The-Hogs.net - Washington Football Discussion, Redskins to Commanders Era

truskinsfan18 wrote:man (f word) smoot, i hate that guy now...he just left one of the best D's to go to one of the worst...his loss

skins will be LUCKY to get close to the 3rd ranking again... i don't want to here this BS about wilds or harris. skins lost smoot and pierce, you don't lose 2 guys that played extremely well last year and expect to be 3rd or higher again. as someone just posted '06 is here and biting us square in the ass.
also for all you guys saying how smoot signed for only 800k more well noe one yet no the sory, maybe he gave the skins a chance and they wouldnt budge... i don't know but who cares? he's still gone and it will hurt! don't take the easy way out and say that he didnt have any heart and good riddance. the skins had all of last year to resign him and pierce! look at what the eagles and patriots do. they identify thier good young talent and lock them up before the season is over. sorry fellas, you'll never convince me that the skins didnt drop the ball this season.

he didn't have any heart to stay here... good riddance... oops!

Two things:

First of all, before you guys get all mad about Smoot supposedly leaving for only .8M more in Signing Bonus, consider the type of contract he was offered AND consider the yearly average as well as the total.

If they are similar to the 'Skins parameters, THEN you can get all hissy about it.

Second, some of you are putting way too much stock in Gregg Williams. He's a great DC, but the 'Skins D was #1 last year just as much because of the talent as the scheme. Sure, the scheme is great, but what good is it without the right type and right talents of players?

Look no further for an example than Dallas' D in 2003...also a #1 ranked D.

If it was all about the scheme, we'd have finished #1 again. But it's not, and you know the reason why?

Lost Woodson, Wiley sucked, key injuries in the secondary.

Even if Mike Zimmer WERE a defensive genius, the D would have been lucky to finish Top 15. And he's NOT a defensive genius because he rested on his laurels and played way too conservative with no real weapons in the front 7.

Think about that for a few minutes.

BringThePain! wrote:he didn't have any heart to stay here... good riddance... oops!

Primetime42 wrote:Two things:

First of all, before you guys get all mad about Smoot supposedly leaving for only .8M more in Signing Bonus, consider the type of contract he was offered AND consider the yearly average as well as the total.

If they are similar to the 'Skins parameters, THEN you can get all hissy about it.

Second, some of you are putting way too much stock in Gregg Williams. He's a great DC, but the 'Skins D was #1 last year just as much because of the talent as the scheme. Sure, the scheme is great, but what good is it without the right type and right talents of players?

Look no further for an example than Dallas' D in 2003...also a #1 ranked D.

If it was all about the scheme, we'd have finished #1 again. But it's not, and you know the reason why?

Lost Woodson, Wiley sucked, key injuries in the secondary.

Even if Mike Zimmer WERE a defensive genius, the D would have been lucky to finish Top 15. And he's NOT a defensive genius because he rested on his laurels and played way too conservative with no real weapons in the front 7.

Think about that for a few minutes.

wow... cowboy fan that makes sense. good post.

Hey I expect the Skin's defense to be at least as good as last year if not better. Last year if you would have told me we would be ranked 3rd I wouldn't have believed you. This past year we lost several starters from our D during the year and still finished 3rd. So we lose Smoot and Pierce this year, guess what the coaches will find replacements and they will play great.

Somebody needs a time out.

The D will still be good. As good? Who knows... Injuries, egos, replacements, etc. all can factor in and change the chemistry.

No it is not the end of the world in DC. We lost a good player in Pierce and borderline great player in Smoot. Those will be tough to replace, but even harder to replace are two starters with one year under the belt in this scheme.

Still, with a better D-Line and Arrington back, we should be in the top 10.

Dumbass organization? What has DC been for the past 15 years?

Why think about it? It doesn't make sense.

This defense that's so full of talent, as you stated, was said to be extremely lacking in talent going into 2004... namely NO DEFENSIVE LINE. We supposedly overpaid for Griffin and we had 'no ends' and subsequently no pass rush was the general concensus.

Then throw in that two of our starting 3 LBs in Arrington and barrow played jack between them due to injuries.

