong.

TopHawg · Post by **TopHawg** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 9:53 pm

Short-sighted? We've been losing for how long now? Every year we've said maybe next year and our time will come. All we've been doing the last 10 yrs is looking into the future. At what point is person allowed to think about the now, I ask you?

Hoss · Post by **Hoss** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:20 pm

TopHawg wrote:Short-sighted? We've been losing for how long now? Every year we've said maybe next year and our time will come. All we've been doing the last 10 yrs is looking into the future. At what point is person allowed to think about the now, I ask you?

Exactly,
I'm thinking that right now we are 2-0!

NikiH · Post by **NikiH** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:21 pm

TopHawg wrote:Short-sighted? We've been losing for how long now? Every year we've said maybe next year and our time will come. All we've been doing the last 10 yrs is looking into the future. At what point is person allowed to think about the now, I ask you?

Perhaps a good time to think about now is when your team is 2-0 and with a loss for the Giants this evening will be leading the NFC East. What do you people want??

DEHog · Post by **DEHog** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 10:28 pm

I spend four nights a week coaching football, I spend Friday night watching high school football where my daugther is a cheerleader. I spend Saturdays coaching my son and Sundays at FedEx watching the Skins...oh yea I played the game as well. Does that make me an expert...Not by a long shot!! But like BH I still read some post here and have to shake my head sometimes for example..

Let's see, I don't happen to agree that Gibbs is doing such a great job. SO what if he is a HOF coach. We are measured by what we do today. He has had 18 games and 9 pre-season games to put together an offense that has scored 23 points in the 2 games this year. Last year, the Redskins were horrible. Why? Because everyone knew what Gibbs offense was going to do. It was the same thing they did the first time around. The first time it was visionary and innovative. This time, it is history that everyone has studied. There can be no surprises!

This part of your post stood out like a sore thumb to me...Your trying to make a point about Joe Gibbs offense by pointing out that he only managed 23 points in two games. Well if I told you that's the same amount of points that Peyton Manning and the Indy Colts have scored in their last two victories does that change things??

It's a 16 games season do you remember that the Steelers won some low scoring games last year or do you remember they were 15-1.

As for the Skins they are 2-0 with a chance to go 3-0... here's what that means. The last two years 12 teams have started 3-0 10 went to the playoffs and 7 won their division. 3 of the last 4 SB champs went 3-0. Do I know this because I'm an expert? No I know this because I'm informed!

Now what does all this have to do with BH original post. Most who post here are great...some make uninformed posts and to someone who's taken the time to be informed... it can be frustrating when someone just spouts off something so rediculous that it make you do one of two things...First they may take issue with you (I like this because I think it helps educate and it sparks good posts in the end) But more times than not as BH already pointed out it causes the poster to not respond.

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:12 pm

Good post, DEHog. I didn't know the stat about 3-0 teams. We have a great chance to go to 3-0 next Sunday, at home, against a team that can be fickle on the road. [I wonder what the playoff stats are for teams that start 4-0. . .but it's certainly too soon for that; I don't want to get blasted for speculation]

You gotta believe the playoffs are in sight, and that Gibbs is the man to take us there.

hkHog · Post by **hkHog** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:13 pm

DEHog wrote:This part of your post stood out like a sore thumb to me...Your trying to make a point about Joe Gibbs offense by pointing out that he only managed 23 points in two games. Well if I told you that's the same amount of points that Peyton Manning and the Indy Colts have scored in their last two victories does that change things??

Great point.

It also might be worth noting that we had considerably more rushing AND passing yards than Indy in the first two weeks (268 vs. 232 and 401 vs. 376 respectively).

Today Manning only had 228 and they had 111 rushing. That means they are only averaging 1 yd more passing and 20 yds less rushing than we are per game so our offense is still better thus far.

Brunell is also the 10th rated passer at 87.2, Manning is 20th with 74.7. Brunell is completing 5.2% more passes, is averaging 1.7 more yds/attempt and in the first two games had one less int.

