No Virginia, we will not score points

[thaiphoon]

I believe faced with the loss of smoot that Rogers was the right pick and that CB was the right pick at #9. It just the #25 pick for a developmental QB I have trouble dealing with. Especially the price we paid for him. We could've gotten a good receiver out of that pick. Like I said in another post. Campbell, to justify all that we mortgaged for him, better be the second coming of Peyton Manning and Joe Montana all rolled into one.

[Scottskins]

Ray Brown is 42 years old. Dockery is penalty prone and likely to miss his assignments, as well as jump offsides if Samuels doesn't do it first (we threaten to set records for penalties year after year, remember), Samuels is inconsistent from year to year, constantly making comebacks and last year repeatedly let his man tackle Portis from the rear. Thomas is a fine player but past his time as a all pro performer. Jansen had a bad year with Spurrier before being hurt last year and is two years from being a star. Casey has been a first stringer for one year and is not regarded as a top athlete, or haven't you read the scouting reports. Royal is a below average blocker.
Where is the great OL line you project going to come from-- your imagination?
It has a dismal record of protecting the passer and opening holes for runners, as well as punching it across from the one. Was all of that record Spurrier's fault, or Raymer's? If we don't get a top WR in a trade and a Top TE you'll see real quick how far this OL will take us.

Your arguement might make sense if it weren't complete and utter bull...

Go get some football knowledge and come back when your ready.

Our only weakness is RG. Jansen, Thomas and Samuels are all top 5 at their positions. Rabach was the #1 FA center. I don't know where that ranks him in the league, but everything I read about him said he is very good. 4 out of 5 is pretty damn good. Royal isn't a stud blocker, but he isn't bad and he is getting better. Same thing with Dockery. He's learning. His biggest problem is that he false starts too much and in bad situations....

We will by far have the best line in the NFC east. Our line will be top 5 if Dockery developes any time soon.

Our WRs aren't the best in the NFL, but they are definitely able to get the job done. Patten and Moss are both borderline #1 receivers. DMac catches everything thrown his way if he can convince Gibbs that he's a team guy. ey is the best H-Back(receiving RB) in the NFC east. Thrash is MR gotoguy who makes the tough catches. And Jacobs is, well we don't know what he is yet...

Our WRs are certainly as good as New Englands, and they seem to have done pretty damn well 3 of the last 4 years...

Portis is far and away the best RB in the division. Anyone who says different need only look at the numbers. His numbers will be very good this season as well since nobody will be able to stack the box 80% of the time like they did last season.

We obviously have the best defense in the division as well.


What was the question again?

[Scottskins]

How would a top reciever and top TE do us any good if our o line is so terrible? I mean if they can't block the QB can't throw it to the reciever or the TE. You guys are going overboard with your projections of doom and gloom.

I think Mike Williams being a top WR is very debateable anyway, but we'll see how he does in detroit.

As I and others have stated many many times as well, a TE in the first round would have been a complete waste for us. Our TEs block. They don't catch enough to merit drafting a receiving TE. Miller would have been completely wasted on our team, not to mention there were probably much better blocking TEs than him in the draft. We didn't draft one, so that tells me, that Gibbs thinks Royal is sufficient, or we can pick one up later...

[thaiphoon]

Our WRs are certainly as good as New Englands, and they seem to have done pretty damn well 3 of the last 4 years...

Big difference between their QB (Brady) and ours (Brunell = who can't throw a pass farther than 5 yds and Ramsey who has yet to put together a complete season).

Another difference here is that the Patriots OL is better than our and has been during this time span .. .they:

A.) Don't get false start after false start penalties pushing us back from 1rst and 10 to 3rd and 30 at times.

B.) Don't get stupid holding penalties negating TD's

C.) Actually Pass block in the interior line

D.) Actually run block and drive the DL off the line.