Our starting safety went out, then our back up safety went out... both for the season.

Our offense was as bad as it gets and left our defense on the field as much as just about any defense in the league.

... and you think that the coach is getting too much credit for fielding the #3 defense?

Whatever.

FanofallthatisGibbs wrote:Dumbass organization? What has DC been for the past 15 years?

a word of truth!!!

i know i sound like chicken little but it's my opinion that this is the end of things before it even got started.
listen... just promise me they'll beat nervous norville... OK?

Smoot is one of my favorite all time Redskins, he's a great trash talker and he has the skills to back it up... he'll be missed... I wonder if we'll select Rolle or Jones in the draft or a WR instead. Hmmmm

BossHog wrote:Why think about it? It doesn't make sense.

This defense that's so full of talent, as you stated, was said to be extremely lacking in talent going into 2004... namely NO DEFENSIVE LINE. We supposedly overpaid for Griffin and we had 'no ends' and subsequently no pass rush was the general concensus.

Then throw in that two of our starting 3 LBs in Arrington and barrow played jack between them due to injuries.

Our starting safety went out, then our back up safety went out... both for the season.

Our offense was as bad as it gets and left our defense on the field as much as just about any defense in the league.

... and you think that the coach is getting too much credit for fielding the #3 defense?

Whatever.

I didn't say he's getting too much credit. He deserves a hell of a lot of credit.

I said you're putting way too much stock in him pulling a repeat performance. Good players, believe it or not, help the situation

He's got us there, Williams is a damn good coach... but is it fair to expect him to turn water into wine again?

Primetime42 wrote:

BossHog wrote:Why think about it? It doesn't make sense.

This defense that's so full of talent, as you stated, was said to be extremely lacking in talent going into 2004... namely NO DEFENSIVE LINE. We supposedly overpaid for Griffin and we had 'no ends' and subsequently no pass rush was the general concensus.

Then throw in that two of our starting 3 LBs in Arrington and barrow played jack between them due to injuries.

Our starting safety went out, then our back up safety went out... both for the season.

Our offense was as bad as it gets and left our defense on the field as much as just about any defense in the league.

... and you think that the coach is getting too much credit for fielding the #3 defense?

Whatever.

I didn't say he's getting too much credit. He deserves a hell of a lot of credit.

I said you're putting way too much stock in him pulling a repeat performance. Good players, believe it or not, help the situation

Im pretty upset about this one, Smoot is the one guy I didnt want to see us lose, Im going to miss you Fred

Lol, wasn't he supposed to be a COOORRRREEE Redskin?

HAHAHHA.

I dont even care that he's gone. At least now I dont have to listen to my father complain about how he gets beat on that quick slant all day.

Bye Smoot, we'll see how good you really are.

i think i heard he signed a 10.8 mil bonus...and didnt we offer him a 10.5 or a 10...does that difference really swing you to another team...if you wanted to be with the redskins...bummmer

BossHog wrote:Why think about it? It doesn't make sense.

This defense that's so full of talent, as you stated, was said to be extremely lacking in talent going into 2004... namely NO DEFENSIVE LINE. We supposedly overpaid for Griffin and we had 'no ends' and subsequently no pass rush was the general concensus.

Then throw in that two of our starting 3 LBs in Arrington and barrow played jack between them due to injuries.

Our starting safety went out, then our back up safety went out... both for the season.

Our offense was as bad as it gets and left our defense on the field as much as just about any defense in the league.

... and you think that the coach is getting too much credit for fielding the #3 defense?

Whatever.

When you pay a HC to be your DC,he better do something.

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Lol, wasn't he supposed to be a COOORRRREEE Redskin?

HAHAHHA.

I dont even care that he's gone. At least now I dont have to listen to my father complain about how he gets beat on that quick slant all day.

Bye Smoot, we'll see how good you really are.

Plus you'll have to change that avatar

Primetime42 wrote:

Chris Luva Luva wrote:Lol, wasn't he supposed to be a COOORRRREEE Redskin?

HAHAHHA.