So, I guess Indy's offense is really aweful. Manning obviously didn't do anything over the offseason to prepare for this year and I guess the game has passed him by. They should cut him.

Irn-Bru · Post by **Irn-Bru** » Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:15 pm

That, and all of those plays where Manning did a good job were lucky. If you take away those good plays, the other 100 minutes of football were so-so to not that great. . .things aren't looking up in Indy.

SkinsLaVar · Post by **SkinsLaVar** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:14 am

canadians

JansenFan · Post by **JansenFan** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:06 am

FanfromAnnapolis wrote:[I wonder what the playoff stats are for teams that start 4-0. . .but it's certainly too soon for that; I don't want to get blasted for speculation]

I can tell you that historically, 65% of the teams that have started 2-0 have made the playoffs, of course Spurrier's Redskins were part of the 45% :oops:

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 11:38 am

I have a comment on form and another on substance.

On form:

It truly surprises me that if a poster expresses its views some people agree/disagree/could-care-less BUT if the original poster is the Administrator everything comes down to feeling a sense of authoritarianism from those who oppose his point of view. I can not understand it. Sure BH has a direct non-holding back approach but so What? So do others and that is why we are here. As far as I am concerned, I enjoy his posts -among- other posters that I respect and in the nature of EVERY forum we may strongly agree or disagree over a myriad of issues.

It is not fair by those who disagree with him to call for unfairness against him when no such thing has been even suggested. This thread is proof among many others of it.

This is one of the best threads in a while.

On substance:

The call for Joe to resign was made by a single poster and maybe supported by another AMONG thousands of registered users and hundreds of daily posters. It was an emotionally motivated response made in frustration by a YOUNG Skins fan.

AND my last sentence also points out in the direction to explain to at least some extent the "camps" in the "Joe knows what he's doing" versus the "The NFL has passed Jo by"

FAMILIARITY that comes with AGE. Yes, simply age. Some of us can recognise the careful piece-by-piece approach used by Joe to rebuild this FRANCHISE (not just try to "fix" it with some expensive players).

A Joe Gibbs' team stands for:

Character, discipline, ball control, error-free football, clock management, game balance for your team, game imbalance for the other team, wearing out and crushing the spirit of other teams, confidence, self-respect and pride.

Joe has accomplished many of the above points already! But it is difficult for posters who were not witnesses to the older days, to relate to this approach or to acknowledge these steps as progress.

Are there points still to be accomplished! Yes. I for one agree with Joe that no QB has decided to OWN this team yet. But this is not something I am coming up with. This is ALREADY acknowledged and first stated by Joe!

I know that the age divide is not the single explanation for our divide. I know some posters who may not have witnessed the first coming of Joe and still UNDERSTAND the progress. I also know some old-timers (at least one whom shall remain nameless) who are hopeless. But FAMILIARITY with his method and UNDERSTANDING of it is at the heart of the question.

Those who know our history know that there are more than a few analogies between 1981 and 2004...

... and I see many between 1982 and 2006.

cvillehog · Post by **cvillehog** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:05 pm

Redskin in Canada wrote:This is one of the best threads in a while.

If you say so. Seems pretty useless to me, especially when this could've just been added to one of the threads already discussing all of this.

Redskin in Canada · Post by **Redskin in Canada** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:26 pm

cvillehog wrote:If you say so. Seems pretty useless to me, especially when this could've just been added to one of the threads already discussing all of this.

Some people will simply take longer folks. That's all.

A matter of time.

Scooter · Post by **Scooter** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:27 pm

In addition, some people seem to take things so personally it's ridiculous. One can be happy we're 2-0, love Joe Gibbs and the Redskins AND have concerns and different opinions to decisions that have been made - past, present, future.
I'd rather have no other person on the planet as the HC of the Washington Redskins than Joe Gibbs.

cvillehog · Post by **cvillehog** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:48 pm

Redskin in Canada wrote:
cvillehog wrote:If you say so. Seems pretty useless to me, especially when this could've just been added to one of the threads already discussing all of this.

Some people will simply take longer folks. That's all.

A matter of time.