Individually their OL might not match up but they play together as a unit. And that is something that our OL hasn't done in that timespan. Although to be fair, last year was better than the previous 3 for the OL. But thats not saying much... it still meant alot of DL's getting an inside push negating our short yardage situations and getting to Brunell/Ramsey faster than they could even get set up. Why else would Gibbs be warming up to the idea of the shotgun even more than he has before ?

I agree with you about Williams and Miller.

If people look at Williams in college he had trouble getting separation there too. He caught alot of balls because of his size and not his speed. If you can't get separation in college you ain't gonna get it in the pros. And Miller would've been wasted on this team. We already have ey and Royal as our starting H-back and TE. We don't need Miller as much as we needed other positions.

[Scottskins]

I was strictly talking WRs. I realize our QB and OLine aren't where theirs is. If it was, we'd win the superbowl this year...

I do think we have the makings of their QB and their OLine though

we'll see how good our guys do this season...

[sch1977]

Last years stats:

Moss/Patten = 1638 yrds, 18.4 Yd/Rec, 12 TD's

Owens/Pinkston = 1876 yrds, 17.2 Yd/Rec, 15 TD's

Burress/Toomer = 1445 yrds, 17.25 Yd/Rec, 5 TD's

Johnson/Glenn = 1381 yrds, 15.35 Yd/Rec. 8 TD's

------

I would hardly say we have the weakest wideouts in the division... maybe not biggest, or big named... but not the weakest... and we might have the weakest TE, but we've got the best H-Back... since we don't really use the TE for passing as much.... I partially agree with your O-line opinion... all though I believe we made an improvement adding Raubach...

Excellent point BTP!

[sch1977]

Are you sure that you are the non-troll version of Curveball. I mean I know that you are a Cowgirls fan and all but, really....You must be kidding! I sure wouldn't trade for your line! Perhaps Larry Allen....but thats it!

Chad

Adams > Samuels - At least according to the pro bowl

Allen > Whomever Washington throws out there

Johnson > Rabach - Probably the closet position

Rivera > Thomas - Rivera's generally regarded as the best in NFC

Jansen > Whomever Dallas puts out there even coming back from injury


Face it, there are probably 20 O-lines I'd take over the Redskin's line right now. That makes them below average.

Dallas has a top 10 line, at least on paper.

Hey man, put down the crack pipe. If you think Rivera is better than Thomas you are crazy. Dallas sucks, face it! I am sure they have a fan site, why dont you put your skirt back on sally and head over there?

[crazyhorse1]

The presence of Williams and Miller, with ey and Moss could save our pourous OL the yearly embarrassment of almost getting our QB killed. The short yardage skills of the first three would kill the blitz instead and provide superb safety valves. The presence of all four would move tacklers out of the box so Portis would have a fair shot at finding holes, which have been otherwise non-existent.
A lot of you guys have been reading too much PR crap about the skills of the Redskin OL. No stat bears it out. No pro bowl selections bear it out. The Skins would love to immediately upgrade two positions, are ok with three, and wish they hadn't spent so much on a final one and would love a trade to get them off the hook, A major problem with the OL is its intelligence. Holding, missed assignments, jumping off-sides. It's had both Spurrier and Gibbs tearing their hair.

[Scottskins]

The presence of Williams and Miller, with ey and Moss could save our pourous OL the yearly embarrassment of almost getting our QB killed. The short yardage skills of the first three would kill the blitz instead and provide superb safety valves. The presence of all four would move tacklers out of the box so Portis would have a fair shot at finding holes, which have been otherwise non-existent.
A lot of you guys have been reading too much PR crap about the skills of the Redskin OL. No stat bears it out. No pro bowl selections bear it out. The Skins would love to immediately upgrade two positions, are ok with three, and wish they hadn't spent so much on a final one and would love a trade to get them off the hook, A major problem with the OL is its intelligence. Holding, missed assignments, jumping off-sides. It's had both Spurrier and Gibbs tearing their hair.

lol, don't even know how to respond to someone like you. Just say NO!!