I dont even care that he's gone. At least now I dont have to listen to my father complain about how he gets beat on that quick slant all day.

Bye Smoot, we'll see how good you really are.

Plus you'll have to change that avatar

Lol, thanks for reminding me.

Primetime42 wrote:... He's a great DC, but the 'Skins D was #1 last year just as much because of the talent as the scheme.

Sure!

Primetime42 wrote:... Even if Mike Zimmer WERE a defensive genius... And he's NOT!

Two things:

I am not "mad" about FS leaving. I think we will miss him and AP! I just think he let himself down by indicating he wanted to stay and then leaving for such a small difference! This was not the money he indicated he thought he should get!

Secondly there is a huge difference in the 2 people and their schemes. Zimmer and his defence were a lot more dependent on the talent level than Greg's defence. This was an area that we were not going to be good in because people thought we had no "talent", or not enough!

Our defence was great because of the scheme and because Greg and his assistants got more out of the players than anybody thought they could.

Greg has proven his ability over many years and that is one of the reasons Joe flew up to get him so quickly.

Our defence without these very good players will be right up there again. I only hope that we pick it up on offense and special teams this year.

We will miss these players - but we are becoming a team and they are going to be looking at what could have been.
In one case for a lousy .8

... He's a great DC, but the 'Skins D was #1 last year just as much because of the talent as the scheme.

Now thats retarded. I contrast to our off the shelf teams of years past we had 1/5 of that talent. Lets go through the list.

1. Springs - Everyone wrote him off and said he was washed up and injury prone and that he couldn't replace Chump...
2. It was said that we had a mediocre D-line and we did have a bunch of no names on their in rotation.
3. We went through 2 no name safeties who both played exceptionally well.
4. We had an injured Walt Harris sure is up in CB, when all the naysayers said we were dumb for picking him up.
5. Wilds is going to be a beast.

We didn't have the best of the best and we were the best. We will continue to be the best without Smoot and Peirce.

SkinsJock wrote:

Primetime42 wrote:... He's a great DC, but the 'Skins D was #1 last year just as much because of the talent as the scheme.

Sure!

Primetime42 wrote:... Even if Mike Zimmer WERE a defensive genius... And he's NOT!

Two things:

I am not "mad" about FS leaving. I think we will miss him and AP! I just think he let himself down by indicating he wanted to stay and then leaving for such a small difference! This was not the money he indicated he thought he should get!

Secondly there is a huge difference in the 2 people and their schemes. Zimmer and his defence were a lot more dependent on the talent level than Greg's defence. This was an area that we were not going to be good in because people thought we had no "talent", or not enough!

Our defence was great because of the scheme and because Greg and his assistants got more out of the players than anybody thought they could.

Greg has proven his ability over many years and that is one of the reasons Joe flew up to get him so quickly.

Our defence without these very good players will be right up there again. I only hope that we pick it up on offense and special teams this year.

We will miss these players - but we are becoming a team and they are going to be looking at what could have been.
In one case for a lousy .8

Keep in mind Zimmer rode a #D ranking with the likes of Ebenezer Ekuban at RE, Wiliie Blade at NT, Mario Edwards at CB, and Eric Ogbobu as his pass rush specialist.

For all the "shortcomings" of Washington's D, they still had two solid corners, a much better LB corps, and a bigger, beefier D-Line (Anchored by a great run stuffer in Brandon Noble- yes, that plays a HUGE part in any defense.)

Signing bonus is not the only thing that determines pay... there is a little thing call salary... and although it's not guaranteed it's still paid if you're on the team...

"Washington never budged after free agency began March 1. According to sources, Minnesota's contract was structured to pay Smoot an average salary of $6 million over the first three years -- which was significantly higher than Washington's offer. "



Our defense will take a hit unless we can find someone intelligent enough to replace pierce.

we need to draft an awesome corner

BringThePain! wrote:http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/3449186

.8 mil more than what we offered him in a signing bonus... yeah...tons of heart...

Yes, but it pays him 6 mil in the first three years. Significantly more than we were able to offer.