What are you even talking about?

SkinsJock · Post by **SkinsJock** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:11 pm

I took BH's post to be some input from someone who was probably just fed up with some of our posts and how we were reacting to them. This was more like someone holding up a mirror and saying "take a look at yourselves"! I think he also wanted to clarify some things and encourage everybody to be a liitle more tolerant and let all sides of the issue be discussed rather than some being so forceful and not willing to let others explain their very different and sometimes IMHO, unclear points of view :roll:

Now some of us probably do not care at how we are perceived and just feel that this is our opinion and to hell with the rest of you!

I also think that BH is very correct in that as with a lot of sports or competitions these games are more often lost than won. By that I would add that teams generally "win" because they made fewer or less costly mistakes than others. This can be referred to as beating yourself but it should be considered. As BH points out the games are not error free and yet we tend to demand perfection or at least an attempt to be perfect by both players and coaches.

I am not an expert on the game per se but I do know from the early Gibbs days that a lot of plays are run to not just be "successful" but to see how the opposing 11 reacted to that particular look. I also would echo BH's point about Gibbs and his offensive game planning. The offensive co-ordinators here will have a game plan that will be effective and boring in its execution. There will not be a lot of deep passes - that is not what this coach likes to see. There may be some big scores but that will be more because the opposing team did not execute well enough on their aspects of the game than our team beating them.

I am very glad that we are at 2-0 but also think that these players and this team have a lot of work to do to eliminate the mistakes and to get their timing down and this only comes with experience and time. BUT it is especially rewarding that however we did it we won a game in Dallas.

I took BH's post to be encouraging the different ideas we all have but also to be more tolerant of those who oppose your feelings. To think about what you are saying a little more before you just rant on about something just makes sense.

Thankfully the bye week is over and now we can get on to worrying about the sea birds from Seattle coming into our stadium. I am not going to be there but will be very surprised if this crowd is not a lot louder than opening day - and that was incedible, especially on that last drive in the 4th qtr.

HTTR

Jake · Post by **Jake** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:51 pm

NikiH wrote:If you have no faith in your team what the heck keeps you cheering in the first place?

Loyalty. I didn't think we'd come back but I was happy as hell we did, though. I don't say anything stupid like 'fire Joe Gibbs' but when I'm not sure of something, like coming back with 4 minutes to go, I'm going to be honost. I knew it was possible but I didn't expect it based on the previous 56 minutes.

Gibbs' Hog · Post by **Gibbs' Hog** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:55 pm

Wow. This thread's pretty crazy.

I think BH is just saying that nobody can know everything. And when you know that you can't know everything, you don't post ignorant statements - such as calling for our coach's head after 2 games, and/or saying people are overrated and washed up because they went through an injury.

It's not that hard to say, "I believe Coach Gibbs may be slipping, even though we are 2-0 [insert facts here]," rather than, "Gibbs is not what he used to be, and he should be fired because we barely won those two games."

Everyone can have an opinion, but if you don't give me believable, valid, and factual reasons for why I should side with your views, then I'm not going give any credence to them.

NikiH · Post by **NikiH** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:55 pm

Jake I was not directed that at you at all. You on some level believed in your team or you would have gone to bed! ;-)

I think sometimes it's easier for those of us who've believed and been rewarded for believing to continue. You'll get there. Hopefully this season will give you the faith you need to carry you through the rough spots! ;-)

Gibbs' Hog · Post by **Gibbs' Hog** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:57 pm

Jake wrote:
NikiH wrote:If you have no faith in your team what the heck keeps you cheering in the first place?

Loyalty. I didn't think we'd come back but I was happy as hell we did, though. I don't say anything stupid like 'fire Joe Gibbs' but when I'm not sure of something, like coming back with 4 minutes to go, I'm going to be honost. I knew it was possible but I didn't expect it based on the previous 56 minutes.

I didn't expect it based on all of last year's losses - but it's the same thing - I knew it was possible. And as long as that's the case, my face remains glued to the TV; or my rear end glued to the orange plastic seat.