I don't listen to, what did you say, the redskins PR department on the offensive line? Heh, never heard that one before. I watch the games, that's how I determine a players value. You might wanna try the same instead of listening to Manfreda and trying to mimic him. You might wanna try not using pro bowl selections as a sign of a players skill either. If I need to go into why, then you truly are lost...

[skins81]

The presence of Williams and Miller, with ey and Moss could save our pourous OL the yearly embarrassment of almost getting our QB killed. The short yardage skills of the first three would kill the blitz instead and provide superb safety valves. The presence of all four would move tacklers out of the box so Portis would have a fair shot at finding holes, which have been otherwise non-existent.
A lot of you guys have been reading too much PR crap about the skills of the Redskin OL. No stat bears it out. No pro bowl selections bear it out. The Skins would love to immediately upgrade two positions, are ok with three, and wish they hadn't spent so much on a final one and would love a trade to get them off the hook, A major problem with the OL is its intelligence. Holding, missed assignments, jumping off-sides. It's had both Spurrier and Gibbs tearing their hair.

You really need to get over yourself.
Williams and Miller? Why are you continuing to live in fantasy land? They are not on the team. Live with it.

You think the problem with the OL is intelligence. Is that from all your years in football and your analysis of aptitdue tests you performed on the players?
Or is it because you saw penalties?
You must be a genius, because you can assess the intelligenxce of the linemen from a freaking stat sheet.

The thing about guys like you and Manfreda is that you cry the sky is falling, but when Sept comes around and the team looks strong, we won't hear a peep from you. If you ever were Skins fans to begin with.

Seriously.
I have now reached the point where I simply can't read your posts anymore.

[SkinsJock]

Sorry crazyh! I respect your opinion but I have more faith in Joe Bugel and Joe Gibbs. Yes, you can use stats to make your case but I think the coaches will make a big difference this year. Both Bugel and Gibbs will make the adjustments and I think we will have a decent performance from the players on this O line this season. I also think that Joe Gibbs will have a better plan for the present NFL defences than he seemed to last year.

We need to have a little more faith and patience. We are not all "B&G biased" fans - some of us saw the improvement last year and I think we will see more of a Joe Gibbs type success on the field this year.

This years potential cannot be properly measured by last years stats. If you think that the pukes (OR anyone!) are going to beat us based on their record over the past 8 years you really should consider getting involved in some other game.

We do not think Joe is a winner because of what he did (that is a fact!) - Joe Gibbs is a winner because of what he does.

[Redskins Rule]

Are you sure that you are the non-troll version of Curveball. I mean I know that you are a Cowgirls fan and all but, really....You must be kidding! I sure wouldn't trade for your line! Perhaps Larry Allen....but thats it!

Chad

Adams > Samuels - At least according to the pro bowl

Allen > Whomever Washington throws out there

Johnson > Rabach - Probably the closet position

Rivera > Thomas - Rivera's generally regarded as the best in NFC

Jansen > Whomever Dallas puts out there even coming back from injury


Face it, there are probably 20 O-lines I'd take over the Redskin's line right now. That makes them below average.

Dallas has a top 10 line, at least on paper.

I needed a good laugh curveball! Thank you!

[General Failure]

Hey man, put down the crack pipe. If you think Rivera is better than Thomas you are crazy. Dallas sucks, face it! I am sure they have a fan site, why dont you put your skirt back on sally and head over there?

When you lay it all out so logically like that ...

[sch1977]

Hey man, put down the crack pipe. If you think Rivera is better than Thomas you are crazy. Dallas sucks, face it! I am sure they have a fan site, why dont you put your skirt back on sally and head over there?

When you lay it all out so logically like that ...

Since you are the expert, why dont you lay it out logically for all of us?

[General Failure]

For starters, the Cowboys don't suck. They snort. Big coke problem over there, you may have heard about it. Also, they do have a fan site. The Eagles have a fan site as well. There's currently no interweb law that says a fan of one team can't talk to a fan from another.

Last, and this is the most important part, curveball's name isn't Sally. It's Booker T. He doesn't wear a skirt, just a baggy jogging suit and several gold chains.